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[bee]

this shows anti aliasing scaling in both os's, sometimes xp wins and sometimes vista

http://www.madshrimps.be/?action=getarticle&number=1&artpage=3684&articID=869

On average with the Geforce GTX 280 you lose -1.6% by switching to Vista 64-bit, so in short: same performance and no loss!

The Radeon HD 4870 X2 does even better, if we leave out the numbers of Stalker and Tomb Raider (as Crossfire failed to run properly under XP) we see a +5.8% boost in average FPS going from XP to Vista. If we add the two game titles and let them enjoy CF-scaling the number jumps up to +27.7%!

no reason not to go with vista these days

 

[Zzoram]

Ya, Vista has a serious image problem, but it's a great OS. It's better at allocating RAM than XP, and Vista SP1 64-bit is usually the same or faster than XP SP3 32-bit, plus Vista 64-bit actually works with just about everything, while XP 64-bit is a broken mess incompatible with everything.

 

[chespace]

Got some bad news. I spent all night putting stuff together and was pretty happy with how it turned out and as excited to actually see this puppy power on. Unfortunately, it powers on, but nothing happens -- the case fans go live, the motherboard has the green light, the CPU fan starts spinning, the GPU has red lights to tell me it has power and its fan is spinning.. basically everything is on except I get nothing on the monitor. And hitting SW reset on the chassis front panel does nothing. I've tried powering on with just a stick of RAM, etc. I've tried opening the CPU again and reclosing it. It was quite late so I stopped trying and went to bed defeated.

Any advice? I hope I don't have a component that's DOA and that I've just done something wrong in assembling the system.

 

[Big Takeover]

Got some bad news. I spent all night putting stuff together and was pretty happy with how it turned out and as excited to actually see this puppy power on. Unfortunately, it powers on, but nothing happens -- the case fans go live, the motherboard has the green light, the CPU fan starts spinning, the GPU has red lights to tell me it has power and its fan is spinning.. basically everything is on except I get nothing on the monitor. And hitting SW reset on the chassis front panel does nothing. I've tried powering on with just a stick of RAM, etc. I've tried opening the CPU again and reclosing it. It was quite late so I stopped trying and went to bed defeated.

Any advice? I hope I don't have a component that's DOA and that I've just done something wrong in assembling the system.

You forgot to plug in the 8 pin power cable. Number 3, top left.

 

[otake]

Got some bad news. I spent all night putting stuff together and was pretty happy with how it turned out and as excited to actually see this puppy power on. Unfortunately, it powers on, but nothing happens -- the case fans go live, the motherboard has the green light, the CPU fan starts spinning, the GPU has red lights to tell me it has power and its fan is spinning.. basically everything is on except I get nothing on the monitor. And hitting SW reset on the chassis front panel does nothing. I've tried powering on with just a stick of RAM, etc. I've tried opening the CPU again and reclosing it. It was quite late so I stopped trying and went to bed defeated.

Any advice? I hope I don't have a component that's DOA and that I've just done something wrong in assembling the system.

is the fan on the cpu heat sink spinning?

 

[prodystopian]

You forgot to plug in the 8 pin power cable. Number 3, top left.

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r195/jpm_photos/Picture1.png[IMG][/QUOTE]

If it isn't that, just check ALL power connections (unplug and replug firmly). Mine did the same thing the first time and IIRC, it was the 24 pin power connector that wasn't entirely connected.

 

[chespace]

You forgot to plug in the 8 pin power cable. Number 3, top left.

I could kiss you right now!!!!!!!!!!

Got to the bios screen!

 

[Chiggs]

BCD2 nails it from the get-go. Don't see that sort of thing too often on the internet. Good work, dude.

 

[Zzoram]

I could kiss you right now!!!!!!!!!!

Got to the bios screen!

Ya that plug is easy to miss. I almost forgot it when I built my latest PC as well.

 

[DaCocoBrova]

Now go and install OS + Crysis and report back.

 

[Big Takeover]

You won't be surprised to hear I've done that myself. :lol

Glad it's up and running, Che. Crysis time is fast approaching.

 

[chespace]

Yup. Just switched around SATA plugs a bit. Not sure what SATA0 and SATA1 do (they're different colored than the rest) but I have DVD/HDD1/HDD2 in SATA2, 3 and 4 now.

And I'm out of time and need to leave for work. Thanks for your help guys. I'm sure I'll need more of it later today when I start configuring the system.

One thing I am thinking about doing is a dual-boot setup between X32 and X64. The one music app I really need to use (Ableton Live) isn't too happy with 64-bit. What's the easiest way to have a 32-bit dual boot scenario?

 

[Gully State]

Anyone know where I can look up normal temperatures for idle/load for processors? I'm getting inconsistent numbers for the temp of my E8400. Coretemp says it's 39C idle/42C load while the Asus PCI temp monitor is giving me 25C idle/35C load. I'm inclined to believe it's the former but I thought the core 2 duo processors were supposed to run a whole lot cooler than the p4 prescotts? I want to know b/c I want to give OC'ing a shot. What's the general value that this processor can be pushed to? And what exactly does stepping mean? I hear that all the time in regards to how well a processor can overclock.

 

[Zzoram]

Anyone know where I can look up normal temperatures for idle/load for processors? I'm getting inconsistent numbers for the temp of my E8400. Coretemp says it's 39C idle/42C load while the Asus PCI temp monitor is giving me 25C idle/35C load. I'm inclined to believe it's the former but I thought the core 2 duo processors were supposed to run a whole lot cooler than the p4 prescotts? I want to know b/c I want to give OC'ing a shot. What's the general value that this processor can be pushed to? And what exactly does stepping mean? I hear that all the time in regards to how well a processor can overclock.

RealTemp is what you use for 45nm CPUs like the E8000 and Q9000. CoreTemp is for 65nm E6000/Q6000.

The Asus PCI monitor is most likely wrong.

 

[Manp]

Yup. Just switched around SATA plugs a bit. Not sure what SATA0 and SATA1 do (they're different colored than the rest) but I have DVD/HDD1/HDD2 in SATA2, 3 and 4 now.

And I'm out of time and need to leave for work. Thanks for your help guys. I'm sure I'll need more of it later today when I start configuring the system.

One thing I am thinking about doing is a dual-boot setup between X32 and X64. The one music app I really need to use (Ableton Live) isn't too happy with 64-bit. What's the easiest way to have a 32-bit dual boot scenario?

makes no difference but usually you start with HDDs in the first ports (SATA 0 and 1 in your case) and then optical drives

 

[careful]

Yup. Just switched around SATA plugs a bit. Not sure what SATA0 and SATA1 do (they're different colored than the rest) but I have DVD/HDD1/HDD2 in SATA2, 3 and 4 now.

And I'm out of time and need to leave for work. Thanks for your help guys. I'm sure I'll need more of it later today when I start configuring the system.

One thing I am thinking about doing is a dual-boot setup between X32 and X64. The one music app I really need to use (Ableton Live) isn't too happy with 64-bit. What's the easiest way to have a 32-bit dual boot scenario?

I'm interested in this too, but for XP 32-bit and Vista 64-bit.

 

[Manp]

for XP-Vista if you're starting from scratch install XP first and then Vista on 2 different drives/partitions.
problem is XP boot loader can't recognize Vista so if you install Vista first and then XP you'll be unable to boot Vista until you restore Vista boot loader (which you can do from XP but is a bit more difficult).

for Vista 32/64 just install both on 2 different drives/partitions, installation will handle dual boot just fine.

another way is to use the boot manager integrated in the motherboard bios if you have more than one HDD.
an easy way to do so may be to connect one HDD and install Vista. then disconnect the first HDD with Vista, connect the other HDD and install XP on it.
at this point connect both and use the motherboard boot device selection menu (usually F8 at the bios screen, it should be written in the manual) to chose which hard disk to boot from.

 

[Gully State]

RealTemp is what you use for 45nm CPUs like the E8000 and Q9000. CoreTemp is for 65nm E6000/Q6000.

Why is that the case?

 

[bee]

the first 2 sata ports can usually be run in ide mode and hence don't need an f6 driver install when installing windows, the others usually do require that

 

[dLMN8R]

Guys, what's the word on Vista vs XP performance?

My friend is convinced that Vista is noticeably slower in Games than XP.
I, on the other hand, think that Vista is en par, or even faster than XP, now that ATI and NVidia have enough experience with Vista.

Any recent Benchmarks available?

The extremetech benchmakrs already posted are from early May when Vista SP1 was first released, and show Vista on par with, or faster than, XP on a very mid-range system (not at all high-end).

More recent benchmarks from Crysis Warhead have continued to show that the faster your computer is, the bigger a difference there is between XP/Vista performance. Basically, on an old system, XP will of course run games faster than Vista, but on practically any system built, Vista performs faster than XP:

http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,...ecial_and_general_info_about_the_game/?page=2

 

[Big Takeover]

Yup. Just switched around SATA plugs a bit. Not sure what SATA0 and SATA1 do (they're different colored than the rest) but I have DVD/HDD1/HDD2 in SATA2, 3 and 4 now.

And I'm out of time and need to leave for work. Thanks for your help guys. I'm sure I'll need more of it later today when I start configuring the system.

One thing I am thinking about doing is a dual-boot setup between X32 and X64. The one music app I really need to use (Ableton Live) isn't too happy with 64-bit. What's the easiest way to have a 32-bit dual boot scenario?

The first two SATA ports (white, orange) are for the RAID controller. You don't want to use those. The bottom connector in row two (from the right) is SATA 1.

I might as well take the time here to suggest you go to the Asus website, and download the latest 64bit mobo drivers. Sound, SATA, chipset, and LAN. Grab the video drivers from ATI as well. Put them all on a thumb drive or burn them to a disk. As soon as Vista is installed you're going to need to install these pronto, starting with the chipset drivers. Your on-board LAN may, or may not work after Vista is installed, so you'll need to get this stuff ahead of time.

You'll need to do the same thing when you go to install Vista32, only you'll need the 32bit drivers for that.

 

[SRG01]

So AMD finally spun off its manufacturing capabilities after months of speculation. Why isn't there a thread about this? :lol

 

[ahoyhoy]

I could kiss you right now!!!!!!!!!!

Got to the bios screen!

EXACTLY what happened to me. Me and my friend spent like an hour adjusting and replacing parts to see which was broken. Took me another hour or so after I gave up with that to realize the empty connector :lol

Enjoy the new compy, che

 

[chespace]

Some pics. I got so into building last night I didn't bother taking any pictures step by step... so this is sort of a before and after (but still WIP obviously).

With the PSU installed, still barebones.

I love this Antec case. Very nice fit and finish, and the drive bays are great.

So here's the beast with all components loaded. I'm actually pretty happy I was able to get a bunch of the wires running behind the mobo in the case. Sure, it doesn't look that elegant, but you should see all the damn wires in the back. Pardon the shitty iPhone pic.

Here's the CPU with Arctic Cooler 7 HSF on top. That thick PSU cable running by the CPU is that elusive 8-pin power plug I missed last night. I tried running it behind the case but it wasn't long enough. Strangely, while the Corsair 750W had more plugs and cables than I knew what to do with (it really was like putting Medusa's head into my Antec -- see pic below), the PSU only came with one 8-pin power plug.

Here's the lower half of the innards. Yeah, definitely not a pretty sight. :lol

Here's a pulled back shot for some size context and comparison. This Antec 1200 is a serious goliath. Sorry for the mess in my hobby room there. That corner and TV used to be where I kept all my console crap. I got rid of them and am in the process of reorganizing.

 

[ahoyhoy]

That thing looks massive compared to my 300, which I considered roomy at the time (and still is enough for me, thanks to GAF for recommending it.) You gonna fill up all the fan openings, or just suffice with the default options until needed later? My 300 is kept pretty cool with 4 fans (2 intake, 2 exhaust), but I have the option of a fifth 120mm in the front I might take later if I want to double my 4870 love.

 

[kaiserbus]

Some pics. I got so into building last night I didn't bother taking any pictures step by step... so this is sort of a before and after (but still WIP obviously).

With the PSU installed, still barebones.

I love this Antec case. Very nice fit and finish, and the drive bays are great.

So here's the beast with all components loaded. I'm actually pretty happy I was able to get a bunch of the wires running behind the mobo in the case. Sure, it doesn't look that elegant, but you should see all the damn wires in the back. Pardon the shitty iPhone pic.

Here's the CPU with Arctic Cooler 7 HSF on top. That thick PSU cable running by the CPU is that elusive 8-pin power plug I missed last night. I tried running it behind the case but it wasn't long enough. Strangely, while the Corsair 750W had more plugs and cables than I knew what to do with (it really was like putting Medusa's head into my Antec -- see pic below), the PSU only came with one 8-pin power plug.

Here's the lower half of the innards. Yeah, definitely not a pretty sight. :lol

Here's a pulled back shot for some size context and comparison. This Antec 1200 is a serious goliath. Sorry for the mess in my hobby room there. That corner and TV used to be where I kept all my console crap. I got rid of them and am in the process of reorganizing.

Always bet on black.

 

[Hazaro]

Why is that the case?

Well the temp sensors were different, but now both programs have been updated Coretemp past 0.99 is fine for 45nm as it reads the same for me as RealTemp 2.60+

 

[Chiggs]

Che, use the other side of the motherboard panel for cable management. Clear up some of that clutter. Make sure you use electrical tape.

 

[Hazaro]

Oh and your CPU Cooler is facing the wrong way :lol

Seriously though, with the 1200 there's no real excuse for not having at least decent cable management. Get some zipties as well.

 

[Chiggs]

Oh and your CPU Cooler is facing the wrong way :lol

Is it really?

 

[bee]

Is is it really?

yes

 

[DaCocoBrova]

The fans facing each other makes that rather obvious

 

[Chiggs]

The fans facing each other makes that rather obvious

You know, considering that both fans are exhaust, and he's got a wind tunnel behind it, I think he could get away with it.

Edit: I just looked at it again, both fans aren't exhaust. :lol Whoops. Don't feel bad, Che.

 

[lachesis]

I hate but love doing cable management... your PSU is a good one, but doesn't seem to be have modular cables. With modular PSU, you can pick and choose the ones to connect to your PSU, except main power cable. Makes the whole thing so much neater in the end.

Routhing through the back of your case would make things much cleanter too. My Antec P182 does it - and since your 1200 is higher-end than mine, perhaps you can do that too? Cable length is defnititely issue in some cases though, as you've mentioned - I'd say route through as much as you can... and Cable ties, some electrical tapes also helps too.

 

[Blackface]

RealTemp is what you use for 45nm CPUs like the E8000 and Q9000. CoreTemp is for 65nm E6000/Q6000.

The Asus PCI monitor is most likely wrong.

CoreTemp is just as good as Realtemp now. Intel released the real TJMAX.

So all of them will give you the same result.

 

[chespace]

You know, considering that both fans are exhaust, and he's got a wind tunnel behind it, I think he could get away with it.

Edit: I just looked at it again, both fans aren't exhaust. :lol Whoops. Don't feel bad, Che.

Hmm, the instructions said that I should have the fan facing towards the rear of the computer so that's what I did.

So which fan is an exhaust and which is an intake?

Bah, I hate taking that thing off.

EDIT: yup, looks like I'll be flipping that thing around tonight. :lol

 

[chespace]

RE: the clutter.

Yeah, most of it are just un-used power cables from the PSU.

Are you guys saying I should just put all un-used cables into the back panel and tape them down?

Also, what's the deal with thermal paste? The Arctic Cooler 7 already came with some pre-applied. When I take it off and flip it around, is that going to mess up the thermal paste that's already on the CPU/fan? Should I buy more thermal paste now just in case?

If so, which type is good?

 

[Kadey]

Look at mine Che, same cooler. Builders tend to put it on incorrectly. And don't use tape, use zip ties.

 

[Zzoram]

RE: the clutter.

Yeah, most of it are just un-used power cables from the PSU.

Are you guys saying I should just put all un-used cables into the back panel and tape them down?

Also, what's the deal with thermal paste? The Arctic Cooler 7 already came with some pre-applied. When I take it off and flip it around, is that going to mess up the thermal paste that's already on the CPU/fan? Should I buy more thermal paste now just in case?

If so, which type is good?

Ya it messes up the paste if you remove it. You have to slowly and carefully remove it with high purity rubbing alcohol (preferably 90-100%, lower is ok but give it more time to dry) and Q-tips. Basically wet the Q-tip and slowly wipe off the old paste. You use alcohol because it evaporates super quick and won't mess stuff up by sticking around. It could take a very long time, I know it does for me, but carefully remove all the paste, and don't leave any stray cotton fibres around. When it's all removed and dried, then you can apply a TINY amount of paste, there should be pictures online of how much to use. The best right now is MX-2 or Arctic Creamique, since they don't conduct.

Make sure your computer is not plugged in and the PSU is off when doing this.

 

[rc213]

RE: the clutter.

Yeah, most of it are just un-used power cables from the PSU.

Are you guys saying I should just put all un-used cables into the back panel and tape them down?

Also, what's the deal with thermal paste? The Arctic Cooler 7 already came with some pre-applied. When I take it off and flip it around, is that going to mess up the thermal paste that's already on the CPU/fan? Should I buy more thermal paste now just in case?

If so, which type is good?

Just be sure to twist it around a bit once the clips are off the motherboard. The flat surfaces of the cpu and heatsink + thermal paste create quite the seal.


Also, Did you have any issues of the 8pin reaching the plug at the top of the case? I have a Antec P180 rev1.1 and want to grab the 650w version of the same Corsair PSU.

 

[chespace]

Ya it messes up the paste if you remove it. You have to slowly and carefully remove it with high purity rubbing alcohol (preferably 90-100%, lower is ok but give it more time to dry) and Q-tips. Basically wet the Q-tip and slowly wipe off the old paste. You use alcohol because it evaporates super quick and won't mess stuff up by sticking around. It could take a very long time, I know it does for me, but carefully remove all the paste, and don't leave any stray cotton fibres around. When it's all removed and dried, then you can apply a TINY amount of paste, there should be pictures online of how much to use. The best right now is MX-2 or Arctic Creamique, since they don't conduct.

Make sure your computer is not plugged in and the PSU is off when doing this.

Fucking shit, that sucks. So if I remove it, the paste is a total loss and I can't just re stick it back on the other way and use it until the new paste arrives?

Argh...

 

[Chiggs]

And don't use tape, use zip ties.

Kadey, that's some nice work.

Also, what's wrong with using electrical tape to secure the zip-tied cables to the back of the motherboard panel? This is what I did, and I just want to make sure that I'm not causing some awful mess or something. My build is fairly neat, too.

Not as neat as this, though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhlAfrly9vo

 

[chespace]

Just be sure to twist it around a bit once the clips are off the motherboard. The flat surfaces of the cpu and heatsink + thermal paste create quite the seal.


Also, Did you have any issues of the 8pin reaching the plug at the top of the case? I have a Antec P180 rev1.1 and want to grab the 650w version of the same Corsair PSU.

8 pin reached the top mobo plug with a little slack to spare, but I couldn't get it to reach from behind the case.

 

[godhandiscen]

So AMD finally spun off its manufacturing capabilities after months of speculation. Why isn't there a thread about this? :lol

what? link please.


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


:'(
:'(


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK!

FUCK!


In a way they saved themselves, but now it is clear that there will be no AMD beyond 2010.

 

[Ezza]

Well the temp sensors were different, but now both programs have been updated Coretemp past 0.99 is fine for 45nm as it reads the same for me as RealTemp 2.60+

CoreTemp is just as good as Realtemp now. Intel released the real TJMAX.

So all of them will give you the same result.

Mine don't.

I'm using Core Temp 0.99.3 and Real Temp 2.70 and the temps are always different, sometimes by as much as 7 degrees celsius. Core temp is always higher than real temp.

What could be causing this?

Edit: Meant Core temp is always higher than real temp.

 

[zoku88]

In a way they saved themselves, but now it is clear that there will be no AMD beyond 2010.

Uh, why? I think you're overreacting...

Spoiler

And they own 44% of the new company

\

They also got floated a couple billion dollars, too...

 

[godhandiscen]

Uh, why? I think you're overreacting...

Spoiler

And they own 44% of the new company

\

They also got floated a couple billion dollars, too...

Chances of them adapting to their new manufacturing strategy are slim. Chances of them being able to compete in the higuer end are almost null.
Socket AM3... :'(

From now on Intel will dictate the absolute pace at which the higuer end moves. Not that AMD was a rival before, but the 9850BE at least forced to reduce the price of some of the Intel Quads. This doesn't bother me as much, we all saw it coming, but still. I guess the Phenom FX (20x) will be the last AMD processor I will buy.

 

[Hazaro]

Chances of them adapting to their new manufacturing strategy are slim. Chances of them being able to compete in the higuer end are almost null.
Socket AM3... :'(

From now on intell will dictate the absolute pace at which the higuer end moves. Not that AMD was a rival before, but the 9850BE at least forced to reduce the price of some of the Intel Quads. This doesn't bother me as much, we all saw it coming, but still. i guess the Phenom Fx will be the last AMD processor I will buy.

I would just say they will continue with their aggressive price/performance.

Sad thing is we saw what happened with Nvidia and ATi (8 series domination, until ATi finally came back), although I would argue that although us consumers didn't get anything new, we didn't really NEED it, plus it gave time for R&D to do something without having to churn out new cards.

This industry really needs competition.

 

[MickeyKnox]

RE: the clutter.

Yeah, most of it are just un-used power cables from the PSU.

Are you guys saying I should just put all un-used cables into the back panel and tape them down?

Also, what's the deal with thermal paste? The Arctic Cooler 7 already came with some pre-applied. When I take it off and flip it around, is that going to mess up the thermal paste that's already on the CPU/fan? Should I buy more thermal paste now just in case?

If so, which type is good?

CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT! CABLE MANAGEMENT!

AAAAAAAAAAAGGHAGFHWAGF'IHA;KLGBA;KJBGQ!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously though, I'm ocd about that shit:

Grats on your new box though.

 

[zoku88]

Chances of them adapting to their new manufacturing strategy are slim. Chances of them being able to compete in the higuer end are almost null.
Socket AM3... :'(

Can you elaborate on the first thing you said. I don't get where you're getting your conclusions from... :-/

EDIT; You can tell that the news is good since their shares 'soared' after they released the news. (and of course, since they were given billions of dollars.) I don't think being fabless is really a big deal. Nvidia does well being fabless. I mean, it's one less thing having to worry about (keeping your fabs up to date..)

I mean, AMD is just now getting 45nm :-/

EDIT2: I have no idea when they built/upgraded a fab to that process...