Okay, classic Veelk "Sexism is a problem and there is no real excuse for it" post coming up, brace yourselves.
I mean of course this is fantasy and it does not have to be exactly like reality but you cant blame oda if he draws inspiration from reality.
Yes, I goddamn well can.
The 'it's reality, can't do anything about it' argument is always bullshit in the context of any fiction, but it's never been more bullshit than when applied to one piece. The number of ways that OP deviates from what would 'realistically' happen is so laughably monumental that it would be farcical to list them all. Why doesn't Oda draw on reality when he has tiny, scrawny Luffy outmuscle enemies that tower over them, for example? Because it is wish fulfillment that the plucky, goofy but hiddenly powerful tiny kid can actually be a such a powerhouse that he might actually become the Pirate King.
I'm just going to quote Scott Lynch on this. He writes the Gentlemen Bastards sequence, which I enjoy, but one thing he does that I don't think I've seen anyone else do is that he truly removes most of the gender boundaries that preoccupy most of fantasy fiction. There are female pirates, thieves, soldiers, sailors, and bouncers in about equal number to their male counterparts. This is never remarked on as being out of the ordinary. You would think this doesn't do anything unusual, but it adds so much fascination with his world just because it shakes your expectations by subverting character archetypes you didn't realize you believed were male exclusive until then. For context, this is him responding to a fan who was angry that he dared make one particular character, a middle-aged, black, female pirate mother of two. The fan is complaining about politiical correctness, but you can easily swap out that for 'realism'.
Let me also preface this that the fan in particular was clearly bigoted (the use of politically correct is almost always a code for "I want to promote prejudices without it seeming like I'm doing that"), so he's pretty pissed off and throwing insults at the guy.
I'm not trying to channel those insults to you, but the content of his argument, which is centered around what wishfulfillment is and how everyone has a right to it.
Scott Lynch said:
You know what? Yeah, Zamira Drakasha, middle-aged pirate mother of two, is a wish-fulfillment fantasy. I realized this as she was evolving on the page, and you know what? I fucking embrace it.
Why shouldn’t middle-aged mothers get a wish-fulfillment character, you sad little bigot? Everyone else does. H.L. Mencken once wrote that “Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.” I can’t think of anyone to whom that applies more than my own mom, and the mothers on my friends list, with the incredible demands on time and spirit they face in their efforts to raise their kids, preserve their families, and save their own identity/sanity into the bargain.
Shit yes, Zamira Drakasha, leaping across the gap between burning ships with twin sabers in hand to kick in some fucking heads and sail off into the sunset with her toddlers in her arms and a hold full of plundered goods, is a wish-fulfillment fantasy from hell. I offer her up on a silver platter with a fucking bow on top; I hope she amuses and delights. In my fictional world, opportunities for butt-kicking do not cease merely because one isn’t a beautiful teenager or a muscle-wrapped font of testosterone. In my fictional universe, the main characters are a fat ugly guy and a skinny forgettable guy, with a supporting cast that includes “SBF, 41, nonsmoker, 2 children, buccaneer of no fixed abode, seeks unescorted merchant for light boarding, heavy plunder.”
One Piece oooooozes wish fulfillment. While I have many, MANY issues with how Oda goes about these wishfulfillment moments, the idea that OP shouldn't indulge in wishfulfillment of 'reality' is an argument fundamentally inconsistent with what OP is at it's core. You could almost pick up any volume and pick a chapter at random, and you will have a moment that does It breaks reality in some pay almost every chapter, for an awesome moment, or a gag, or an emotionally gratifying moment.
I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that you didn't intend this, but if the only time realism can interfere with wishfulfillment is when gender is involved, then Oda made a sexist work. If he's not beholden to realism at any other time, then he's not beholden to when gender comes into play, and it is patently absurd to suggest otherwise. But more than that, women DESERVE wishfulfillment. Authors are supposed to be providers of it. To not provide it for a customer just because their women is, imo, wrong.
I maintain that there is no excuse for this, and it is an active detriment to OP as a narrative work that would be better for both men and women if it had awesome female wishfulfilments like it does male.
i don't think it's necessary to discuss this like every other week. It's getting really tiresome.
It's literally been months since anyone's brought this up.
Awww did i hurt your feelings
Wtf can't you discuss something normally? I was just comparing two things no need to get butthurt. You can cry as much as you want it won't change anything. Hah.
Despite your condescention, I'm going to try and remain couteous. What you are arguing is a persistent, but fundamentally flawed argument that women had to deal with for literally centuries. They've ALWAYS been told they can't have this or that, and it's always been dressed up as "that's just how it is". It's always been wrong. Now you're arguing that Oda can't be blamed, because that's 'reality'. I don't believe you intended sexism, but the argument you're putting forth is an argument foundamentally based in sexism that people keep ignorantly bringing up. I don't blame Cindi's irritated reaction, and while I'm willing to give you a pass, the condescension in "aww did i hurt your feelings" is palpable and removes whatever higher ground of wanting to 'discuss something normally' you wanted to hold. We can discuss things normally, but not with reations like that. If you honestly weren't aware of how "it's realism!" is an old, tired, and poorly reasoned argument, that's alright and we can discuss it normally, but you need to be empathetic to the fact that me and probably cindi as well are tired of having to refute the same, obviously flawed BS over and over, and as a result tempers can be short on these sorts of things.
