Meaning that none of the heroes are more powerful than they are supposed to be (McCree used to outsnipe the snipers in the beta for example), or having an exploit within the game mechanics that gives unfair advantage like Widowmaker's quick scoping that was removed.
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Overwatch |OT5| 15 Million Strong, None Are On The Payload
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Meaning that none of the heroes are more powerful than they are supposed to be (McCree used to outsnipe the snipers in the beta for example), or having an exploit within the game mechanics that gives unfair advantage like Widowmaker's quick scoping that was removed.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
I mean I don't expect it to be 100% balanced ever.
But having 12 characters that are useless in pro is pretty unhealthy.
But having 12 characters that are useless in pro is pretty unhealthy.
Useless is a bit misleading. Since there is no drafting in OW, it's easy to detect and play the six absolute best heroes. Why would you play the 7th best even though he isn't "bad" or "useless"?
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Problem is that there's very little room for niches in ow currently. That's what i mean by unhealthy. Attacking and defending shouldn't have the same strategy.
Red Arremer
Member
Or rather, attacking/defending shouldn't have to have the same strategy/team comp.
Of course there's no way to make a game like this 100% balanced, ever. For that we'd have to have the same character with the same loadout of weapons and abilities, and even then it could be imbalanced due to the non-symmetric nature of the maps, even the KotH ones.
If in a game like this more than half of the roster of characters is unviable, however, you ought to look into the problems of these characters, and what makes the ones that get picked so powerful. If you notice there's some mechanic or skill of a character at the core of these problems (e.g. Zenatta's discord melting most tanks), then you can easily correct that by adjusting the numbers or reworking that ability.
There's always going to be stragglers that don't get picked often either because they're easier to counter due to their mechanics, or because they're extremely niche due to their mechanics (Symmetra comes to mind here). I don't expect Bastion to get changed in any significant way from here on out, for instance, because he'd need a massive rework of his mechanics and still is a low/mid level stomper, but there's characters who are on the verge of being viable and just need a little change to their kit in order to make them such (e.g. Mei).
Of course there's no way to make a game like this 100% balanced, ever. For that we'd have to have the same character with the same loadout of weapons and abilities, and even then it could be imbalanced due to the non-symmetric nature of the maps, even the KotH ones.
If in a game like this more than half of the roster of characters is unviable, however, you ought to look into the problems of these characters, and what makes the ones that get picked so powerful. If you notice there's some mechanic or skill of a character at the core of these problems (e.g. Zenatta's discord melting most tanks), then you can easily correct that by adjusting the numbers or reworking that ability.
There's always going to be stragglers that don't get picked often either because they're easier to counter due to their mechanics, or because they're extremely niche due to their mechanics (Symmetra comes to mind here). I don't expect Bastion to get changed in any significant way from here on out, for instance, because he'd need a massive rework of his mechanics and still is a low/mid level stomper, but there's characters who are on the verge of being viable and just need a little change to their kit in order to make them such (e.g. Mei).
There's plenty of room for niches for most people. But in pro levels everything is optimized. Overwatch isn't the only game where "quirky" characters and strats don't exist at high level pro play.
TheLetdown
Member
I think most of the time these are players raging from the previous lost. But yes, it pretty much sets the tone when there's zero interaction. No fun allowed.
My morning rounds in QP and comp have actually been positive this morning... Everyone joking around for once.
They need to add a frontline offense character like 76. Sombra being assumedly yet another flanker will be extremely disappointing.
I feel like I'm starting to hate Junkrat players the most. Every game I play there is always a Junkrat on my team standing too far away for the obj just lobbing shit into random doorways. I know they "feel" like they're helping, but in reality you're not killing anyone and giving the other teams' healers their ults faster because they are constantly healing their teammates.
Early morning salt, apologies.
I agree with what you said and I don't think it's reasonable to expact for that to change by balancing alone. Maybe new maps will bring out the strength of other characters so we will overall see more diversity of heroes in pro play.
Have fun missing out on all widowmaker teams.
Garrett Hawke
Member
we managed to push the payload past the first checkpoint on Dorado as an all Widowmaker team
They buffed Zenyatta, so her nerf was kind of pointless. Maybe we should let fully charged body shots be 140.
Skel1ingt0n
I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
I asked this earlier but didn't get any replies (that I saw).
Truly, with more than 60 hours ticked, I have not really complained about any overpowered characters. Never had issue with McCree, for example. Early on, I found Bastion to be easy fodder. And hell, nowadays I fucking love D.VA because I thought she was pretty damn decent and critical before her buff.
But man, I'm having a really tough time with Mei.
Her spray-and-pray freeze is just - unlike all the other issues - not fun to play against. It's tied with Junk-Rat's trap for most frustrating thing in the game - getting control taken away from me. But at least with the ladder, I can keep an eye out for it. But Mei is just constantly taking control away - between her non-stop spraying, her frustrating Ult when you're pushing right before point, or hell, even the damn ice walls that she throws up at the start of every match... And if you catch her, she Halo 3 Armor Locks killing the flow of the fight, and making me wait around or hope to get away to someone else.
And so, I tried to play as her - played for a couple hours - and there really wasn't any good counter against me. I mean, I just used what I was seeing, and I was dominating. Five or six games in a row, and they were easy wins. The two games I lost, I had multiple golds and died once each.
Instantly freezing Roadhogs and Reins, allowing myself and teammates to reduce them to shreds instantly. You could easily track a Tracer because the freeze gas doesn't require precision. And I could throw up a wall several times a minute, which on certain attack maps (Hanamura Point 1), makes it damn near impossible for offense to get through when I'm on D.
Only real issues at all was it was hard to freeze Lucio because he can run on walls, and Genji could get me because of his fast strike. Snipers SEEM like the obvious counter; but between her ice wall and heal block ability, she can usually escape a sniper or outright avoid it.
Is there a trick to fucking her up? I'm not mad - I'm just genuinely curious. I hear a lot of meta followers and Mei mains constantly tell me she's underpowered and rarely picked. But I'm facing her in almost every game, and time and time again, she's the only hero I have an issue with, regardless of who I choose.
Just looking for some input.
Truly, with more than 60 hours ticked, I have not really complained about any overpowered characters. Never had issue with McCree, for example. Early on, I found Bastion to be easy fodder. And hell, nowadays I fucking love D.VA because I thought she was pretty damn decent and critical before her buff.
But man, I'm having a really tough time with Mei.
Her spray-and-pray freeze is just - unlike all the other issues - not fun to play against. It's tied with Junk-Rat's trap for most frustrating thing in the game - getting control taken away from me. But at least with the ladder, I can keep an eye out for it. But Mei is just constantly taking control away - between her non-stop spraying, her frustrating Ult when you're pushing right before point, or hell, even the damn ice walls that she throws up at the start of every match... And if you catch her, she Halo 3 Armor Locks killing the flow of the fight, and making me wait around or hope to get away to someone else.
And so, I tried to play as her - played for a couple hours - and there really wasn't any good counter against me. I mean, I just used what I was seeing, and I was dominating. Five or six games in a row, and they were easy wins. The two games I lost, I had multiple golds and died once each.
Instantly freezing Roadhogs and Reins, allowing myself and teammates to reduce them to shreds instantly. You could easily track a Tracer because the freeze gas doesn't require precision. And I could throw up a wall several times a minute, which on certain attack maps (Hanamura Point 1), makes it damn near impossible for offense to get through when I'm on D.
Only real issues at all was it was hard to freeze Lucio because he can run on walls, and Genji could get me because of his fast strike. Snipers SEEM like the obvious counter; but between her ice wall and heal block ability, she can usually escape a sniper or outright avoid it.
Is there a trick to fucking her up? I'm not mad - I'm just genuinely curious. I hear a lot of meta followers and Mei mains constantly tell me she's underpowered and rarely picked. But I'm facing her in almost every game, and time and time again, she's the only hero I have an issue with, regardless of who I choose.
Just looking for some input.
Pharah and Junkrat can destroy Mei easily.
Skel1ingt0n
I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
Pharah couldn't touch me. I felt one of her rockets, and I'd hide in my healing cube until a teammmate took her out (she doesn't have much HP, so Pharah is a pretty easy threat to take care of.
Junkrat couldn't do shit to get past my Ice Wall. As soon as it went down, Roadhog would snag and one shot him.
Maybe I was just getting lucky. Admittedly, I never play Junkrat; but as Pharah, I can rarely take down a Mei - she just ice cubes up; or plants an ice wall somewhere in my line of site.
I'll try switching out next time and give it another shot.
Zarya does not need a nerf.
TheLetdown
Member
Agreed. I faced an all Mei plus Lucio team the other week and just went nuts with Pharah. The trick was waiting out the ice block and making sure to follow up for the kill. You also have to strafe in the air and play with shooting from angles and using cover, otherwise she can put a hurt on with her alt-fire.
McCree is a good anti-Mei, too.
Zarya? Wut...
I mostly play Tank in OW and prefer projectiles usually so... it's been quite the struggle.Pharah has the Concussive Blast ability which can push enemies away from her. This is a good strategy when you can't fly because of the cool down.
And if you have seen Pharahs and Junkrats not dealing with Mei, then they don't really know how to play these heroes.
optimus8936
Banned
Eh? I can't comprehend any nerf to tanks as they're the most balanced heroes in the game, especially Zarya and Reinhardt.
Yeah her shield is too strong.
optimus8936
Banned
TheLetdown
Member
Or if one Reaper does.
His wraith lasts about as long as her shields, so he's even best equipped for waiting that out.
...how? With it on she has as much health as roadhog. Using it on other teammates effectively requires considerable coordination and judgment. Outside of the shield she has no other abilities.
She a strong character in the right hands, but there is no way she's overpowered.
optimus8936
Banned
Except for the fact that he doesn't have to aim and is better at starting fights. It's easier for your team to capitalize on winstons shield than Zaryas, especially when Zarya only has enough shields for two people, whereas Winston can provide for the whole team. He also has much better mobility.
I disagree, Winston is great in dealing with snipers and flankers in a way Zarya never could.
Newtype-001
Member
Are we at the "nerf characters im having trouble against" point :x
optimus8936
Banned
Also, Zarya can be kind of worthless if you can't get any energy, it takes a little bit for her to be a key role in a fight, whereas Winston can jump into the fight instantly.
optimus8936
Banned
People asked for Bastion to be nerfed. I also feel that the Hanzo nerf was mostly because people were salty they were getting killed by an underpowered hero. And there is the current cries for a Genji nerf.
I'm waiting for the day when someone asks for Reinhardt to be nerfed. That would be something.
Zarya doesn't need a nerf, not yet at least. She's a pretty main pick for comp teams now. And Genji is fine besides his ultimate, no one is mentioning Lucio who has had a near 100% pick rate, at least since the game launched. Definitely wanted to see more support variations besides Lucio + someone else.
More on the Symmetra buffs, I think along with her teleporter having more HP and being able to rotate it, she should be able to recall the teleporter as long as it hasn't been attacked in the last 5 seconds or so and after a cooldown. It would refund your ult charge depending on how many uses were remaining and make it so her teleporter isn't wasted. If your healer died, you could get them in the battle faster, then recall your teleporter. Or they could make the recall build a seperate meter like mechless D.Va.
More on the Symmetra buffs, I think along with her teleporter having more HP and being able to rotate it, she should be able to recall the teleporter as long as it hasn't been attacked in the last 5 seconds or so and after a cooldown. It would refund your ult charge depending on how many uses were remaining and make it so her teleporter isn't wasted. If your healer died, you could get them in the battle faster, then recall your teleporter. Or they could make the recall build a seperate meter like mechless D.Va.
For Symmetra, I think it would be nice if you could apply the shield to yourself, at the moment its such a little buf that it wouldn't hurt that much.
xaosslug
Member
and Blizz are considering/planning a buff for her (the little robot ult thingy will be able to be thrown through shields & will have a larger freezing area) OUT OF NOWHERE, so get ready. xD
why? Just kill her before she gets her charge up = DONE. It's dumb teams that let her and Zen run amok until it's too late.
TheLetdown
Member
Now that you mention it, he DOES do a shit ton of damage...
Honestly, though, I think the cries for Genji are somewhat justified. Something needs to change about him. I think ult gain could do the trick and I really dislike that he keeps most of his ult if you stuff his ass early when he pops it. Someone mentioned making Deflect slow him down, and I think there's merit to that. I don't want to see to much or else he risks being useless.
I also think Reaper's shotguns need less range or a steeper drop off, if you want to put it that way.
But damn, this game is really good at balance for the most part. I don't know what to do about the data concerning Defense heroes, though.
-Bastion's main form is now the tank
-Hanzo's newest arrow is a 3sec CD teleport arrow
-Junkrat can riptire at will
-Mei no longer starts a blizzard she is the blizzard
-When destroying Torjbjorn turrets they will only revert to prior level, ex: Molten Core > Level 2 > Level 1
-Widowmaker's Ult now has an aimbot, what's that?
There isn' a need o nerf zarya because a this point the only good ones are those that have a good eye on what's happening. She's very situational in a sense. that picking and choosing to to bubble and when is esstiental
As I see it most of them out there have tunnel vision and the ones that are complaining are doing it because they don't know how to be good "floor generals" or "quarterbacks" in a sense. I'm taling more of other people that play zarya complaining about better zarya players
Zarya is pretty much the point guard or QB of Overwatch
As I see it most of them out there have tunnel vision and the ones that are complaining are doing it because they don't know how to be good "floor generals" or "quarterbacks" in a sense. I'm taling more of other people that play zarya complaining about better zarya players
Zarya is pretty much the point guard or QB of Overwatch
ROBOKITTYZILLA
Member
I need more OW PC friends! Most of the people I play with on PC are west coast and play a bit on the late side for me. Anyone around the 50s or higher on PC and interested in grouping for comp? I'm also up for messing around or practicing in quick play. I use mic and can fill any role but currently focusing on Genji, Mcree, Zarya, D.va, and Zenyatta.
I started this season a little late but have put in around 40 hours or so with over 100 in quick play. I'm planning to play a lot more in season 2 and in general.
Post your battle tag if interested. Thanks!
I started this season a little late but have put in around 40 hours or so with over 100 in quick play. I'm planning to play a lot more in season 2 and in general.
Post your battle tag if interested. Thanks!
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