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[Battersea Power Station]

Offering my humble opinion as a competitive athlete (not in a combat sport, but I'd like to think that I'm good at reading fighters' intentions, balance, timing, distance, etc.):

I think some of you are getting fooled by the fighters' styles into thinking that Marquez was more effective or more in control than he really was. His strategy was to turtle, basically, like the Italians play soccer. As a result, he looks more stable and more on balance and occupies the center of the ring frequently.

Manny, being the aggressor, was dancing around more, sometimes going off-balance, and scrambling to find new angles, while playing around with different distances and timings.

As a result, it looks like Manny is not in control while Marquez is more centered. But that didn't really reflect who dished out the most pain, which is generally what the judges look for. I'm not saying that Manny clearly won, but I think you're wrong to say Marquez did.

Again, just an opinion.

 

[HiResDes]

Exactly. Marquez landed something like 52. Body shots and Pacquiao landed 20ish. Pacquiao beat him by far in headshots. Having 100. More punches spread to the majority of the head makes a difference. It was a close fight, but manny won by a very conscientious judging.

Maybe you should consult De La Hoya, about the seriousness of getting hit with hard body shots:

 

[TheNatural]

Exactly. Marquez landed something like 52. Body shots and Pacquiao landed 20ish. Pacquiao beat him by far in headshots. Having 100. More punches spread to the majority of the head makes a difference. It was a close fight, but manny won by a very conscientious judging.

Effective striking > pitter patter. Plus I would like to see on what authority is Compubox coming up with these numbers and decisions on landed vs. missed striking. Too many people suck Compubox's dick and act like that tells the tale of the fight. I like Pacquaio, but this decision was a fucking joke. Anyone who has to go look at stats to see who won a fucking fight knows nothing about boxing because it doesn't tell the story.

Until someone wants to analyze the video and dissect exactly what these so called shots Pacquaio landed were versus what Marquez landed, its all fucking bullshit.

 

[Barbacoatl]

What a joke.

Great show nonetheless.

edit/twitter feed: "Travel Advisory: Filipinos, do not travel to Mexico in the next few weeks."

 

[TheNatural]

Offering my humble opinion as a competitive athlete (not in a combat sport, but I'd like to think that I'm good at reading fighters' intentions, balance, timing, distance, etc.):

I think some of you are getting fooled by the fighters' styles into thinking that Marquez was more effective or more in control than he really was. His strategy was to turtle, basically, like the Italians play soccer. As a result, he looks more stable and more on balance and occupies the center of the ring frequently.

Manny, being the aggressor, was dancing around more, sometimes going off-balance, and scrambling to find new angles, while playing around with different distances and timings.

As a result, it looks like Manny is not in control while Marquez is more centered. But that didn't really reflect who dished out the most pain, which is generally what the judges look for. I'm not saying that Manny clearly won, but I think you're wrong to say Marquez did.

Again, just an opinion.

What fight were you watching? Pacquaio was STANDING IN FRONT OF HIM 90% OF THE FIGHT. Shit, even the commentators were commenting on how Pacquaio was getting beat by NOT using angles and NOT going side to side. Marquez was effectively counter punching insignificant striking from Pacquaio and landing significant body shots as well.

Seriously, I want to know what fight some of you watched and how long some of you have been watching boxing.

 

[JLG-]

Offering my humble opinion as a competitive athlete (not in a combat sport, but I'd like to think that I'm good at reading fighters' intentions, balance, timing, distance, etc.):

I think some of you are getting fooled by the fighters' styles into thinking that Marquez was more effective or more in control than he really was. His strategy was to turtle, basically, like the Italians play soccer. As a result, he looks more stable and more on balance and occupies the center of the ring frequently.

Manny, being the aggressor, was dancing around more, sometimes going off-balance, and scrambling to find new angles, while playing around with different distances and timings.

As a result, it looks like Manny is not in control while Marquez is more centered. But that didn't really reflect who dished out the most pain, which is generally what the judges look for. I'm not saying that Manny clearly won, but I think you're wrong to say Marquez did.

Again, just an opinion.

Terrible opinion imo.

 

[Purexed]

Yup, that's why even the guys from PRIMETIME (that were saying that Manny was going to take this one) called it a robbery.

They MUST be gaffers.


Fuck off with that kind of mentality, Manny didn't win, just look at the thread and how we are reading round by round, even some Pacquiao fans are giving it to Marquez.

Not going to argue with you dude.

To land a decision in a championship fight, you need to leave no doubt and close the fight like you're down. Marquez may have been able to pull it off if he didnt let his foot of the gas pedal.

My scan of the web and my Twitter feed from sports journalists show Pacman earned the nod, 7-5. But continue on rabble-rousing!!

 

[Noshino]

Very much enjoyed the fight.

Agreed with the call and was surprised with Nacho and his coaching decisions. I like how he evaded the basic question of whether or not he would have advised his fighter differently. Perhaps because the answer was obvious.

That said, I don't think Pacquio can beat Floyd. I thought he could, but not after seeing how he struggled tonight. Floyd will employ the same strategy as Marquez, but with much more effectiveness thanks to his speed. I think it would be a decision because Floyd wouldn't take enough chances to knock him out, but I don't think it'd be too close on the cards either. It'd end in with a Floyd win, and a very frustrated PacMan who could never really get in.

HAHAHAHAHA

This is just another example of the sham that is Top Rank boxing. Manny is in the ring with someone that isn't washed up (Max said it himself as well) Look at what happened. Manny looked like he lost. Juan wasn't in there to touch gloves like Shane, he was there to win and in the eyes of many, he did just that. There is no way, no way Floyd loses to Manny Pacquiao. I hope on May 5th, Floyd takes his soul.

Like I said before, I actually like Pacquiao, but after this fight? there is no way Manny can beat Mayweather, not like this at least.

Marquez read him like a children's book.

And Im sorry, but if Manny goes like this against Mayweather, he ll get destroyed. Mayweather has a higher reach, is faster, younger, and as smart on the ring as Marquez....

 

[Buzzati]

Maybe you should consult De La Hoya, about the seriousness of getting hit with hard body shots:

Who said they're not effective? They are easier to land than headshots. This is understood by the judges.

 

[computers putin']

Terrible opinion imo.

The defense for Pacquiao is gonna be " the people saying Marquez won aren't educated enough to know who really won!"

prepare for it now.

 

[Heel]

What fight were you watching? Pacquaio was STANDING IN FRONT OF HIM 90% OF THE FIGHT. Shit, even the commentators were commenting on how Pacquaio was getting beat by NOT using angles and NOT going side to side. Marquez was effectively counter punching insignificant striking from Pacquaio and landing significant body shots as well.

Seriously, I want to know what fight some of you watched and how long some of you have been watching boxing.

b-b-b-b-but....THE NUMBERS!

Seriously, we don't agree very often but I'm with you here. How is Compubox defining power punches? I find it hard to believe there's 100+ examples of Pacquiao landing cleanly, with power, through Marquez's gloves.

 

[TheKaeptain]

Offering my humble opinion as a competitive athlete (not in a combat sport, but I'd like to think that I'm good at reading fighters' intentions, balance, timing, distance, etc.):

I think some of you are getting fooled by the fighters' styles into thinking that Marquez was more effective or more in control than he really was. His strategy was to turtle, basically, like the Italians play soccer. As a result, he looks more stable and more on balance and occupies the center of the ring frequently.

Manny, being the aggressor, was dancing around more, sometimes going off-balance, and scrambling to find new angles, while playing around with different distances and timings.

As a result, it looks like Manny is not in control while Marquez is more centered. But that didn't really reflect who dished out the most pain, which is generally what the judges look for. I'm not saying that Manny clearly won, but I think you're wrong to say Marquez did.

Again, just an opinion.

Turtling is how a counter puncher fights.

 

[Agent Icebeezy]

http://msn.foxsports.com/boxing/story/Manny-Pacquiao-Juan-Manuel-Marquez-Round-by-round-111211

Round 12

On my scorecard if Marquez can make it to the end of this round then he’s got the victory he so desired. Incredibly, Marquez is the one on the offense, with Pacquiao unable to put together the offense and blast out Marquez as he needs to. Marquez is fighting tidy, not offering Pacquiao any opportunities for the crunching knockout blow he needs. With 30 seconds left they break to put Pacquiao's mouthguard back in. Right to the end Marquez is the one landing first.

Superb performance. Incredible. An absolute clinic from Marquez on my scorecard. I have it 118-110 to Marquez. Even Pacquiao’s training partner Amir Khan has Marquez as the victor.

The judges have it 114-114 and 115-113, 116-112 to the winner and still world champion Manny Pacquiao.

Completely disagree with that decision. I am aware there were a lot of close rounds and so my 118-110 may have been lopsided, but Marquez put on an absolute clinic tonight. The Vegas fans let Pacquiao know what they think about the decision, booing Pacquiao and chanting Marquez. A disgusting call.

Manny Pacquiao defeats Juan Manuel Marquez via majority decision 114-114, 115-113 and 116-112 to retain his WBO welterweight title

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Like I said before, I actually like Pacquiao, but after this fight? there is no way Manny can beat Mayweather, not like this at least.

Marquez read him like a children's book.

And Im sorry, but if Manny goes like this against Mayweather, he ll get destroyed. Mayweather has a higher reach, is faster, younger, and as smart on the ring as Marquez....

Actually, I think Floyd is 38? So not younger.

Hopefully in May we'll see if Marquez was so effective at countering because they've fought twice before...or because he's just that quick to react. Either way, I can't wait.

http://msn.foxsports.com/boxing/story/Manny-Pacquiao-Juan-Manuel-Marquez-Round-by-round-111211

Intelligent minds can disagree.

And life goes on.

 

[TheNatural]

15rounds.com gave it to Marquez too. I could look for some other sites, but I'm not seeing this "well everyone is saying Pacquaio won" stuff.

 

[Buzzati]

What fight were you watching? Pacquaio was STANDING IN FRONT OF HIM 90% OF THE FIGHT. Shit, even the commentators were commenting on how Pacquaio was getting beat by NOT using angles and NOT going side to side. Marquez was effectively counter punching insignificant striking from Pacquaio and landing significant body shots as well.

Seriously, I want to know what fight some of you watched and how long some of you have been watching boxing.

He was the much quicker boxer. He angled out of punches several ted. Marquez did 2-steps the whole match.

 

[Boogybro]

The defense for Pacquiao is gonna be " the people saying Marquez won aren't educated enough to know who really won!"

prepare for it now.

I'm an educated boxing fan that expected JMM to lose.

He won.

I gave Pacquaio MAYBE 3 rounds in the whole fight.

I'm now officially sick of boxing.

 

[Jamesfrom818]

http://msn.foxsports.com/boxing/story/Manny-Pacquiao-Juan-Manuel-Marquez-Round-by-round-111211

118-110 tells you that his opinion should be discarded.

 

[Agent Icebeezy]

http://twitter.com/#!/sportingbetoz/status/135600223656493056

Pacquiao majority decision against Marquez - we believe it was a bad decision and are refunding all head to head bets on Marquez

 

[computers putin']

Seriously, everytime I saw Pacquiao try to become more aggressive, I saw Marquez turn it against him and land the most flush shots of the match. But I apparently what I saw wasn't what I really saw according to some posters smh.

 

[TheNatural]

He was the much quicker boxer. He angled out of punches several ted. Marquez did 2-steps the whole match.

Put together a clip list of the top 20 hardest, cleanest landed punches for Marquez and the top 20 for Pacquaio. Pacquaio's best punch probably wouldn't have made Marquez's top 10. I didn't see him angling out of shit, he was standing in front getting hit being conservative with an inaccurate flurry thrown in every once in a while.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Damn, there's much salt in here. Magneto would be proud.

I think I'll just sit back and enjoy the tears a bit more.

 

[facepalm007]

'Kay, time to head out of the conversation and go something more concrete...SC2.

Let's not forget about the actual fight, as well as the fights before the main event. All-in-All it was a good night for boxing.

Good night everyone.

 

[Noshino]

Actually, I think Floyd is 38? So not younger.

Hopefully in May we'll see if Marquez was so effective at countering because they've fought twice before...or because he's just that quick to react. Either way, I can't wait.

Manny is 32

Marquez is 38

Floyd is 34

118-110 tells you that his opinion should be discarded.

I had it at 116-112, but some filipino friends had it at 118-110 as well.

 

[TheNatural]

Seriously, everytime I saw Pacquiao try to become more aggressive, I saw Marquez turn it against him and land the most flush shots of the match. But I apparently what I saw wasn't what I really saw according to some posters smh.

It's like Shogun-Machida I. Apparently the only way to see the brilliance of the decision is just to know some kind of voodoo magic that every benefit of the doubt was given to the champ in a close round, and the undisputed rounds the challenger won couldn't match that amount of bullshit.

 

[Buzzati]

Put together a clip list of the top 20 hardest, cleanest landed punches for Marquez and the top 20 for Pacquaio. Pacquaio's best punch probably wouldn't have made Marquez's top 10. I didn't see him angling out of shit, he was standing in front getting hit being conservative with an inaccurate flurry thrown in every once in a while.

Pacquiao would come in with a short combination and angle out an escape to avoid Marquez's counters. This happens several times. I don't need to make a video for you. Pacquiao won. You think Marquez won. The onus is on you to make a video, not me.

 

[JLG-]

Pacquiao would come in with a short combination and angle out an escape to avoid Marquez's counters. This happens several times. I don't need to make a video for you. Pacquiao won. You think Marquez won. The onus is on you to make a video, not me.

Don't worry there will be a vid up soon and it will look something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tF_BHUhJgtU

 

[Mr. Robot]

Wow, this questions the credibility of the sport, i don't know if it is just a Vegas thing or every major boxing match is like that, but Marquez got robbed, i was watching it in TV Azetca Mexico and Julio Cesar Chavez was on commentary, he ended in tears when they called the decision.

 

[TheNatural]

Pacquiao would come in with a short combination and angle out an escape to avoid Marquez's counters. This happens several times. I don't need to make a video for you. Pacquiao won. You think Marquez won. The onus is on you to make a video, not me.

The stupidity of reasoning amazes me here. Shit, even Pacquaio's sparring partner and friend Amir Khan was on the UK broadcast talking about how Marquez thoroughly beat him and fucking offered Marquez a fight in Round 12 because of this win.

Marquez won from the outside, Marquez landed the meaningful shots, Marquez won almost all of the exchanges, Pacquaio didn't do ANYTHING from the outside, Marquez stunned Pacquaio several times with clean shots while Pacquaio didn't hit Marquez with a meaningful stunning shot the whole fight, and at BEST Pacquaio had a handful of flurries where he landed little more than glancing blows and you can count on your hands the clean meaningful shots he hit the whole fight.

This isn't rocket science. The only people who say Pacquaio won are people who are so up his ass they can't see straight, and as a guy who likes Pacquaio it was clear tonight he lost, and the majority of people, commentators, the people in the arena booing and throwing shit in the arena, all saw it the same way. The end.

 

[Boogybro]

Don't worry there will be a vid up soon and it will look something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tF_BHUhJgtU

Exactly.

Pacman barely landed anything clean in the whole fight. Where as JMM got in a few demonstrated in your link, almost every round.

 

[Ether_Snake]

I want to see the Pac May fight.

I think May would likely win.

 

[Buzzati]

The stupidity of reasoning amazes me here. Shit, even Pacquaio's sparring partner and friend Amir Khan was on the UK broadcast talking about how Marquez thoroughly beat him and fucking offered Marquez a fight in Round 12 because of this win.

Marquez won from the outside, Marquez landed the meaningful shots, Marquez won almost all of the exchanges, Pacquaio didn't do ANYTHING from the outside, Marquez stunned Pacquaio several times with clean shots while Pacquaio didn't hit Marquez with a meaningful stunning shot the whole fight, and at BEST Pacquaio had a handful of flurries where he landed little more than glancing blows and you can count on your hands the clean meaningful shots he hit the whole fight.

This isn't rocket science. The only people who say Pacquaio won are people who are so up his ass they can't see straight, and as a guy who likes Pacquaio it was clear tonight he lost, and the majority of people, commentators, the people in the arena booing and throwing shit in the arena, all saw it the same way. The end.

To you "winning an exchange" is actually both fighters apart equally landing clean blows in the tussle. I don't disagree that Marquez won in meaningful punches.. But he lists team in a numbers game and Pacquiao was able to stick in more.

 

[Star Power]

I need a download of this fight so I can rewatch it, my stream was choppy.

 

[Buzzati]

To you "winning an exchange" is actually both fighters apart equally landing clean blows in the tussle. I don't disagree that Marquez won in meaningful punches.. But he lost steam in a numbers game and Pacquiao was able to stick in more.

Fucking autocorrect

 

[Boogybro]

I want to see the Pac May fight.

I think May would likely win.

Only if he knocks him out.

Otherwise the scorecards would be: 120-110 Pacquiao 120-110 Pacquiao 120-110 Pacquiao.

 

[TheNatural]

To you "winning an exchange" is actually both fighters apart equally landing clean blows in the tussle. I don't disagree that Marquez won in meaningful punches.. But he lists team in a numbers game and Pacquiao was able to stick in more.

So basically Manny won because he was the big favorite, he did stuff that resembled the way he fights at some points in the fight, even though practically none of his shots landed in a meaningful way and were glancing blows at best, while Marquez usually counterpunched heavy and clean most of those flurries, and the judges handed him the fight because of it instead of actually winning the fight the way any other fucking judge in the universe would have scored this fight if these were two no name guys with no bias a part of the equation.

That basically sums it up. Pacquaio won on name, when he would have otherwise lost if this were two no name guys fighting on the basis of who really won the fight.

 

[Buzzati]

So basically Manny won because he was the big favorite, he did stuff that resembled the way he fights at some points in the fight, even though practically none of his shots landed in a meaningful way and were glancing blows at best, while Marquez usually counterpunched heavy and clean most of those flurries, and the judges handed him the fight because of it instead of actually winning the fight the way any other fucking judge in the universe would have scored this fight if these were two no name guys with no bias a part of the equation.

That basically sums it up. Pacquaio won on name, when he would have otherwise lost if this were two no name guys fighting on the basis of who really won the fight.

Yet the way you sum it, it seems as if it should have been an 18-0 across the board. I'm going to bed, But I would like to read your theory about why every major boxing enthusiast outlet considers this a "close" fight and not a complete thrashing like how you describe it to be.

 

[Heel]

Let's be honest with ourselves...with the boxing landscape the way it is right now, was there any way in hell JMM was going to walk out with a decision victory over Manny Pacquiao?

 

[abuC]

I don't see how anyone thought Pacman won, all the effective punches were landed by Marquez and he controlled the pace of the fight. This is the second worst decision of the year, the first goes to Erislandy Lara Vs Paul Williams, which is one of the worst I've ever seen.

 

[Jamesfrom818]

Most of Manny's strikes were glancing blows? Were you folks watching a SD stream of the fight on your computer or something?

 

[Buzzati]

Most of Manny's strikes were glancing blows? Were you folks watching a SD stream of the fight on your computer or something?

Tunnel vision

 

[Baby Milo]

I don't see how anyone thought Pacman won, all the effective punches were landed by Marquez and he controlled the pace of the fight. This is the second worst decision of the year, the first goes to Erislandy Lara Vs Paul Williams, which is one of the worst I've ever seen.

agreed with everything

i though JMM win was just as lopsided as Lara's win

 

[computers putin']

I don't see how anyone thought Pacman won, all the effective punches were landed by Marquez and he controlled the pace of the fight. This is the second worst decision of the year, the first goes to Erislandy Lara Vs Paul Williams, which is one of the worst I've ever seen.

That shit made it hard to like boxing for a while

With boxing struggling to stay relevant it's shit like these decision's that make you think the stars have some leeway with the judges.

 

[Jamesfrom818]

Marquez fans are classy. I just heard from my sister that people are trying to start a fight with her 50+ old mother in law in Vegas.

 

[TheNatural]

Yet the way you sum it, it seems as if it should have been an 18-0 across the board. I'm going to bed, But I would like to read your theory about why every major boxing enthusiast outlet considers this a "close" fight and not a complete thrashing like how you describe it to be.

Probably because even a close score doesn't mean there wasn't a clear winner, because the 10 point must scoring system is a joke. Basically the argument for Pacquaio winning is that Marquez had the clearer round wins, but somehow, on every single close round, Pacquaio won them ALL by 10.0 to 9.9 on a subjective scale, which means a 10-9 round for Pacquaio. A judge had the fucking fight 8-4 for Pacquaio, are you fucking kidding me?

And even with that philosophy, I still can't see how Pacquaio won more than 4 rounds. When someone wants to put together a video package that shows me how Pacquaio won this shit, feel free to do so, I trust my eyes instead of bullshit, and so did everyone else at the arena and even Pacquaio's own fucking training partner. Another horrible decision and another shit night for boxing, I'm done.

 

[computers putin']

You don't have to be a Marquez fan to be upset the right man didn't win

I'm not a Marquez fan.

 

[Barbacoatl]

Marquez fans are classy. I just heard from my sister that people are trying to start a fight with her 50+ old mother in law in Vegas.

The judges will give it to the mother in law.

 

[alterno69]

Marquez fans are classy. I just heard from my sister that people are trying to start a fight with her 50+ old mother in law in Vegas.

GTFO, people can be assholes, nothing to do with who they were rooting for.

 

[Noshino]

The judges will give it to the mother in law.

Well, that's because she only dealt the first and last hits

 

[Jamesfrom818]

GTFO, people can be assholes, nothing to do with who they were rooting for.

So the person hassling a little, old Filipino woman who's probably wearing some sort of Filipino jacket isn't a Marquez fan? Wake up. You're dreaming.