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Orphan Black Season 4 |OT| Paul Free Since 2015 – Thursdays at 9/10c on BBC America

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MisterFalcon

MisterFalcon

Member
Watching Rachel it's hard to imagine she was the villain not too long ago. It's so unusual to see a long painful recovery from injury on a TV show, usually it goes from getting shot > bandage > scratch > full recovery in 2 or 3 episodes. Of course no other show can afford to put their lead in a seasons long recovery program but here they can.
 
D

Dereck

Member
Probably the best episode this season.

Rachel has been completely dismantled. She's physically handicapped, occasionally stutters and has much less power. I knew they would make her stutter when talking to Evie Cho. Rachel for awhile has been trying to separate herself from the rest of the clones and now she's been reduced to just "one of the clones" whose prone to the same sickness.

Sarah is still an inconsiderate dirtbag, Cosima is dealing with too many emotions, Scott got fucking shitted on, Delphine's supposedly alive, Helena's nowhere to be found and the Hendrixes are about to get bopped.

Duko also getting jumped by Art at the station was some stupendous shit.

Evie Cho's face annoys me because it is too symmetrical.

Kira's about to make friends with Mika and will become her physic sidekick.
 
K

KibblesBits

Member
Ira and Susan's relationship has changed and is quite noticeable in this episode. Ari looks pretty good in high end men's wear. Rachel seems to be "glitching" which is hilarious. But she's getting stronger too which is interesting.

Siobhan polishing a gun is very interesting. I don't feel that Duko will survive this season.
 
D

Dereck

Member
us9lZwW.gif
 
J

Jay Shadow

Member
Applebite said:
can we give it up for Felix, the MVP of this show and the only one capable of consistently un-fucking everything fucked up
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, they could have just titled this episode "Felix Saves Everyone". Guess that would be a spoiler though...but it should be assumed by now in all situations.
 
L

Larson Conway

Member
Dereck said:
S04E07 Promo on Space

Spoiler tag any discussion

Some people in here might be interested in this.

https://www.reddit.com/r/orphanblac...ne_help_me_out_with_all_the_different/d3d00oj

Kendall - Siobhan's mother, went to prison for killing John Sadler. Ethan found her there. She's a human chimera meaning she absorbed her brother in the womb and has two sets of DNA; being the original for both Ledas and Castors. She's a mix of the two and thus is not played by Tatiana or Ari.

Dyad - Level 1 of the Leda clone project, Leekie and Rachel ran it. Marion and Rachel decided Leekie should die for mishandling the reappearance of Ethan Duncan. Rachel let Leekie have a chance to run,nobody knows he was shot by Donnie and is under the Hendrix garage. After Leekie died and they disabled Rachel, Marion Bowles made Delphine the leader of it. With Delphine MIA now, its seems the clones have caused too many problems so the Neos are dealing with them more directly.Apparently Rachel grew up thinking both her parents died in a lab explosion. Both survived and while Susan became more of a Neolutionist, Ethan ran away and hid Kendall so nobody could make more clones. Ethan killed himself in front of Rachel in S2 to make sure they couldn't get the key to making more clones but he left it behind in a book Rachel knew how to read, perhaps hoping Rachel would eventually start helping her sisters find a cure for the clone sickness. Sarah and Helena's surrogate birth mother Amelia ran away from the Duncans before anyone knew she was carrying twins. Dyad assumed they lost one clone who became Helena. Rachel came later as the Duncans replacement baby. In exchange for letting Siobhan's people hide him, Kendall had Ethan arrange for the one free clone Sarah-to be raised by Siobhan. Siobhan knew Sarah was some kind of "medical experiments" child to protect, but didn't know about the clones until she met Alison in Season 1. Didn't know about the connection to her own mother until last year.

Proleathans - Religious cult. Tomas and Maggie trained Helena to kill all clones as abominations. Maggie was apparently part of the team who made the clones but was a traitor. Henrick and his side think the clones are a gift from God to breed from-had Tomas killed. Henrick is the father of Gracie and Helena's baby-killed by Helena. His wife Bonnie seems to be leader now, but after kicking Gracie out for miscarrying another baby, they seem out of the picture for the moment. Helena has the canister of other eggs at the Hendrixes right now which have expired and withered away so she buried it. Henrick was Ethan's lab assistant and tried to have a son from a stolen Castor sample but Abel died shortly after birth. Paul blew up Abel's bones with a grenade when he died.

Topside - shadow group controlling Dyad, Marion Bowles is part of it, started caring about the clones as people when raising little Charlotte but the rest of Topside like Ferdinand just see the Ledas as tools. Ferdinand may have changed now that he knows the Neolutionists were playing him too and he likes Rachel. Marion is dead based on Veera's research and Susan's saying Charlotte had unfortunate guardians.
Helsinki-A group of clones executed in 2001 by Ferdinand and Topside with Marion's approval. Why and how, plus another connection still to be revealed on the show is actually in a comic series focused on Veera. Final issue out May 25th. Veera's burn scar is not from Ferdinand and she has another reason to be pissed at Clone Club.

Neolutionists - Publicly thought to be just hipster science nerds that admired Leekie but it turns out they were running both Leda and Castor and are apparently the top dogs. Rachel's mother Susan appears to be leader. Evie Cho, Detective Duko and the paramedic couple all appear to be new Neo underlings. What they think happened to Leekie is unclear. As we saw last night, Evie, Duko and the paramedics are tired of all the time and resources the clones are taking, thinking the Brightborn babies and Maggot-Bots are more efficient and better, thus betraying Susan and content to just let all the clones get sick and die. Susan views these methods as savage substitutes when they should ideally have as many clones as they need to advance the science.
The clones were intended as a test to perfect the human genome to advance evolution and cure disease and study humans in different circumstances. The clone sickness has derailed that plan somewhat, especially for the Castors.

Castor - Military branch that ran there own male cloning project, also pawns of the Neolutionists. They had Paul spy on the Ledas/Dyad for the first two seasons to look for a cure for the clone sickness. Ferdinand captured their leader Dr. Coady at the end of last year. Coady wanted to cure the Castors and though Sarah/Helena's healing factor might help but she also wanted to turn the sickness into a bio-weapon which turned Paul against the military. Mark was their spy on the Prolethans for the same reason but betrayed them for Gracie. Ira was raised as a Neo insider by Susan, the other Castors don't know him at all. As far as we know, only Mark and Ira are left of the Castors. Based on Paul and Mark's conversation last year, they had a connection to Sammy; Tony's dead friend and probably monitor who had that message for Beth. It might come back up this year given how Beth centric we are.
Click to expand...

I've been losing track of all the layers of the mythology in this show, so this is really appreciated.
 
Q

Quick

Banned
Catching up right now.

Duko gonna die soon. It's hilarious that he just keeps bringing up that he knows about their clone shit, and it'll just get him killed.
 
U

umop_3pisdn

Member
I wish there had been more build up to Sarah reaching her breaking point, it would have made it a lot more believable for me. I think the real difference between Sarah and Beth is just that Sarah has a decent support network while she's discovering all this stuff, so Sarah suddenly loosing her shit seemed like sort of a plot convenience to me.
 
K

KibblesBits

Member
umop_3pisdn said:
I wish there had been more build up to Sarah reaching her breaking point, it would have made it a lot more believable for me. I think the real difference between Sarah and Beth is just that Sarah has a decent support network while she's discovering all this stuff, so Sarah suddenly loosing her shit seemed like sort of a plot convenience to me.
Click to expand...

I feel the stress from unraveling the mysteries and events that make up her life have just culminated into a breakdown. Looking back at everything that has happened gives a bit more perspective when you consider how removed the other clones are from the central worries of the mysteries. Sarah is in the thick of it, while the others are just doing support.

She's the only tank in a raid of casters and healers. The other physical dps is missing and unreliable and no one knows any of the boss strategies for the encounters.

XD
 
D

Dereck

Member
Quick said:
Duko gonna die soon. It's hilarious that he just keeps bringing up that he knows about their clone shit, and it'll just get him killed.
Click to expand...
Art unfortunately knows that he cannot kill Duko, so hopefully someone who is not a suspecting cop can get the job done.

Hint: this person has blonde hair.
 
Q

Quick

Banned
Dereck said:
Art unfortunately knows that he cannot kill Duko, so hopefully someone who is not a suspecting cop can get the job done.

Hint: this person has blonde hair.
Click to expand...

I legit had to chuckle when he gave Alison his card and straight up admitted that he was involved in Kendall's death, couple that with Art basically giving S his details...

Might as well just put a giant target on his back for S to hit.
 
D

Dragon Puncher

Member
I've been pretty happy with this season (especially compared to season 3), but this episode just cemented how incredibly idiotic it was for Evie not to kill Cosima.

She could have easily have got the message across that Kendall was dead without her, and now she admits she still sees Sarah and co. as a threat and won't give them "humane treatment". So why not just kill the only person that actually still has a shot at finding a cure for the clones you clearly want out of the picture?

You could call it a character flaw because she's now drunk with power or whatever, but that's basically reducing her to Bond villain status. I expect more from this show.
 
K

KibblesBits

Member
Dragon Puncher said:
I've been pretty happy with this season (especially compared to season 3), but this episode just cemented how incredibly idiotic it was for Evie not to kill Cosima.

She could have easily have got the message across that Kendall was dead without her, and now she admits she still sees Sarah and co. as a threat and won't give them "humane treatment". So why not just kill the only person that actually still has a shot at finding a cure for the clones you clearly want out of the picture?

You could call it a character flaw because she's now drunk with power or whatever, but that's basically reducing her to Bond villain status. I expect more from this show.
Click to expand...

I attribute it to her not wanting to get her hands dirty. Killing Kendall was already a big thing for her. The show gave her a frame to show how awful she found what she was doing so taking it a step further and killing Cosima would have been out of hand in relation to how she was acting.

I think they are portraying Evie as less of a murderous cartoon character and more conflicted with committing actual violence. She didn't really fight off Beth, she shuddered and closed her eyes when Duko killed Kendall. She has two hired cleaners for Brightborn. Heck, she quickly left Ontario afterwards. She's a bit removed from the actual violence unless she's absolutely needed to be involved.
 
D

Dragon Puncher

Member
KibblesBits said:
I attribute it to her not wanting to get her hands dirty. Killing Kendall was already a big thing for her. The show gave her a frame to show how awful she found what she was doing so taking it a step further and killing Cosima would have been out of hand in relation to how she was acting.

I think they are portraying Evie as less of a murderous cartoon character and more conflicted with committing actual violence. She didn't really fight off Beth, she shuddered and closed her eyes when Duko killed Kendall. She has two hired cleaners for Brightborn. Heck, she quickly left Ontario afterwards. She's a bit removed from the actual violence unless she's absolutely needed to be involved.
Click to expand...

Considering she is head of an organization that has no problems messing with baby genes at the risk of death or terrible deformation, and her main project involves implanting robot worms in people (apparently sometimes without consent, as with Sarah), that litterally kills the host if forcibly removed (and seem pretty damn dangerous regardless), I find it hard to believe that she would suddenly have moral qualms about letting her henchmen kill off one of the few theats left to her.

She might not be a stone cold killer, but if she can do all that in the name of science, I don't see why she would have a huge issues with disposing of the problematic clones, since they are basically just obsolete tech from her point of view. Especially considering she is apperently going to strike out against clone club in a "non-humane" way regardless.
 
K

KibblesBits

Member
Dragon Puncher said:
Considering she is head of an organization that has no problems messing with baby genes at the risk of death or terrible deformation, and her main project involves implanting robot worms in people (apparently sometimes without consent, as with Sarah), that litterally kills the host if forcibly removed (and seem pretty damn dangerous regardless), I find it hard to believe that she would suddenly have moral qualms about letting her henchmen kill off one of the few theats left to her.

She might not be a stone cold killer, but if she can do all that in the name of science, I don't see why she would have a huge issues with disposing of the problematic clones, since they are basically just obsolete tech from her point of view. Especially considering she is apperently going to strike out against clone club in a "non-humane" way regardless.
Click to expand...

She's complicated, it's part of what makes her a bit interesting. The shows villains have always been rather interesting.
 
K

KibblesBits

Member
Dragon Puncher said:
And sometimes badly written.
Click to expand...

Men are more likely to kill to end a problem. Evie had the chance to kill Sarah, did she do it? No. She doesn't really care. What she cared about was securing Brightborn as the torch carrier for Neolution and funding from what remains of Topside.

You can call it bad writing, that's fine. But I beg to differ. From her standpoint there's no need to stir up the hornets nest any more than needed. She implied that she wouldn't go as easy on the Ontario clones but when Rachel offered suggestions, Helsinki measures weren't an option, just a tense cold war.

Evie truly doesn't see the need to kill the clones. She only had Kendall killed to prevent Susan from usurping her power. They (the clones) are so beneath her she just doesn't see them as a threat. She probably didn't really see reason to care if she became aware that Cosima swiped the cheek bug.
 
J

Jay Shadow

Member
I'm glad other clones are getting the illness since Cosima's plot armor is so thick, but man, MK has had a really shitty life.
 
K

KibblesBits

Member
Watching Jennifer die from the Leda defect was sad. Seeing porn stache Castor die was sad too.

And can we just take a second to reflect on the fact that Ira has toy soldiers? :(
 
J

Jay Shadow

Member
Cronen said:
Has a season 5 been confirmed?
Click to expand...
No, but they've been all over the place in previous years on when they announce a renewal.

There was an article yesterday about the after show trend and one of the people interviewed was the BBC America president who was really happy with Orphan Black's DVR numbers calling them “bonkers high. It’s off the scale.”

So it should be in good shape being a small network in the first place, being co-produced by another network in Canada, and focusing on alternative metrics like delayed viewership and highlighting their social media imprint at the start of the season. Plus their streaming deals might help cause I have relatives that didn't even know this show aired on tv. They seem more concerned with maintaining the rabidness of the fans they have rather than expecting big viewing numbers that they'll never get.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Great episode. I never expected to actually see Alison in a dramatic role, but here we are. Though the writers couldn't help but ham up the Donnie scenes, even when he was about to die, which took away from the moment.

I'm a little sad that Duko died; he was a great villain because he was human. I wanted to believe that he might do the right thing, but he was too deep in his own shit to change. The actor did a great job with that role.

Speaking of villains, a not great villain seems to be coming back, Rachel. It seemed to me that someone is taking control of her with that eye implant. Seems a bit hokey if that's where they're going with it.
 
C

Cronen

Member
Jay Shadow said:
No, but they've been all over the place in previous years on when they announce a renewal.

There was an article yesterday about the after show trend and one of the people interviewed was the BBC America president who was really happy with Orphan Black's DVR numbers calling them “bonkers high. It’s off the scale.”

So it should be in good shape being a small network in the first place, being co-produced by another network in Canada, and focusing on alternative metrics like delayed viewership and highlighting their social media imprint at the start of the season. Plus their streaming deals might help cause I have relatives that didn't even know this show aired on tv. They seem more concerned with maintaining the rabidness of the fans they have rather than expecting big viewing numbers that they'll never get.
Click to expand...

Yeah that's a good point. Netflix has picked up the rights here in the UK, making it a 'Netflix Original'. They did the same with Better Call Saul.
 
T

TripOpt55

Member
Just caught up on the last four episodes after falling behind. What a great season this has been. My favorite since the first. Tatiana continues to amaze. Loved the bits with Krystal recently. Generally just been enjoying the direction of the main story. Mika has been a good addition. Liked how they delved into the stuff with Beth in the flashbacks and its connections to now. Loving this season.
 
holygeesus

holygeesus

Banned
It blows my mind that the show continues to be good, even after discarding the best clone for the entire season!

Come back Helena! :(
 
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