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[drotahorror]

Name of the song?

nero - satisfy

 

[desu]

Sunhi is creating better trailers than the official Driveclub marketing team. God-damn!

I really like the video, but the tour announcement videos done by Evo for the DLC were really awesome each month.

 

[SolarMystic]

I'd say the best option for standards, assuming that they do keep them, is to simply give people an option at the start of the game to disable them. That way people that don't like them will never see them while people that aren't bothered by them will still get to use them.

I like this idea. I hate seeing the recommended cars list for an event, and try and find them in the dealership only to see that they are standards.

As someone who exclusively drives cockpit view, I will never use a standard. They're just in my way as it is now.

 

[brainchild]

SunhiLegend has you covered!

https://vid.me/P3wA

Awesome trailer!

 

[TheAdmiester]

I like this idea. I hate seeing the recommended cars list for an event, and try and find them in the dealership only to see that they are standards.

As someone who exclusively drives cockpit view, I will never use a standard. They're just in my way as it is now.

I think people have been asking for some filter like that since we knew what standards were in 2009 or so, but I highly doubt PD will ever do it.

 

[ShapeGSX]

Next time you're in the rain and driving take a look at the way the water pools at the edge of the blade arc and how it travels across the windscreen as you drive - well, preferably as someone else drives! - and it too has a weird, jelly-like quality to it..

I've looked (this isn't the first time I saw the odd effect in Driveclub). And no it doesn't. Driveclub's water droplets stay as discrete jelly drops even after the wiper blade hits them. That isn't how water looks at all.

 

[cakely]

SunhiLegend has you covered!

https://vid.me/P3wA

Amazing!

Tell me Sunhi does that for a living ... he certainly should.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

SunhiLegend has you covered!

https://vid.me/P3wA

Thats amazing. Is the video on youtube, too? Nobody clicks on vid.me links when you share them.

Another video comparing the weather in both FM6 and Driveclub but this time the video is at 720/60fps. Driveclub still looks like a whole genreation apart IMO.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=borC9k3dMbc

Edit: The video is 1080p/60fps not 720p.

Damn @1:47

Spoiler

Sorry I don't know how to make high quality gifs

Edit: Something I noticed in the comparison vid:
At 2:10 if you look at the black bar below the window left from the driver.
In Driveclub you see it lit up with a light slightly flickering green touch because of light reflected from trees you drive by.
In Forza its just plain black.
These are subtle differences, but its a huge difference in the quality and capability of the lighting tech.

 

[tattooed_dwarf]

Edit: Something I noticed in the comparison vid:
At 2:10 if you look at the black bar below the window left from the driver.
In Driveclub you see it lit up with a light slightly flickering green touch because of light reflected from trees you drive by.
In Forza its just plain black.
These are subtle differences, but its a huge difference in the quality and capability of the lighting tech.

I think biggest problem with F6 is it's lighting. It makes cars pop out of rest of the game world too much.

 

[AndyD]

I mostly notice it now after all these videos, but how come DC cars don't have lights on when raining?

 

[Inf3cted_b3ast]

I mostly notice it now after all these videos, but how come DC cars don't have lights on when raining?

Yeah I don't really understand how the headlights work in DC. Cars that have LED daytime running lights don't work during the day. It's just confusing. I tried asking the dev about it on twitter but never got a reply.

 

[NullPointer]

I think biggest problem with F6 is it's lighting. It makes cars pop out of rest of the game world too much.

And AA, though its far worse on some tracks than others.

Tracks like Rio and Bathurst are clean and gorgeous, but then you get Le Mans and Catalunya where every straight line is broken and shimmering. The differences can be so stark it reminds me of the old Gran Turismo premium/standard split.

 

[AndyD]

Yeah I don't really understand how the headlights work in DC. Cars that have LED daytime running lights don't work during the day. It's just confusing. I tried asking the dev about it on twitter but never got a reply.

What's also weird is that they are modeled, as they work at night. And if I remember right you can even toggle them for photo mode. I wonder of it's just an oversight, or a conscious decision for performance reasons.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

And AA, though its far worse on some tracks than others.

Tracks like Rio and Bathurst are clean and gorgeous, but then you get Le Mans and Catalunya where every straight line is broken and shimmering. The differences can be so stark it reminds me of the old Gran Turismo premium/standard split.

The AA in Forza is bad?
I haven't seen F6 live, yet, but Horizon2s IQ was much better than Driveclubs. DCs IQ is one of my biggest complaints about the look of the game.
Didn't F6 use Horizon2s AA method?

 

[TheAdmiester]

The AA in Forza is bad?
I haven't seen F6 live, yet, but Horizon2s IQ was much better than Driveclubs. DCs IQ is one of my biggest complaints about the look of the game.
Didn't F6 use Horizon2s AA method?

Horizon 2 uses 4xMSAA. Motorsport 5 and 6 use 2xMSAA, which is still far clearer than other games but of course introduces more jaggies than 4 samples.

I think all Motorsport games get bumped up to 4x in time trial mode.

 

[_machine]

The AA in Forza is bad?
I haven't seen F6 live, yet, but Horizon2s IQ was much better than Driveclubs. DCs IQ is one of my biggest complaints about the look of the game.
Didn't F6 use Horizon2s AA method?

Nope, FM6 doesn't use the same AA method and the IQ is considerably worse. In my opinion FH2 has probably the best IQ of any console racer this generation. FM6 did improve the AA over FM5 and especially in time trial mode it addresses some parts pretty well, but there's definitely shimmering left in the game. That said, I'm not sure of the actual specifics other than FH2 uses 4xMSAA with alpha-testing for foliage and a forward setup and some shader specific tricks to help with specular aliasing.

 

[NullPointer]

I think all Motorsport games get bumped up to 4x in time trial mode.

And I was actually speaking from how they look in time trials - which makes me wonder how Le Mans looks when there's a full grid.

 

[TheAdmiester]

And I was actually speaking from how they look in time trials - which makes me wonder how Le Mans looks when there's a full grid.

The only comparison I can find is the 2xMSAA vs 4xMSAA in Forza 4. It's not as big of a difference as you might think, you can only really tell on high contrast things (like the black leather against white dashboard on these pics).

Time Trial FM4

Race FM4

As I said on a post in the FM.net forums, I'd much rather have slightly jaggier MSAA with great IQ than the blurry mess that is FXAA. GTA 5 on new gen always looked hazy to me.

 

[M52B28]

Next time you're in the rain and driving take a look at the way the water pools at the edge of the blade arc and how it travels across the windscreen as you drive - well, preferably as someone else drives! - and it too has a weird, jelly-like quality to it.

No, it is not a good representation.

Sorry, water doesn't look like grease when it goes to the side of the windshield..

And for the record, the water animation on the windshield goes too slow.

 

[Inf3cted_b3ast]

What's also weird is that they are modeled, as they work at night. And if I remember right you can even toggle them for photo mode. I wonder of it's just an oversight, or a conscious decision for performance reasons.

I really don't know. like I said I tried asking one of the devs on twitter but never got a reply. I don't think you can toggle the headlights in photomode.

 

[Fess]

project cars on pc looks worse than forza 6

You sure about that? With every graphics setting on max? Like I said, I haven't tried it myself yet but PC usually have the best looking games by default imo, simply because the graphics doesn't have to drag down the framerate and 60fps doesn't have to be the upper limit either.

 

[jusufin]

SunhiLegend has you covered!

https://vid.me/P3wA

That was better than any trailer I've seen for DC so far.

 

[etta]

Did they update the windshield water particles to refresh at 60Hz in FM6? It was 30Hz in the demo, right? It looks like 60fps in that rain comparison video.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Did they update the windshield water particles to refresh at 60Hz in FM6? It was 30Hz in the demo, right? It looks like 60fps in that rain comparison video.

Nope, every engine feature in the demo was final. It really isn't that noticable when you're in the heat of a race though, I'd rather have the tradeoff like that for 60fps.

 

[cakely]

No, it is not a good representation.

Sorry, water doesn't look like grease when it goes to the side of the windshield..

And for the record, the water animation on the windshield goes too slow.

Something tells me you're not actually sorry.

Personally, I think the windshield water animation in Driveclub is great. The water collects in realistic-looking rivulets, instead of the circular droplets that you see in other representations. It's a nice touch.

 

[etta]

Nope, every engine feature in the demo was final. It really isn't that noticable when you're in the heat of a race though, I'd rather have the tradeoff like that for 60fps.

Dafaq?! That looks like 60fps to me. Can someone make a gif of it and compare it to the refresh rate of the wipers? They look the same.

Look at the top left corner in FM6, the droplets look like they update at 60Hz.

Here, too. Looks as smooth as the wipers animation.

This as well, look at the left streaks of water that are pushed in FM6 in comparison to DC's streaks, FM6 ones look smoother.

 

[Dictator93]

Why are people uploading videos to YouTube when Gamersyde is basically made for these comparisons?

 

[TheAdmiester]

Dafaq?! That looks like 60fps to me. Can someone make a gif of it and compare it to the refresh rate of the wipers? They look the same.

Look at the top left corner in FM6, the droplets look like they update at 60Hz.

Here, too. Looks as smooth as the wipers animation.

Hmm, two possibilities, either I'm mistaken and they were updated, or that Youtuber's equipment only records at 30fps, so they interpolated the FM6 video, making everything 60 as a result.

I'll start the game up again and check.

EDIT: Also, can we take a moment to appreciate the way FM6's droplets leave "invisible" streaks that you can see when the window is in more direct light? It creates the illusion of condensation on the window and looks incredible.

 

[Synth]

Dafaq?! That looks like 60fps to me. Can someone make a gif of it and compare it to the refresh rate of the wipers? They look the same.

Look at the top left corner in FM6, the droplets look like they update at 60Hz.

Here, too. Looks as smooth as the wipers animation.

This as well, look at the left streaks of water that are pushed in FM6 in comparison to DC's streaks, FM6 ones look smoother.

iirc, they're 60fps in time trial, and 30fps in standard races.

 

[etta]

iirc, they're 60fps in time trial, and 30fps in standard races.

Hmm, this makes sense. See if you can compare them in both situations, TheAdmiester.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Hmm, this makes sense. See if you can compare them in both situations, TheAdmiester.

Definitely 30 in a full race, just checked. Will update with TT mode.

EDIT: Yep, bumped up to 60 in TT just like reflections.

 

[etta]

Definitely 30 in a full race, just checked. Will update with TT mode.

EDIT: Yep, bumped up to 60 in TT just like reflections.

Nice. What about free mode?

 

[TheAdmiester]

Nice. What about free mode?

As in free mode with 0 drivatars? That's what I tested, wasn't sure if what people called "time trial" was Rivals mode, or just free play with no AI.

I thought I'd test free play since the ghost car in Rivals might cause it to revert to 30.

 

[etta]

Can you check free mode with some cars? Try with 1 opponent and 10 or something.

 

[_machine]

Definitely 30 in a full race, just checked. Will update with TT mode.

EDIT: Yep, bumped up to 60 in TT just like reflections.

Cool, I admire how far they go to make sure they're squeezing everything they got. It's a rare luxury for most developers and such micro-level optimization is a ton of work even though it might sound simple.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Can you check free mode with some cars? Try with 1 opponent and 10 or something.

Will do, I know Forza 4's files contain settings that adjust certain things with 2, 4, 8, and 12 cars, so I imagine this might have something similar. I think Forza 4 reduces the LOD distance for cars a little bit with each increment.

While I test, here's an example of what I'm talking about.

FM4 8-car race render settings:

<DynamicRenderSettings>
<TilingScenario value="0"/>
<DepthOfField value="1"/>
<MotionBlur value="1"/>
<CarDrawDriver value="1"/>
<CarDamage value="1"/>
<CarDamageTextures value="1"/>
<CarLODThresholds lod1="2" lod2="4" count="6"/>
<CarFocusLODMinMax min="0" max="5"/>
<CarNonFocusLODMinMax min="0" max="5"/>
<CarLODTransDist near="15.0" far="25.0" veryfar="50.0"/>
<CarMinWheelLOD value="1"/>
<CrowdDraw value="1"/>
<CrowdDrawModels value="1"/>
<CrowdDrawSprites value="1"/>
<CrowdDrawShadows value="1"/>
<CrowdSpriteDistScale value="1.0"/>
<CrowdLODCountScales scale0="1.0" scale1="1.0" scale2="1.0" scale3="1.0"/>
<ParticleRateScale value="1.0"/>
<EnvMapFrequencyScale value="1.0"/>
</DynamicRenderSettings>

FM4 12-car race render settings:

<DynamicRenderSettings>
<TilingScenario value="1"/>
<DepthOfField value="1"/>
<MotionBlur value="1"/>
<CarDrawDriver value="1"/>
<CarDamage value="1"/>
<CarDamageTextures value="1"/>
<CarLODThresholds lod1="2" lod2="4" count="6"/>
<CarFocusLODMinMax min="0" max="5"/>
<CarMinWheelLOD value="1"/>
<CarNonFocusLODMinMax min="0" max="5"/>
<CarLODTransDist near="15.0" far="25.0" veryfar="50.0"/>
<ParticleRateScale value="1.0"/>
<EnvMapFrequencyScale value="1.0"/>
<MaxCarsInMirror value="6"/>
</DynamicRenderSettings>

EDIT: Well one test was enough for our findings - the droplets and reflections drop to 30fps with one AI driver on track. I don't think I need to test any other combinations since that's pretty conclusive.

 

[etta]

Will do, I know Forza 4's files contain settings that adjust certain things with 2, 4, 8, and 12 cars, so I imagine this might have something similar. I think Forza 4 reduces the LOD distance for cars a little bit with each increment.

While I test, here's an example of what I'm talking about.

FM4 8-car race render settings:


FM4 12-car race render settings:



EDIT: Well one test was enough for our findings - the droplets and reflections drop to 30fps with one AI driver on track. I don't think I need to test any other combinations since that's pretty conclusive.

Oh, damn. Oh well, 80% of my FM6 playtime will be solo Nordschleife runs anyway. Thanks for the testing.

 

[Wax Free Vanilla]

They really need to get rid of standard cars before it can have any kind of consistency though.

EDIT: And actually have motion blur in gameplay.

The tessellated PS4 standard gameplay exteriors will look better than car models featured in other games and be of equal quality to GT Sport premium exteriors, all they have to do is put in the PSP interior game play view and they won't be a problem.

I don't understand why people think GT Sport won't better Driveclub visually? It's just going to take it apart with ease.

 

[Yiazmat]

 

[icecold1983]

You sure about that? With every graphics setting on max? Like I said, I haven't tried it myself yet but PC usually have the best looking games by default imo, simply because the graphics doesn't have to drag down the framerate and 60fps doesn't have to be the upper limit either.

i mean obv you can keep scaling up the downsampling as you throw more and more gpu power at project cars, but IQ aside forza def looks better. the project cars engine is a horrible, inefficient mess. the art is also pretty awful

 

[TheAdmiester]

The tessellated PS4 standard gameplay exteriors will look better than car models featured in other games and be of equal quality to GT Sport premium exteriors, all they have to do is put in the PSP interior game play view and they won't be a problem.

The tessellation is great tech but the information still has to be there on the original model for it to look convincing. The tessellation tech can make curved stuff like wheel arches, bolts, screws, lights, etc look fantastic, but they won't magically add 3D panel gaps to standard cars, which is the main problem with most.

The updated standards (the "semi premiums") are perfect recipients for the tessellation, but there are hundreds that still need to be updated.

I don't understand why people think GT Sport won't better Driveclub visually? It's just going to take it apart with ease.

I think it will top DC visually, but I have worries about misdirection like unsteady framerates.

 

[GoldenCrow]

My main tv broke this morning so waiting for the insurance company to sort it out and today I hooked up the PS4 to my old crappy 720p display and the difference in image quality specifically in DC is ridiculous, it looks a hell of a lot worse. First time I have experienced this with a game, looked at The Phantom Pain and FIFA 16 and apart from the obvious resolution difference and lack off full colour range the images were as you expect. DC on the other hand is full of jaggies and lots of shinny bits. I never understood some of the complaints before but if that is what people have been seeing then damn no wonder they were underwhelmed.

 

[ypo]

Another video comparing the weather in both FM6 and Driveclub but this time the video is at 720/60fps. Driveclub still looks like a whole genreation apart IMO.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=borC9k3dMbc

Edit: The video is 1080p/60fps not 720p.

Pretty cool that Forza has some hovercraft action.

 

[JeanPi]

Why is this still a discussion? Driveclub is a better looking game without doubt, but Forza has the 60 fps, which is nice.

 

[Shaneus]

My main tv broke this morning so waiting for the insurance company to sort it out and today I hooked up the PS4 to my old crappy 720p display and the difference in image quality specifically in DC is ridiculous, it looks a hell of a lot worse. First time I have experienced this with a game, looked at The Phantom Pain and FIFA 16 and apart from the obvious resolution difference and lack off full colour range the images were as you expect. DC on the other hand is full of jaggies and lots of shinny bits. I never understood some of the complaints before but if that is what people have been seeing then damn no wonder they were underwhelmed.

I'd be checking what your PS4 is outputting. It could well be sending out a 1080P signal and having your TV downscale, which would be bad. I've inadvertently played DC on my PS4 in 720P (upscaled to 1080P by my TV) more than once and it looked fine.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Pretty cool that Forza has some hovercraft action.

What a constructive post...

 

[DHC-Shannow]

Why is this still a discussion? Driveclub is a better looking game without doubt, but Forza is the better game overall with the included bonus of 60 fps.

You missed out 'in my opinion' - some of us beg to differ.

 

[DD]

You missed out 'in my opinion' - some of us beg to differ.

Yep. As I've said before, Dirt Rally beats the shit of 'em both. :')

 

[JeanPi]

You missed out 'in my opinion' - some of us beg to differ.

i edited it, didn't want to sound like an ass. It's true that it's an opinion, but isn't it also the general opinion? Forza being the better game? I've played both, although i have to say i didn't play Driveclub as much as some of you have played, so my judgement could be from an incomplete experience, but still...

 

[VanWinkle]

i edited it, didn't want to sound like an ass. It's true that it's an opinion, but isn't it also the general opinion? Forza being the better game? I've played both, although i have to say i didn't play Driveclub as much as some of you have played, so my judgement could be from an incomplete experience, but still...

No. The games have different gameplay styles, but are both polished, content-rich, and high-quality, so the "better" one depends on which kind of racing game you like. I don't like a simulation physics model and car customization, so for me Driveclub is better. But I'm not going to outright say it's the better game.