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Now that the PS4 has already outsold the Wii U, where does Nintendo go from here?

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K

Krev

Unconfirmed Member
JoeTheBlow said:
Massive price drop and a concerted effort to focus on it being a kids console.
The gamer market is gone, with the lack of third party support, the only thing they can do now is sell to parents looking to buy little Timmy/jenny their first console.
Click to expand...
I was surprised to learn a cousin bought the Mario & Luigi bundle for his young kids at Christmas, so they could play Skylanders.

There's still some hope for the U in this niche, but spending big money on games like Bayonetta 2 or X is a waste at this point.
 
S

Shmuely Bully

Member
Lunar said:
Say that again when the gamecube had better hardware the the PS2 or when the N64 had better hardware then the PS1. This the most powerful console does the best is bull shit. There has never been a generation where the most powerful console has one. Maybe the ps4 might break that cycle but nintendos problem is third party plain and simple.
Click to expand...

The Gamecube launched late with the PS2 having already sold ~20M and it still had better/more equivalent third-party support than the Wii and Wii U. The GCN also had to deal with the stupid proprietary mini discs Nintendo used. I won't even bother treading over old ground with the N64, if you don't know why that had issues with third-party support then it's only because you choose to ignore reality.

You can choose to continue to deliberately ignore and misinterpret my points (the Wii and Wii U are a half decade or more behind their direct competitors in performance which is a situation that no serious competitor has put themselves into before), or you can accept that Nintendo has a problem. It's up to you.
 
C

Coolwhip

Banned
Daingurse said:
I recently had to explain to a friend of mine, a middle class guy in his 40's, pretty typical American male, what a Wii-U was. His son wanted one for Christmas, but he didn't even know what a Wii-U was. I explained to him that it was the new Nintendo console, and tha that the kid probably wants it for Mario 3D World. Hell, I got Nintendo a sale. I've never seen such brand confusion.

The name hurt way more, than a fucking product's name ever should!
Click to expand...

Yeah exactly. I'm not saying Nintendo hasn't screwed up MANY other things aswell, but the name... goddamn.

If average Joe has to put in effort to understand if something is a new product... terrible.
 
M

MyBodyisReady

Neo Member
They need to make it so you can use two programs at once. If I could activate Netflix via my Wii U, and play off-tv play with a game AT THE SAME TIME. Holy crap.
 
Baki

Baki

Member
Neff said:
Actually his point was that declaring Wii U 'dead' is vindicated by PS4 selling 30% more in the same release timeframe. PS4 may continue to sell as well (or with its own impending drought, and negative word of mouth regarding lack of features and bland software, it may not), but he's outright ignoring the fact that PS4's launch doesn't represent a significant comparative lead.



https://www.google.com/search?q=wii..._sm=122&espv=210&q=wii+u+3.06+million+shipped

Some say sold, some say shipped, I guess you can take your pick based on preference.
Click to expand...

Nintendo only SOLD 1.94m units in 2012. They shipped 3.09m units. There is no confusion over this.
 
J

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
MYE said:
I'm sorry but not being able to enjoy games because the machine its on "doesn't resonate with you" is just...what? Are you five?
Consoles are not your friends. These devices are a means to play shit and you really shouldn't be so emotionally attached to a bunch of plastic and chips that looking at the thing puts you off. Thats...sad?

A good game is good even if its running on a pink, turd-shaped system called Precious.
Click to expand...

Agree.

I had a similar post yesterday but in a different light about ppl not wanting Nintendo to go 3rd party.....

Its not about the console...its the games we love to play that matter, and the features of the consoles. Ppl that love Sonic, Sega games could care less that Sega doesnt make consoles anymore. As long as they get to play Sega games. Same will happen for Nintendo. Those thinking Nintendo games all of a sudden will start sucking is really selling Nintendo short.

Yes...the Wii U is more on par with the PS3 and 360 internally....and on that note IMO Nintendo should try to compete with those consoles. Eventually PS3 and 360 games will start to dwindle, maybe faster with the success of the PS4 and XBO. Be the last console standing from last gen....market it as such, just market the Wii U more and they will be fine. And Nintendo needs to seriously distance themselves from the Wii, especially since the Wii U is backwards compatible. What I find odd tho is companies not wanting to do games for the Wii U...yet they still will for the PS3 and 360....even tho all 3 have similar internals. The Gamepad, motion controls might be the issue. For the PS3 and 360 Motion and Kinect games are a niche market.

For the post saying the PS4 sales might slow with negative things about the features and games....this is the successor to the PS3 and PS2 and PS1. Games will be there. Launch lineup looks nice to me...and its just that launch lineup. There will be a boatload more. With technically the PS4 having the better looking games....the PS4 will be fine.

Just install times alone vs the PS4....MS is lucky the XBO has the sales it has. That and many say the PS4 UI is faster, less confusing, more streamlined.
 
G

Guevara

Member
This bump make me laugh.

Nothing really has changed though. Nintendo's home console business is in just as much trouble now as it was 2 months ago: basically dead.
 
O

orioto

Good Art™
I'll use that thread to say the same thing again and again!

Nintendo's problem is software, and their conservatism. They're managing there legacy and they'll die by continuing to do that. If Disney never had renewal, but kept releasing Mickey and Donald movies for years, they would be dead.

Nintendo going third party will only be a short boom, but the problem will remain the same after a while if they don't evolve radically in there way to think games. They can have every strategy you want but not acknowledging that will only distance the problem for a short while. Nintendo games don't appeal to new people, or at least new gamers anymore. Zelda is not the game that defines how an adventure game should be today, nor Metroid for its genre. Mario is not a game relevant enough, revolutionary and modern enough, so non mario fans just have to play it. This is really a matter of state of mind. They have to stop thinking of their properties as cherished legacy which they refresh yearly. They have to act like they have everything to prove again, and show the world how it's done.

Short term wise, strengthening their portable market, where they are relevant cause it's still a domain for kids and gamers with more old schools tastes, will give them an advantage, but for how long..
 
G

GrotesqueBeauty

Banned
orioto said:
I'll use that thread to say the same thing again and again!

Nintendo's problem is software, and their conservatism. They're managing there legacy and they'll die by continuing to do that. If Disney never had renewal, but kept releasing Mickey and Donald movies for years, they would be dead.

Nintendo going third party will only be a short boom, but the problem will remain the same after a while if they don't evolve radically in there way to think games. They can have every strategy you want but not acknowledging that will only distance the problem for a short while. Nintendo games don't appeal to new people, or at least new gamers anymore. Zelda is not the game that defines how an adventure game should be today, nor Metroid for its genre. Mario is not a game relevant enough, revolutionary and modern enough, so non mario fans just have to play it. This is really a matter of state of mind. They have to stop thinking of their properties as cherished legacy which they refresh yearly. They have to act like they have everything to prove again, and show the world how it's done.
Click to expand...
Agreed. That's why I think Nintendo needs to utilize the eShop to float new ideas. Imo they should put together a few small teams lead by the most promising of their younger devs and let them loose on small scale proof of concept games. It could be new or it could be a radical re-envisioning of stagnating franchises. If one of these new concepts strikes the right chord then fast track some sort of more fleshed out retail sequel. This way they could dip their toes in the water with new IPs or idiosyncratic variations on popular franchises allowing for maximum creative freedom with conservative low risk budgets. Get smaller more focused teams excited about bringing their vision to life, and create some friendly competition amongst the most ambitious devs. Right now it seems like Nintendo's best talent is tethered to the same handful of franchises, and expected to be slavishly devoted to the same aesthetic themes within a series ad nauseum. I believe that's the perception that hurts them most among long time gamers.
 
SpinningBirdKick

SpinningBirdKick

Banned
The PS4 and Xbone aren't the competitors that Nintendo need to worry about.

Nintendo's real competition is from tablets and smartphones.

When people only want shallow time waster type titles it's hard to compete with "free".
 
G

Glass Joe

Member
GrotesqueBeauty said:
Agreed. That's why I think Nintendo needs to utilize the eShop to float new ideas. Imo they should put together a few small teams lead by the most promising of their younger devs and let them loose on small scale proof of concept games. It could be new or it could be a radical re-envisioning of stagnating franchises. If one of these new concepts strikes the right chord then fast track some sort of more fleshed out retail sequel. This way they could dip their toes in the water with new IPs or idiosyncratic variations on popular franchises allowing for maximum creative freedom with conservative low risk budgets. Get smaller more focused teams excited about bringing their vision to life, and create some friendly competition amongst the most ambitious devs. Right now it seems like Nintendo's best talent is tethered to the same handful of franchises, and expected to be slavishly devoted to the same aesthetic themes within a series ad nauseum. I believe that's the perception that hurts them most among long time gamers.
Click to expand...

I agree. I also feel that Game & Wario could have been the catalyst from the start. It didn't NEED to be a delayed disc game or even Wario themed. Could have been a bunch of cheap, purchasable experiences spread over time with maybe a disc version offered at the conclusion.
 
T

thecouncil

Banned
I'm glad this thread was bumped. I needed it to be official before I suggested where Nintendo goes from here: Ok, so, for starters, I think they need to abandon Wii U, announce their next system tomorrow and maybe start making iOS games so they have a few bucks before that new system I just mentioned comes out by the end of the year...
 
S

StevieP

Banned
thecouncil said:
I'm glad this thread was bumped. I needed it to be official before I suggested where Nintendo goes from here: Ok, so, for starters, I think they need to abandon Wii U, announce their next system tomorrow and maybe start making iOS games so they have a few bucks before that new system I just mentioned comes out by the end of the year...
Click to expand...

Sarcasm is lost on me sometimes.
 
Z

ZSaberLink

Media Create Maven
Nintendo going third party would essentially be giving up over half the company (Nintendo nearly always made more money on their HW and not their software). That's a large change for a company to swallow and it'll likely result in the death of their smaller franchises. Sure, Mario, Zelda & Pokemon, but things like Fire Emblem, etc. would likely get cut. It's probably why Nintendo won't do anything of the sort in the near term. They have enough cash to take the losses financially. The question is whether they can revive their brand in the console space. The 3DS is still selling fairly well considering all the competition, so Nintendo's IPs still have the power to move hardware.

The Wii U was clearly going to be outsold by the PS4 after the PS4's launch, and Nintendo clearly has accepted their console is basically continuing to hibernate until Mario Kart 8. Hopefully they have some sort of plan at least with 1st party titles for the 6 months after that...
 
K

Kriken

Member
thecouncil said:
I'm glad this thread was bumped. I needed it to be official before I suggested where Nintendo goes from here: Ok, so, for starters, I think they need to abandon Wii U, announce their next system tomorrow and maybe start making iOS games so they have a few bucks before that new system I just mentioned comes out by the end of the year...
Click to expand...

You forgot to add "Make a F2P mobile game that have powerups cost $2.99 and the ability to jump higher is $0.99"
 
A

atr0cious

Member
Untalkative_Bunny said:
Read this article to find out why Nintendo had less than stellar 3rd party support.
it had nothing to do with console power
Click to expand...

Thanks for this. Amazing:
“Microsoft is going after performance only, and does not understand that the game is played with software. A Nintendo is ultimately a toy. It is the most advanced machine for playing games, and it is totally different from the Microsoft product. It is just like trying to compare a sumo wrestler and pro-wrestler; they play by totally different rules. We do not consider Microsoft to be our competitor,” said Yamauchi.
Click to expand...

Never change, Nintendo.

Hmm.. Iwata in 2001:

Iwata said, “What really showed me that they [Microsoft] don’t have the experience in the entertainment industry is that they started off by announcing the $500 million marketing amount. So that’s what they’re going to go with and that’s a big number and of course it’s great because it got them in the news. But our philosophy is that you don’t start off with a number of what you’re going to market something with. Rather, you look at the product, you look at the entertainment and what you’re trying to package and what you want it to be. Then you think about the best way to convey that to the consumer. That’s what entertainment is about and that’s why we don’t go in for those types of tactics. If you come up with a product that people don’t want, it doesn’t matter how much money you spend, they’re still not going to want it. We don’t necessarily agree with how they’ve gone about doing things so far and don’t think it’s for us.”
Click to expand...
 
G

Glass Joe

Member
ZSaberLink said:
Hopefully they have some sort of plan at least with 1st party titles for the 6 months after that...
Click to expand...

Hopefully. With how they've been executing so far, I'm not expecting some huge turnaround. I'm just gonna have to be content with it being my 1st Party / Indie Machine. And maybe my Virtual Console if they can get that right. That could still be a decent little box worth having, even if it isn't my primary after enough quality stuff gets released on the other consoles.
 
F

faridmon

Member
JoeTheBlow said:
Massive price drop and a concerted effort to focus on it being a kids console.
The gamer market is gone, with the lack of third party support, the only thing they can do now is sell to parents looking to buy little Timmy/jenny their first console.
Click to expand...

Sorry for my knee-jerk reaction to this post but; Fuck that!

If anything, they should target the mature people and, maybe, even put AO only titles if they have to. Children won't buy the thing as long they see the PS4 being marketed as it is now.
 
A

atr0cious

Member
Imagine being Iwata and hearing this from people you want to make exclusive to your platform:

Miyamoto said:
“I often talk to other developers and they think that we make GameCube software childish so that we can sell lots more games to children. Whenever we have talks with licensees or potential licensees, we make a point of asking them to make their game exclusive to Nintendo. They obviously mistook it for thinking that Nintendo wanted more childish looking games. So we had a lot of meetings with the licensees, like Sega, and explained that we really needed something unique from Sega. Then they said, “Actually we wanted to make more adult orientated games, rather than making them look childish,” so I said, “Actually, that’s what we wanted to say at the beginning.”
Click to expand...

Iwata is gonna be bald in a year.
 
S

Scum

Junior Member
GrotesqueBeauty said:
Agreed. That's why I think Nintendo needs to utilize the eShop to float new ideas. Imo they should put together a few small teams lead by the most promising of their younger devs and let them loose on small scale proof of concept games. It could be new or it could be a radical re-envisioning of stagnating franchises. If one of these new concepts strikes the right chord then fast track some sort of more fleshed out retail sequel. This way they could dip their toes in the water with new IPs or idiosyncratic variations on popular franchises allowing for maximum creative freedom with conservative low risk budgets. Get smaller more focused teams excited about bringing their vision to life, and create some friendly competition amongst the most ambitious devs. Right now it seems like Nintendo's best talent is tethered to the same handful of franchises, and expected to be slavishly devoted to the same aesthetic themes within a series ad nauseum. I believe that's the perception that hurts them most among long time gamers.
Click to expand...
It's even more frustrating when you realise that NCL are more than capable of doing all. They decided to spice up Zelda and we got the brilliant Link Between Worlds. They should be doing this with their forgotten IPs to improve software output.
 
Freeman

Freeman

Banned
ZSaberLink said:
Nintendo going third party would essentially be giving up over half the company (Nintendo nearly always made more money on their HW and not their software). That's a large change for a company to swallow and it'll likely result in the death of their smaller franchises. Sure, Mario, Zelda & Pokemon, but things like Fire Emblem, etc. would likely get cut. It's probably why Nintendo won't do anything of the sort in the near term. They have enough cash to take the losses financially. The question is whether they can revive their brand in the console space. The 3DS is still selling fairly well considering all the competition, so Nintendo's IPs still have the power to move hardware.

The Wii U was clearly going to be outsold by the PS4 after the PS4's launch, and Nintendo clearly has accepted their console is basically continuing to hibernate until Mario Kart 8. Hopefully they have some sort of plan at least with 1st party titles for the 6 months after that...
Click to expand...
If anything going multiplataform would help smaller franchises. I don't think they should necessary do it, but there is definitely some potential in it. Nintendo could cut a deal with Sony where they pay no console owner fee for a while, would help Sony move consoles and Nintendo would likely make more money on their software(third party don't sell on the WiiU and the WIiU itself doesn't sell, Nintendo wouldn't lose much, the Wii was the exception and not the rule).
 
S

StuBurns

Banned
They can't announce they're dropping the Wii U, but they can ship a 3DS replacement, available in console form, and support it aggressively, while basically ignoring the Wii U.
 
G

Guamu

Member
GrotesqueBeauty said:
Agreed. That's why I think Nintendo needs to utilize the eShop to float new ideas. Imo they should put together a few small teams lead by the most promising of their younger devs and let them loose on small scale proof of concept games. It could be new or it could be a radical re-envisioning of stagnating franchises. If one of these new concepts strikes the right chord then fast track some sort of more fleshed out retail sequel. This way they could dip their toes in the water with new IPs or idiosyncratic variations on popular franchises allowing for maximum creative freedom with conservative low risk budgets. Get smaller more focused teams excited about bringing their vision to life, and create some friendly competition amongst the most ambitious devs. Right now it seems like Nintendo's best talent is tethered to the same handful of franchises, and expected to be slavishly devoted to the same aesthetic themes within a series ad nauseum. I believe that's the perception that hurts them most among long time gamers.
Click to expand...

The weird part is that it seemed they were going to start doing exactly that when new IPs and remixes of known games were released in rapid sucession on the 3ds eshop in 2012. They had pushmo, sakura samurai, dillon (x2), ketzal's, crashmo.

And then they slowed down. A lot.
 
P

Pie and Beans

Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
StuBurns said:
The Wii U's biggest competitor is the 3DS.
Click to expand...

This has always been the most hilariously perplexing part about the WiiU GamePad. Nintendo actually managed to find a way to compete exclusively with themselves and their more successful product for recreational game time.

Hey no, little Timmy, put down that 3DS. You want to play with the power of a full HD console game... at 854 x 480 resolution. No you can't have access to a 1080p TV. Wait where are we going with this.
 
I

Interceptor

Banned
Finally a PS has outsold the competition. Finally a PS which is more powerful than the competition. No need to shit on everything else though. Let it all out. All is good. Here, take a hug.
 
P

Punjabi_Hitman

Banned
Well they will have to wait a few years either way.

But the way I see them being able to compete is going in a whole New direction. Adapt PSN and LIVE's way of online. Make a home console that comes with a portable console that can also act like a phone. All at a $400 price or subsidized with a phone contract. Have all their legacy software ready to be played from the get go.

The portable and home console should play every game. Developers should only have to make one game and it works both on the home console and on the road allow your portable to run Android since it's free.

That's my suggestion. But they should wait till 2016/17. If they move too soon, they might alienate their current fanbase. Also by then the current tech will be cheaper and more efficient.
 
A

AstroNut325

Member
orioto said:
I'll use that thread to say the same thing again and again!

Nintendo's problem is software, and their conservatism. They're managing there legacy and they'll die by continuing to do that. If Disney never had renewal, but kept releasing Mickey and Donald movies for years, they would be dead.

Nintendo going third party will only be a short boom, but the problem will remain the same after a while if they don't evolve radically in there way to think games. They can have every strategy you want but not acknowledging that will only distance the problem for a short while. Nintendo games don't appeal to new people, or at least new gamers anymore. Zelda is not the game that defines how an adventure game should be today, nor Metroid for its genre. Mario is not a game relevant enough, revolutionary and modern enough, so non mario fans just have to play it. This is really a matter of state of mind. They have to stop thinking of their properties as cherished legacy which they refresh yearly. They have to act like they have everything to prove again, and show the world how it's done.

Short term wise, strengthening their portable market, where they are relevant cause it's still a domain for kids and gamers with more old schools tastes, will give them an advantage, but for how long..
Click to expand...

THIS! THIS! THIS! I don't want anymore Marios, Zeldas, and Metroids. And it's very clear that the public at large doesn't either. Overall I feel it's a combination of issues including software. I mainly ignore the Wii U because the hardware simply isn't what I would drop $300 on. I'm glad that another console can overtake the Wii U in less than 4 months time. I really hope this sends a signal to Iwata and Miyamoto. But I honestly think nothing of significance will come.
 
Malio

Malio

Member
I see Nintendo minimally supporting the Wii U until their console/handheld thing they are working on is finished. I have a very bad feeling the Wii U will be the worst supported console from them (like it is currently) and I'm more than a little bit pissed off about it.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
I have no idea where Nintendo goes from here for console. They are in a bit of a bind. Whatever they do, they have to make sure their number one is to get third parties on board from day one in a big way and keep this support for the entire platform life cycle. They can excite, surprise and delight as their second bullet point but can't abandon the main objective in their quest to make something different.
 
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