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[viveks86]

Playstation Monthly Active User Engagement

This makes me sad. I can't relate to anything in the top 10 games being played. At least Xbox had Indy, which I'm sure will vanish from the top 10 in January :'(

Have I become irrelevant? What is the purpose of my life anymore?

 

[yazenov]

Call of Duty Black Ops 6 was the best selling game of the year Microsoft right now.

The majority of those sales are on Playstation. MS can thank Sony later.

Meanwhile, MS giving Sony 30% of those sales to Sony to kill Xbox. According to Phil.

 

[DForce]

Where is the cutoff? like after the 10th is all low sales?

ASTROGOAT still hanging with the big sellers, it deserves all the sales and more

Indiana Jones was the only new game that made the Top 20 for December, so it should have at least been #2.

Look at this for comparison.

Returnal
- Sold 307k worldwide in the first week
- 8th overall in its first month on the Circana/NPD charts with only 2 days of tracking.
- Returnal was 1 of 4 new games released that month.

14th overall with no new game releases is not good. Forza Horizon 5, Halo Infinite, and Starfield all managed to much rank higher while being on game pass

 

[RetroGamingUK]

*Estimates

Makes you wonder if the Series consoles will reach 35m globally at this point.

It’ll likely finish behind the N64 in the all time rankings.

 

[Unknown?]

So basically PS5 has done almost a 3:1 in December against Xbox.

Nov & Dec Xbox couldn't even match just November's PS5 sells and was 250k less.

I think Mat meant to say 'Gran Turismo 7 now ranks 1st in dollars and 5th in units among all Gran Turismo franchise releases.' But yeah, GT7 is performing very well in the US (I think in Europe it's doing even better if we take into account the latest PSN download charts).

Mat Piscatella (@matpiscatella.bsky.social)

Gran Turismo now ranks 1st in dollars and 5th in units among all Gran Turismo franchise releases. Are you the same person that used to ask about Gran Turismo on the other site? If so, I respect the focus.

bsky.app

GT7 will end up outselling GT3 worldwide and probably pretty close in the US.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Makes you wonder if the Series consoles will reach 35m globally at this point.

I think they can't change course fast enough

Imagine these numbers if in fact they don't produce the next Xbox until 2027 or beyond

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I think Mat meant to say 'Gran Turismo 7 now ranks 1st in dollars and 5th in units among all Gran Turismo franchise releases.' But yeah, GT7 is performing very well in the US (I think in Europe it's doing even better if we take into account the latest PSN download charts).

Mat Piscatella (@matpiscatella.bsky.social)

Gran Turismo now ranks 1st in dollars and 5th in units among all Gran Turismo franchise releases. Are you the same person that used to ask about Gran Turismo on the other site? If so, I respect the focus.

bsky.app

Massive achievement by Gran Turismo 7, helped out no doubt by the success of the Gran Turismo movie especially on Streaming as well as the My First Gran Turismo demo, but I do feel there is a lot Sony can do to make Gran Turismo more successful and easily the best selling iteration in the franchise.

• PC Port
• PSVR2 Bundle
• PS5 Bundle
• Bring back GT Academy as a streaming series on Netflix akin to Drive to Survive, but also maybe use it as a showcase for vehicles like Top Gear
• PlayStation Handheld
• Get the license for pro leagues and release DLC expansions

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Makes you wonder if the Series consoles will reach 35m globally at this point.

Probably going to be the lifetime sales for XBS. Not far off from that, anyway.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Every one arguing over a declining console market and not seeing that every publisher, dev, retailer and investor is looking at pc due to its growth.

We gotta keep the fight alive!

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Every one arguing over a declining console market and not seeing that every publisher, dev, retailer and investor is looking at pc due to its growth.

We gotta keep the fight alive!

Playstation and Nintendo are doing just fine with PC around.
It's always been like that.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

Every one arguing over a declining console market and not seeing that every publisher, dev, retailer and investor is looking at pc due to its growth.

We gotta keep the fight alive!

The biggest reason is people not buying BOTH a PlayStation and Xbox this time around.

 

[Unknown?]

Massive achievement by Gran Turismo 7, helped out no doubt by the success of the Gran Turismo movie especially on Streaming as well as the My First Gran Turismo demo, but I do feel there is a lot Sony can do to make Gran Turismo more successful and easily the best selling iteration in the franchise.

• PC Port
• PSVR2 Bundle
• PS5 Bundle
• Bring back GT Academy as a streaming series on Netflix akin to Drive to Survive, but also maybe use it as a showcase for vehicles like Top Gear
• PlayStation Handheld
• Get the license for pro leagues and release DLC expansions

It doesn't need those ports, it will do it on PS5 alone. Gt Sport made it to 12.8 million according to leaks and GT7 is tracking way better than that in the same timeframe. You have to remember, GT7 has been out only over two years. It ranks fifth so far among games that have been out for 5+ years at extreme discounts.

 

[DenchDeckard]

The biggest reason is people not buying BOTH a PlayStation and Xbox this time around.

Facts! But investors and the industry don't see it. They see a shrink in the tam and that's all they need to start looking at alternatives.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

that every publisher, dev, retailer and investor is looking at pc due to its growth.

That’s why Indy did so increadibly well on PC

That growth!

 

[Thief1987]

Every one arguing over a declining console market and not seeing that every publisher, dev, retailer and investor is looking at pc due to its growth.

We gotta keep the fight alive!

We are losing! Move the goalpost at once!

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

Indiana Jones was the only new game that made the Top 20 for December, so it should have at least been #2.

Look at this for comparison.

Returnal
- Sold 307k worldwide in the first week
- 8th overall in its first month on the Circana/NPD charts with only 2 days of tracking.
- Returnal was 1 of 4 new games released that month.

14th overall with no new game releases is not good. Forza Horizon 5, Halo Infinite, and Starfield all managed to much rank higher while being on game pass

And Returnal was 4th out of those 4 new games.

No other new games in December on the list but it's December, everyone is buying all of their Christmas games. It's weird how before the game came out GAF was down on it because it's a first person adventure game and Indy is a dead franchise. After release apparently the game should have outsold CoD and Madden and everything else.

 

[DenchDeckard]

That’s why Indy did so increadibly well on PC

That growth!

It's an amazing game. Hopefully you buy it and realise it too.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

How was Xbox priced lower this holiday season? It was barely on sale vs the prior year. Plus more people are buying the X version vs S now.

I mean't to say had a much lower price last year. It's been corrected.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It's an amazing game. Hopefully you buy it and realise it too.

I’m doing my part to save the game from being an utter sales disaster

Thanks to that console growth

 

[DenchDeckard]

We are losing! Move the goalpost at once!

Lol. I'm talking from a wider view than what you think. It will become apparent over the next couple of years.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

It doesn't need those ports, it will do it on PS5 alone. Gt Sport made it to 12.8 million according to leaks and GT7 is tracking way better than that. You have to remember, GT7 has been out only over two years. It ranks fifth so far among games that have been out for 5+ years at extreme discounts.

Gran Turismo used to come out more frequently.

If GT Sport was the only GT game on PS4 and if GT7 is the only GT game on PS5, it has a massive advantage compared to GT1-6.

We know the only game it would have sold more units than was Gran Turismo 6, which desperately needed a PS4 version. Not only is this the only REAL Gran Turismo game since six, but it was also cross platform.

This game should end up with double the sales if not more than any other GT game, if it's not going to get a sequel on PS5.

 

[jm89]

I think Mat meant to say 'Gran Turismo 7 now ranks 1st in dollars and 5th in units among all Gran Turismo franchise releases.' But yeah, GT7 is performing very well in the US (I think in Europe it's doing even better if we take into account the latest PSN download charts).

Mat Piscatella (@matpiscatella.bsky.social)

Gran Turismo now ranks 1st in dollars and 5th in units among all Gran Turismo franchise releases. Are you the same person that used to ask about Gran Turismo on the other site? If so, I respect the focus.

bsky.app

So it possibly sits between GT5 and GT4(we haven't had any sales split for gt sport so that my change that)

Gran Turismo 3: 7,140,000
Gran Turismo: 3,990,000
Gran Turismo 2: 3,960,000
Gran Turismo 4: 3,470,000
Gran Turismo 7: ?
Gran Turismo 5: 3,440,000
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue : 1,340,000
Gran Turismo 6: 1,240,000
Gran Turismo PSP: 1,050,000

Safe to say it's done >3.4m in north america.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

That’s why Indy did so increadibly well on PC

That growth!

It's an amazing game. Hopefully you buy it and realise it too.

There was that report showing that PC gamers on steam only spent 15% of their time on new releases... this idea that PC gaming is this salvation is massively misleading.

PC gamers are cheap and aren't looking to buy games at full price. Once PS5 reaches peak sales and the PS6 comes out, the combined MAUs on PS5 will keep game sales much higher than PC games. The PS5 will have a much longer life than the PS4, which in theory should be still sold and produced today and could have had it not been for the pandemic.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

There was that report showing that PC gamers on steam only spent 15% of their time on new releases... this idea that PC gaming is this salvation is massively misleading.

PC gamers are cheap and aren't looking to buy games at full price. Once PS5 reaches peak sales and the PS6 comes out, the combined MAUs on PS5 will keep game sales much higher than PC games. The PS5 will have a much longer life than the PS4, which in theory should be still sold and produced today and could have had it not been for the pandemic.

PC gamers seem to mostly care about Live Service games more then anything else by far

Not much growth there for SP titles

 

[Mibu no ookami]

So it possibly sits between GT5 and GT4(we haven't had any sales split for gt sport so that my change that)

Gran Turismo 3: 7,140,000
Gran Turismo: 3,990,000
Gran Turismo 2: 3,960,000
Gran Turismo 4: 3,470,000
Gran Turismo 7: ?
Gran Turismo 5: 3,440,000
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue : 1,340,000
Gran Turismo 6: 1,240,000
Gran Turismo PSP: 1,050,000

Safe to say it's done >3.4m in north america.

If Gran Turismo belonged to any other publisher, they would go all out in making it more successful. Not sure why Sony is doing the bare minimum.

 

[Unknown?]

Gran Turismo used to come out more frequently.

If GT Sport was the only GT game on PS4 and if GT7 is the only GT game on PS5, it has a massive advantage compared to GT1-6.

We know the only game it would have sold more units than was Gran Turismo 6, which desperately needed a PS4 version. Not only is this the only REAL Gran Turismo game since six, but it was also cross platform.

This game should end up with double the sales if not more than any other GT game, if it's not going to get a sequel on PS5.

GT3 kept selling after 4 came out because it was a $19.99 greatest hit and 4 came out long afterwards. GT5 wasn't effected by GT6 because it was already after the gen ended. GT2 probably did effect GT1 but sold less because it was out less time. GT5 and Sport were heavily discounted to $10 as well. GT7 has only been discounted to $30 for a short period and has tracked better at a higher price.

GT7 will easily surpass GT3 by a few million. It could be better but rather than half ass trying to port and shoehorn stuff, I'd rather they just make a good game that has lots of content.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

PC gamers seem to mostly care about Live Service games more then anything else by far

Not much growth there for SP titles

Which is really ironic, going by Gaf.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

PC gamers seem to mostly care about Live Service games more then anything else by far

Not much growth there for SP titles

It's because most of them are F2P games.

FF7 Rebirth is about to come out on PC and people are going to be disappointed when it doesn't generate massive sales. Square Enix is running out of excuses for their games not meeting expectations. They'll start putting them on Xbox but that won't change anything either.

 

[Unknown?]

So it possibly sits between GT5 and GT4(we haven't had any sales split for gt sport so that my change that)

Gran Turismo 3: 7,140,000
Gran Turismo: 3,990,000
Gran Turismo 2: 3,960,000
Gran Turismo 4: 3,470,000
Gran Turismo 7: ?
Gran Turismo 5: 3,440,000
Gran Turismo 5 Prologue : 1,340,000
Gran Turismo 6: 1,240,000
Gran Turismo PSP: 1,050,000

Safe to say it's done >3.4m in north america.

Keep in mind the GT3 is only so high because it was heavily bundled early on in North American PS2s.

 

[Topher]

Which is really ironic, going by Gaf.

How so?

 

[RetroGamingUK]

It's because most of them are F2P games.

FF7 Rebirth is about to come out on PC and people are going to be disappointed when it doesn't generate massive sales. Square Enix is running out of excuses for their games not meeting expectations. They'll start putting them on Xbox but that won't change anything either.

FF7 Rebirth will flop on PC

It would do much better on Switch 2

 

[Mibu no ookami]

GT3 kept selling after 4 came out because it was a $19.99 greatest hit and 4 came out long afterwards. GT5 wasn't effected by GT6 because it was already after the gen ended. GT2 probably did effect GT1 but sold less because it was out less time. GT5 and Sport were heavily discounted to $10 as well. GT7 has only been discounted to $30 for a short period and has tracked better at a higher price.

GT7 will easily surpass GT3 by a few million. It could be better but rather than half ass trying to port and shoehorn stuff, I'd rather they just make a good game that has lots of content.

3 years separate GT5 and GT6, but yes, as I said GT6 needed a PS4 version badly.

GT3 was bundled with the PS2, which is a reason it sold as much as it did.

I doubt GT7 outsells GT3 on its current course and I'm not sure why you assume a GT7 PC port would be half assed or why you ask for more content but suggest that more content would be "shoehorning stuff".

 

[GHG]

It's the 4th best selling game on Xbox in the month, tho.

Not the flex you think it is.

This is the most damning indictment possible.

 

[adamsapple]

Not the flex you think it is.

This is the most damning indictment possible.

Not a flex, just a factual correction.

The post I quoted said it wasn't in the top 50 paid apps on Xbox within a week, it being the 4th best selling game on the platform directly contradicts that. Meaning it either sold a lot more physically than digitally, or those top paid charts are inaccurate.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

How so?

There is a large PC contingent on GAF but GAF is also anti GaaS.

The ultimate reality is that GAF isn't representative of actual gaming demographics.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

How so?

Is that a serious question?

You're smarter than that.

 

[GHG]

Not a flex, just a factual correction.

The post I quoted said it wasn't in the top 50 paid apps on Xbox within a week, it being the 4th best selling game on the platform directly contradicts that. Meaning it either sold a lot more physically than digitally, or those top paid charts are inaccurate.

The top paid charts on Xbox are on a regional/country basis, not global.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

The PS5 2024 handily outsold PS4 2017 in the U.S.

2013/2020 (millions of units)

PS4: 2.00
PS5: 1.96

2014/2021

PS4: 4.68
PS5: 4.28

2015/2022

PS4: 5.72
PS5: 5.66

2016/2023

PS4: 5.10
PS5: 6.76

2017/2024

PS4: 5.42
PS5: 5.93

 

[adamsapple]

The top paid charts on Xbox are on a regional/country basis, not global.

Right, and these are Circana charts, also US centric only, not global.

Or if you mean it might not have been in DForce's region, then sure, I can see that.

 

[Topher]

Is that a serious question?

You're smarter than that.

Is "how so" really that difficult of a question to answer? I can't read your mind my man

 

[RodriGames40]

I’m sensing that there isn’t a lot of goodwill out there with gamers with everything that is going on. The culture wars, subscriptions, microtransactions abound.

I know I haven’t been excited by much as everything feels like it is about money. There used to at least be a mask that they cared for gamers. Now, it is give us your money and if you don’t you’re a bad person, bigot, ist, phobe, or whatever new term we will have in a week.

A game like Indian Jones, should have sold somewhat decent being an actual good game. I know the IP is pretty weak these days, but dang, the movie before it and gamers distrust is starting kill a lot of joy around gaming in general. It is also killing IPs.

It could just be me and I hope it is, but it seems like a lot of wind has been knocked out of us.

And it will remain like this until GTA 6.

 

[Unknown?]

3 years separate GT5 and GT6, but yes, as I said GT6 needed a PS4 version badly.

GT3 was bundled with the PS2, which is a reason it sold as much as it did.

I doubt GT7 outsells GT3 on its current course and I'm not sure why you assume a GT7 PC port would be half assed or why you ask for more content but suggest that more content would be "shoehorning stuff".

GT7 will worldwide, not in North America. It's tracking better than Sport in all charts in the same timeframe and that game came close. 12.8 million as of early 2019. It likely ended up a bit over 13M but we don't know for sure.

I say that because licensing stuff without a focus on it doesn't really make for good content. Like how they did NASCAR in GT5.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Is "how so" really that difficult of a question to answer? I can't read your mind my man

It already got answered by Mibu no ookami , which should've been pretty obvious to any regular on Gaf, incl you.

And since I know you're pretty level-headed and have sound logic, I assumed it didn't actually need explanation.

 

[Klosshufvud]

No figure on the ratio of PS5 Pro sales to normal edition in December? That's odd.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

GT7 will worldwide, not in North America. It's tracking better than Sport in all charts in the same timeframe and that game came close. 12.8 million as of early 2019. It likely ended up a bit over 13M but we don't know for sure.

I say that because licensing stuff without a focus on it doesn't really make for good content. Like how they did NASCAR in GT5.

I'm not sure that the NASCAR licensing was a mistake in GT5, but it was also well before live service gaming.

If they could get licensing, they could put out a NASCAR DLC, F1 DLC, WRC DLC, IndyCar DLC, e.t.c.

 

[jm89]

Keep in mind the GT3 is only so high because it was heavily bundled early on in North American PS2s.

Yeah.

I think GT7 will comfortably head towards 2nd best gran turismo in north america. Unless gran turismo sport did some really good numbers that polphony haven't released then it will be 3rd. Really impressive for that type of game.

 

[Unknown?]

I'm not sure that the NASCAR licensing was a mistake in GT5, but it was also well before live service gaming.

If they could get licensing, they could put out a NASCAR DLC, F1 DLC, WRC DLC, IndyCar DLC, e.t.c.

Ah, I just wasn't envisioning it right. As free dlc like all the content they've done so far, I could see it really boosting exposure/sells. I agree that would be a good way to do it.

The reason GT7 is still doing so well and hasn't dropped into obscurity is all of the DLC added for free keeps them in the spotlight and creates a good word of mouth.

As for NASCAR in GT5, it wasn't a mistake but it wasn't good. It didn't offer the NASCAR experience, except for on one track.

 

[Topher]

It already got answered by Mibu no ookami , which should've been pretty obvious to any regular on Gaf, incl you.

And since I know you're pretty level-headed and have sound logic, I assumed it didn't actually need explanation.

Hell man, I see "GAF" generalized about a few dozen different ways on a regular basis. And I don't disagree with how Mibu no ookami characterized it so I'll thank him for providing context.

 

[bundylove]

I think they can't change course fast enough

Imagine these numbers if in fact they don't produce the next Xbox until 2027 or beyond

2026 right? Rrrrriiiight?

 

[Ozriel]

You're paying attention the wrong things and coming to the wrong conclusions.

None of the stuff you mentioned actually matters.

You bring up Indiana Jones as example and don't realize why Indiana Jones isn't selling well and that's because Xbox isn't selling well and GamePass has eroded premium sales on the platform. Even with GamePass Indiana Jones SHOULD be the #1 Xbox game for the month, but it isn't. Why is that? Because the demographic on Xbox most likely to pay for GamePass isn't multiplayer gamers but single player gamers, that's even with them paying for online. They've destroyed the market for single player premium games on Xbox.

You're so focused on the wrong things you don't know what's actually going on in gaming.

We're witnessing the end of Xbox as we know it and that will send shockwaves through the industry. And no even if Indiana Jones had launched on PlayStation it still wouldn't have sold. It was a mistake to make a 1st person Indiana Jones games after the success of Tomb Raider and Uncharted. You narrow down the interest of the game far too much, which is another problem developers are actually making.

Making GaaS games without single player campaigns for example alienates single player gamers. There is ZERO chance of me playing Marvel Rivals, because I don't play online games at all. You can't sell it to me no matter how good it is. The more you narrow down your demo, the worse your game is going to perform.

Indiana Jones was also on Steam.

I guess we’re also witnessing the end of Steam as we know it, too?