Shmunter
Member
Hehe. Accurate.
But Sony didn't pull their rabbit out of a hat without some foresight. If the gen is defined by mass asset delivery, Sony is a gen ahead.
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But Sony didn't pull their rabbit out of a hat without some foresight. If the gen is defined by mass asset delivery, Sony is a gen ahead.
No they aren't. PS5 ssd is faster. Which will obviously be a benefit for devs. But you don't have to exaggerate.
geordiemp
Member
Do you appreciate excellence in design and engineering ? Going excellent and with good cost is to be commended.
Sony desigend a 12 channel system using 12 cheaper chips, and got higher throughput but also very low latency is just as important.
If you cant appreciate that then thats on you
MS bought a controller from Phison, a decent solution I agree.
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Aceofspades
Banned
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Agnostic2020
Member
As of right now ps5 ssd is the fastest ssd on market but in case of xsx ssd is not even the fastest from seagate .
it falls around number 12 speedwise on the market which means mid range ssd .
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SportsFan581
Member
Xbox Series X logo might not be "final imagery" according to Microsoft
Company seemingly confirm the trademark but tell us it's "not indicative of final imagery"www.gamesradar.com
Typical. I would expect the logo they use on a final product to not have the aliasing issues that are visible in the TM filing. LOL
Thirty7ven
Banned
Sony is just following on the footsteps of the PS4, which is listening to the devs. SSD and CPUs were the main asks, to the surprise of no one but young Jim who likes to go to school and argue with his mate about why asymmetrical sticks are better and won't let go until he's at the register of his local GameStop witnessing his effort pay off and finally Jimmy can hold hands with his mate and say "now we can both be happy for each other".
Shmunter
Member
I'm not one to exaggerate. Look at ram generations, DDR3 VS DDR4
DDR3 RAM peak transfer data = 2133MT/s
DDR4 RAM peak transfer data = 4266MT/s
Twice the speed. Pertinent comparison to XsX vs PS5 SSD speed.
MisterXDTV
Member
Actually Sony SSD is more than twice the speed: about 130% faster
Shmunter
Member
What's the opposite of exaggerate? Understate.
Sony is delivering a system like no other, and many cannot see it...yet. Sony's fault for not bringing the tangible proof. It's only a matter of time.
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Neo Blaster
Member
Too early to ask, the great majority of gamers don't even know what difference it makes. First they must watch what it can do on games.
ZywyPL
Banned
It will and it will not at the same time, depends on the games/genres, some titles will rely on streaming even more than ever and some will be able to fit within entire RAM no streaming will be used at all, I even gave some examples recently how and why. So that being said, I expect Sony's 1st party to be primarly, if not solely focusing on huuuge open worlds with miles of draw distance, and hence marketed as "possible only on PS5".
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Dabaus
Banned
So we've gone from:
- "12 teraflops are the end all be all. Ps5 sucks."
"-Fast Ssds won't make a difference, just sony spin."
-" 10.3 teraflops aren't really next gen"
to
"teraflops don't matter it's all about ssds" Hope you astroturfers With the halo avatars got your talking points in front of you because I have whiplash. Wonder how the true believers are going to take this?
- "12 teraflops are the end all be all. Ps5 sucks."
"-Fast Ssds won't make a difference, just sony spin."
-" 10.3 teraflops aren't really next gen"
to
"teraflops don't matter it's all about ssds" Hope you astroturfers With the halo avatars got your talking points in front of you because I have whiplash. Wonder how the true believers are going to take this?
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MisterXDTV
Member
Well, when you are simultaneously releasing a 4 teraflops next-gen console, you don't have any choice....
BluRayHiDef
Banned
Hardware and software capabilities don't affect my decision in regard to which consoles I choose to buy; all I care about is the brand, and Sony's is better than Microsoft's. Hence, even if the PlayStation 5 were a grilled cheese sandwich in which "PlayStation 5" were branded into the slices of bread in between which the cheese lies, I'd buy it rather than the Xbox Series X, even if it costs more.
Just joking.
Neo Blaster
Member
It's intriguing that Windows Central had to go ask devs about their feelings, why didn't they say that before? MS told them not to focus on TF narrative?
Xbox Series X: What do game developers say about next-gen? We asked several for their thoughts.
The Xbox Series X is upon us. But what do game developers think of this next-gen beast? We spoke to several to find out their thoughts.www.windowscentral.com
They all are excited for the SSD and I/O capabilities. Seems Mark Cerny made good moves focusing on SSD.
Shmunter
Member
Totally. No reason we won't see Pac-Man Championship Edition 3 next gen. Ssd totally wasted but TF can make it sparkle better.
It is the potential capacity that is the point of difference. It's usage is down to devs.
Large asset streaming can however be applied to linear games just as much as open world. It's about more availability to the visible scene.
xacto
Member
Guerrilla Games used the PS5 hashtag in a job listing tweet, then deleted it
Deleted Guerrilla Games tweet seemingly confirms its working on a PS5 exclusive
Makes one wonder.
Neo Blaster
Member
Well, from what he said during the deep dive about loud noise on the current solution, looks like he learned his lesson. Definitely I'm not concerned about that.
Metroiddarks
Member
The problem is the xbox fan side use as source, so now Xbox needs to make a change in the message for the budget console, he did the same so that is just to convinient.
If you dont work as some kind of PR please dont change the message when the company think is necesary.
Is like if a play fan bring a site which only analize products of Sony and he/she used when think is correct as an impartial source (just the fans of Xbox did when were talking about TF) but the play fan be offend it if someone say they are not impartial.
Neo Blaster
Member
Rewatch Cerny's deep dive.Is there any truth to Xbox series X having Velocity Engine architecture means they don't need a superfast SSD.
having a low cost SSD will keep the price down and the architecture makes up for it
whoever81
Member
I see you are a man of culture too. Spoken like a true fanboy. I want that grilled sandwich too!
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Metroiddarks
Member
Agree this kind of guys are just cancer which love the make fans of both side fight just for views.
Well first off you are comparing storage to memory. Two very different things with very different goals.
Second those two technologies clearly fall within the same generation, as the X1 and it's ddr3 are still playing all the games any system with ddr4 is running. You could argue that the underlying technology makes them a gen apart but the SSD in PS5 and SeX use the same technology so that argument doesn't work either.
Both the PS5 and SeX SSD is ~1000x faster than last gen. That's a generation ahead.
The fact that PS5 is "double the speed" of SeX doesn't matter as much as the jump from last gen to next.
Your argument is like saying SeX GPU is a "generation ahead" of PS5 cause 2TF was a huge gulf in power ~8 years ago.
SeX GPU advantage over PS5 is more than an entire PS4.
But we know the way technology works, this won't result in the SeX being a generation above PS5 in graphics rendering.
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Metroiddarks
Member
Not until Nintendo release the first console with more than 13 TF.
Thirty7ven
Banned
See how he keeps the messaging on track? Dude gets paid to know how to do his job. "Both SSD are fast", "Xbox is more powerful". Why doesn't he say "Both GPUs are powerful"? Because MS puts food on his plate.
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Neo Blaster
Member
Well if you read the Windows Central interview with developers yesterday, they kept talking about SSD and fast I/O as the main feature of the next-generation
Now they are releasing a 4TF console.
So the music changed big time since last month
From this:
To this
It's hilarious!
Oh, boy, how the narrative has changed. Do I promote TFs and f... Lockart or CPU/SSD and f... XSX?
Metroiddarks
Member
Also the alternative is worst for part of marketing in the end for the graphics is more important the new fast ssd, RT support and even the CPU than the TF of the GPU.
You guys are just fighting straw men here to defend PS5.
Obviously TFs matter for GPU performance.
Obviously Lockhart will have very low GPU performance compared to SeX and PS5
Why are we all acting dumb like this is a difficult concept or something?
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Tom Warren has worked at the Verge for 4 times longer than he ran WinRumors lol.. since then he's covered Sony or whoever else is in gaming, and everything mobile that has nothing to do with consoles (cell phones, etc.)
He's not some paid MS shill, even if he is biased.
But he's just another random dude with an opinion.. why do we give a shit either way?
He's not some paid MS shill, even if he is biased.
But he's just another random dude with an opinion.. why do we give a shit either way?
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Shmunter
Member
What a missed opportunity for the sweaty red button jpg
MasterCornholio
Member
Is there any truth to Xbox series X having Velocity Engine architecture means they don't need a superfast SSD.
having a low cost SSD will keep the price down and the architecture makes up for it
It won't make up for the lower amount of lanes though. You can only do so much with the software.
Aceofspades
Banned
The Mad Draklor
Member
More than double in raw bandwidth along with further bottleneck removals in the I/O (e.g. coherency, memory mapping, file I/O, and check-in), something in which Cerny talked about in depth whereas we've heard nothing from Microsoft. The fact that the PS5's flash controller has, IIRC, twice as much levels of priority as the number of lanes on the XSX's SSD is also something that can't be handwaved away.
The reason why saying the XSX has a PS4's worth of TF advantage over the PS5 doesn't work is because it does not take into account the percent delta. However, when people are comparing the PS5's SSD to the XSX's SSD, they compare them in terms of again, percent delta. 5.5 GB/s vs. 2.4 GB/s of raw bandwidth is over a 100% difference. That's not insignificant.
And before you say "Well, loading times will be short anyways, so what does it matter?", that's not even the main reason why Cerny went with a high-speed SSD. If the SSD is fast enough so that the RAM only needs to store 1 second's worth of data that might be used, that's saves much more memory compared to storing 2 seconds' worth of data. This is especially true when games progressively become more and more detailed.
Thirty7ven
Banned
He mostly covers MS because thats where his sources and connections are. You click his twitter of the first 10 tweets, 7 are MS related.
We are just talking, and I'm just explaining why he does what he does. I have no problem with him because I know what he is, and there's no crime there. He doesn't pretend to be what he's not but he doesn't make a parody out of it either.
Again "both SSDs are fast" is a line of thought he could easily apply elsewhere but doesn't. Why would he care to control the message that way? Feelings? I doubt its about his own feelings, it's about pandering.
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Neo Blaster
Member
Defend PS5? Don't you think that after so many devs spontaneously praising PS5 SSD it's at least intriguing that Windows Central goes asking devs, they praise XSX SSD and suddenly Tom Warren changes his narrative? Who is being defensive now?
Microsoft has talked extensively about their customizations.
The only one "hand waving" is you.
Again. They are both ~1000x faster than last gen.
When you claim the PS5 and SeX SSDs are a generation apart you are not considering that "percent delta"
50% more storage speed is nowhere near the same as 50% more GPU power.
For example from last gen to next. The GPU power has only gone up about 5x while the storage speed has gone up 1000x
Two very different technologies with very different number and goals.
I said nothing about load times.
For years devs have figured out how to optimize for drives that are 1000x slower than what's in the next gen systems. They will find a way to deal with SSDs that are slower than the one in PS5.
To claim otherwise is delusional.
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You guys see what you want to see.
Which devs have spontaneously praised PS5 SSD specifically?
Two separate concepts and you guys are acting dumb just to attack this dude and defend your PlayStation.
He believes that a gap of 2TF could therefore be discernible as we move into the next generation.
On the other hand the lockhart with 4TF will have no impact and will not be a burden for the XSX despite the 8Tflops that separate them.
it's funny
There are 4, 10, and 12 TF cards on the market right now.
The 12TF cards clearly outperform the 10TF ones and the 4tf ones offer a budget way to play the same games.
Why are you guys pretending this doesn't exist already?
Evilms
Banned
SportsFan581
Member
Some people have convinced themselves that console development exists inside a bubble. Never mind the fact that these games are built on PC (with 95% of them playable on PC) before being packaged up for the different consoles.
BluRayHiDef
Banned
Does anyone think that Hellblade II is a major loss to PlayStation? Does anyone think that it was cheap of Microsoft to make it exclusive even though the first one was multiplatform?
Like I said you guys are using strawmen and pretend ignorance to defend PS5.nice damage control
That's how you want to roll, that's ok I guess.
But it ain't me doing damage control.
Neo Blaster
Member
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Shmunter
Member
I'm a Hellblade fan. I think Ninja Theory is a high caliber studio. Except that silly mulitiplayer game that just came out, gamepass fodder.
You forgot the button for Sony and their fans
"Praise SSD and downplay everything else"
Agnostic2020
Member
Dude the game barely sold 100k on pc and ps4 combined after few months and when it did after 7-8 months they celebrated it as a milestone . The game is not that big at all. And no MS owns the studio now. Fair game.
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