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NFL Offseason Thread 2013 - Here comes the wait

Wes

venison crêpe
:(

I don't care if Peters comes back or not. That is a position the Eagles should look to improve when they have a chance. I don't know if Joeckel can play the other side. They could go with...

Peters-Mathis-Kelce-Herremans-Joeckel

He probably only plays LT though.

I was watching some pre-draft coverage on nfl.com and they were talking up another OT who played well at the senior bowl. I think it was Eric Fisher. I've seen him go in to the top 10 of mocks recently.
 
I don't think so either. It's just how they view the position is all. I think you factor in motivation and the role the guy is playing and he hasn't done much with what he's gotten. I just don't see it as a fit and didn't when he was drafted either (even moreso in that they moved up to get him).

*comeatmebro.gif*
No, I think you have a point there - though I think it's a product of their offense. Saints like those vertical routes which makes you see runners coming a mile away. Still, Ingram has shown little spark in two years. Fine the deck is stacked against you - do something about it. The Saints drafted Bush and he managed to work his way into their offense even in a non traditional role.
 
Still, Ingram has shown little spark in two years. Fine the deck is stacked against you - do something about it. The Saints drafted Bush and he managed to work his way into their offense even in a non traditional role.
That actually brings up a good point as well. I know Bush was injury prone at times but look at the difference in how he was used with the Saints to what he's done as a Dolphin. Bush is a bit more versatile in that he could come out of the backfield and provide the role that Darren Sproles is filling now in that offense but he never seized that power runner role for them.

Bush goes to the Dolphins and all of a sudden becomes a between the tackles downhill running back. No one believed he could be that guy either.

Ingram doesn't have that kind of versatility, IMO which leaves him to vie for the same role that Pierre Thomas and Ivory inhabit. It could be that the Saints drafted him for the eventuality of Thomas moving on and then giving him a bigger role when that arrives. Then the question becomes - didn't they already have Ivory?
 
That actually brings up a good point as well. I know Bush was injury prone at times but look at the difference in how he was used with the Saints to what he's done as a Dolphin. Bush is a bit more versatile in that he could come out of the backfield and provide the role that Darren Sproles is filling now in that offense but he never seized that power runner role for them.

Bush goes to the Dolphins and all of a sudden becomes a between the tackles downhill running back. No one believed he could be that guy either.

Ingram doesn't have that kind of versatility, IMO which leaves him to vie for the same role that Pierre Thomas and Ivory inhabit. It could be that the Saints drafted him for the eventuality of Thomas moving on and then giving him a bigger role when that arrives. Then the question becomes - didn't they already have Ivory?

With a first round pick?!

I get what you're saying, but remember - the Saints traded UP to get Ingram. A 2011 second and first in 2012 is a high price for a replacement to a utility back.
 
With a first round pick?!

I get what you're saying, but remember - the Saints traded UP to get Ingram. A 2011 second and first in 2012 is a high price for a replacement to a utility back.
Exactly why I question the pick when you've already got Chris Ivory, PT and go out and sign Darren Sproles to a four year contract.;)
 

Goro Majima

Kitty Genovese Member
In retrospect, Mark Ingram is a great example of why drafting a running back that high for a pass first team is a waste. Yet draft after draft people wonder when Green Bay will get their big name back.

Ha!
 

effzee

Member
What are you on? No way in hell was Rose a top 5 player at that time and no way in hell was he better than Wade. Now? yes, Wade has massively regressed since Lebron has been there. I could give a shit who is MVP because it's almost always completely wrong.Too bad Rose is always injured, really like the kid. I'm speaking under the impression that Bosh doesn't go to CHI as well. Would Chicago be better than Miami? Unquestionably but that's not my point. You are arguing the point of a stacked team while I'm arguing the mind set Lebron had in making his decision. He chose to shack up with another top 3 talent at the time with an additional agreement that Bosh would come with the hopes of a super friend victory. The kind of conversations those three had to have, that they should combine their talents instead of going against each other bother me. If Lebron chose to be the final piece to make a solid team a contender like CHI, I would not only respect that, but have found it smart. Far smarter than going to Miami but that's relatively moot because Miami just won the big dance anyway.

What rank would you have given D. Rose then in 2010? You know the year he won the MVP? If not top 3 then what? You think he was some scrub at the time?

What difference does it make if he is considered top 5 and not top 3? He was already the established franchise player who was turning the Bulls around. Point is either team for Lebron would be considered teaming up with another superstar to win a championship rather than winning it all by himself. And again what difference does it make what his mindset is or was? Bosh was in never in competition with D Wade or Lebron. Different position and completely below their level. And even then Miami was so bad there was no rivalry between Wade and Lebron. This wasn't MJ joining forces with Isiah because he couldn't get past them.

This is the modern NBA. Players bitch, moan, and complain their way onto the 2-4 big market teams where they can both win and get paid. Kobe bitched his way onto the Lakers. Dwight cried his way out of Orlando. KG and Ray Allen teamed up with Paul Piece to make their own super team. Carmelo forced his trade to NYK. Darren Williams to Brooklyn. Probably some more examples I am forgetting but you get the point.

Why does it matter what his "mindset" was while he made his decision? He wanted to win a ring so Cleveland was automatically out. Then it was between the Knicks, Heat, and Bulls. Heat and Bulls were probably tied because they already had established top 5 talent. Knicks had nobody but was offering him the biggest market, MSG, and chance to become the billionaire superstar everyone assumed he was more concerned with becoming. He chose Miami mainly because they all decided to take cuts (Wade, Bosh, and Lebron) to play together. I honestly think him going to Chicago would have been the exact same thing in terms of perception and production.

And I also guarantee that if he was smart and savvy about how he left Cleveland no one would have a problem with him to the extent they do now.
 

Goro Majima

Kitty Genovese Member
Mccarron is a 22 year old male being challenged on his manhood. Ignoring Dockett was never going to happen.

Dockett is one of those jerks at the club who hits on your wife/girlfriend and wonders why you get so upset about it saying that the lady should choose for herself.

Edit: I'm late to the Xbox news, sounds like I'm going with PS4 next gen. I imagine that the games will be identical again anyway.
 
I hear enough DRose is the greatest bullshit all over Chicago, do we really need it in the NFL thread? He hasn't done shit, regular season NBA is a joke so Idc about the Bulls and their amazing regular season statistics because that shit is practice in the NBA for any team with it's eyes on a ship.

Also, Kobe didn't bitch his way off the Hornets. The Lakers told the Hornets during that pick that they want Kobe. It is true Kobe did not want to sign with the Hornets, but he never had to complain. Hornets didn't want to sign him at the time and if the trade wasn't happening they'd have drafted some1 else.
 

Goro Majima

Kitty Genovese Member
Am I the only one who thinks she looks like a man?

No, she's missing some curves and for her age she looks rough. Like an NFL cheerleader vs. an SEC cheerleader despite being the same age.

What if Sony follows suit?

Sony wins next gen if they don't. If they do? I'll probably still get the PS4 since Xbox "exclusives" have been lame for a few years now. May end up getting both, who knows!
 

cdyhybrid

Member
Dockett is one of those jerks at the club who hits on your wife/girlfriend and wonders why you get so upset about it saying that the lady should choose for herself.

Edit: I'm late to the Xbox news, sounds like I'm going with PS4 next gen. I imagine that the games will be identical again anyway.

I don't play used games really, so it'll depend on what console my friends get. Hell, I don't even play console games anymore unless I want to play something with friends (shooters and sports games mostly).
 
Sounds like theyll have a CD key type system to bypass used games.
As a primarily PC gamer, complete non-issue to me. If it pushes these manufacturers to move their ecosystems to something more steam like with full digital distribution and the requsite discounts that come along with it - I'm good with it. Used game values don't mean as much if game prices are brought down lower.

The problem is that console gaming has moved more into the realm of PC Gaming with patches, etc without any of the benefits of the more open PC Market.

The persistent online connection is the more problematic issue.
 
As a primarily PC gamer, complete non-issue to me. If it pushes these manufacturers to move their ecosystems to something more steam like with full digital distribution and the requsite discounts that come along with it - I'm good with it.

The problem is that console gaming has moved more into the realm of PC Gaming with patches, etc without any of the benefits of the more open PC Market.

:jnc yeah.

I don't see why this is the straw that broke the camel's back. Console gamers have proved time and again that they can take whatever schlong console makers want to ram in them.
 

Slo

Member
Always online

No used games.

As for the news I don't think people will have much of a choice. I'm sure MS wouldn't be doing this alone. They're probably backed by prominent 3rd parties. I'd also bet that Sony plans to do this too.

That's fine. I won't be putting more actual dollars into the gaming industry. Games will either have to come down in price or I'll be buying fewer games. You want my money? Give me a reason it give it to you, bitches.
 

Bowser

Member
40 page thread?!

nRO2i.gif


lol not like I care, last console game I played was Super Mario Galaxy 2. I don't even own anymore consoles, although I played some Halo 4 co-op with my bro over xmas break.

Might pick up a 3DSXL tho
 

Goro Majima

Kitty Genovese Member
I tend to buy used games (mostly in b2g1 sales or something) because that's the only way to bring the prices down to my perceived value. I've probably been distorted by Steam sales but there is zero chance that there will ever be prices that low for console games. A quick glance at the PSN store or Nintendo EShop makes that very clear. Those prices are currently competing with used prices but they aren't lowering them so what in the world would make them lower the prices without used sales?

However, as lazy as it sounds, Id probably play my console games more if I didn't have to swap the discs out. Would also be nice if they didn't take a few minutes to boot up.
 
:jnc yeah.

I don't see why this is the straw that broke the camel's back. Console gamers have proved time and again that they can take whatever schlong console makers want to ram in them.
I should be more clear in saying that's in a non-issue for me because there really is no such thing as a resell market for PC games anymore. Mainly because its hard to give a shit about getting money back when I'm buying games 25-35% off the base price right out of them gate with places like GMG and Steam sales available.

If that is the future of console games in purely digital form, I have no issue with it. The $60 console game needs to die.

I tend to buy used games (mostly in b2g1 sales or something) because that's the only way to bring the prices down to my perceived value. I've probably been distorted by Steam sales but there is zero chance that there will ever be prices that low for console games. A quick glance at the PSN store or Nintendo EShop makes that very clear. Those prices are currently competing with used prices but they aren't lowering them so what in the world would make them lower the prices without used sales?
There is no used sales market to fall back on in the PC space...what makes them offer a recently released game for 30% off on Steam? Remove the used sales market and detach yourself for traditional retail pricing where the publisher is seeing more direct money and you can do whatever the fuck you want with the pricing of your game.
 

Godslay

Banned
I'm going to wait it out on Orbis/Durango. Hopefully by that time WiiU has some good games, so it won't make the wait tough. I still think one of those two consoles aren't going to make it.
 
I can't believe Ahmad Bradshaw is gone. To some extent I knew Canty would go, and even Boley after watching his playing time decline down the stretch. But Bradshaw? Coughlin loves the guy and Giants have always gone with 3 decent RBs. I'm sorry, but Ryan Torain and Kregg Lumpkin showed me zilch to warrant having either around. Plus Andre Brown is coming off a pretty serious injury... Giants are going to have to get another RB anyway.

Farewell sweet prince, lets us look back at some great Bradshaw moments:

2007-2008 - Bradshaw 88 yard TD in Buffalo to help clinch a playoff spot

Ahmad Bradshaw destroys Brodney Poole


bradshawboogie.jpg


bradshawboogie2.jpg


So one last time, Giants fans... let us remember the BRADSHAW BOOGIE.
 

Goro Majima

Kitty Genovese Member
If that is the future of console games in purely digital form, I have no issue with it. The $60 console game needs to die.

Unfortunately, those 60 dollar games probably subsidize the cost of cheap PC games so I doubt those will be going away.

I miss the old days when long games like RPGs were super expensive but shorter games were cheaper and it all made sense. I'd pay upwards of 80 bucks for a new Tales or Yakuza but I'm not dropping that much on a 5 hour action game. Those military shooters just need to hurry up and go F2P already with pay to win options (and we all know it will happen).
 
I should be more clear in saying that's in a non-issue for me because there really is no such thing as a resell market for PC games anymore. Mainly because its hard to give a shit about getting money back when I'm buying games 25-35% off the base price right out of them gate with places like GMG and Steam sales available.

If that is the future of console games in purely digital form, I have no issue with it. The $60 console game needs to die.

I really don't think Microsoft will be following the Steam model. They have proven that they want to keep costs high. The number one reason to kill of the used market is the threat it causes to price stability. If the publishers control everything in the console space they'll have no reason to drop anything shy of an abject bomb.

EA and Activision have already come out and said they have a distaste for the Steam model of cheap games and sales constantly. Think you're gonna buy that copy of MW5 for a discount behind that MS paywall?
 

Talon

Member
I'm just going to build a desktop come Haswell release time and then call console gaming quits, I think.

Or buy a Wii U when the next real Mario comes out.
Unfortunately, those 60 dollar games probably subsidize the cost of cheap PC games so I doubt those will be going away.

I miss the old days when long games like RPGs were super expensive but shorter games were cheaper and it all made sense. I'd pay upwards of 80 bucks for a new Tales or Yakuza but I'm not dropping that much on a 5 hour action game. Those military shooters just need to hurry up and go F2P already with pay to win options (and we all know it will happen).
SNES prices really did make sense. Chrono Trigger was $80 worth of gameplay.
 
I really don't think Microsoft will be following the Steam model. They have proven that they want to keep costs high. The number one reason to kill of the used market is the threat it causes to price stability. If the publishers control everything in the console space they'll have no reason to drop anything shy of an abject bomb.

EA and Activision have already come out and said they have a distaste for the Steam model of cheap games and sales constantly. Think you're gonna buy that copy of MW5 for a discount behind that MS paywall?
You won't buy it behind the Steam pay wall either but plenty of other publishers have no issue with that model. I'm not pie in the sky enough to believe this will happen this generation as retail will not be cut out when these new consoles release but eventually when we reach the point where games have truly moved to a primarily digital medium - pricing will absolutley need to be revisited.
 
You won't buy it behind the Steam pay wall either but plenty of other publishers have no issue with that model. I'm not pie in the sky enough to believe this will happen this generation as retail will not be cut out when these new consoles release but eventually when we reach the point where games have truly moved to a primarily digital medium - pricing will absolutley need to be revisited.

Steam is not the console space though. Remember, Steam is more fully populated by smaller and mid tier developers who wouldn't have a name were it not for that service. The consoles are different, especially after this PS360 generation.

Steambox may be the wildcard, but we'll have to see.
 

Talon

Member
Microsoft still charges out the wazoo for certification. It's absurd to think they'd continue to do that in next gen - with the way the Windows App Store is set up.

I really think we're past peak with the console market. I welcome the destruction of vidya game consoles.
 
Steam is not the console space though. Remember, Steam is more fully populated by smaller and mid tier develop who wouldn't have a name were it not for that service. The consoles are different, especially after this PS360 generation.
Exactly why the console space game pricing is unsustainable. As long as there is no "middle" in the console space (i.e massive hit or bust), those smaller mid-tier publishers will run to where they can make money. it's funny hearing console folks bitching about lack of original titles while they continue to buy Call Of Duty 14.
 
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