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Official 2008 "I Need A New PC" Thread
- Thread starter Kosma
- Start date
dagZ said:is the monitor and case included? if not, please pick me for me too.
The monitor is not, the case is. The case is kinda expensive but I've got it myself, and it's got loads of space, looks very cool (and not in some horrid over the top 500 different lights after a plexiglass side way) and is very quiet.
I don't know too much about monitors myself, so I'd leave that to someone else.
COOLER MASTER RC-690-KKN1-GP Black SECC/ ABS ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119137
Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3750330AS 750GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148298
POWERCOLOR AX4870X2 2GBD5-H Radeon HD 4870 X2 2GB 512-bit (256-bit x 2) GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131116
PC Power & Cooling T1KWSR 1000W Continuous @ 50°C EPS12V Power Supply - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703003
G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F3-10666CL9D-4GBPK - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231188
GIGABYTE GA-EP45T-DS3R LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128348
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450 Yorkfield 2.66GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80569Q9450 - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115042
XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 120mm Rifle CPU Cooler - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233003
Scythe SY1225SL12SH 120mm "Slipstream" Case Fan - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185060
$1880.
This computer is as future proof as you will get. This will play Crysis with AA on easily. No game, coming out, out on the market now, or will be out in the next couple of years will even be a challenge for this computer.
1. 4870X2, the most powerful graphic card money can buy.
2. Motherboard supports all Intel 775 CPU's, and supports Overclocked DDR3 memory. DDR3 is the newest DDR memory, and will be the standard in a year or so.
3. 4gb of DDR3 Ram, future proof.
5. Quad Core CPU. Games will eventually use more then two cores, more often. So future proofing yourself means you buy a Quad core. This is a fantastic quad core, that OC's very well.
6. One of the top HSF on the market today, arguably the best. Has beaten TRUE in various tests. Will allow you to OC without worrying about exploding your CPU.
7. Case supports up to 8 120MM fans, 6HDD, 4 5.25 inch bays, and has room for any graphic card, no matter how large.
8. 7 110 CFM fans. These things push TONS of air. You will not have cooling issues.
9. 1000W PC Power and Cooling PSU. Need I say more? 1000W of power, all the connections you need, from arguably the top PSU maker on earth.
I also left you a few hundred dollars of room to get Vista if you need it, or a new Samsung monitor.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119137
Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3750330AS 750GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148298
POWERCOLOR AX4870X2 2GBD5-H Radeon HD 4870 X2 2GB 512-bit (256-bit x 2) GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131116
PC Power & Cooling T1KWSR 1000W Continuous @ 50°C EPS12V Power Supply - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703003
G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F3-10666CL9D-4GBPK - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231188
GIGABYTE GA-EP45T-DS3R LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128348
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450 Yorkfield 2.66GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80569Q9450 - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115042
XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 120mm Rifle CPU Cooler - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233003
Scythe SY1225SL12SH 120mm "Slipstream" Case Fan - Retail
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185060
$1880.
This computer is as future proof as you will get. This will play Crysis with AA on easily. No game, coming out, out on the market now, or will be out in the next couple of years will even be a challenge for this computer.
1. 4870X2, the most powerful graphic card money can buy.
2. Motherboard supports all Intel 775 CPU's, and supports Overclocked DDR3 memory. DDR3 is the newest DDR memory, and will be the standard in a year or so.
3. 4gb of DDR3 Ram, future proof.
5. Quad Core CPU. Games will eventually use more then two cores, more often. So future proofing yourself means you buy a Quad core. This is a fantastic quad core, that OC's very well.
6. One of the top HSF on the market today, arguably the best. Has beaten TRUE in various tests. Will allow you to OC without worrying about exploding your CPU.
7. Case supports up to 8 120MM fans, 6HDD, 4 5.25 inch bays, and has room for any graphic card, no matter how large.
8. 7 110 CFM fans. These things push TONS of air. You will not have cooling issues.
9. 1000W PC Power and Cooling PSU. Need I say more? 1000W of power, all the connections you need, from arguably the top PSU maker on earth.
I also left you a few hundred dollars of room to get Vista if you need it, or a new Samsung monitor.
Looked at this:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-gtx-280,1953.html
Sounds like the latest nVidia chips don't compare so favorably with ATI. I really would rather get nVidia due to Linux drivers and stuff like X-Plane that's designed with it in mind. Are the 8800/9800 versions still decent? Like I said, I want a good computer, but probably not the HIGHEST end cards/processors since those tend to be more expensive. Sounds like core 2 duos are still the way to go since quads won't help with some apps/games.
One question about newegg: I tried searching for the nVidia card mentioned and got like 20 different listings with prices from $300-400 or more. What's the best way to find which of those is the one to pick? Are they third-party sellers, or just different products newegg sells? Sorry, I'm new to newegg. >_>
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-gtx-280,1953.html
Sounds like the latest nVidia chips don't compare so favorably with ATI. I really would rather get nVidia due to Linux drivers and stuff like X-Plane that's designed with it in mind. Are the 8800/9800 versions still decent? Like I said, I want a good computer, but probably not the HIGHEST end cards/processors since those tend to be more expensive. Sounds like core 2 duos are still the way to go since quads won't help with some apps/games.
One question about newegg: I tried searching for the nVidia card mentioned and got like 20 different listings with prices from $300-400 or more. What's the best way to find which of those is the one to pick? Are they third-party sellers, or just different products newegg sells? Sorry, I'm new to newegg. >_>
Is that 550w PSU good enough for the 4870?
About newegg: I try to stick with familiar brands like Asus, PNY, evga, etc. Also, look at the top sellers as they might reveal to you some nice deals and brands.
EDIT:
A little side story, after I ordered my 4850, I went back to newegg and it said it was sold out! I think they are back in stock now, but I can only imagine what would have happened if it was out of stock! Just my luck.
About newegg: I try to stick with familiar brands like Asus, PNY, evga, etc. Also, look at the top sellers as they might reveal to you some nice deals and brands.
EDIT:
A little side story, after I ordered my 4850, I went back to newegg and it said it was sold out! I think they are back in stock now, but I can only imagine what would have happened if it was out of stock! Just my luck.
TheHeretic
Banned
Anyone who actually recommends buying DDR3 ram has absolutely no idea what they are talking about, and that build shows it.
TheHeretic
Banned
Trax416 said:
The timings on that RAM are complete shit, like all DDR3 RAM that doesn't cost a shitload. The performance increases from getting higher clocked RAM compared to DDR2 800 are exactly zero, he might as well donate that $50 to charity and do something useful with it.
He doesn't need a 1000 Watt PSU as well, mainly because he isn't powering an office building. Not that the Watts even matter, its voltage on rails that matters, but hey, 1000 WATTZ OF JUICE MAN!!!
Hazaro said:
Ah, I mixed it up with the crossfire recommendation.
Also, subscribe to newegg so you can take advantage of these deals:
http://promotions.newegg.com/NEemail/Aug-0-2008/Promo081908in/index-landing.html
The 5870 video card has a -15 dollar coupon code.
Also check out: http://www.dealigg.com/story-NewEgg-coupons-NewEgg-com-coupon-code
for other codes and deals.
TheHeretic said:
If you look at the builds I normally make for people on here, I don't suggest 1000WPSU. However, he wants to be future proof. Why not get a PSU that will be able to handle any SLI/CRossfire build he will make in the next 5 years?
Graphic cards are always sucking up more power. It's a fact of life and physics. Buying a 620Watt PSU now, means it will be useless a few years down the line.
In 2004, 500Watt's was considered pretty extreme. Four years later, they have 1200Watt PSu's out, that are selling like hot cakes.
Having a 1000Watt PSU, with all modern connections, that will not be changing any time soon, means he will never have to worry about getting a different PSU again.
It's not just Performance increases as to why I picked the DDR3 ram. I picked it for several reasoning. Outside of Overclocking, Intel's new standard is DDR3 ram. Thats what new motherboards supporting I7 will be using.
The speeds of DDR3 now, will be what we use 4 years down the line. In 4 years, the ram I gave him, will still be good ram.
How would buying DDR2 Ram, which will be obsolete in the future, just like PC3200 Ram, make sense? Especially when DDR3 ram is going to be supported for a very long time.
I think you missed the word future proof.
Also, You are stuck in early 2007. Good DDR2 Ram, is close in price to DDR3 ram.
zoku88 said:
8gb of DDR2 ram is not only useless, it gives many motherboards bios issues and problems.
I would take 4gb of DDR3 ram now, then add another 4gb of DDR3 with Intels new I7 boards. Then pick up 8gb of DDR2 that will be next to useless with up coming motherboards/sockets.
DDR2 is simply not future proof. And thats what he wants.
If he wants to go cheaper, and not as future proof, another user linked a less future proof, more cost effective PC. Which, if you actually read this thread, you would see I also suggested if he didn't want to spend the money.
TheHeretic
Banned
The concept of future proofing is completely foreign to the PC market, and you shouldn't be buying needlessly expensive parts for the hell of it. DDR3 is a waste of money from a performance standpoint, and doubly so from a practical standpoint. Until it actually does something, noone who knows what they are talking about can actually recommend it, and the same goes for bloated PSU's that people think they need. Even with SLi/Crossfire you will be lucky to push 500 Watts.
Whatever you buy today will be shit tomorrow. Buy the best value system today and to the same in a few years, you'll be better off.
Whatever you buy today will be shit tomorrow. Buy the best value system today and to the same in a few years, you'll be better off.
TheHeretic said:
You really don't know what you are talking about. Do I need to explain the simple concept of how Power supplies work, and as you push them towards there max, they become less effecient, meaning you need more wattage, and 12v 30A rails suddenly start to fail?
500Watts of modern Crossfire/SLI configuration is pretty laughable.
http://game.amd.com/us-en/crossfirex_components.aspx?p=3
Look at all the 500 Watt Crossfire supported PSU's.
You can get buy with a 620 Watt, and that's assuming you don't have multiple Hard-drives, and disc drives and buy from only a top quality company with high efficiency ratings.
Also, future proofing may not "exist" per say. But you can build computers that run games for years.
I was running COD4 at 30FPS on my 4400X2 and 7900GS, with 2gb of PC3200 ram.
TheHeretic
Banned
Trax416 said:
Yeah, whatever.
DDR3 would do nothing for him. I mean, if this is future proof, you really shouldn't be thinking about how you could use the RAM in future builds. In the future, the RAM you recommended now will be slow.Trax416 said:
I mean, due to latency, DDR3 1333 is hardly that much better than something like DDR2 800 or something. If you're going to get DDR3 for the heck of it, you should get 1600+, which is uber expensive. I see no reason to get DDR3 unless you're forced to (Nehalem.)
And you say 8GB is useless? Sure, it may be too much now, but are you going to hazard a guess on how much RAM future games will take? Or how about other programs.
zoku88 said:
Future PC games are going to be more GPU dependent then CPU dependent. This is a trend all graphic card companies want. Intel on the other hands wants to integrate the GPU on the CPU die. Which won't be happening for a long time.
You won't need 8gb of ram for a long time. When you do, DDR2 will be harder to find then Carmen Sandiego.
GPU memory is what you will need more of, as resolutions increase. Playing modern games at 1080p with 512mb of ram, is a joke now that 1gb and 2gb cards are out.
His 4870X2 has 2 gb of GDDR5 ram. Thats what counts.
Dr. Zoidberg
Member
OK fellas. I'm asking for advice:
I'm getting totally fed up with trying to stream video content through the PS3/360. Unless I'm wrong there is some kind of annoying 4GB limit for video files with these systems, plus I keep getting stuff in MKV format and I've had to waste time converting, etc. It's just pissing me off at this point.
SO, I'd like to get some kind of small PC for my living room. I'd like it to be:
- Small
- Able to play hi-def content
- Able to output 1080p to the TV via component or HDMI
- As cheap as possible
- Something I don't have to put together
What kind of options are there for something like this? Am I doomed to have to research parts, build it, and go through all that rigmarole? I'll do that for my main PC but for this purpose I'd much rather just buy a pre-made box from some company that could handle this.
I'm getting totally fed up with trying to stream video content through the PS3/360. Unless I'm wrong there is some kind of annoying 4GB limit for video files with these systems, plus I keep getting stuff in MKV format and I've had to waste time converting, etc. It's just pissing me off at this point.
SO, I'd like to get some kind of small PC for my living room. I'd like it to be:
- Small
- Able to play hi-def content
- Able to output 1080p to the TV via component or HDMI
- As cheap as possible
- Something I don't have to put together
What kind of options are there for something like this? Am I doomed to have to research parts, build it, and go through all that rigmarole? I'll do that for my main PC but for this purpose I'd much rather just buy a pre-made box from some company that could handle this.
Chiggs said:
It's pretty obvious I am not one of those people. I have an HX620. I suggested similar PSU's in this thread.
However, a PSU is one thing you can future proof. a 1000WATT psu with all the connections you need now will be useful longer then any PC part you can possibly buy.
If Crossfire Setups now need a minimum of 620Watts, Whats it going to be like in 3 years?
TheHeretic
Banned
Chiggs said:
Everytime I come into this thread (and similar threads) im always making the same points. A system with a E8400 and an 8800GT with a few hard/optical drives consumes around 300 Watts, and even then people were reccommending 620W PSU's to handle "teh power".
I'm not entirely familiar with these new GPU's but they don't need 1000W PSU's, that doesn't seem to stop people from buying them.
Dr. Zoidberg said:
You have tons of options for very energy efficient HTPC's. Even using Mini ITX boards. However, you will need to put it together. AMD has really good Chipsets out that work amazing with 1080p content over HDMi. Couple that with some low cost ram, and an energy effecient AMD CPU, a cheap HD, a small Power supply and a cost effective case. Even toss in a Blu Ray drive, and you are good to go.
TheHeretic said:
They don't need it, but he wants to be future proof. PSU's can be future proof.
Like I said, if he wanted to go cheaper, and more cost effective, another user linked a great computer for him to build.
I buy PSU's for not only the build I am doing now, but something that I can use for 3-4 builds down the road.
Why would I buy a 400Watt PSU for my 8800GT E8400 set up, when I will be forced to buy a new PSU another build down the road.
It's cheaper for him to buy a 1000WATT 80 percent efficiency PSU now. Then buy a 500 watt one. Then a 600 watt one next build, etc..
It's silly to guess how much RAM you will need in the future. When I was a freshman in highschool (uh, 2001-2001? I think?) 512 MB of RAM was considered standard (I believe, maybe it was 1GB. I got a computer with 512MB that year.)Trax416 said:
A year (or two) ago, 2GB was considered standard. A game called Supreme Commander came out, which could sometimes break the 32-bit address space limit in Windows (2GB,) and crash. Now we have a lot of people going for 4GB of RAM. Who knows what the situation could be in 4 years.
You can't just say that one single part is important. A system is only as strong as it's weakest link, which can potentially be the RAM.
Anyway, the point was, there is no reason why buying the DDR3 RAM would be more 'future-proof.'
Who knows, but the answer you want to hear probably helps my point. (I think it was PC2100, actually)Trax416 said:
How many builds in 4-5 years, do you think, will be using DDR3 1333MHz RAM? I mean, your argument was that he could use it in a new build, but that would probably be considered slow RAM by that time, would it not?
zoku88 said:
Intel has stated it's being supported for 5 years. Intel doesn't even start it's full support for a few more months.
So why not get it now, and use it for the full four-5 years. Then buy 8gb of DDR2 ram, that won't even work with motherboards in a couple years.
Also, no because the ram I suggest can be overclocked to higher speeds. The DDR3 ram out now is pretty mature, outside of the price. It's not like DDR2 5300. Which, by the way, is still being used in gaming builds.
I use DDR2 ram in my build now, but when I make a new one, it will be DDR3. In four months, I will bet my entire account, most builds you see on the Internet will be including DDR3 to go along with the I7's.
Tbh, to me it seems like a far better idea to buy price/performance and upgrade earlier than to try to future proof something. From my experience in the past, the time both builds last really doesn't differ all that much, and there really aren't very many components you can reuse (pretty much only the PSU/case and peripherals). Man do I regret spending a fuckton in the past, and seeing my friends who spent half lasting almost as long with their builds :/.
Kabouter said:
Lets put it like this.
You buy DDR2 ram now.
I buy DDR3 ram now.
In two years when you need to upgrade, because your CPU, motherboard, chipset, and the entire LGA775 boards are no longer supported. You will be buying DDR3 ram.
When I upgrade in two years because my CPU, Motherboard, chipset and entire LGA775 board is not supported, I WON'T be buying ram. Saving over $100.
Tell me what makes more sense.
We aren't in the middle of a generation. We are at the START of a new one.
In a few months when the new boards and sockets are out. EVERYONE building high end PC rigs will be purchasing DDR3. So why not buy it now?
This isn't a year away. It's a few months away.
The I7 stuff will be out before Xmas.
I'm not sure if you're understanding me.Trax416 said:
What you're describing:
Buy 4GB DDR3 for $100 premium, use it for 4 years (maybe have it not be enough,) then use it in the new build
What I'm saying 1):
Buy 4GB DDR2, use it for 4 years (maybe have it not be enough,) then buy faster DDR3 RAM (faster than 1333 MHz) and use it in the new build.
What I'm saying 2):
Buy 8GB DDR2, use it for 4 years (unless something strange happens, should be adequate,) then buy faster DDR3 RAM and use it in the new build.
EDIT: Whoa whoa, do you think DDR3 prices will stay stagnant for 2 years?