Official 2008 "I Need A New PC" Thread
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- Start date
MickeyKnox
Member
I've built a lot of systems for friends, been doing it for a long time just never made money off it. Although if things work out alright by this time next year I'll be selling custom designed rigs on the side (talking about custom chassis that I'll be making at a foundry in Red Hook) I want the cases to be more like art pieces than really gaudy gamer boxes though.SRG01 said:
Jamesfrom818
Banned
MickeyKnox said:
That sounds awesome.
Big Takeover
Member
Yeah, don't take it off tonight, or maybe even ever. Sure it's not ideal, but it's hard to say if flipping it will make any quantifiable difference. It's not like you'll be pushing the cpu to the very edge of it's thermal limits anyway. You won't miss a couple degrees C, if there happens to be one.chespace said:
I'm not saying you shouldn't eventually flip it, but it's really not that big of a deal.
Sweet pics, btw.
MickeyKnox
Member
Don't fret, it's not a big deal at all to remove it these days since the cpu die isn't directly exposed. Use an old credit card to scrape the most of it off, then use alcohol with a cloth that doesn't leave fibers behind to remove the rest of it from both the bottom of the heatsink and the top of the heatspreader. I recommend getting yourself some ArcticSilver5 as it's much better than the default stuff that ships with your heatsink. Apply it according to the directions their site gives for your cpu and done.chespace said:
Hey while you're at it you could go ahead and lapp your cpu and heatsink to gain some extra degrees of cooling!
Just get some glass for a flat surface, tons of sanding paper starting rough and down all the way to the finest grade you can get, tape it to the glass then take your processor and your heatsink and sand them down till you expose the copper and make it mirror smooth.
(don't try this)
MickeyKnox said:
Lint free cloths are great with alcohol.
As for Arctic Silver 5, it's good, but MX-2 is better. Arctic Creamique is probably better as well, since it's non-conductive whereas AS5 is very slightly conductive, and noobs always apply too much paste, which can goop onto the sides and risk short circuiting something.
Page 4 of this linked PDF shows you how to apply it.
http://www.arcticsilver.com/pdf/appinstruct/as5/ins_as5_intel_quad_wcap.pdf
The same instructions apply for MX-2.
So, I've gotten the go-ahead to spec out a couple of rendering boxes for the office, and I'd like GAF's input on what I've come up with. The application for these boxes will be high-end video compositing and rendering. The baseline requirements for the box will be:
1.) A Beastly Quad Core
2.) 8GB of RAM (2gb per core needed)
3.) 500gb-1TB of storage
3.) Rock-Solid Stable under high-load situations (2-day-long renders)
The price I was given for each box was 1500-2000, but given that the tasks it will be performing require very little GPU acceleration, I'm thinking that's sort of overkill, ideally I'd like to keep it sub-1000 if possible.
What I (roughly) specced out:
CPU: Q9550. Any reasons for/against this choice?
Motherboard: This I'm not sure about, I'd prefer something by Gigabyte / Asus, but given that it's in an office environment, there won't be any overclocking needed, just stability. P45? X38? I'm open to suggestions.
RAM: Again, I've been somewhat out of the loop for the past year, so I'm not sure which kit would be best to match the FSB of the CPU. DDR2? 3? PC6400 vs 8500? 800 vs 1066?
GPU: I won't be needing much in the way of GPU acceleration, although many of our preview renders are OpenGL accelerated, so something decent-ish (yet nowhere near gamer-grade).
Thanks for any help / suggestions.
1.) A Beastly Quad Core
2.) 8GB of RAM (2gb per core needed)
3.) 500gb-1TB of storage
3.) Rock-Solid Stable under high-load situations (2-day-long renders)
The price I was given for each box was 1500-2000, but given that the tasks it will be performing require very little GPU acceleration, I'm thinking that's sort of overkill, ideally I'd like to keep it sub-1000 if possible.
What I (roughly) specced out:
CPU: Q9550. Any reasons for/against this choice?
Motherboard: This I'm not sure about, I'd prefer something by Gigabyte / Asus, but given that it's in an office environment, there won't be any overclocking needed, just stability. P45? X38? I'm open to suggestions.
RAM: Again, I've been somewhat out of the loop for the past year, so I'm not sure which kit would be best to match the FSB of the CPU. DDR2? 3? PC6400 vs 8500? 800 vs 1066?
GPU: I won't be needing much in the way of GPU acceleration, although many of our preview renders are OpenGL accelerated, so something decent-ish (yet nowhere near gamer-grade).
Thanks for any help / suggestions.
SRG01 said:
Where I'm looking (NCIX) the 9450 is actually more expensive than the 9550 (399 vs 391? wtf?)
As for the GPU, in the box I specced out, I just had a passive HD2400 in there, I REALLY do not need much in the way of GPU accel, so the FireGL/Quadro series would be total overkill. All of our tasks are very CPU-dependant, with very light GPU acceleration needed.
rabhw said:
You probably want to aim for higher speed ram given what you are going to be using the rig for. PC6400 is cheap for gaming rig and the difference isn't that drastic for games. For a render farm, it definitely matters. Higher number isn't always better either because of increased latency. You might want to google some memory reviews before jumping into it.
Went out and picked up some stuff.
99% rubbing alcohol. Zip ties. 8GB thumb drive cuz i was feeling impulsive.
and a Linksys PCI wireless network card (on my last pc, I was using a USB wifi dongle).
also picked up some Arctic-5 paste cuz all they had was coolermaster, zalman, or that.
I'll be working on this tonight...
EDIT: oh, I also bought some electrical tape.
99% rubbing alcohol. Zip ties. 8GB thumb drive cuz i was feeling impulsive.
and a Linksys PCI wireless network card (on my last pc, I was using a USB wifi dongle).
also picked up some Arctic-5 paste cuz all they had was coolermaster, zalman, or that.
I'll be working on this tonight...
EDIT: oh, I also bought some electrical tape.
MickeyKnox
Member
Yes. Now if you want better management, take that electrical tape and use it to wrap all the loose cables (the PSU ones specifically) like sleeving them so that they take up less volume and are stiff enough to work with.chespace said:Went out and picked up some stuff.
99% rubbing alcohol. Zip ties. 8GB thumb drive cuz i was feeling impulsive.
and a Linksys PCI wireless network card (on my last pc, I was using a USB wifi dongle).
also picked up some Arctic-5 paste cuz all they had was coolermaster, zalman, or that.
I'll be working on this tonight...
EDIT: oh, I also bought some electrical tape.
rabhw said:
I tend to do the same. I get the brands I am familiar with. When it comes down to performance, unless you go cheap, the performance difference really isn't that big between different boards. I think it's more important to make sure the board has all the features you need. (i.e. # of memory slots, kind of memory it supports, # ports)
Kribaca117
Neo Member
I just built, for the first time, a computer. I've had it for about a week now. No problems.
evga 790i Ultra
evga 9800GT 1gb
Q9550
4gb RAM 1600
Vista 64 Ultimate
and some random SATA 500gb
Other than a 8800GT, what do you guys think? Where did i mess up? No Vista comments please. I happen to love it. I mostly use it to play WoW, and Oblivion: super modded edition. Thanks
evga 790i Ultra
evga 9800GT 1gb
Q9550
4gb RAM 1600
Vista 64 Ultimate
and some random SATA 500gb
Other than a 8800GT, what do you guys think? Where did i mess up? No Vista comments please. I happen to love it. I mostly use it to play WoW, and Oblivion: super modded edition. Thanks
Anyone getting the Antec Skeleton case? :lol
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article840-page1.html
I have the P182, love it. P183 looks ugly from the front...
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article840-page1.html
I have the P182, love it. P183 looks ugly from the front...
godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
Kick ass, but I'll wait for reviews. Dust and noise could pottentially cancel the pros of this case. If not, I have the perfect spot to put this baby.RuGalz said:Anyone getting the Antec Skeleton case? :lol
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article840-page1.html
I have the P182, love it. P183 looks ugly from the front...
chespace said:
I think idle at ~40-45 is pretty typical (according to RealTemp 2.60 or newer) in a normal temperature room. My E8400 is idling around 40C in RealTemp 2.60 in a room that's about 15C. I should note I overclocked my E8400 from 3GHz to 3.2GHz, using stock voltage and stock heatsinkfan. I don't plan to push it any further until this PC is old and slow.
lachesis
Member
chespace said:
Not so sure about the normal temp for Q9550 - but one thing I know that is quads run hotter.
Also I hear artic freezer 7 isn't that great cooling quad cores. (as well as my Zalman 9700nt.
) I also have Arctic Freezer 7 for my 2nd computer with E7200, and does its job quite well... However, it should be better than your stock cooler, and AF7's price is quite good too. Best cooler that I hear for quad cores is Thermalright Ultra 120 with 2x 120mm fans, front and back. Unless you are going for some serious OC'ing, AF7 should be good enough for most, and your case's excellent airflow should help too. (once you are done with your cable management, that is. 
)
lachesis
Member
RuGalz said:Anyone getting the Antec Skeleton case? :lol
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article840-page1.html
I have the P182, love it. P183 looks ugly from the front...
Skeleton... sorry nope.
I also have P182, and love it very much. P183 does seem to have some improvements, as it now seems you can add 120 mm fan in the front of lower chamber (which I thought it always made more sense). New Sonata looks intriguing enough. I wonder how it would actually work out? (rather strange airflow design, I'd say) - as if you install multiple HDDs on top and bottom, it would generally cancel out the airflow itself creating walls...?
Wait, I'm confused about this talk about the direction of the heatsink. I have mine oriented pretty much the same way, with the fan on the back facing back. Either way, it's sucking whatever hot air there is through the HS and blowing it towards the rear chassis fans. Is it really a huge deal over whether the fan is fore or aft of the HS? (I have a different HSF, but it's essentially the same configuration)
bee
Member
lachesis said:I'd be very much interested learn how to. I have 8800 GTS g92 512, and I'd love to softmod into Quadro. The computer it's running is basically for 3d max and Autocad (and didn't have any $$$$ to buy 2000 dollar card.
http://www.techarp.com/showarticle.aspx?artno=539
should also work for the incoming photoshop cs4 which has plugins for quadro acceleration
Big Takeover
Member
CPU HSFs generally blow, not suckDarthWoo said:
Unless you have one specifically designed to suck, or you've purposefully mounted the fan to suck, chances are it's actually blowing.
lachesis
Member
bee said:
Thanks for the link. I googled before I came back to this board, and found that exact article too. I'm thinking about modding my 8800 GTS g92 512mb to Quadro FX 3700 - as it's the most closest thing I can find. (Actually, many people are modding 8800 GT into FX 3700 - which makes me wonder whether I can do the same with my g92 GTS...)
Chiggs
Gold Member
HardOCP reviews the 1GB 4870:
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTU2MiwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTU2MiwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==
Jamesfrom818
Banned
Probably a stupid question but I'll ask anyway. I'm getting my Eee PC 1000H today. I don't plan on buying an external DVD drive but if I wanted to install Vista, could I stick the Eee's HDD in my laptop and then put it back in my Eee when its done installing?
RuGalz said:
Hmm, at a room temperature of about 70 down here in my den, my idle reads 29, 29, 35, 32 right now while surfing GAF and downloading Crysis complete package from Steam.
So anyway, here's an update. I reinstalled the HSF facing the right way this time.
Scrubbed the HSF and CPU clean with rubbing alcohol and attached it. This Arctic Silver 5 seems to have worked pretty good.I went ahead and installed Vista 32 and Vista 64 onto two different HDDs so I can dual boot from bios. Is there an easy way to choose which drive to boot from without having to hold down DEL and select the drive? Like have a quick menu pop up when I boot?
Tragically, the Linksys wifi card I bought (WMP54G) does not have drivers that support Vista 64 so I can't access the internet via my 64 bit OS.
To install Catalyst drivers, I had to do a lot of back and forth with my thumb drive and laptop. Does anyone know where I can find drivers for Linksys WMP54G on 64 bit Vista? Do most games even support 64 bit Vista outside of Crysis?
Also, I left my computer running while I went to sleep, hoping I'd have Crysis downloaded by now. Unfortunately, when I came down, the computer was turned off. When I turned it on, it came on real quick, like it was in sleep mode. How do I get rid of sleep mode if I want to download stuff all night? In the Asus mobo bios?
Anyway, it's getting close... once I figure out my Vista 64 wifi driver situation I'll be good to go.
Manp
Member
how's the corsair 750w? noise?chespace said:
on Asus boards usually F8 at bios screenchespace said:
according to Google that wireless card has a Ralink RT2500 chipsetchespace said:Tragically, the Linksys wifi card I bought (WMP54G) does not have drivers that support Vista 64 so I can't access the internet via my 64 bit OS.
http://www.ralinktech.com/ralink/Home/Support/Windows.html
fourth one should be the one you need, give it a try
Manp said:how's the corsair 750w? noise?
It's definitely not quiet, but considering I've got a total of 8 other fans going in this case, I can't really tell just how much noise it's making.
But overall, this system is surprisingly quiet! I love it.
One question: Realtemp says my CPU is running at 1999.77 MHz, but when I run benchmarks using Realtemp, it says the E8400s are running at like 4000MHz and 3000Mhz. I'm seriously confused.
Argh, and why does Steam just sit there and says "Downloading starting..." for Crysis but not actually start? It's been doing this forever now.
EDIT: N/M, there it goes!
bee
Member
chespace said:
i did dual boot for around 18 months with xp32 and vista 64 i just put both os's on 1 hdd with separate partitions and when i booted the pc, the vista boot loader kicked in and asked me which i wanted to run, older version of windows or windows vista
all games run fine on vista 64 they just run in 32bit mode
chespace said:Do most games even support 64 bit Vista outside of Crysis?
Also, I left my computer running while I went to sleep, hoping I'd have Crysis downloaded by now. Unfortunately, when I came down, the computer was turned off. When I turned it on, it came on real quick, like it was in sleep mode. How do I get rid of sleep mode if I want to download stuff all night? In the Asus mobo bios?
Anyway, it's getting close... once I figure out my Vista 64 wifi driver situation I'll be good to go.
I use nothing but Vista 64 and have no problems as a gamer and student. Vista 64 allows you to use all of your RAM, not just 3GB of it, which will help in modern games since they are growing more asset rich, especially open world games. Vista 64 can run almost every 32-bit application just fine.
Chiggs
Gold Member
chespace said:
Cool!
Tragically, the Linksys wifi card I bought (WMP54G) does not have drivers that support Vista 64 so I can't access the internet via my 64 bit OS.
I would probably recommend ditching that card and just getting a USB Wi-Fi adapter. I know people generally shriek at the thought of their internet connection running on USB, but mine has been pretty decent.
http://www.dlink.com/products/?model=WUA-2340
Full Vista Support (comes with a wired stand, too).
No, but I'd still recommend running it.
You can go into the bios, or you can just go into the control panel and then select power options or something.
Manp
Member
i'm trying to find a decent PSU that must be really quiet since the one i have now is the thing making more noise in my PCchespace said:It's definitely not quiet, but considering I've got a total of 8 other fans going in this case, I can't really tell just how much noise it's making.
But overall, this system is surprisingly quiet! I love it.
PS: you caught me before the edit. take a look at my previous post.
Chiggs
Gold Member
chespace said:It's definitely not quiet, but considering I've got a total of 8 other fans going in this case, I can't really tell just how much noise it's making.
But overall, this system is surprisingly quiet! I love it.
What the hell? Your system is...quiet? We need to fix that. On the back of the case, towards the top, you'll notice some switches. Those are the fan controls for the exhaust and for that giant beast on the top. Switch them all the way up until you can't stand the sound of your system. On the front panels, you'll notice some nobs sticking out. Those are the controls for the intake. Turn them all the way up until you get a headache.
Okay, now you're in business.
chespace said:Hmm, at a room temperature of about 70 down here in my den, my idle reads 29, 29, 35, 32 right now while surfing GAF and downloading Crysis complete package from Steam.
Very nice. I'll probably get a better HS when I actually am going to play games on this rig. Right now, the Q9550 is totally over kill for compiling code. :lol
Big Takeover
Member
I have no idea what Realtemp is doing with those benchmarks, but the 1999.77 MHz is because your motherboard is throttling back the cpu to save power. It kicks it back up when you do anything intensive. Not a bad feature, but if you want it running full bore all the time disable C1E, and SpeedStep in your bios under CPU Configuration.chespace said:It's definitely not quiet, but considering I've got a total of 8 other fans going in this case, I can't really tell just how much noise it's making.
But overall, this system is surprisingly quiet! I love it.
One question: Realtemp says my CPU is running at 1999.77 MHz, but when I run benchmarks using Realtemp, it says the E8400s are running at like 4000MHz and 3000Mhz. I'm seriously confused.
Argh, and why does Steam just sit there and says "Downloading starting..." for Crysis but not actually start? It's been doing this forever now.
EDIT: N/M, there it goes!
Definitely try that Ralink driver Manp suggested (4th one down). Here's full directions if you need them.
Big Takeover
Member
You do not want to do that. Buy/borrow/steal an external drive.Jamesfrom818 said:
Jamesfrom818
Banned
BCD2 said:
Yeah I think I'm just going to buy a 360 HD DVD drive. Should be pretty cheap.
JSnake said:
Depends on who you ask. When I started OCing, I read on a bunch of forums that temps between 40-50 C under load were good, and temps between 50-60C under load are acceptable, but usually indicate that you need better cooling.
Try to turn up your CPU fan in the motherboard. Helped reduce my temp's from around 45 C to 40 C (I'm using a P5Q mobo with a E8500 OC'd to 3.8)
prodystopian
Member
JSnake said:
The 8º difference between your two cores seems a bit much to me. As for the temps, I wouldn't worry as long as those are at full load after a long period of time (Prime95 after twenty minutes or a similar stress test). I'd be worried when you start pushing close to 65ºC.