OH, my bad. I thought he was there last night. Sorry! I'm worse than Florio!
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NFL Offseason Thread 2013 - Here comes the wait
- Thread starter DeaconKnowledge
- Start date
OH, my bad. I thought he was there last night. Sorry! I'm worse than Florio!
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Trading Stafford, maybe. Getting rid of his contract and then the consequent reduction in food costs would easily save another million or two.
Seriously, though, they couldn't unless they thought about trading Suh and that gargantuan deal.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
Haha, I fully expect any positivity I have right now to come back and bite me sometime next season. It's okay, it's par for the course as a Dolphins fan who tries to stay somewhat optimistic when lots of changes are happening.
As of right now Jonathan Martin will be taking over at LT, where he played the last four games of the season when Long was out. There is the infamous gif of him getting destroyed by Aldon Smith that one time but other than that Martin looked okay in that role, especially considering that he was a rookie and a converted RT. The hope is that he will bulk up some in the offseason and improve his footwork enough to be a good fit for that role, but it's definitely a concern.
The bigger issue is who takes over for Martin at RT, and right now that's Nate Garner. He was bad last year at RT so I wouldn't be surprised if the Dolphins look to replace him immediately with the draft (or possibly draft an NFL ready LT and move Martin back to RT).
As far as the Tannehill/Wallace stuff goes I'm in agreement with you, there is some reason for concern there. Wallace will be coming in with a hot head thanks to his massive payday and it might be tough for the coaching staff and Tannehill to keep his attitude in check. I'm not entirely sold on Tannehill either but I'm definitely positive on him (much more than I was with checkdown Chad) and I think he improved a lot as the season went on last year, particularly with his ability to move in the pocket and scramble. His decision making was very good overall last year so I'm not worried about that, but his accuracy was an issue at times on the deep ball (which Wallace's speed should help with) so hopefully we'll see some improvement there.
Considering how small Tannehill's body of work is as a QB (really only three years between college and pro) I think there is a lot to be excited about, and it seems like his potential ceiling is still a good ways away. The fundamentals are there, he just needs to develop. Of course, a lot more will be expected of him now that the Dolphins actually have a deep threat and it's his second year, so this season should really be the moment of truth as far as that goes.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
NFL-Gaf Mock Draft 2013
1. Chiefs -
2. Jaguars - Tamanon
3. Raiders - ChanHuk, Mackenzie 92
4. Eagles - Yankeehater
5. Lions - WedgeX, Goldlion054, Kastrioti, Plinko
6. Browns - BlackGhost, Wes, theBatman
7. Cardinals - Squall ASF
8. Bills - LJ11
9. Jets - Fox3182
10. Titans - Fidelis Hodie
11. Chargers - Nightz
12. Dolphins - The_Darkest_Red
13. Buccaneers -
14. Panthers - Bowser
15. Saints - cajunator
16. Rams - squicken, B for Bendetta
17. Steelers - DeaconKnowledge, chuckddd, Angmarsking701, 789shadow
18. Cowboys - cashman
19. Giants - Futurevoid, BigAT, Striker
20. Bears - cuevas, phd., Vio-lence
21. Bengals -
22. Rams (from Redskins) - squicken, B for Bendetta
23. Vikings -
24. Colts - SpinDasher
25. Vikings - from Seattle -
26. Packers - eznark, TheLegendary
27. Texans - MechDX
28. Broncos - Godslay, Hunter S Thompson
29. Patriots - Dutch Patriot
30. Falcons - Talon
31. 49ers - FrenchMovieTheme
32. Ravens - BaltimoreLarry, Nakazato
Missing reps for the bolded teams. Please. Let's get fans to represent before we move to alternates.
1. Chiefs -
2. Jaguars - Tamanon
3. Raiders - ChanHuk, Mackenzie 92
4. Eagles - Yankeehater
5. Lions - WedgeX, Goldlion054, Kastrioti, Plinko
6. Browns - BlackGhost, Wes, theBatman
7. Cardinals - Squall ASF
8. Bills - LJ11
9. Jets - Fox3182
10. Titans - Fidelis Hodie
11. Chargers - Nightz
12. Dolphins - The_Darkest_Red
13. Buccaneers -
14. Panthers - Bowser
15. Saints - cajunator
16. Rams - squicken, B for Bendetta
17. Steelers - DeaconKnowledge, chuckddd, Angmarsking701, 789shadow
18. Cowboys - cashman
19. Giants - Futurevoid, BigAT, Striker
20. Bears - cuevas, phd., Vio-lence
21. Bengals -
22. Rams (from Redskins) - squicken, B for Bendetta
23. Vikings -
24. Colts - SpinDasher
25. Vikings - from Seattle -
26. Packers - eznark, TheLegendary
27. Texans - MechDX
28. Broncos - Godslay, Hunter S Thompson
29. Patriots - Dutch Patriot
30. Falcons - Talon
31. 49ers - FrenchMovieTheme
32. Ravens - BaltimoreLarry, Nakazato
Missing reps for the bolded teams. Please. Let's get fans to represent before we move to alternates.
Make sure you don't quote this when I laugh at you for finishing below the Jets next year, but I like the Dolphins. Mostly because I love the staff. They've been super smart and haven't followed "common wisdom" to make what would have been kind of easy and lazy moves (cutting Johnson, passing on Flynn and Jennings, bold signings yesterday) . I don't think all of the signing are great, but going out and getting the Ravens Ray Lewis successor was inspired. They have the room, may as well use it when the opportunity presents itself and you need to chase New England.
On the other hand I'm a little disappointed that Philbin hasn't been able to instill some of the Packer restrain in the front office.
Guy would rather eat a solid piece of shit than suck down diarrhea through a straw. Who can blame him really?
In all fairness the Browns had a bunch of close losses last year and still got 5 wins with one of the toughest schedules. Looking at it before the draft and only 1 day in to FA the division seems to have got weeker whilst we've got a bit stronger. I certainly think we'll improve to at least a single-digit loss season.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I want in on the Lions draft again.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
Leading receivers in 2012:
PIT: Mike Wallace with 836 yards, Heath Miller with 816 yards.
MIA: Brian Hartline with 1,083 yards
Sorry, not seeing it.
Tanny is legit. You guys are looking good in Miami, DarkestRed. Not as big a fan of Martin at LT as you are. MIA still wants Long back, but not at top dollar. He said he wouldn't give them any discounts, or even a right to match, so I sense some love loss there
Vikes writer says Jennings is still asking for 11m-12m a year, so no one is interested. They'll get back in as his price comes down
Vikes writer says Jennings is still asking for 11m-12m a year, so no one is interested. They'll get back in as his price comes down
BlackGhost
Banned
I think Banned episode said he would do Vikings last night
brah, WTF is wrong with you. Smh smh
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Reggie Bush, Jason Jones, and Glover Quin are all currently at Detroit Lions' headquarters. Jason Jones just completed his physical.
If we can sign all three of these guys, I'll have a bit of hope for next year.
If I could pick just one, it would be Glover Quin. Please sign.
If we can sign all three of these guys, I'll have a bit of hope for next year.
If I could pick just one, it would be Glover Quin. Please sign.
Is that even possible?
Antonio Brown had 700 and Sanders had 630. Ben spreads the ball well.
So the fourth leading receiver on the Steelers had 630 yards. The third best receiver in Miami had 300.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
Your #1 warm body had one good season. Not seeing your point.
If the Browns sign Keenan, they have the best D in that division. If not, it's still arguable, but regardless their front 7 is something to be considered, and Joe Haden is a beauty. Offensively is a whole other ball game of course...
The Dolphins offense is, on paper, pretty awesome, so it's a total wild card if they'll do well. I don't think Mike Wallace is all that and a bag of chips, so the money is cray, but you don't get 32 TD's in 4 seasons by fluke. Guy has talent. Defensively is another wild card. The biggest impact, if any, will be Smith's departure.
The Lions will probably be back to where they were in 2011, especially if they sign Bush. But they ARE the Lions, so for them to be worse than 4-12 this year wouldn't even be surprising either. They have the worst coach in the league.
The Dolphins offense is, on paper, pretty awesome, so it's a total wild card if they'll do well. I don't think Mike Wallace is all that and a bag of chips, so the money is cray, but you don't get 32 TD's in 4 seasons by fluke. Guy has talent. Defensively is another wild card. The biggest impact, if any, will be Smith's departure.
The Lions will probably be back to where they were in 2011, especially if they sign Bush. But they ARE the Lions, so for them to be worse than 4-12 this year wouldn't even be surprising either. They have the worst coach in the league.
Well, in all honesty Miami has fickle fans just like the northeastern teams do. It's not like Green Bay where you can sell out at 8-8. It's just a different fan climate there.
Antonio Brown is their stud.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
It's easy to spread the ball to "warm bodies" when you've got Wallace opening up the field, though. You don't think Bess and Hartline will get a lot more looks with Wallace on the field? My question is who fills that role for the Steelers now that Wallace is gone? Is Antonio Brown so terrifying that he'll help open up the field the same way Wallace did?
The Dolphins receivers sucked last year overall but calling Hartline a warm body just seems disingenuous. The idea is that Wallace will make Hartline and Bess better, which doesn't seem too far fetched to me. Bess in particular gets overlooked a lot, but I really think that guy can thrive in an offense where he is playing primarily in the slot.
I actually think Quinn is pretty decent, and rivaled JJ for the best in their secondary. Regardless, with losing him and seeing just how hilariously bad the Texans got lit up in the pass game in the last half of the year, it might be raining TD's in Texas this season.
B For Bendetta
Member
Just read through the Jim Thomas chat on STLToday from yesterday. He gave the impression that the Rams are really high on Austin for the 16th pick, taking him over Patterson and Sheldon Richardson. He would certainly give us speed. Combined with Givens and Cook we would have some fast ass players
lol, it's not like Thompson is consistently missing the playoffs. 8-8? C'mon. The only time they aren't playoff contenders is when they go through institutional shifts like a head coaching change or a QB change.
Chasing free agents is what puts you into the perpetual boom and bust cycle.
No, not a chance. Not even close. "A lot more looks?" Are you insane? They had like 70 catches apiece. Are the Dolphins going to Stafford it up and throw 60 times a game?
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I don't think you realize how bad our safety play was last year. Just having someone somewhat competent back there would make a colossal difference.
The defense was better when Jones was playing but he really didn't end up playing that much. Seahawks got him on a pretty cheap deal and I'm guessing they offered him at least the same to stay. I'm curious to see how much he gets after playing only half the season, though I wish we could get him to re-sign for the same amount though it does seem like Detroit is about to overpay for him.
D-Rich and Pead are some fast fuckers as well.
I'd love Austin at 16, fills a huge need at KR/PR as well. But I'd also still like to have some more reliability from a bigger WR. Cook could help in that area, though.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
Fine, let me rephrase: "quality" looks. Better matchups, more opportunity to pick up YAC, more opportunity to exploit the middle of the field farther downfield, etc. All of this changes for the better when you pick up a guy like Wallace. When a defense looks at your team and gets to assign their best CB to Brian Hartline what are your chances of success? Now, how does that change when Wallace becomes that primary guy, and Hartline and Bess are suddenly not the biggest concern? Don't you at least agree that Hartline and Bess are expected to be better with Wallace on the team? Why else give Hartline the big contract?
B For Bendetta
Member
For sure. Quick developing could really solve some issues...
Bears thought so too. "Problem" (if you want to call it that) is that Wallace is an enticing target.
The Bears went from having no one with more than 800 yards receiving to having Marshall almost double it with 1500.
Their total receiving yards went down. From 3346 in 2011 to 3298 in 2012.
It isn't quite as simple as plug-and-play stats with wide outs. Obviously everyone is hoping it works out, you're the Next Great Hope to defeat evil!
They are both great players, let me state this first, but Heath Miller and Antonio Brown owe a nice chunk of their success to Mike Wallace, that's the type of thing a guy of his skill level brings. He attracts either of the Top 2 corners, and you pretty much have to respect him with a safety quite often as well.
Absolutely will signing Wallace help Hartline and Bess.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
Do you really think you're going to get much more than you've already seen out of Davonne Bess? Wallace or no, we've seen what Bess is - just a guy. Wallace's presence won't change that. Let's see Hartline produce in consecutive seasons before we start claiming the Dolphins have dual 1000 yard receivers.
I'm sure the Dolphins realize this too as reportedly they're looking to get Gibson as well.
I don't see how the Lions afford all three. Crazy that Megatron, Stafford and Suh account for 42% of the cap.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
So what are you getting at? It's better to have three or four WR's who are all almost good enough to be number 1's than a clear number 1 and a few decent guys behind him? If the Dolphins had that luxury available to them right now I might be with you. I definitely envy the Packers ability to groom quality WR's instead of depending on huge FA signings like this, but considering the current state of the team it seems like a fairly reasonable approach.
Bess has developed a reputation as a great third down receiver and an excellent route runner, plus he has exceptionally good hands. He isn't spectacular but I think he could potentially fit that role very nicely. And Wallace's presence could most certainly change his role because of all the attention he will demand.
Eh, you were kinda mediocre in 2004-6 and during the pre-Favrian Packers, but I never heard of any attendance issues in Green Bay.
Chasing the seats is an issue in Miami, and it is very a much problem with the NYJ (hence Woody's craziness). The Giants sell out even when they're garbage (the mid 90's), pretty much them and the New York Rangers are the only teams in the tristate that can do so.
My point is that I don't think you are going to see a huge jump in the overall effectiveness of the passing game. It'll look a lot flashier and I am sure if you asked anyone on the street if the Bears had a better passing attack in 2012 than 2011 they'd say "fuck yeah by a country mile" but I don't see there being a massive impact.
It's why I don't want the Packers to ever sign a FA wide out, to ever extend a wide out for big dollars or to ever draft a wide out in the first round. Good receivers are a product of a good system and a good arm and a good offensive line. They don't create. And when they are amazingly excellent football players like Megatron, they become less and less valuable the closer you get to the goal line because it's easy to key on a receiver when you don't have much else to worry about.
Give me 4 #2's over a #1 and 3 #3's any day of the week.
Just saw Soap's contract with the Eagles, bigger than I thought. NT is not as important to the Niners anymore though, and he would've been a continued luxury.
If RJF signs something similar-ish the Niners might be looking at 4 compensatory picks now in the 3rd and/or 4th round next year. I'm not expecting us to sign either Landry or Smith, and anything else will be small, one year deals.
I like it.
If RJF signs something similar-ish the Niners might be looking at 4 compensatory picks now in the 3rd and/or 4th round next year. I'm not expecting us to sign either Landry or Smith, and anything else will be small, one year deals.
I like it.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
This makes a ton of sense to me, but if I agree with you 100% I have a lot less to look forward to. Right now I'm just happy Tannehill will have a legitimate number 1 guy to throw to.
DeaconKnowledge
Member
The big secret of the Steelers offense was that Antonio Brown started to steal catches from Wallace. When that happened Wallace started getting self conscious and developed his drop problem.
I think people are really overestimating Wallace's value and generally the value of receivers in general. With the exception of maybe like 2 or 3 guys, this is one of those positions that is the easiest to replace if your team knows what it is doing and has some patience.
I agree that he will improve a team if he returns to his form in 2010 and 2011 (no guarantee but if he is not a fuckhead he should be able to). But not as much as Dolphins fan want to believe. It is just one piece of the puzzle, and a smaller piece than fans seem to think.
I don't think so! Like I said, it'll be a fuck of a lot more exciting offense to watch.
I think Bess will be the biggest winner in Miami from the Wallace signing. Full time in the slot with single coverage and he should have a big year. Great route runner, great hands and quick.
With Miami's limited WR group last year he was stuck playing outside more, which isn't his game at all.
With Miami's limited WR group last year he was stuck playing outside more, which isn't his game at all.
BlackGhost
Banned
No idea who this is, and I don't expect anyone to
Quinn wasn't the problem a lack of pass rush from the olb'ers was. Fuck Quinn for even considering the cesspool that is Detroit
Dutch Gronk
Banned
DOG POUND! WHOOOF WHOOOF!
The_Darkest_Red
Member
I know WR is not as important as a lot of people might think and can be a very overrated position at times but if you watched every Dolphins game last year you would see how much the offense was stifled as a result of not having a deep threat guy with some real speed. Hartline is good but he isn't going to do much against most team's best corner, and Bess is much less effective when a team is creeping up towards the line because they don't respect the deep ball (and when he's forced to play outside of the slot). The Dolphins needed a guy like Wallace, period.
And by the way, they still have nine picks in the draft. It's not like they can't draft a late WR or two and start grooming them now, but this regime is relatively new (even Ireland in a way now that Parcells is gone) so it's going to take some time. In the meantime they absolutely had to have a guy like Wallace on the roster if they wanted to have a shot at competing, and considering their cap situation it just made sense.
And by the way, they still have nine picks in the draft. It's not like they can't draft a late WR or two and start grooming them now, but this regime is relatively new (even Ireland in a way now that Parcells is gone) so it's going to take some time. In the meantime they absolutely had to have a guy like Wallace on the roster if they wanted to have a shot at competing, and considering their cap situation it just made sense.
ActStriker
Member
Ravens released Bernard Pollard.
Dutch Gronk
Banned
You know what would be pretty sweet? If you traded Bess to us.
I hope he retires.
BlackGhost
Banned
Dammit Dutch..................
It's DAWG! Why can't you be more hip like the rest of us!