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[Coulomb_Barrier]

For years there's been rumors that Xbox branch has made no money and has lost billions. These billions have been bleeding every year. MS was not succesful to create a brand to occupy everyone's living room. Now they aim for the PC space. People will not like Win 10 Store as long as there's Steam and such. Where does MS move from this point?

Future will be interesting.

They are getting out of the console business I am certain. They will remain in the games industry via Windows but I am also sure that the budget for their endeavours here will be dramatically reduced compared to Xbox's heyday. They are transitioning slowly away from gaming as we witness it's slow marginalization in the face of their more profitable businesses. Like Windows Explorer. No, only joking.

 

[Javin98]

I forgot about that. In that case, QB may enf up selling 4+ million as well right ;D?

At this rate, I'll be surprised if Quantum Break can break the one million figure worldwide by the end of 2016.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Sure it might be profitable, but are the margins good enough for Microsoft when all their other departments do so much better. Why waste resources here when that capital can be spent in much better investments. Ms is a huge company and when something is just ”profitable,” that sounds like they're not doing well enough to have a huge impact on ms bottom line.

Considering Microsoft shut down Lionhead because they 'only' tripled their investment, you gotta think sooner or later the heads are gonna look at XBox and think 'is it really worth the billions we have put into this?'

If the XBox division is profitible it cant be by much, yeah they made a lot with 360 but also lost a tonne with the original XBox, lost over a billion dollers on the RROD and i cant imagine the XBO has been profitable overall since they have repeatedly had to do massive sales on the console (that we know had a high manufacturing cost) just to stay in the race.

 

[sense]

It went up against an established Ip with Souls, carry over of the Division, and a $40 remake.

those are some terrible excuses. a 40$ remake which is an exclusive on a competing console, division is somehow a competition a month later? i can probably give you dark souls but then again i would say they are targeting different markets(casual vs hardcore)

 

[Jack The Nipper]

At this rate, I'll be surprised if Quantum Break can break the one million figure worldwide by the end of 2016.

it will do that and more imo... Over a million for sure, people were acting like SF was a mess an would be sub a million for a long time but it hasn't been that bad.

I still expect a SF come back if they put the effort into some worth while content.

 

[jelly]

Sure it might be profitable, but are the margins good enough for Microsoft when all their other departments do so much better. Why waste resources here when that capital can be spent in much better investments. Ms is a huge company and when something is just ”profitable,” that sounds like they're not doing well enough to have a huge impact on ms bottom line.

Microsoft will use anything to make the Windows Store/ecosystem successful and Xbox is a big part of getting the mainstream momentum but I think they could easily dump Xbox if Windows Store actually took off and the console wasn't bringing in substantial profit and could be replaced by a phone, much cheaper device instead or even just a better form factor PC.

 

[chadskin]

It went up against an established Ip with Souls, carry over of the Division, and a $40 remake.

All of these games released in the same month as Alan Wake:

Red Dead Redemption (same day)
Skate 3
Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands (same day)
Split Second: Velocity (same day)
Super Mario Galaxy 2
Blur
Lost Planet 2
Modnation Racers
UFC 2010

 

[Kill3r7]

those are some terrible excuses. a 40$ remake which is an exclusive on a competing console, division is somehow a competition a month later? i can probably give you dark souls but then again i would say they are targeting different markets(casual vs hardcore)

The Division had an absolutely awful second month. A traditional month over month drop would have had them in second place easily, maybe even challenging for first.

 

[wapplew]

Guys, this is just one game under perform, a little premature with all the MS exit console business talk, at worst this just make MS back to release everything in holiday mode.

There are plenty of reason QB didn't do well, short campaign, no replay value, single player linear TPS a little out dated, bad marketing etc, none of that show MS going to quit console.

 

[jelly]

All of these games released in the same month as Alan Wake:

Red Dead Redemption (same day)
Skate 3
Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands (same day)
Split Second: Velocity (same day)
Super Mario Galaxy 2
Blur
Lost Planet 2
Modnation Racers
UFC 2010

Bizarre Creations couldn't catch a break. Didn't Microsoft screw them with the PGR4 release as well.

How does Greenberg still have his job. He releases games at absolute idiotic times among mammoth titles.

 

[Apathy]

It went up against an established Ip with Souls, carry over of the Division, and a $40 remake.

month old game, budget title with less marketing.

Seriously, people need to stop moving goal posts. A big budget AAA game with a huge marketing push. The place where it ended up was not good.

There are still a bunch of xbox one in the wild, and the fact that their biggest game for this part of the year sold terrible is a problem

 

[Javin98]

it will do that and more imo... Over a million for sure, people were acting like SF was a mess an would be sub a million for a long time but it hasn't been that bad.

I still expect a SF come back if they put the effort into some worth while content.

Unlike Street Fighter V, Quantum Break doesn't have the luxury of the console it released on doing very well everywhere. Also, the PC version of SFV isn't hampered by terrible UWP policies. Flawed comparison, IMO.

 

[Kill3r7]

Bizarre Creations couldn't catch a break. Didn't Microsoft screw them with the PGR4 release as well.

How does Greenberg still have his job. He releases games at absolute idiotic times among mammoth titles.

To be fair no one had a clue how big RDR was going to be. It was coming off the heels of Red Dead Revolver which did not sell particularly well and the Western genre was mostly dead.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

Guys, this is just one game under perform, a little premature with all the MS exit console business talk, at worst this just make MS back to release everything in holiday mode.

Halo 5 under performed by a lot even though not sure where it is today. The last gears as well if memory severs right. May be a few that I'm not sure about. This is definitely not the first. Halo was the big one though

 

[tiredheadcrab]

Guys, this is just one game under perform, a little premature with all the MS exit console business talk, at worst this just make MS back to release everything in holiday mode.

There are plenty of reason QB didn't do well, short campaign, no replay value, single player linear TPS a little out dated, bad marketing etc, none of that show MS going to quit console.

Yeah but just like George Bush they have a feeling in their gut. You know. It makes sense.

 

[labaronx]

Bizarre Creations couldn't catch a break. Didn't Microsoft screw them with the PGR4 release as well.

How does Greenberg still have his job. He releases games at absolute idiotic times among mammoth titles.

But april was a good month for quantum break especially with uncharted 4 moving to may...

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Guys, this is just one game under perform, a little premature with all the MS exit console business talk, at worst this just make MS back to release everything in holiday mode.

There are plenty of reason QB didn't do well, short campaign, no replay value, single player linear TPS a little out dated, bad marketing etc, none of that show MS going to quit console.

As others have said this isnt the first MS game to under perform for the XBO, pretty much all of their big games have so far.

Saying "Its only one game" just feels like this now

I honestly see Microsoft transferring to a set top box style model, where its mainly a device to access universal apps/games compared to a full console only experience as it has been. How this goes down im not sure but there is no way MS will continue with the standard console model.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

To be fair no one had a clue how big RDR was going to be. It was coming off the heels of Red Dead Revolver which did not sell particularly well and the Western genre was mostly dead.

And yet, RDR went on to sell ~1513K

 

[Shin-chan]

Any comment on the Dark Souls split? I doubt all the Xbox one buyers of that game were significant enough that it infringed on QBs success.

Edit: also if Dark Souls 3 was such a detriment to QB sales how come it wasn't to Ratchet sales when they came out literally the same day and ratchet released on the platform with the lions share of Souls sales?

 

[SpotAnime]

ummm, since they said its below 150k with bundles, i'm pretty sure its safe to say that its below 150k ... where did you get 175k from?

From here:

Official numbers are out.

Dark Souls 3 - 504,000
Quantum Break < 150,000 (including bundle)
Bravely Second < 100,000

Others sales from this month

MLB 16 the Show < 185,000
The Division - 175,000 (including bundle)
Call of Duty: Black Ops III - 262,000 (including bundle)

Call of Duty: Black Ops III bundle sold 157,000 unit this month, 90% of total PS4 sales.

As others have said this isnt the first MS game to under perform for the XBO, pretty much all of their big games have so far.

Saying "Its only one game" just feels like this now


I honestly see Microsoft transferring to a set top box style model, where its mainly a device to access universal apps/games compared to a full console only experience as it has been. How this goes down im not sure but there is no way MS will continue with the standard console model.

Yep this sounds like the exact same argument that was happening when RoTR came out, and we know how that turned out... a shame, since both QB and Tomb Raider are great games, but they just aren't getting any respect on the Xbox One. Same for Sunset Overdrive. And probably the reason why Halo 5 has not met expectations.

 

[wapplew]

As others have said this isnt the first MS game to under perform for the XBO, pretty much all of their big games have so far.

Saying "Its only one game" just feels like this now


I honestly see Microsoft transferring to a set top box style model, where its mainly a device to access universal apps/games compared to a full console only experience as it has been. How this goes down im not sure but there is no way MS will continue with the standard console model.

Well, maybe a few games, but Sony have far more failure in the PS3 era and yet they survived.
I mean this could be first few challenges for MS to diversify their catalog, Rome is not buold in a day, at least they try.

 

[rhandino]

People were acting like SF was a mess an would be sub a million for a long time but it hasn't been that bad.

SFV numbers are not sold to costumers though and we know that the game is not performing great retail wise (It made into the top 60 this month) and SteamSpy numbers are not really that good (around 160k worldwide) so yeah...

 

[Mooreberg]

Are we going to get through this hardware cycle without Microsoft introducing a new franchise that lasts into the next console?

It seems like the pre-$299 PS3 days. But even Uncharted, inFamous, and LBP made it to new hardware. I think Microsoft got too comfortable with Halo/Gears/Forza + preferential third party treatment, and it seems to be biting them in the ass.

For all the stumbles Nintendo had with Wii U, you can be fairly certain that Splatoon will appear again on NX.

 

[AdanVC]

I'm surprised to see Star Fox Zero on the chart. I personally thought it wouldn't be there due to the not so great reviews and word of mouth. I simply skipped the game because I'm done with motion control gaming and because the game is $80 in my country. Just nopeeeEEE.

 

[Dash_Riprock]

Guys, this is just one game under perform, a little premature with all the MS exit console business talk, at worst this just make MS back to release everything in holiday mode.

There are plenty of reason QB didn't do well, short campaign, no replay value, single player linear TPS a little out dated, bad marketing etc, none of that show MS going to quit console.

Its not just that MS' exclusives are under-performing, its not just that all of their Xbox PR name drops Windows 10 as often as humanly possible, its not just that ALL MS exclusives will be on PC from now on. Its not just the rumors, whispers that MS wants to move away from traditional consoles models. Its not just MS' renewed focus on PC gaming with UWP.

Its ALL of these put together that gives the impression MS is, at the very least, seriously reconsidering their current console strategy.

 

[Omnistalgic]

Well, maybe a few games, but Sony have far more failure in the PS3 era and yet they survived.
I mean this could be first few challenges for MS to diversify their catalog, Rome is not buold in a day, at least they try.

This is MS 3rd console, this is the part where you start seeing them acquire studios and diversify, prices drop and do everything to turn around momentum. What have they done so far? closed Lionhead, bought Gears and Minecraft, put a bunch of exclusives on PC and came up with a B/C solution. The price drop have helped only in the Holidays and only in US UK markets.

I dunno man, PS is likely a much more important part of Sony than Xbox is to MS. I don't see any "Rome" being built any time soon.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Well, maybe a few games, but Sony have far more failure in the PS3 era and yet they survived.
I mean this could be first few challenges for MS to diversify their catalog, Rome is not buold in a day, at least they try.

Sony have had failures for sure, but they also have a global audience that helped them sell as many consoles in their hardest time (PS3) as MS best time (360). I mean as much as some like to paint the PS3 as a failure, it sold faster than the 360 did when launch aligned.

You say Rome isnt built in a day yet MS are only 5 years short of Sony with regards to their games console business so how much more time do they need? Sony took over the gaming industry twice and came in joint 2nd the third time in the same amount of time Microsoft has been around so im not sure how MS are meant to suddenly compete when they have had plenty of time to build up a dedicated audience but as we have seen with the XBO they havent really done that compared to Sony.

 

[Omnistalgic]

Sony have had failures for sure, but they also have a global audience that helped them sell as many consoles in their hardest time (PS3) as MS best time (360). I mean as much as some like to paint the PS3 as a failure, it sold faster than the 360 did when launch aligned.

You say Rome isnt built in a day yet MS are only 5 years short of Sony with regards to their games console business so how much more time do they need? Sony took over the gaming industry twice and came in joint 2nd the third time in the same amount of time Microsoft has been around so im not sure how MS are meant to suddenly compete when they have had plenty of time to build up a dedicated audience but as we have seen with the XBO they havent really done that compared to Sony.

Yea similar thoughts. I don't think they are existing and becoming a 3rd party or anything, but they are likely going to do something different with the next hardware. PC integration seems to be important.

 

[Fady K]

If they release it on Steam and have a "pay what you want" offer at Humble Bundle then why not?

How much did Alan Wake perform on the Xbox 360 lifetime though? We should probably look at that and see if QB can reach anywhere near it.

As for steam, it would have likely helped QB a lot more rather than have it only on the Windows store, though it's a dilemma for MS cause they also need to promote their store. Rough times.

At this rate, I'll be surprised if Quantum Break can break the one million figure worldwide by the end of 2016.

Hmm...i think it will do over a million by end of the year but it'll still be a disaster IMO.

 

[Baleoce]

You did good, Fox.

 

[Kill3r7]

How much did Alan Wake perform on the Xbox 360 lifetime though? We should probably look at that and see if QB can reach anywhere near it.

As for steam, it would have likely helped QB a lot more rather than have it only on the Windows store, though it's a dilemma for MS cause they also need to promote their store. Rough times.



Hmm...i think it will do over a million by end of the year but it'll still be a disaster IMO.

I think someone on GAF did a breakdown on all the sales figures last year. AW sold around 1.4-1.6M (lifetime).

 

[wapplew]

Sony have had failures for sure, but they also have a global audience that helped them sell as many consoles in their hardest time (PS3) as MS best time (360). I mean as much as some like to paint the PS3 as a failure, it sold faster than the 360 did when launch aligned.

You say Rome isnt built in a day yet MS are only 5 years short of Sony with regards to their games console business so how much more time do they need? Sony took over the gaming industry twice and came in joint 2nd the third time in the same amount of time Microsoft has been around so im not sure how MS are meant to suddenly compete when they have had plenty of time to build up a dedicated audience but as we have seen with the XBO they havent really done that compared to Sony.

Well, I seriously don't know how MS can fix that global presence thing.

On the second point, maybe MS realize they can't rely on their ten pole anymore, they are making new some IPs now. QB might be under perform, but we should atleast give them credit for trying.

 

[CosmicQueso]

What a weird thread this one's been.

So May presents a real easy HW comp month for both boxes.

Software has the launch of The Witcher 3 as the comp and month 2 of MKX, but other than that it was mostly older titles in the top 10.

When May comes around, and if both HW and SW on Sony/MS show year on year growth, are we going to get more of the "but GAF said consoles were dead?" and "consoles alive" and "everyone's doing well, I don't get the doom and gloom?" nonsense? Tiring.

 

[Fady K]

I think someone on GAF did a breakdown on all the sales figures last year. AW sold around 1.4-1.6M (lifetime).

Oh wow, didn't think PC sold by far the majority of the game. I can easily see Quantum break reach these numbers lifetime. Though it'll be horribly low for a game of its budget and scale. A steam release could have really helped.

 

[michaelius]

I honestly see Microsoft transferring to a set top box style model, where its mainly a device to access universal apps/games compared to a full console only experience as it has been. How this goes down im not sure but there is no way MS will continue with the standard console model.

Next xbox will be windows 10 equivalent of steam machine or streaming box only imho.

But I wonder what's end game plan for Microsoft

- Windows 10 Phone is dead
- Xbox is barely kept alive by US and UK markets
- they literary have to force people to use windows store
- Windows 10 will fall short of Microsoft own goals and adaption rate isn't that amazing considering it's "free" update and most new pcs are sold with it.

So 2/3 of their UWP windows 10 ecosystem are failing

 

[Mooreberg]

Next xbox will be windows 10 equivalent of steam machine or streaming box only imho.

But I wonder what's end game plan for Microsoft

- Windows 10 Phone is dead
- Xbox is barely kept alive by US and UK markets
- they literary have to force people to use windows store
- Windows 10 will fall short of Microsoft own goals and adaption rate isn't that amazing considering it's "free" update and most new pcs are sold with it.

So 2/3 of their UWP windows 10 ecosystem are failing

Steam is as entrenched as anything else on the market. They also ignored the PC market for too long after the Halo 2 and Gears of War ports. And Intel's mobile fail festival means focusing on casual games for lower priced tablets will be off the table as well. Not sure what the path forward is for MS store as a game distribution platform.

 

[Dirtyshubb]

Well, I seriously don't know how MS can fix that global presence thing.

On the second point, maybe MS realize they can't rely on their ten pole anymore, they are making new some IPs now. QB might be under perform, but we should atleast give them credit for trying.

Its always good that a company is willing to try new things for sure, but will MS continue to pump millions into trying new things if they keep failing to meet expectations? I mean after spending $75M on Fable legends only to cancel it and shut the studio down im willing to bet they wont be trying anything like that again any time soon.

If that is the case they would traditionally go back to their tent pole titles but since they have all been underselling maybe they will just decide fuck it with big AAA games and focus more on third party titles that are cross Universal apps titles and have their next console more as a PC Windows apps stream box instead of a fully fledged console where they fund big games like they currently are.

Either way they wont continue to go down their current route in my mind.

EDIT*

Next xbox will be windows 10 equivalent of steam machine or streaming box only imho.

But I wonder what's end game plan for Microsoft

- Windows 10 Phone is dead
- Xbox is barely kept alive by US and UK markets
- they literary have to force people to use windows store
- Windows 10 will fall short of Microsoft own goals and adaption rate isn't that amazing considering it's "free" update and most new pcs are sold with it.

So 2/3 of their UWP windows 10 ecosystem are failing

All great points, i see them trying with the stream box and eventually shutting XBOX down if that isnt a run away success as this would have been their last ditch effort to try and make a very successful platform instead of one that overall just barely made money.

 

[wapplew]

Next xbox will be windows 10 equivalent of steam machine or streaming box only imho.

But I wonder what's end game plan for Microsoft

- Windows 10 Phone is dead
- Xbox is barely kept alive by US and UK markets
- they literary have to force people to use windows store
- Windows 10 will fall short of Microsoft own goals and adaption rate isn't that amazing considering it's "free" update and most new pcs are sold with it.

So 2/3 of their UWP windows 10 ecosystem are failing

What failing? Didn't you read their PR? Global engagement at all time high, Windows 10 like 9 billion hours of gaming activity. /s

I more upset about Windows phone, they bring Nokia down with it.

 

[SpotAnime]

Next xbox will be windows 10 equivalent of steam machine or streaming box only imho.

But I wonder what's end game plan for Microsoft

- Windows 10 Phone is dead
- Xbox is barely kept alive by US and UK markets
- they literary have to force people to use windows store
- Windows 10 will fall short of Microsoft own goals and adaption rate isn't that amazing considering it's "free" update and most new pcs are sold with it.

So 2/3 of their UWP windows 10 ecosystem are failing

Let's not get carried away. Xbox One has sold 20 million consoles and by all measures is doing quite well in the US. And Windows Store is pretty new in comparison - people were used to getting software the old way, so migrating over to the Windows Store is going to take some time.

By comparison, Xbox 360 ultimately came in third place last generation carried by its strength in the same US and UK markets, and that was a success.

And I agree with you, the best play for MS is to come out with a Win10 box next.

 

[Bioshocker]

It also came out on same day as Red Dead though..

Really disappointing sales for QB. Hope MS continues to work with Remedy in future but I wouldn't blame them if not. The sales explain the out of thin air PC port release, MS must have panicked hard after seeing the preorders.

This is not Remedy's fault. Does anything sell on Xbox One? Sunset Overdrive bombed. Halo 5 was a big disappointment saleswise. Rise of the Tomb Raider has not done well either.

I think this is all about Xbox One as a platform, not about the games. Microsoft must have seen this for some time. The market is all about PS4 and there is probably nothing Microsoft can do about it at this stage. Unlike they come up with something like Kinect again.

 

[Jinfash]

Is 175k accurate for PS4? if so, what's the YoY %?

 

[Kill3r7]

What a weird thread this one's been.

So May presents a real easy HW comp month for both boxes.

Software has the launch of The Witcher 3 as the comp and month 2 of MKX, but other than that it was mostly older titles in the top 10.

When May comes around, and if both HW and SW on Sony/MS show year on year growth, are we going to get more of the "but GAF said consoles were dead?" and "consoles alive" and "everyone's doing well, I don't get the doom and gloom?" nonsense? Tiring.

What do you make of The Division's drop?

 

[Kaako]

Saw a bunch of Scalebound mentions and I completely forgot about that one. :/
Platinum should be fine since they got a shit ton of other projects in development already. Remedy probably sweating heavy tho.

 

[Chris1]

This is not Remedy's fault. Does anything sell on Xbox One? Sunset Overdrive bombed. Halo 5 was a big disappointment saleswise. Rise of the Tomb Raider has not done well either.

I think this is all about Xbox One as a platform, not about the games. Microsoft must have seen this for some time. The market is all about PS4 and there is probably nothing Microsoft can do about it at this stage. Unlike they come up with something like Kinect again.

I didn't mean it like that. Just that MS might not want to take the risk again if it sells like crap. I can't imagine MS are too happy funding a game that took 4? years to come out and not sell much and have the game get mediocre reviews. Saying that, I don't think Remedy is perfect here either, after all, the game is a 77 metacritic which couldn't have helped sales. I really liked the game mind you and think it deserved higher, I just don't think they are free from any criticism either. The 77 metacritic is on them.

Halo 5 had it's own issues unrelated to all other games (MCC, Halo 4, 343). If MCC wasn't broken I think Halo 5 would have done much more. Broken games hurt franchises, just like AC Unity did. ROTR did 1M in 2015 that's not bad IMO considering the situation (xbox one & release date), much better than NPD and Pal charts made out to be at least.

From where I'm sitting MS is "done" this generation, and I think they know it too and just riding it out but not completely dropping it either. As I said few pages back IMO their biggest mistake was going forza/halo/gears route at the end of the 360 instead of banking on new IP's and building franchises while they had the fanbase and the games had a higher chance of success because of that.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Is 175k accurate for PS4? if so, what's the YoY %?

Yes and it's flat YOY.

 

[Voost Kain]

those are some terrible excuses. a 40$ remake which is an exclusive on a competing console, division is somehow a competition a month later? i can probably give you dark souls but then again i would say they are targeting different markets(casual vs hardcore)

How can you possible make this comment, did you see the "The division" sales that were posted a couple pages back? Heck even Bops 3 got a good number. Then of course, if you want to attract NEW USERS which is the whole point of the bundles primarily that QB was putting out, a $40 game on a competing console is indeed a thread, even if it's not that significant.

 

[Voost Kain]

month old game, budget title with less marketing.

Seriously, people need to stop moving goal posts. A big budget AAA game with a huge marketing push. The place where it ended up was not good.

There are still a bunch of xbox one in the wild, and the fact that their biggest game for this part of the year sold terrible is a problem

Did you look bad to the sales that were posted a page back? That month old game has legs. Not only that COD got a boost, COD has a bundle, and a $40 game may go good with a COD bundled on the competitions console over MS using a new IP to get new users.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

How can you possible make this comment, did you see the "The division" sales that were posted a couple pages back? Heck even Bops 3 got a good number. Then of course, if you want to attract NEW USERS which is the whole point of the bundles primarily that QB was putting out, a $40 game on a competing console is indeed a thread, even if it's not that significant.

Now all of a sudden Ratchet and clank is a threat..where were you people when April started.

 

[CosmicQueso]

Dark Souls impacting QB sales? Wut.

What do you make of The Division's drop?

Looks like Titanfall's decay. But the month 1 was so huge, tough to have a strong opinion on it with only 2 data points.

 

[Voost Kain]

Any comment on the Dark Souls split? I doubt all the Xbox one buyers of that game were significant enough that it infringed on QBs success.

Edit: also if Dark Souls 3 was such a detriment to QB sales how come it wasn't to Ratchet sales when they came out literally the same day and ratchet released on the platform with the lions share of Souls sales?

You only look at one side of the coin. DId people forget that QB was suppsoed to move units?