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NHL 2011-2012 Offseason thread of Cash Rules Everything Around Me

Y

yankeehater

Member
brucewaynegretzky said:
BOTH for Bobby Ryan!?! No thank you.



Don't even try explaining this line of reasoning with him. It's not worth it.
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If they get Ryan I bet it is for those guys + pics. I really like Voracek but Ryan is a much better player and you say yourself that Read has maxed out his abilities. You actually have to give up something good to get back a great player.

You are so inconsistent when it comes to stuff like this. You keep saying that big market teams can structure contracts such that they get an advantage compared to small market teams, and yet you keep saying that the Flyers are going to be fucked by the cap. They are way under the cap this year and they could easily take on the difference in cap hit between Nash and Scheen's contract.
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
yankeehater said:
If they get Ryan I bet it is for those guys + pics. I really like Voracek but Ryan is a much better player and you say yourself that Read has maxed out his abilities. You actually have to give up something good to get back a great player.

You are so inconsistent when it comes to stuff like this. You keep saying that big market teams can structure contracts such that they get an advantage compared to small market teams, and yet you keep saying that the Flyers are going to be fucked by the cap. They are way under the cap this year and they could easily take on the difference in cap hit between Nash and Scheen's contract.
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No the Flyers are alright right now. They CAN structure contracts like that, but they have to not overpay if they're gonna do it. See, Bryz and Danny B.

And I have no problem losing Read, but Read + Voracek is a cap hit AND an overpayment.

EDIT: Bobby Ryan had 57 points last year. Voracek had 49 and Read had 47.
 
Y

yankeehater

Member
I think that Ryan has a much higher celling then Voracek. Read's production would be easy to replace. I bet Wellwood could put up similar numbers giving the same ice time/situation. I would love for the Flyers to get Ryan for nothing but I doubt it happens.
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
yankeehater said:
I think that Ryan has a much higher celling then Voracek. Read's production would be easy to replace. I bet Wellwood could put up similar numbers giving the same ice time/situation. I would love for the Flyers to get Ryan for nothing but I doubt it happens.
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Voracek is 22. Ryan is 25. Talking about their "ceilings" is also kinda nuts. Voracek has had one year on a real NHL team.... On top of that Voracek will likely sign for a few million less. Giving him up for Ryan just doesn't make sense. Read + a pick? Sure, why not. But the Flyers don't need Ryan and Ryan wants out. Flyers have the leverage. No reason to accept a deal just to bring him in. He doesn't really improve the team. Especially if we lose two SLIGHTLY lower producing roster players just to add one.

This isn't basketball. Depth is more important than big name players.
 
C

Cactus

Banned
brucewaynegretzky said:
Voracek is 22. Ryan is 25. Talking about their "ceilings" is also kinda nuts. Voracek has had one year on a real NHL team.... On top of that Voracek will likely sign for a few million less. Giving him up for Ryan just doesn't make sense. Read + a pick? Sure, why not. But the Flyers don't need Ryan and Ryan wants out. Flyers have the leverage. No reason to accept a deal just to bring him in. He doesn't really improve the team. Especially if we lose two SLIGHTLY lower producing roster players just to add one.

This isn't basketball. Depth is more important than big name players.
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How do the Flyers have leverage? There will probably be over 20 teams submitting offers for Ryan.
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
Cactus said:
How do the Flyers have leverage? There will probably be over 20 teams submitting offers for Ryan.
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Flyers are competing with 20 other teams, yes. But ALL those teams have leverage over the Ducks which will drop down offers. On top of that the Flyers shouldn't care if someone else gets him, cuz like I said we don't need him.

The Flyers should not be looking to "win" this bidding war. Just submit a fair offer and be willing to SLIGHTLY bump it up if the Ducks show strong interest.

KingHenrik30 said:
Neither Read or Voracek are centers....
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Read can play center. We just have 8 billion of them....
 
Y

yankeehater

Member
Cactus said:
How do the Flyers have leverage? There will probably be over 20 teams submitting offers for Ryan.
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Yeah I am sure the Ducks will have their pick of offers. I really think this is the year that Ryan really puts it together and becomes a great player. I think he improves whatever team gets him.
 
K

KernelPanic

Member
Didn't Ryan want to play in Philly ? Don't his parents live there or something ?

I bet he walks when his contract is up (wherever he is) and signs there.
 
K

KingHenrik30

Member
brucewaynegretzky said:
Read is a natural center. Flyers just use him on the wing because we have BETTER centers. We have arguably 5 guys who could play second line center on other teams.
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Didn't know that. Regardless, he's only had 1 year in the league where he didn't primarily play the position. Don't think that's what they are looking for.
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
CrankyJay said:
Meh, word is Sabres are interested in Bobby Ryan but Anaheim want Ennis a part of the deal and I don't think Buffalo is willing to deal him. Not sure how I'd feel about losing Ennis. Past AHL rookie of the year, did awesome when he was moved from wing to center last year.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nd0H5qQRdxg
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I like Ennis a lot actually, but he's had me worried over the last two years as to where his development is going. If it's just him and like a second rounder for Ryan I think that's a pretty awesome deal. Ennis is a pretty small dude and doesn't seem to be bulking up.
 
C

CrankyJay

Banned
brucewaynegretzky said:
I like Ennis a lot actually, but he's had me worried over the last two years as to where his development is going. If it's just him and like a second rounder for Ryan I think that's a pretty awesome deal. Ennis is a pretty small dude and doesn't seem to be bulking up.
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Sure, that's legit, but I think his speed makes up for some of that lack in size. He could be a Briere 2.0.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
CraigJButton: Per @NHLAdamK it must be nice for Dallas Stars to hear Jagr say, "Montreal was my 1st choice but they weren't interested."
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LOL
 
M

Merguson

Banned
Dreger said:
Carolina Hurricanes are no longer persuing Rick Nash. Cost way too high. CBJ believed to be after Jeff Skinner. Non-starter.
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Jeff Skinner? Had a great rookie season, rough sophomore season but he could put up the same amount of points Nash is currently producing.

This is going to drag out all summer isn't it?
 
H

Heretic

Member
CrankyJay said:
Sure, that's legit, but I think his speed makes up for some of that lack in size. He could be a Briere 2.0.
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You know nothing! This season its all about getting bigger for the Ducks! We're not trading Bobby for small dudes. Barstool wants to get bigger. Couple of seasons ago he said we needed to get faster. And they did but in doing so they got smaller. Now it's about getting bigger. Next season? Who knows. Eventually he'll get it right...
 
C

CrankyJay

Banned
Heretic said:
You know nothing! This season its all about getting bigger for the Ducks! We're not trading Bobby for small dudes. Barstool wants to get bigger. Couple of seasons ago he said we needed to get faster. And they did but in doing so they got smaller. Now it's about getting bigger. Next season? Who knows. Eventually he'll get it right...
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Don't shoot the messenger, brah! Bigger/tougher to play against is what the Sabres are going for as well...well...except for guys like Hodgson and Ennis an Gerbe(lol).
 
C

Cake Boss

Banned
LOL I wouldnt do Skinner for Nash, let alone in a package, same with Cotoure in SJ. Good luck Howsen, the market is shrinking and your demands are dumber than ever.
 
K

KingHenrik30

Member
Heretic said:
You know nothing, Jon Snow! This season its all about getting bigger for the Ducks! We're not trading Bobby for small dudes. Barstool wants to get bigger. Couple of seasons ago he said we needed to get faster. And they did but in doing so they got smaller. Now it's about getting bigger. Next season? Who knows. Eventually he'll get it right...
Click to expand...

Ygritte?
 
M

Montresor

Member
I remember Burkie holding out all summer long and through the subsequent trade deadline for a good deal on Kaberle. He ended up getting a 1st (we used a 2nd to trade up and draft potential power forward Biggs), Colborne (hopefully becomes a decent 2nd line centre), and a 2nd (converted into Liles, now signed to a hometown discount).

Then again Kaberle didn't publically request a trade and Burke didn't publically throw Kaberle under the bus.

I can see Gillis doing something similar with Luongo. Whether or not there is no room for Luongo anymore, he is an incredible asset, an elite goalie signed at a competitive cap hit for a long time. Gillis's pride (like Burke's) will cause him to hold on to Luongo until he gets a fair deal. He won't be forced to dump Luongo.

Too bad about Howsen and the Nash situation. He is going to be forced to dump Nash.
 
F

Foreign Jackass

Member
Seriously, the only guys on this team I'd give for Rick Nash are Plekanec/Desharnais, Bourque, Kaberle, Gionta, picks and/or shitty prospects.

And throw in Gomez.

I wouldn't give MaxPac, Gorges, Markov, Subban, Yemelin, Price, Cole, etc. for a guy who's never proven anything.
 
Y

yankeehater

Member
Montresor said:
I remember Burkie holding out all summer long and through the subsequent trade deadline for a good deal on Kaberle. He ended up getting a 1st (we used a 2nd to trade up and draft potential power forward Biggs), Colborne (hopefully becomes a decent 2nd line centre), and a 2nd (converted into Liles, now signed to a hometown discount).

Then again Kaberle didn't publically request a trade and Burke didn't publically throw Kaberle under the bus.

I can see Gillis doing something similar with Luongo. Whether or not there is no room for Luongo anymore, he is an incredible asset, an elite goalie signed at a competitive cap hit for a long time. Gillis's pride (like Burke's) will cause him to hold on to Luongo until he gets a fair deal. He won't be forced to dump Luongo.

Too bad about Howsen and the Nash situation. He is going to be forced to dump Nash.
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By who? If he doesnt trade him then Nash has to play for them. Howson either gets a package he is happy with, or he gets another year out of their best player.
 
C

Cake Boss

Banned
We're not making money, and that's one reason we need to fix our system. We need to fix how much we're spending right now. [The Wild's] revenues are fine. We're down a little bit in attendance, but we're up in sponsorships, we're up in TV revenue. And so the revenue that we're generating is not the issue as much as our expenses. And [the Wild's] biggest expense by far is player salaries." — Craig Leipold, Minnesota Wild owner, to Star Tribune on April 11, 2012
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LOL save us from ourselves.
 
K

Kave_Man

come in my shame circle
Foreign Jackass said:
Seriously, the only guys on this team I'd give for Rick Nash are Plekanec/Desharnais, Bourque, Kaberle, Gionta, picks and/or shitty prospects.

And throw in Gomez.

I wouldn't give MaxPac, Gorges, Markov, Subban, Yemelin, Price, Cole, etc. for a guy who's never proven anything.
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Solo...nobody is taking his contract man. :(
 
K

KingHenrik30

Member
yankeehater said:
Right but he cant hold out. No one is going to trade for a guy that is holding out. Nash is also being super picky, if the reports about him only having 3 teams on his list are true.
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He doesn't have to hold out. There are other things he could do.

And there are more than 3 teams on his list, and it's been said he could expand it. But Howson is turning away other interested parties with his ludicrous demands. What would it matter if 29 teams where on his list if the demands where insane like they are?
 
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