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[Simon Belmont]

Not really. Those are facts. It's been 6+ weeks. He hasn't been charged with anything.

If he is charged and found guilty, then my stance will change. Until then, I will do what's right and treat him like an innocent person.

As you are wont to do, however you could just as easily look at the fact that he employs a police officer and come to another conclusion. Focusing solely on whether he has been charged is ignoring a bunch of other facts whether you'd like to admit that or not. Especially when there is a clear pattern in law enforcement to avoid charging high profile people whenever possible.

 

[KingBroly]

Kind of?

I mean...that's not a good photo since you can't see face. It could be Stone Cold Steve Austin for all we know?

 

[thelatestmodel]

Kind of?

What is this picture supposed to mean?

 

[Simon Belmont]

I think the bigger story about that picture is the CRT TV in the background.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

What is this picture supposed to mean?

That's the cop referenced by KingBroly.

 

[kess]

Kind of?

two guys one cup

 

[Simon Belmont]

two guys one cup

And a shit storm.

 

[hodayathink]

So this goes from mostly a he said/she said case (like the majority of rape cases in the first place) to almost entirely a he said/she said case because any DNA evidence is likely to get thrown out at this point. If this was a plan to help Kane (in terms of tampering with the evidence), whomever planned/executed it really didn't think things through, unless the evidence was actually tampered with before the rape kit was processed (and that's why we had the reports/rumors of no DNA found). This does nothing but make him look more guilty in the public eye (even if he had nothing to do with said tampering).

Edit: And as far as him playing, it's more of a PR issue than it is a CBA issue. It looks like the Blackhawks stance is that they aren't going to suspend him/bar him from team activities until he gets charged. Which is obviously their right. But if I were them, if it were looking likely that he'd get charged, I'd tell him to stay away from the team until the dust settles. And at this point, it's looking likely that unless he gets a super-favorable grand jury, he's going to get charged.

 

[DeathoftheEndless]

As horrible as this is, couldn't it have farther reaching implications? Anything that went through that evidence locker or lab would be called into question now. LawyerGAF?

I don't think rape cases usually have much physical evidence. According to the leaked reports, the alleged victim had traces of Kane's DNA on her and scratches/bruises, which would be the most important things.

 

[Sheroking]

It's the same CBA that was used against Ray Rice and Adrian Petterson, who both won when they took it to court.

Not it isn't.

The NHL and the NFL have different collective bargaining agreements. The NHL and the Chicago Blackhawks explicitly and independently have the right to suspend Kane for simply being the subject of a criminal investigation.

 

[Fjordson]

Kind of?

Good lawd.

 

[Troy]

Not it isn't.

The NHL and the NFL have different collective bargaining agreements. The NHL and the Chicago Blackhawks explicitly and independently have the right to suspend Kane for simply being the subject of a criminal investigation.

I'm referring to the one that nailed Ben.

 

[BronsonLee]

I mean...that's not a good photo since you can't see face. It could be Stone Cold Steve Austin for all we know?

IT IS ME, AUSTIN *Stunner to Kane*

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

I'm referring to the one that nailed Ben.

I used that as an example to show how an athlete can be disciplined without criminal conviction.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Blackhawks' fan but the Hawks should dump Kane.

 

[Troy]

I used that as an example to show how an athlete can be disciplined without criminal conviction.

And the courts showed us that they'll overturn it if the athlete fights it.

 

[Lambtron]

As you are wont to do, however you could just as easily look at the fact that he employs a police officer and come to another conclusion. Focusing solely on whether he has been charged is ignoring a bunch of other facts whether you'd like to admit that or not. Especially when there is a clear pattern in law enforcement to avoid charging high profile people whenever possible.

Tons and tons and tons of rapists are not charged or not found guilty of the crimes they commit. False rape accusations are rare, and cases where there isn't enough evidence to take it to court are counted with them as "false accusations." Let's just say I'm far more comfortable presuming that Kane is guilty than not.

 

[thelatestmodel]

Blackhawks' fan but the Hawks should dump Kane.

As a fellow Blackhawks fan, you're one sandwich short of a picnic.

Tons and tons and tons of rapists are not charged or not found guilty of the crimes they commit. False rape accusations are rare, and cases where there isn't enough evidence to take it to court are counted with them as "false accusations." Let's just say I'm far more comfortable presuming that Kane is guilty than not.

Just... wow.

 

[Kazerei]

Did the NHL even suspend Kane when he assaulted a cabbie? He actually pled guilty to disorderly conduct that time.

 

[Wazzy]

This whole case is so fucked up.

Also it's really disgusting watching the Kane fans in here immediately rush to his defense. You're not even attempting to play neutral.

 

[darscot]

Blackhawks' fan but the Hawks should dump Kane.

Yeah that would be great for the sport, you would have crazies coming out of the wood work. Shit I will accuse Towes myself if that will run him out of Chicago, fuck Keith too.

 

[23qwerty]

can someone post a screenshot of that tweet? I can't access twitter atm

https://twitter.com/Lahlahlindsey/status/646752172978368512

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

Yeah that would be great for the sport, you would have crazies coming out of the wood work. Shit I will accuse Towes myself if that will run him out of Chicago, fuck Keith too.

No you wouldn't.

 

[hodayathink]

Oh, and one of the things that makes this sad to me is that if anything, last season proved that the Blackhawks don't necessarily need Kane around for the regular season (and especially for the start of it). Forcing him to sit may hurt the team in the short term, but if you actually think he's innocent, he probably comes back well before the playoffs (if you're actually worried about him being rusty). There really isn't that much of a downside to not letting him play (again, if you think he's innocent), but the Blackhawks went full speed ahead anyway and let him play anyway because, well, they can.

 

[HawksWinStanley]

So if there isn't proof the actual kit was tampered with then why would it be inadmissible? I mean they have the kit itself and the processed results from when it was first conducted, right? Isn't her lawyer only claiming the bag the kit had been in was tampered with? I didn't see anything about the actual kit being missing.

 

[Troy]

Did the NHL even suspend Kane when he assaulted a cabbie? He actually pled guilty to disorderly conduct that time.

I don't think so. This is how the Blackhawks handled the news that Kane admitted to assaulting the cabbie:

"We recognize that this has been a difficult time for Patrick, his family and all of those involved," Bowman said.

"We are glad this matter has finally been resolved and that this situation can now be put behind him."

Poor Patrick, it was such a difficult time for him.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

So if there isn't proof the actual kit was tampered with then why would it be inadmissible? I mean they have the kit itself and the processed results from when it was first conducted, right? Isn't her lawyer only claiming the bag the kit had been in was tampered with? I didn't see anything about the actual kit being missing.

Just the fact that the bag is out in the wild is a HUGE red flag.

 

[darscot]

So if there isn't proof the actual kit was tampered with then why would it be inadmissible? I mean they have the kit itself and the processed results from when it was first conducted, right? Isn't her lawyer only claiming the bag the kit had been in was tampered with? I didn't see anything about the actual kit being missing.

They found it open and at the victims mothers house, if that is not tampered with I dont know what is?

 

[23qwerty]

Just... wow.

Yeah it's a bit surprising but unfortunately true

 

[Marvie_3]

This whole case is so fucked up.

Also it's really disgusting watching the Kane fans in here immediately rush to his defense. You're not even attempting to play neutral.

Neither are the people that are convinced he's guilty already. It goes both ways.



Also, police statement about the evidence:

Regarding Evidence
September 23, 2015 at 11:43am

In regard to the information conveyed today by Mr. Thomas Eoannou, the Hamburg Police Department will cooperate with any authorized investigation regarding the handling of evidence and the procedure of such. That said, The Hamburg Police Department has documentation that unequivocally demonstrates that its handling of the evidence and the integrity of its chain of custody of evidence in this case is unassailable. As is policy with active investigations, there will be no further comment regarding this situation.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Yeah that would be great for the sport, you would have crazies coming out of the wood work. Shit I will accuse Towes myself if that will run him out of Chicago, fuck Keith too.

D-Rose's accuser may be crazy but there is something to this allegation with Kane.

I'm pretty sure there is actual evidence(well, some left that hasn't been destroyed).

Not going to be a blind fanboy and even if I turned my face away from the stench, I'd still smell it.

Kane's giving a great organization a really bad look.

 

[thelatestmodel]

This whole case is so fucked up.

Also it's really disgusting watching the Kane fans in here immediately rush to his defense. You're not even attempting to play neutral.

That's an interesting opinion. I hope you're not referring to me!

I'm a big Hawks fan, but I am totally neutral on the Kane case, because I, like you, don't know the facts and am not playing backseat lawyers. He fucking deserves some people defending him and his right to be innocent until proven guilty.

If it comes out that he is guilty, then he's officially a scumbag and can rot in jail. That is when I'll do my 180.

 

[Troy]

This whole case is so fucked up.

Also it's really disgusting watching the Kane fans in here immediately rush to his defense. You're not even attempting to play neutral.

Assuming someone is innocent until proven guilty is playing neutral.

 

[hodayathink]

So if there isn't proof the actual kit was tampered with then why would it be inadmissible? I mean they have the kit itself and the processed results from when it was first conducted, right? Isn't her lawyer only claiming the bag the kit had been in was tampered with? I didn't see anything about the actual kit being missing.

Just the fact that the bag is out in the wild is a HUGE red flag.

Yeah, just that fact shows that something is seriously wrong with the handling of the evidence in the case, and unless they can provide some VERY CLEAR proof that the handling of the evidence up to the point of the rape kit being tested was spot-on, you can't trust anything coming out of the evidence that was in that bag.

 

[HawksWinStanley]

Just the fact that the bag is out in the wild is a HUGE red flag.

Yeah no doubt something fishy is going on. But they would have the initial results of the kit documented right? So aside from the broken chain of command now I'm not sure how it has any bearing on the initial results when it was processed.

They found it open and at the victims mothers house, if that is not tampered with I dont know what is?

The bag. They found the bag it was in. Her lawyer didn't say anything about the actual kit, which I guess we're supposed to assume is in police custody seeing as how nobody said the evidence is missing. Just that it's possibly compromised now since the bag it was in left police custody.

 

[HariKari]

Also, police statement about the evidence:

Wouldn't expect them to admit any wrongdoing when it's their ass on the line.

 

[darscot]

D-Rose's accuser may be crazy but there is something to this allegation with Kane.

I'm pretty sure there is actual evidence(well, some left that hasn't been destroyed).

Not going to be a blind fanboy and even if I turned my face away from the stench, I'd still smell it.

Kane's giving a great organization a really bad look.

You have your opinion but in pro sports, if another organization thought they could get a player the caliber of Kane, Towes or Keith by some bullshit accusations that sure as shit is going to happen. Kane and his accuser both equally deserve their day in court. This whole thing stinks I'll grant you that, but in this shit storm there is no way I could form an opinion one way or the other. Right now I will give Kane the benefit of the doubt, innocent until proven guilty. I know people think that is crazy these days but I'm going with it.

 

[Boke1879]

D-Rose's accuser may be crazy but there is something to this allegation with Kane.

I'm pretty sure there is actual evidence(well, some left that hasn't been destroyed).

Not going to be a blind fanboy and even if I turned my face away from the stench, I'd still smell it.

Kane's giving a great organization a really bad look.

The DRose situation is vastly difference to this.

But like someone said. With Kane there were reports that the DNA in the rape kit didn't link him to anything. So this whole thing is bizarre

 

[Wazzy]

Assuming someone is innocent until proven guilty is playing neutral.

No it isn't. Playing neutral is withholding judgement from being guilty or innocent.

That's an interesting opinion. I hope you're not referring to me!

I'm a big Hawks fan, but I am totally neutral on the Kane case, because I, like you, don't know the facts and am not playing backseat lawyers. He fucking deserves some people defending him and his right to be innocent until proven guilty.

If it comes out that he is guilty, then he's officially a scumbag and can rot in jail. That is when I'll do my 180.

All I've seen from you in this thread is rushing to defend him so yes, you are one of them. He doesn't need to be defended because he already has plenty of Chicago fans rushing to do it.

Neither are the people that are convinced he's guilty already. It goes both ways.



Also, police statement about the evidence:

I think It's a lot better to be supportive of the victim than him. They're the ones getting harassed and treated like shit by Chicago fans.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

The Hamburg Police Department has documentation that unequivocally demonstrates that its handling of the evidence and the integrity of its chain of custody of evidence in this case is unassailable.

So they're saying the evidence was given to someone else under the rules of chain of custody and then it disappeared?

Or was it their custody when it disappeared and they're full of shit?

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

The DRose situation is vastly difference to this.

But like someone said. With Kane there were reports that the DNA in the rape kit didn't link him to anything. So this whole thing is bizarre

But doesn't that just mean his semen wasn't inside her???

I know there is likely more to a rapekit than that but it doesn't seem to THE huge smoking gun.

I would think other stuff like defensive wounds would be more important to proving an assault took place.

Yeah, the D-Rose situation won't have any physical evidence at all in all likelihood.

 

[Troy]

No it isn't. Playing neutral is withholding judgement from being guilty or innocent.

All I've seen from you in this thread is rushing to defend him so yes, you are one of them. He doesn't need to be defended because he already has plenty of Chicago fans rushing to do it.



I think It's a lot better to be supportive of the victim than him. They're the ones getting harassed and treated like shit by Chicago fans.

Someone doesn't deserve fewer rights just because someone else is being harassed. And according to you, all juries are biased since they're told to assume the person on trial is innocent until proven guilty.

 

[Boke1879]

No it isn't. Playing neutral is withholding judgement from being guilty or innocent.

All I've seen from you in this thread is rushing to defend him so yes, you are one of them. He doesn't need to be defended because he already has plenty of Chicago fans rushing to do it.



I think It's a lot better to be supportive of the victim than him. They're the ones getting harassed and treated like shit by Chicago fans.

To be fair this isn't a game. I have no stake in this but it would be wrong to defend Kane just because he's sports figure just like I think it's wrong to support the victim just because.

I can't take a stance one way or the other because as of right now I can't make the judgement

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

To be fair this isn't a game. I have no stake in this but it would be wrong to defend Kane just because he's sports figure just like I think it's wrong to support the victim just because.

I can't take a stance one way or the other because as of right now I can't make the judgement

What will always bother me is if he's not taken to trial AND we don't hear any definitive specifics.

 

[23qwerty]

I think it's wrong to support the victim just because.

Hm?

 

[boiled goose]

Considering the law is "innocent until proven guilty" -- yes.

Just to clarify, the legal system rules guilty or not guilty. Innocence is not determined.

If someone is not proven guilty it doesn't mean innocent.

 

[Marvie_3]

News 4, WIVB-TV ✔@news4buffalo
#BreakingNews: Erie Co. Commissioner of Central Police Services says all evidence in #Kane case is accounted for in its original packaging

.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

Just to clarify, the legal system rules guilty or not guilty. Innocence is not determined.

If someone is not proven guilty it doesn't mean innocent.

Yes it does.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

.

The plot thickens.

I have come to the conclusion that we'll never know the truth.

At least no one on the awful Bears has been accused of any despicable crime.

 

[HariKari]

Yes it does.

Literally does not.