Support NeoGAF

[Mike Works]

Ok. I'll buy that, losing Foote and Forsberg. Other than the team has more depth, and better goaltending than anyone else in the division.

Alright, I could pull a Drensch and just post a laughing smiley, but since every time you make claims like this I actually debate them, I'll go ahead and do that. First, the claim that Colorado has "more depth" than anyone in the Pacific Division. Lets look at their lineup (keep in mind that I'll probably get the lines/linemates mixed up, as I'm just going to post their best players):

Line1: Tanguay - Sakic - Hejduk
Line2: Brunette - Turgeon - Konowalchuk
Line3: Hinote - Hendrickson -Svatos
Line4: Barnaby - May - Worrell - 50 Cent

D1: Blake - Liles
D2: Skrastins - Boughner
D3: Sauer - Brisebois

G: Aebischer

That first line is incredibly impressive, and easily rivals Vancouver's first line as the best in the division, if not league. The question is, will that be Colorado's first line? In losing Forsberg, Kariya, and Selanne, they've lost a lot of offensive depth. If they keep it together, it'll be a dominant line. But if they decide to go that route, what's their second line going to be? I mean, you can change around what I've got written up there, maybe switch Brunette and Svatos or something, but good lord Drensch, how can you claim Colorado has more depth than this:

Line1: Naslund - Morrison - Bertuzzi
Line2: Sedin - Sedin - Carter
Line3: Kesler - Linden - Cooke
Line4: Ruutu - Bouck - Park

D1: Ohlund - ?
D2: Allen - Jovanovski
D3: Salo - ?

G: Cloutier

Vancouver still has holes in it's defense thanks to the departures of Malik and Sopel. It's assumed Nonis is going to sign or trade for a defensemen, and then call up someone from Manitoba (most likely Baumgartner, the captain of the team, but possibly someone else) to play on the 6th slot. Granted, I'd rather have ? on the blue line than Brisebois, but that's just me and about 2 million Quebecers. Even so, I'd say Blake is probably the best defensemen on both teams, but Jovo, Ohlund, and Salo are way ahead of anyone else the Avalanche have on D. Allen isn't too fucking shabby either.

But those forward lines, look at them. Assuming Colorado keeps their great first line together, look at the 2nd and 3rd lines. I know you're a huge Avalanche homer and all, but can you honestly say that Colorado has more depth than Vancouver for this coming year? Honestly? Considering they've lost Forsberg, Foote, Kariya, Selanne, and picked up average to below average free agents? Come on man.

As for your claim that Colorado has better goaltending than anyone in the division, I'm a fucking Vancouver Canucks fan, and even I have to do this:

D: Blake, Liles, Skrastins, Boughner, Vaaanen, Sauer, Briesbrois. 4 of them are at least as good as anyone else out west.

You're telling me Blake, Liles, Skrastins, and Boughner are as good as Ohlund, Jovanovski, Salo, and Allen? Zuh??

Sakic, Tanguay, Hejduk-there isn't a better line, period, even though they'll probably be broken up.
Svatos is ROY material and could easily put up 30 plus goals.
Konawalchuk is underrated as well.
Brunette was good for 15 goals in MN, which is like 25 anywhere else.
I'm not gonna list fight, but as I said, the avs have lost 1 contributor from last season, Foote.

1) If they'll probably be broken up, why list them?
2) You do realize that no ROY has scored 30 plus goals since 1993? Not exactly an "easy" task.
3) I agree, Konawalchuk is underated.
4) You're banking on Brunette getting 25 goals? Really? You realize he's never scored that many in his entire career, right?
5) Paul Kariya - 36 points, Teemu Selanne - 32 points, Peter Forsberg - 55 points. Those aren't all star numbers by any stretch, but to say Colorado "only lost 1 contributer" in Adam Foote isn't really.. right.

G: Aebischer 3rd in wins out westand the highest sv pct of any starter in the west, in his first year.

You know who had more wins than Aebischer? Cloutier. And you're wrong about the save percentage part. You know who had a higher save percentage? Kiprusoff.

Hey, wait a minute, aren't those two goaltenders for the exact same two teams I said were better than the Avalanche this year??

BY GEORGE WHAT A COINCIDENCE!

Regardless, I'd take the Avs current roster over any team out west. Seriously, take a look at the rosters. Did the Calgary and Edmonton get better? Sure. Are they better? No. We'll see how it turns out.

Calgary and Edmonton did get better. I agree that Edmonton's going to finish a solid 4th in the division, which may oddly enough still get them in the playoffs. But Calgary, given their performance in the last half of the year, their playoff performance, and their acquisitions (I forgot to mention Amonte earlier), yeah I'd say they're better than the Avalanche right now.

But I'll leave that to calder or systemshark or any other flames fan to pick apart your sagging team in comparison with their improved own. I highly suggest one of you guys do it. As you can tell by this post, it's incredibly enjoyable

But if all of that was too much to read, just pretend I posted this after he said Colorado has the best goalie in the Division:

:lol

 

[Crazymoogle]

Mike Works, for your complete owning of the av post, you rawk.

And from a hockey related note, anyone thinking Aebischer is better than Kiprusoff at this point in time would be roughly equivalent to saying the Kipper had a sub-par playoff campaign. :lol

 

[The Internet]

Now i'm curious, when's the first Avs/'Nucks tilt?

 

[Mike Works]

Now i'm curious, when's the first Avs/'Nucks tilt?

Saturday, October 22nd (in Vancouver).

The first game they play in Colorado is on (Thursday) the 27th.

 

[The Internet]

And from a hockey related note, anyone thinking Aebischer is better than Kiprusoff at this point in time would be roughly equivalent to saying the Kipper had a sub-par playoff campaign. :lol

Would it be wrong to say that you can't say neither are better than the other?

I mean, Kipper played only 38 games last season, very excellent playoffs and decent World Cup.

I want to see how he handles 70 games of work.

 

[Drensch]

Rather than this turning into list-fu, I'll say this:
The Avs you list are not accurate.
Kipper didn't start all year, and I take Abby over anyone out west.
Svatos will be playing with Sakic.
I'm not gonna bother with the flames because I don't think they are as good as the Canucks or the Avs. The Ducks, Wild, Hurricanes all did well in the playoffs one time.

In losing Forsberg, Kariya, and Selanne, they've lost a lot of offensive depth.

Theoretical depth. Those guys didn't do a whole lot for the Avs last season. I'd like to see them all back, but in practical terms they didn't do much at all. Granted Kariya and Forsberg were injured half the time.

Line 2 will probably be something like Tanguay Turgeon Konawalchuk.

You're telling me Blake, Liles, Skrastins, and Boughner are as good as Ohlund, Jovanovski, Salo, and Allen? Zuh??

Yes. I'd also say at this point the bunch we have on D is quite capable.

but can you honestly say that Colorado has more depth than Vancouver for this coming year?

Yes. I'd say the first 2 lines stack up favorably. And Laaksonen, Laperriere, May, Brunette, Hinote, etc, all make capable 3/4 liners. Although we don't have a Linden type that far down.

2) You do realize that no ROY has scored 30 plus goals since 1993? Not exactly an "easy" task.

Radim Vrbata put up 20 for the avs in 50 games. The Avs see Svatos as better. And the new rules(which I still have my doubt to how long they get enforced) will help. Add that to pp time and Sakic and Hejduk. Quite possible. I think it it is quite apparent by now the Avs know how to draft guys of that type.

) You're banking on Brunette getting 25 goals? Really? You realize he's never scored that many in his entire career, right?

No. What I am saying, is that he scored 15 in Minnesota his last season there. I think it's fair to say that Gretzky would have issues scoring goals for that team. I think Brunette could score far more goals for the avs under new conditions.

5) Paul Kariya - 36 points, Teemu Selanne - 32 points, Peter Forsberg - 55 points. Those aren't all star numbers by any stretch, but to say Colorado "only lost 1 contributer" in Adam Foote isn't really.. right.

I think guys on the Avs third (let alone second) can surpass or match those totals, at least for Kariya and Selanne.

You know who had more wins than Aebischer? Cloutier. And you're wrong about the save percentage part. You know who had a higher save percentage? Kiprusoff.

Cloutier lost more, had less ties, a worse sv pct and gave up more goals. I'll take alot of people over Cloutier. Kipper played a third less games, and didn't even start the whole year. And to top it off Aebischer has better career stats. Kipper doesn't suck by an stretch. But he has yet to play a year as a starter.

But if all of that was too much to read, just pretend I posted this after he said Colorado has the best goalie

Take a look at the career stats of all the goalies in the division. The only one who came close to Abby was Fernandez. Hate of the avs doesn't make them suck.

I mean, Kipper played only 38 games last season, very excellent playoffs and decent World Cup.

Ding. I think it's fair to say, in the least that Aebischer's first year was very good. Playing in the shadow of Roy in an intense position. He ended up with 32 wins. Playing 10 games less than those with more, except for Cloutier. He was only behind Brodeur and Turco in GAA, and they both played 10 more games. His sv pct was better than any starter out west, and only behind Luongo and Raycroft over all. Give him some credit. Post season? Kipper was .006 svpct better.

 

[dem]

Oh I cant wait till the Avs get slaughtered by the Oilers on Oct 5th...

Drensch... my friend... you are delusional.


Svatos for rookie of the year made me blow water out my nose. Are you fucking kidding me? This kid hasnt even put up 20 in the AHL and hes going to beat out the most impressive group of roy candidates I can remember? Going to beat out Crosby playing with Lemieux and Pallfy? Fuck off... :lol

 

[dem]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=2137098

ESPN decides not to match Comcast's offer

Looks like the NHL is on OLN :lol

 

[ForzaItalia]

Line1: Tanguay - Sakic - Hejduk
Line2: Brunette - Turgeon - Konowalchuk
Line3: Hinote - Hendrickson -Svatos
Line4: Barnaby - May - Worrell - 50 Cent

:lol

 

[Tedesco!]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=2137098

ESPN decides not to match Comcast's offer

Looks like the NHL is on OLN :lol

Center Ice looks more and more appealing.

 

[BigJonsson]

I'm glad almost all Leaf games are on free TV, I may pick up Leafs TV cause I have so many useless digi channels

 

[Tedesco!]

I don't know what the big deal is with ESPN... I know I won't miss it. I mean, how many times can I watch the Avs or the Wings?

 

[calder]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO FUCKING HELL NOOOOO.

Guess I won't be holding my breath waiting for a reply to my emails asking about Center Ice. Fucking Shaw.

And yeah, Drensch = crazy yadda yadda Svatos for ROY!?!? wtf blah blah. Hate to let Oiler fans and Canuck fans take the lead in this argument, but Mike and co. have done a pretty good job. I would like to say that Drensch would make a GREAT Leafs fan - dismissive of players he lost and overrating all the Avs pickups. Isn't Turgeon going to be 36 years old when the season starts? I'll be impressed if he gets more than 35 pts this year.

Team Canada unveils new jersey for Turin

New Team Canada look

Canadian Press

8/17/2005 9:14:22 PM

KELOWNA, B.C. (CP) - The new hockey jerseys Canadian teams will wear at the Olympic Games and world junior championships have been designed to be cooler, lighter and make the players faster.

The jerseys were unveiled Wednesday at the Olympic team orientation camp.

The home white sweaters feature the Hockey Canada Maple Leaf logo on the front, black trim around the neck, and red and black stripes on the shoulders. There are also red and black stripes on the sides.

The red away sweaters have black and white stripes.

Uh..... :\ Hope it looks better from other angles, but I'm sure not liking the verticle striped socks so far. The unis look ok so far, pretty minimalist.

 

[Malakhov]

Hah, since you'd take Sundin over Koivu as captain that's the reason the leafs will have a better season than the Habs? Didn't know hockey was a one player game...

I'll take Koivu, Zednik, Kovalev, Perezhogin, Ribeiro, Ryder and Bonk over your forwards anytime of the week and twice on sunday.

 

[ForzaItalia]

I would like to say that Drensch would make a GREAT Leafs fan - dismissive of players he lost and overrating all the Avs pickups.

So true.

Isn't Turgeon going to be 36 years old when the season starts? I'll be impressed if he gets more than 35 pts this year.

I loved the "Tin Man" (Wizard of Oz) nickname he had when he was in Buffalo. This guy is pretty much done and will turn to Casper come playoff time.

 

[Malakhov]

Theo rejects first offer... This will get ugly.
They ran out Roy out of town, they better not run Theodore out of town.

 

[Pochacco]

Any team with Sakic, Blake, and Hejduk is gonna be a THREAT. Not to mention that the Avalanche's big guns have been playing with each other for years - not like many of the new teams that have signed new free agents. Who knows whether or not there'll be chemistry.

I think it's safe to say that we have no clue what to expect. All the teams have been reshuffled. The rules will be different. Many players are out of shape. It's gonna be fricking awesome.

With that said, the Avs are no longer a comfortable lock for a top 4 position. Really, no team is (aside from the Sens!).

 

[Mike Works]

I just can't see how Vancouver isn't a lock for the top 4 (if they don't win their division, I can't see them doing worse than 4th). The new rules are only going to help them, as they're not a clutch and grab team at all, and the only chemistry that will have been tampered with is defensive parings in losing 2 of our d-men, and the Sedins getting a new winger (which is nothing at all new for them considering they played with Arvedson, Bertuzzi, Cooke, Rucinsky, and Sanderson last season alone).

Colorado's going to be a good team, they're going to make the playoffs. I just don't see them being the great team they were of the past decade.

 

[Drensch]

I mean, how many times can I watch the Avs or the Wings?

I likes it. I could do for that 41 games.

And yeah, Drensch = crazy yadda yadda Svatos for ROY!?!?

I think it's safe to say that Hejduk didn't get much play for ROY his rookie year either. He did finish second I think, to another guy who didn't get much play either.

I just can't see how Vancouver isn't a lock for the top 4 (if they don't win their division, I can't see them doing worse than 4th).

I don't see much of a power shift out west.

Colorado's going to be a good team, they're going to make the playoffs. I just don't see them being the great team they were of the past decade.

So what's the argument? The league has decided that the want to hurt good teams and help bad teams. Invariably Colorado, Det, Vancouver, NJ, Ottawa will all be weaker.

 

[Drensch]

Drensch would make a GREAT Leafs fan

 

[Mike Works]

So what's the argument? The league has decided that the want to hurt good teams and help bad teams. Invariably Colorado, Det, Vancouver, NJ, Ottawa will all be weaker.

It doesn't want to hurt good teams. It wants to make the playing field even money wise. So long as Vancouver gets one alright defensemen, we're going to be a BETTER team than we were last year. I don't see San Jose getting hurt that bad, and they were a good team. It all comes down to payroll, and your team isn't getting punished because they're "good", they're getting punished because they had a bloated payroll.

Deal with it.

 

[Socreges]

Arvedsson (sic?) was solid before he got injured early last season. I hope they bring him back [cheap].

The league has decided that the want to hurt good teams and help bad teams.

Actually, that was incidental, not a deliberate choice.

Really, quit crying. You just seem like a sore loser.

 

[G4life98]

It doesn't want to hurt good teams. It wants to make the playing field even money wise. So long as Vancouver gets one alright defensemen, we're going to be a BETTER team than we were last year. I don't see San Jose getting hurt that bad, and they were a good team. It all comes down to payroll, and your team isn't getting punished because they're "good", they're getting punished because they had a bloated payroll.

Deal with it.

but that was the price of keeping a good team together under the old cba and to not even give teams the option to restructure contracts for cap relief( correct me if i am wrong about that) is kind of a slap in the face to teams that scouted well acquired talent and then paid to keep them together

 

[Manics]

Thats whats going to F up the leafs. Youre dropping guys who are decent players.. and filling in the holes with garbage.

They arent going to finish higher than the Habs. Id bet my house.

I can't believe I would see the day when people would claim the loss of Reichel, Renberg and Fitzgerald was a BAD thing for the Leafs. Stajan can do more than any of those 3 players at this stage in their careers, Antropov and Ponikarovsky can easily fill the Reichel/Renberg "void" and we now give a spot to a younger player to try and win (Steen/Wellwood).

Personally I think Stajan's development will be alot better without the stiffs like Reichel and Renberg playing ahead of him. He'll get alot more chances this year.

 

[acidviper]

LOFL no national cable coverage. They could only sign a deal with OLN. What a joke. I bet Lance coverage is going to beat out NHL coverage.

 

[Foreign Jackass]

By the way, Mike, when are the Sedins going to be any good? They suck, hard, and they're number 2 and 3 overall picks. Arguably, the whole 1999 draft sucks (except for Martin Havlat, and late picks Zetterberg and Comrie), but still that's gotta be a huge letdown in Vancouver, they were so hyped.

 

[dem]

The Sedins dont "suck hard". Theyre never going to be Heatley and Kovalchuk.. but theyre good second line players. I wouldnt doubt that one of them puts up 60 next year.*



*Once the season starts I will deny I ever said this.

 

[Foreign Jackass]

I've seen them play, and they've never impressed me. Why draft two players in the first round, having to trade up for one of the picks, only to end up with retarded looking twins who'd never be able to play on any team's first line?

 

[dem]

What did they give up for the pick? McCabe?

Thats not so bad =P

 

[Foreign Jackass]

Hey, McCabe isn't so bad. He's actually one of the players worth something on that empty wreck of a team.

 

[dem]

Are we talking the same McCabe that got kicked off of an SEL team?

 

[Foreign Jackass]

Are we talking the same McCabe that got kicked off of an SEL team?

:lol The leafs really suck

 

[calder]

The Sedin's could anchor a perfect second line on a great team, and as a second line on a very good Canucks team that's pretty much the best role possible for them. Henrik by himself wouldn't be a second liner but with Daniel they compliment each other enough to make it worthwhile. Sure if you look at their draft positions they were drafted too high, but it is mitigated a bit because it was a weak draft year. Henrik obviously would be a late second rounder most any year and Daniel shouldn't have cracked the top 10, but '99 wasn't a great year for depth or top 5 talent anyway so the Canucks didn't lose out on too much.

 

[dem]

Uh..... :\ Hope it looks better from other angles, but I'm sure not liking the verticle striped socks so far. The unis look ok so far, pretty minimalist.

I guess this is what we can expect from the new NHL jerseys in 2006. Minimalist is right =P
Even the hockey pants look smaller. Can the return Cooperalls be far away? :lol

I'll tell ya what though. I really want to see what a goalie looks like in this new getup.

 

[MaverickX9]

I can't wait until this guy has to face a million shots/rebounds from right outside the crease.

"Fuck you with the save! Fuck you again! Fuck you! Fuck you! Fuck you!"

 

[Malakhov]

Cloutier re-signs, 5 millions for 2 years :lol

 

[Kabuki Waq]

Cloutier re-signs, 5 millions for 2 years :lol

:lol

 

[Malakhov]

Some good reactions from the Canucks message board over at hf:

Terrible move. A multi year deal for a headcase like Cloutier at more than his QO? Nonis has lost his mind on this one. If Cloutier bombs we will have to buy him out, no one will want him.

Nonis is smoking crack.

I can't believe we're anchored to that stupid pylon that couldn't stop a microwave if his life depended on it for 2 years, at an insane price when CUJO, a playoff guy went for 900k.

God its been a few minutes and I'm still disgusted at the signing.

What the hell is Nonis thinking ??

Gross. A huge overpayment by the Canucks, I don't like this at all. There is no way he is worth that much.

:lol :lol :lol

 

[Foreign Jackass]

cup to the canucks? not till 2008!

 

[Mike Works]

cup to the canucks? not till 2008!

Was Jose Theodore the Stanley Cup MVP when the Canadiens won it with him in net, or did Koivu get the award?

 

[Malakhov]

Was Jose Theodore the Stanley Cup MVP when the Canadiens won it with him in net, or did Koivu get the award?

He'll probably be if we do win the Cup, at least we have a chance to win one with him and our team.

You guys don't have a chance to win one with Cloutier though.

 

[dem]

And with one signing Nonis has closed that small window that the Canucks had to win the Stanley cup.


Back to the ol first and out.. eh guys?

 

[Malakhov]

Huh????

He's not even seeing the puck in that pic, he's like a deer caught in headlights :lol

 

[dem]

But dont worry too much guys... rumour has Sven Butenschon signing in Vancouver to shore up that D







:lol

 

[Barrage]

I know this is INCREDIBLY OLD, but I just heard that Sundin is the cover artist for NHL 2K6 in Canada/Europe. What the fuck? Why would anyone want that dumb bastard on the cover? Especially when Turco(an actual GOOD player) is on the U.S. covers. This is bullshit.


P.S.: Cloutier isn't worth four dollars, yet alone 5 million for 2 years.

 

[dem]

Make fun of the leafs all you want... but dont talk about Sundin like he sucks. Hes certainly better than Marty fucking Turco.

Does ANYONE even know who Marty Turco is outside of hardcore NHL fans?

 

[Malakhov]

Sundin? Odd. They could of at least put a canadian player on the canadian cover.

 

[bishoptl]

Back to the ol first and out.. eh guys?

You have to make the playoffs first before you can beak off. Back of the line with you.

As for this signing...


....give me a minute...

FIVE MILLION

 

[Malakhov]

Take a good breath and relax Bishop. Don't let Cloutier kill you

 

[Barrage]

What's wrong with Turco? He's got things Leaf players simply lack...like youth...