Official bitching about Hudson abandoning VC support. [VC/WiiWare = lost cause]
- Thread starter Kobun Heat
- Start date
http://blog.wired.com/games/2008/03/sega-master-sys.html
Sega Master System games officially coming to North America.
Sega Master System games officially coming to North America.
EphemeralDream
Member
Retro Roundup 3/24
King's Knight: Not Worth It
Powerball: Not Worth It
Spelunker: Not Worth It
Super R-Type: Not Worth It
King's Knight: Not Worth It
Powerball: Not Worth It
Spelunker: Not Worth It
Super R-Type: Not Worth It
NES: Adventures of Lolo 2, River City Ransom/Street Gangs (EU only), StarTropicsbengraven said:
SNES: Do Re Mi Fantasy (US/JP only), Harvest Moon, Super Street Fighter II, Super Turrican
N64: 1080 Snowboarding, Kirby 64
MD/GEN: Mega Turrican (EU only), Phantasy Star II
TG: Lords of Thunder
That's about it.
Better be 400 each here as wellShard said:
400 points? Awesome. Edit: Almost makes me wish there were more SMS games I wanted in the first place. Right now it's just the Fantasy Zones, the Game Gear Alestes, Golden Axe Warrior, the Game Gear Shining Force, Wonder Boy in Monster Land, and Golvellius.Shard said:
Pending that you like these genres:bengraven said:
Bubble Bobble (arcade)
Star Tropics (Zelda-ish, kind of)
King of Fighters '94 (fighting)
Adventures of Lolo 2 (top-down puzzle)
1080 Snowboarding (...snowboarding)
Lords of Thunder (horizontal shooter)
Harvest Moon (simulation)
Phantasy Star II (RPG)
Super Turrican (2D action)
DoReMi Fantasy (2D platformer)
Adventures of Lolo 2, Lords of Thunder, and DoReMi Fantasy get my vote for being tops in their respective classes.
crowphoenix
Banned
bengraven said:Oh not bad at all!ST, KoF94, HM, and PSII get.
I'd ask if they released Shining Force 2, but I don't want to bring up bad memories.
It's like they don't want us to have it. *Sob*
bengraven
Member
crowphoenix said:
Yeah, see what I mean?
I played SF1 3 or 4 times. Worked my ass off to pick up a copy on eBay. I've actually picked up TWO copies on eBay. Plus, have the VC edition and the Smash Pack on PC.
But SF2, I only rented once and played it up to that desert level where you had to put a plank in a tree or some such thing. Couldn't figure it out and that was it. Would LOVE to come back to this. LOVE IT.
crowphoenix
Banned
bengraven said:Yeah, see what I mean?
I played SF1 3 or 4 times. Worked my ass off to pick up a copy on eBay. I've actually picked up TWO copies on eBay. Plus, have the VC edition and the Smash Pack on PC.
But SF2, I only rented once and played it up to that desert level where you had to put a plank in a tree or some such thing. Couldn't figure it out and that was it. Would LOVE to come back to this. LOVE IT.
Yeah, I never bought the game, but I rented it tons of times. Didn't get everything about the game either, but I remember that damn plank puzzle. It opened a dungeon under the tree. Really what I'm looking forward to is the chess board.
Nuclear Muffin
Banned
Heh SEGA have just done the opposite with the US/EU and JPN. Japan gets MD/GEN games for 200 points less than us and we get SMS games for 200 points less than them!
Shining Force II is stuck with Ys Book I & II and Dragon Slayer among the list of RPGs that were rated months ago but have yet to show. :/
On a happier note, I wonder if the cheaper price for Master System here means Commodore 64 will also be lower if/when that shows up.
On a happier note, I wonder if the cheaper price for Master System here means Commodore 64 will also be lower if/when that shows up.
Well, that's one way to ruin the news.Nuclear Muffin said:
reggieandTFE
Member
I wonder if they're going to release the little snake maze game that came on the system.
Dash Kappei
Not actually that important
I don't remember if Super Turrican and Mega Turrican are completely different Turrican games or not... wanna shed some light fellas?
Different levels all around. Mega Turrican has the grapple, Super Turrican has the morph ball.Dash Kappei said:
Remind me again how that differs from Wonder Boy In Monster World please (because that's already out).Jiggy37 said:
... or actually, wait, is that the other version of Adventure Island?
I want Alex Kidd In Miracle something something. I've never played it myself, but from what I've seen, it's significantly more desirable than that Enchanted Castle stuff.
Tell me, I remember reading something years ago, where this guy was talking about how he loved his Master System more than his NES, and how the SMS had better counterparts.
He said there was some kind of Metroid-ish game that had different characters with unique abilities.
But I can't remember the title. Anybody know?
He said there was some kind of Metroid-ish game that had different characters with unique abilities.
But I can't remember the title. Anybody know?
A Black Falcon
Member
bcn-ron said:
It's pretty confusing...
http://hg101.classicgaming.gamespy.com/wonderboy/wonderboy.htm
http://www.sega-16.com/feature_page.php?id=270&title=History of: The Wonder Boy Series
HG101 is more comprehensive, of course, but the other article is good too. For some reason I decided to make a complete list of the console versions...
Edit: This site is also great for names.
http://myrsten.nu/spel/wonderboy/
There are six Wonder Boy/Monster World games. Console releases:
(Bolded titles are out now on VC.)
#1: "Wonder Boy 1", released on: Arcade, Sega Master System, NES, Game Gear. Genre: Platform/Action
Arcade title: Wonder Boy
SMS title, US/Europe: Wonder Boy (announced for VC)
SMS title, Japan: Super Wonder Boy (announced for VC)
NES title, US: Adventure Island (with some altered graphics for rebranding for NES ver.)
NES title, Japan: Master Takahashi's Adventure Island (with same altered graphics for rebranding for NES ver.)
GG title, US: Revenge of Drancon
GG title, JP/EU: Wonder Boy
Also on: MSX (as Adventure Island), Sega SG-1000, Amiga, Commodore 64, ZX Spectrum (as Wonder Boy on all four)
#2: "Wonder Boy 2", "Monster World 1", released on: Arcade, SMS, Turbografx-16. Genre: SSARPG
Arcade title: Wonder Boy: Monster Land (unsure about if that is the exact title)
SMS title, US/EU: Wonder Boy in Monster Land (probable for VC)
SMS title, Japan: Super Wonder Boy: Monster World (probable for VC)
SMS title, Brazil: Turma da Monica no Castelo do Dragao (with altered graphics for rebranding (Monica franchise) for Brazilian SMS release)
Turbografx-16 title, Japan: Bikkuriman World (with altered graphics for rebranding (Bikkuriman franchise) for Turbografx-16 release)
Also on: Amiga (as Wonder Boy in Monster Land), Commodore 64, Amstrad CPC (as Super Wonder Boy in Monster Land on both)
#3: "Wonder Boy 3", released on: Arcade, Genesis, Turbo CD. Genre: Platform-Shooter
Arcade title: Wonder Boy III: Monster Lair
Genesis title, Japan: Wonder Boy III: Monster Lair
Genesis title, Europe: Monster Lair
Turbo CD title, Japan: Wonder Boy III: Monster Lair
Turbo CD title, US: Monster Lair
#4: "Wonder Boy 4", "Monster World 2", released on: SMS, Game Gear, Turbografx-16. Genre: SSARPG
SMS title, US/EU: Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap (titled "III" because the actual Wonder Boy III wasn't out yet here at the time; note the Japanese version does not use that number)
SMS title, Brazil: Turma da Monica em O Resgate (with altered graphics for rebranding (Monica franchise) for Brazilian SMS release)
Game Gear title, Japan: Monster World II: Dragon's Curse
Game Gear title, Europe: Wonder Boy (III) : The Dragon's Trap
Turbografx-16 title, US: Dragon's Curse (with altered graphics for TG-16 release)
Turbografx-16 title, Japan: Adventure Island (with same altered graphics for TG-16 release)
#5: "Wonder Boy 5", "Monster World 3", released on: Genesis, Turbo CD, SMS. Genre: SSARPG
Genesis title, US: Wonder Boy in Monster World
Genesis title, Japan: Wonder Boy V: Monster World III
Turbo CD title, US: The Dynastic Hero (with altered graphics for TG-CD release)
Turbo CD title, Japan: Chou Eiyuu Densetsu: Dynastic Hero (unsure about if that is the exact title) (with same altered graphics for TG-CD release)
SMS title, Europe: Wonder Boy in Monster World
SMS title, Brazil: Turma da Monica na Terra dos Monstros (with altered graphics for rebranding (Monica franchise) for Brazilian SMS release)
#6: "Monster World 4", released on: Genesis. Genre: SSAPRG
Genesis title, Japan: Monster World IV (starring a female character, so it is not "Wonder Boy", obviously -- though Wonder Boy III: Monster Lair had both a male and female playable character and that one was called "Wonder Boy", so they could have anyway I guess. They just didn't.)
... done. Gah, that took a while to sort out...
So, can we break this down into genre as well?A Black Falcon said:
If I'm not mistaken it would be something like this?
#1: Arcade, SMS, NES, GG
Classic "Hudson's Adventure Island" style platformer
#2: Arcade, SMS, Turbografx-16
Platformer/RPG?
#3: Arcade, Genesis, Turbo CD
Platformer/Shooter
#4: SMS, Game Gear, Turbografx-16
Platformer/RPG
#5: Genesis, Turbo CD, SMS
Platformer/RPG
#6: Genesis
Platformer/RPG
CreatureX3
Member
SMS games for only 400pts? Yes!
Fantasy Zone and Fantasy Zone II please!
Fantasy Zone and Fantasy Zone II please!
A Black Falcon
Member
BooJoh said:
#1 IS Adventure Island. The first Adventure Island game was a rebranded version of Wonder Boy. The rest of the games in the franchise were original, but the first wasn't. Almost all of them kept the traditional platformer style, however, unlike the Wonder Boy franchise, which quickly went into action-RPGs... only the final Adventure Island game, Super Adventure Island 2, added RPG elements.
#3 is a platformer/shooter, yes. It's considered probably the worst game in the series by most, I believe.
Anyway, yeah, the first and third ones are classic arcadey side-scrolling platformers, and the second, fourth, fifth, and sixth are the ones with RPG elements. Note "Monster World" in the second game's Japanese title -- it is the beginning of the new franchise. Those four are the "Monster World" games, or, for the first game's US title, "Monster Land". Either way, it's distinguished from the just plain "Wonder Boy" of the other two games. The Japanese Monster World game titles have numbers in them, so they are easier to keep track of than the numberless US titles...
The sixth game wasn't "Wonder Boy", of course, because it doesn't star a boy, so it really isn't Wonder Boy 6. It is Monster World IV, and is the sixth title in the loose franchise. It would make a lot of sense if the two action-platformers were separated from the four action-RPGs, though. They really are very different kinds of games.
perfectchaos007
Member
I bought Wonderboy in Monster Land on the VC for Genisis for 800pts. How does it compare to the 400 point version on the master system?
perfectchaos007
Member
BooJoh said:
Oh excellent then. Yeah I mixed up Land with World. But I heard that the whole WonderBoy series has been on many consoles, but a lot of them were just ports. Its good to hear that Monster Land is different from Monster World.
A Black Falcon
Member
BooJoh said:
Yeah, I know that they're porting multiple Wonder Boy games into the VC, but even so, I would not expect the (Europe and Brazil release only) SMS version of Wonder Boy in Monster World (WB5:MW3) to come out on VC. I mean, TWO versions of the game are already there -- Wonder Boy in Monster World and The Dynastic Hero... do we really need a third one that is worse in every way than the other two? I think not.
They might release the SMS version of WB4:MW2 (Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap)'s SMS version, though. Sure, Dragon's Curse, the TG-16 version, is already on the VC, but the SMS version is the actual Wonder Boy one (while with WB5:MW3 the Genesis also had a version of the Wonder Boy version, for the previous game that was not the case), so it could come here. We'll see.
The first Wonder Boy for SMS has been confirmed, of course.
Okay, I hopefully helped clarify things on that list by bolding titles currently available on the Virtual Console and adding notes for the SMS titles that are likely to be added.
perfectchaos007 said:
The list in my post up there is a nearly complete list of Wonder Boy games. All US-released Wonder Boy/Monster World franchise titles are in that list... there are six, but under many different names.
(Not listed: Amiga, MSX, and Sega SG-1000 ports of Wonder Boy 1, and a PS2 collection including a few of the titles only released in Japan)
Narag said:
No, Dragon's Curse isn't Monster Land. See the list. (Monster Land is a version of "Wonder Boy 2"/ Monster World 1", while Dragon's Curse is a version of "Wonder Boy 4"/"Monster World 2")
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
Bloodwake said:
Don't listen to Ethel, you absolutely should. While it's not as good as GX, F-Zero X is still one of the best racing games out there. It's extremely fast, has an extremely awesome rock soundtrack, and holds up better than many N64 games. It's as fun today as it was when it was released.
A Black Falcon
Member
Iam Canadian said:
F-Zero X, San Francisco Rush 2049, and Wipeout 64 were my three favorite racing games on the N64, and all three are very, very high on my all-time favorite racing games list.
F-Zero X... well, F-Zero, F-Zero X, and F-Zero GX are all great, great games. I have trouble ranking them, really... each game adds more stuff and features and play length than the last one, but the older ones aren't any worse just because they are shorter and (relatively) easier, they are just shorter and relatively easier.
F-Zero GX is of course an amazing experience, but it's just so, so hard that it's not fun. F-Zero X is a much more fun game. Anyone who likes futuristic racing games in any way should consider it an absolute must-own, just like F-Zero for SNES and F-Zero GX.
If you haven't played F-Zero GX and you're not averse to buying used games (since that's about the only way you'll find it) as well as something with an insanely high challenge level that will smash your face with difficulty, that should definitely get priority. But F-Zero X is really very good as well. Some people even like it better than GX, although I'm not sure quite how since everything in GX is better except the music (though admittedly music is a pretty huge thing in a racing game).
Video of the obligatory First Very Basic Track.
Video of the obligatory First Very Basic Track.
crowphoenix
Banned
Bloodwake said:
It rocks, man. Grab some buds, scrounge up some controllers, and take it to the track. It's alot of fun, and a has been said, the soundtrack is awesome.
Iam Canadian
and have the worst user name EVER
A Black Falcon said:
Honestly, while I like the original F-Zero, I'm not sure I'd consider it a must-buy...I mean, the lack of multiplayer (in a racer, no less) and the fact that there are only four cars to choose from makes it a bit limited. Some fun can be had from it, but I'm not sure how necessary it is when you've got F-Zero X and F-Zero GX to choose from.
A Black Falcon
Member
Jiggy37 said:
Well, if you actually like enjoying yourself and don't like suffering, I could see liking X more than GX... technically GX is the better game, but that difficulty level is so oppressive...
This is the same reason why my favorite racing game of last generation was XGRA, not F-Zero GX, despite that game's exceptionally high quality. It's just too hard to be fun a lot of the time. So GX gets the higher score, but XGRA is the game I'd rather actually play today.
Iam Canadian said:
I got F-Zero a year or two ago for SNES (within a year of my getting the system), and yeah, I'd always heard it was short, but... well, it's amazing anyway! Also, it's not really easy. Beating all three circuits on Master difficulty will definitely take time. And the graphics, presentation, gameplay... they are all done so amazingly well... it is definitely my favorite racing game of the 16-bit generation. Futuristic racing games have always been my favorite kind... Mario Kart, Outrun 2019, Micro Machines 1 and 2, Top Gear, etc, are great (to name some other great 16-bit racing games), but I like F-Zero even more.
I don't know, GX somehow perfectly nailed that difficulty level in a way I haven't seen any other game do. There are loads of games that I won't play even on so much as Normal, but GX was so freaking good that it just drove me somehow to beat every cup on every difficulty (along with getting around 20 different character ending videos), and most of the story races on at least Hard.
But it would really suck for a player to never get to the fantastic AX courses, or even some of the latter story races that were more creative, so it's always a tentative recommendation.
But it would really suck for a player to never get to the fantastic AX courses, or even some of the latter story races that were more creative, so it's always a tentative recommendation.
A Black Falcon
Member
Jiggy37 said:
I always wanted the AX courses, but never got them... I did manage to beat Story mode on Normal difficulty (incredibly, incredibly hard), but I couldn't get first place in everything in the circuits.
I did beat F-Zero and F-Zero X in Master in every circuit, though. They just aren't as cruel... though both are certainly challenging.
(Oh, and as always, don't get N64 games for VC if you can possibly avoid it... get them for N64. No rumble pack support, no controller pak support, and controllers that are worse for N64 games than actual N64 controllers are? Forget it. I'll play them on my N64. The only one I'd consider is Sin & Punishment, because getting import copies of it is pretty expensive.)
F-Zero GX is probably my second-most played GCN game after Animal Crossing, but I still never managed to get the AX tracks. The game is very difficult.. and while it's enough fun to push you to keep playing, it is clearly above some players' difficulty threshold and for those players, some content is simply unreachable, which is really unfortunate.
F-Zero X is pretty dated in the graphics department, but the gameplay stands the test of time. I recommend it, and whether you go for VC or an N64 cart, it should cost you about the same.
In all honesty I would recommend almost every F-Zero game, including the two ill-recieved GBA games Falcon Legend and Climax (JP only.) The only F-Zero game I don't really recommend is Maximum Velocity for GBA, which was great when it released at GBA launch, but going back to it after the other two GBA games, just feels completely wrong, bordering on uncontrollable.
F-Zero X is pretty dated in the graphics department, but the gameplay stands the test of time. I recommend it, and whether you go for VC or an N64 cart, it should cost you about the same.
In all honesty I would recommend almost every F-Zero game, including the two ill-recieved GBA games Falcon Legend and Climax (JP only.) The only F-Zero game I don't really recommend is Maximum Velocity for GBA, which was great when it released at GBA launch, but going back to it after the other two GBA games, just feels completely wrong, bordering on uncontrollable.
Ironically enough, the AX Cup itself is the only one that I can beat on Master with practically anybody, just because the stages are diverse enough that computer players never tend to score above 300 for the full cup. They really saved the easiest for last, for whatever reason.
A Black Falcon said:
the sticks on either the classic controller, or the gamecube controller are a huge improvement over the n64 stick to me. the visuals are also much less blurry. i rebought some games that i own for n64 just because the vc versions are so improved. i never owned a rumble pack, but i definitely wouldn't choose to use the n64 stick just to have rumble.
A Black Falcon said:
Story mode on very hard is unforgiving (still possible though), but the cups are easy on any difficulty, since you can kill your rivals so that they get 0 points. Even if you win none of the races, you can end up winning the cup by over a hundred points. You just need to be able to finish the races while destroying the rivals.
And for casual non-murderous racing, you can play it on Normal and still get a decent challenge. Yeah, GX is my favorite racer ever. X is ok too.
A Black Falcon
Member
BooJoh said:
Agreed, Maximum Velocity is awful. The controls are just totally broken. I got it after I'd recently gotten SNES F-Zero (as I said) and really, really loved it, so my expectations were good, but it totally failed thanks to the awful controls. It's just absolutely no fun to play.
I haven't played Falcon Legend or Climax. Are their controls any better?
Narag said:
And it took me HG101, Sega-16, Wikipedia, and Gamefaqs to find all of that stuff... HG101's article didn't list every name of every version. But I like making lists of games, so it wasn't so bad. (Otherwise why would I have done it?
)It's certainly a series that needs such explanation to make sense of. When you've got five games which each have three or four different names, several different versions with completely different graphics on a bunch of different platforms, two different gameplay styles... it gets very confusing... great games though. They're all quite worth playing.
imthemaid said:
The N64 controller is my favorite controller ever, so I certainly wouldn't agree on the controller front. The GC and Wii controllers aren't as good as the N64 one was. Sure, N64 analog sticks break down, but before they do, I like the way they feel better than any other analog sticks,a nd therest of the N64 controller's design is pretty much perfect. Six face buttons (a feature I consider a major positive in every controller that uses it), only one shoulder button per hand (I do not like two shoulder button per side designs), an actual trigger (triggers are far better than shoulder buttons), a far better d-pad than either the GC or Wii have... it really can't be beat.
Get one of those third-party rumble packs that don't require batteries and it's even better. Maybe not quite as strong, but you save money... but a lot of N64 games wouldn't be the same without rumble. I didn't have a working N64 rumble pack for several years, and I really missed it.
So yeah, not being able to play N64 games on the controller they were designed for and are best on is the #1 reason I wouldn't buy N64 games on VC. Seriously, forcing games designed for six face buttons onto four? It doesn't work! I have Zelda OoT/MQ for GC. It controls far, far worse than the N64 version and isn't as much fun to play becuase it's on the GC controller instead of the N64 one, and the GC controller just doesn't work as well with the game.
If Nintendo stopped being so incredibly lazy and got around to adding rumble support, controller pak support (enabling 90+% of third party N64 games to be added to VC, if they ever get around to adding Western-developed games that aren't from Rare that is, given that most third-party N64 games are Western (even without Rare), or even third party N64 games in general (Sin & Punishment was published by Nintendo)...), and probably expansion pak support (none of the games that either support or require it are on there yet) it would help some, but it wouldn't solve the basic controller problem. The CC was a good idea, but making it just a four button controller (with a square formation) makes it useless and pretty much irrelevant for Genesis and N64 games, and making it have no rumble makes it even more useless and pretty much irrelevant for N64 games.
jepense said:
Only if you're very good at killing your key opponents. That's not that easy.
Both are throwbacks to the SNES game. Falcon Legend (GP Legend in the US actually) even has most of the tracks from the SNES game in it, but with many, if not all of the racers from X/GX, plus Rick Wheeler from the anime. The controls are leaps and bounds better than Maximum Velocity. I think the biggest reason people didn't like the games is that they're both considered rather easy compared to other F-Zero games.A Black Falcon said:
Personally, I think it's a shame that Climax never made it to the US. The tracks in the main game followed the style of the SNES game, and the track editor made for a lot of great custom track possibilities.