Exactly. And those things didn't need to be nerfed. They should revert these changes for Lucio himself, keeping the slower speed for the rest of the team. I don't like the nerf to my ability to have personal speed.
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Overwatch |OT5| 15 Million Strong, None Are On The Payload
- Thread starter ExMachina
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Exactly. And those things didn't need to be nerfed. They should revert these changes for Lucio himself, keeping the slower speed for the rest of the team. I don't like the nerf to my ability to have personal speed.
Yeah, they should figure out how to buff Widow. To be fair, she was extremely toxic to game health at the time and they had to nerf her pretty hard to be sure. I don't mind things like that sitting out for a patch cycle. Soldier was my most played pre nerf and I knew he was borderline busted. When he got nerfed I kinda expected it and took the opportunity to learn McCree/Genji. Now he's coming back a bit and I'm excited to give him another go. Widow needs that same treatment, but buffing her too much is going to just make her toxic again :T Soldier has a much lower chance of doing that now that we have a good idea of where to be with McCree.
They didn't need to touch her on console. She was already pretty bad there. An example of them not keeping the balance separate between platforms.
which is why i feel i'm at a disadvantage when i don't play Lucio myself. getting amp'd boost from an ally Lucio at the very start of an attack phase gives me a sad feeling since amp'd speed won't be available when we actually hit the fight in just a few more seconds.
in those games, tbh, the team would be better off with Mercy than a Lucio who doesn't regularly amp speed.
but because the pro meta uses Lucio, and it trickles down, Lucio is everywhere...played in a less than optimal fashion.
blizz can't make balance decisions around sub-optimal low level play.
Well that's a different thing than what I'm talking about. I agree that they should balance the versions differently, but that doesn't mean she didn't have to take that hit the way she did on PC.
Y'all can continue to be upset about Lucio, but Blizzard agreed with a lot of the better players, a good percentage of them not in the pro scene and just in comp ladder, that Lucio is a problem. The fact is "it doesn't affect me in my games" isn't a good enough reason when higher ranks have proven without a doubt that if it is used well it is way too good. The only thing stopping it from affecting your games is the person playing Lucio.
Also, yeah, people hear "Lucio is broke", pick him thinking he'll just carry, and then don't use speedboost and fail miserably. Shit's whack, I get sad every time I see a Lucio amp heal when I know we're better off with the speed CD :<
Shorter grapple cooldown so that she has mobility, both to have a chance of escape and to not be stuck in one sniper spot for too long.
Multiple mines. A single mine is so worthless that it literally just functions better as an flank detector. Multiple mines can give Widow a role on the point (It's where I leave most of my mines, so help out teammates with whoever's on there) and better chances of survival.
Change her ult to have some damage potential. Wallhack is useful, but not useful enough. My suggestion is to give her HUD target marks over the heads of enemies when scoped. It basically gives everyone giant headshot hitboxes for the duration of Infra-red. People have plenty of escape options, but Widow still can make a meaningful dent in the enemy team in the right situation.
And possibly, only on consoles, give her her old damage back. The aiming on consoles difficult enough that greater damage is atleast worth consideration.
That all seems like way overkill. Honestly, if they give her back quick-scoping that might be enough tbh. You can make venom mine a bit better, lower hook CD by like 2s. I'd be scared to do that though, if you give her an inch she gets a whole lot back.
Balancing a hitscan gun with no drop off in this game is kind of a nightmare. It's made even harder by the fact Widow's gun has a high firerate. Even with the low damage on quick shots, you can get enough damage quickly without having to un-scope.
You guys on console eventually started to bump into it a lot?
Balancing a hitscan gun with no drop off in this game is kind of a nightmare. It's made even harder by the fact Widow's gun has a high firerate. Even with the low damage on quick shots, you can get enough damage quickly without having to un-scope.
You guys on console eventually started to bump into it a lot?
optimus8936
Banned
What was the point of quick scoping with her anyways? I've watched it happen a bunch of times, but I still can't understand what the purpose of it was.
Newtype-001
Member
Its been a while since i played with Mccree
but i probably cant. I find im not very good with Hitscan heroes in this game. The sensitivity works fine for Genji, Hanzo, Zen and Lucio which are the heroes i play the most.
Maybe all at once is too much, but only because literally every ability she has other than the sniper itself woefully underpowered, with the sniper being only slightly.
I especially think she needs a fast grapple. 10 seconds is almost as worthless as 12. I think it should be 6 at most. Other heroes have SO much more mobility that it's baffling. I'm not evne talking about designed to be fast characters like Tracer, but D.Va can fucking fly every 5 seconds, Soldier can sprint infinitely at any time, Hanzo's wallclimb is passive, Junkrat can use his mine every 8 seconds...It makes no sense to me why Widow's CD should be anywhere near the double digits.
I also think she needs an ult with some offensive capability. Wallhacks can be situationally useful, but the sucky thing about that is that you only know the situation after you activate it. You could activate it with no one near enough for it to matter, or have the team already know where enemies are. Plus, it really is lame that Hanzo has her ult as his ability. So it needs something.
I'd be fine with just those two buffs if that's all I could get.
For a while. Its pretty common to see.
Incendiary
Banned
Have there been any buffs/nerfs that actually changed a character's abilities and how they function since the game came out? I mean, we've gotten damage buffs/nerfs, frame/animation adjustments, burst fire/damage range changes, etc. But all those are adjustments to the current tool kit. So I can see Widowmaker's grapple cool down being a possible change, but adding extra mines or changing how her ult works doesn't seem like a thing Blizzard is going to do.
Like, we all want Bastion's toolkit to be revamped, but is there any indication they're going to outright change abilities as part of their buff/nerf process? 'Cause all I've seen so far is just tweaks to the existing kit for everyone.
not sure of others, but for me, yea.
First, if you shoot there's a very brief period where there is no charge building(I think this was changed in her nerf). Re-scoping gets past that. Second off, the ability to look quickly around the screen, be mobile, and still get quick shots off was really important to her.
Permanently A
Junior Member
I'm a good Mercy. She's simple to play mechanically and she plays to my strengths in that she's all about positioning and game sense.
I'm a decent Lucio. Picked him up after Mercy's nerf and mained him to hit 65 in comp. Not good at wallriding at all though.
Above average Zen. I know how to stay alive but my aim could use work.
I'm fucking terrible with Ana.
I can't speak as to what blizzard will do, just what I think they probably should do. This wouldn't be a complete revamp of her ability anyway. All they'd change would be that targets are placed over people's heads (Soldier's ult does this already, they can just transfer the mechanism if they want) and their head hitbox becomes bigger for Widow specifically during her ult (or, more sensibly, it works like Soldier's except instead aimbotting when a player is onscreen, the game aimbots if you put your crosshair over the target mark). It'd be a more radical change than anything they've done so far, but not THAT out there.
Incendiary
Banned
Did they buff Symmetra's turrets in last few days?? They kill so fast now.
God I hope so. I need my girl back. I still have a good win % with her but my playtime has drastically decreased since the console nerf to her turrets.
Console or PC? On console my wall riding skills increased tenfold when I switched jump to L2. Now I can be that annoying Lucio that jumps around the tower in the middle of Lijiang and keeps you from taking the point.
optimus8936
Banned
Ah, didn't know about the charge thing.
Widow is my worst character, so I'm gonna stay out of the balance talk for her as I don't know shit about her. I think she's the best character ever when I get at least 15 elims in one match XD.
My Widow is shit too. I didn't start getting into scrims/customs until launch, and when I did the first thing that happened was each team ran 2 Widows and/or 2 McCrees and you literally couldn't expose yourself or you died instantly. Was a real nightmare. Even in 1HL Widow+McCree was extremely oppressive to the same degree of "don't peek ever."
I'm really horrified to ever go back to those days. I stopped playing custom as much during PharMercy meta because I found it equally cheesy, but at least I could play Pharah/Mercy and have fun doing stuff. Widow meta was literally "no fun allowed" unless you were playing into or as Widow.
A big issue in this game when I'm using McCree is that so many moves push and and knock characters around. Its annoying when you are about to headshot and some explosion or something knocks the character away.
Though I feel kinda bad when I steal kills from my Roadhog by headshoting his hooked characters, that happens a lot.
Though I feel kinda bad when I steal kills from my Roadhog by headshoting his hooked characters, that happens a lot.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Ungh. I love the team comp that NiP bring to Overwatch (3 tank, 3 support). I just wish the game wasn't balanced to where this just isn't viable against top level teams.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz3jVGPLJBA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hz3jVGPLJBA
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
I do that when my hog hooked another hog.
Honestly, it's not bad against top level teams. It specifically is a problem for "Team Cancer" to deal with. It just has a bit of a weakness against a 2/2/2 or 3/1/2 set that uses like Reaper/McCree that can be an issue. That and it isn't flexible across some map segments :T
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
NRG has something similar except that they use a flex dps instead of a 3rd healer.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
I think a major problem is that the pros often like to take the fight to the high ground which can often lead to narrow corridors (upstairs route on Hanamura, up on the ledge on Dorado, etc.) and that is a big problem for Ana. If a fat tank is in front of her then she can't help the people who actually need healing in the front lines.
Yesterday I was behind Reinhardt in a narrow hallway with an enemy Bastion at the other end. Reinhardt couldn't put down his shield because he would have been melted but every time I tried to shoot Bastion I'd just hit Reinhardt (those hitboxes...) it sucked because he didn't even need healing. But the pros are the pros for a reason, if she is the best choice then they will make it work.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
That's not really a problem for the pro scene.
I dunno, even in casual play I find ana super clutch during attack on payload.
Not sure if it's entirely accurate, but I've read that code-wise his reflect is literally Reinhardt's shield but scaled down to Genji's size.
Which is still hilariously huge.
Nerf the reflect hitbox and give Genji back his triple jump. It's only fair.
Incendiary
Banned
One time as Reinhardt I charged and accidentally grabbed a Mercy as she was being hooked by Roadhog. Or as I liked to think of it: Mercy's Terrible No-Good Awful Very Bad Day.
I feel bad killing Mercy sometimes. Only Mercy that I enjoy killing are MGS ones.
optimus8936
Banned
I still don't think reflect is a problem. It is insanely hard already to actually deflect stuff back at people, nerfing the box is just going to make deflect even harder.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, no one ever complained about deflect before they saw that video. Just saying.
I think most people chalked it up as being outplayed. I FELT something was off but I never thought to make a custom game to test it.
I just wish it was a reactive move and not proactive. Where it drops to 0.5-1 secs of effect and hits cool down if no one shoots at it rather than having to sit and wait for 3 seconds.
Incendiary
Banned
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Starting to win more than i lose as mccree which is nice.
Still not the elim monster mccree can be but I'm hitting over 15 elims most times so that's nice.
Still not the elim monster mccree can be but I'm hitting over 15 elims most times so that's nice.
What are you doing to be an elim monster? I'm finding at 50 hours of him he depends heavily on his team being decent to rack up kills. If their team is all together while yours is continually being killed you have no chance to corner people because you'll always be in situations fighting multiple people by yourself.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
120? isn't 100 the max?
i don't care about k/d. i will gladly sacrifice myself trying to get that stupid trophy. but my recent QP games with him have been nothing but easy kill streaks. he does so much damage.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
I'm saying that I'm not an elim monster.
But honestly, if i get a team that is willing to engage in team fights together i can lay down the poke and get some heavy damage in. And just stick with my tank in general.
I'm finding that I'm winning most 1 v 1 battles which is nice.
Here's my recent session with him just to show where I'm at. I'm reaaaaaaaal bad at not dying too much.
Paltheos
Member
? Don't feel bad. We want the support. I'll often hook characters outside of my league hoping my teammates will attack during the stun. I do get a certain level of satisfaction of blasting squishies in the face (especially the slippery ones) but I care more about winning the game. Knowing my teammates are watching me is more important.
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