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Person of Interest – Season 4 |OT| Gods Will Be Watching – Tuesdays 10/9c

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L

LaunchpadMcQ

Banned
Funky Papa said:
I can't believe we are complaining about the final season.

POI has got a huge mileage and dropped some of the best season finales in recent history. To be able to wrap up the entire show in one neat season with no time for filler is a blessing.

We should be happy it never overstayed its welcome. So many shows would love to reach 30 episodes before going down the shitter, let alone getting over 100. Count your blessings, POI-GAF.
Click to expand...

As a person who appreciates the opinions of both camps, I think just the fact that we're getting another season is amazing and should not be taken for granted. However, while I don't think there's a clear-cut solution, I think there's some value in discussing the two approaches they can take.

piratepwnsninja said:
But of those 150+ episodes, how much of the actual story was going to be told in 4 minute chunks within "Number of the week" episodes that make up a majority of what the show was? I'm sure there is fat to trim, and while we might not get the entirety of the seven season story they had planned, we can at least get an ending that makes sense in the context of the show as it currently exists.

Note, also, I said 13 episodes is enough to give the show a good ending. Nowhere did I mention them telling the entirety of the story they originally had planned.
Click to expand...

The answer is always going to be more than 13 episodes worth.

Also, many people seem to ignore that even though many of these episodes only contributed a small chunk of actual plot development, the amount of character development present in these episodes often turns out to be much more substantial. PoI has always been as character-driven as it has been plot-driven. Much of this "filler" that people keep bringing up was spent tying events back to the main characters or giving them a sizable amount of hands-on development. Ending at 13 episodes not only confines the plot, it confines the characters' ultimate development points. There are parts of these characters that just haven't been explored yet.

I know you didn't mention it; that's why I brought it up. Good ending doesn't necessarily mean the ending they originally intended, and that's what concerns me the most. I'll always defer to whatever the original plan is as being the best, if only because it is an uncompromised vision as opposed to an actually perfect piece of television.
 
F

Funky Papa

FUNK-Y-PPA-4
POI is quite probably the most granular show on TV and it has the added benefit of being headed by actually intelligent humans. It should be really easy to put the final season together without doing away with anything really important.

We may lose some lore, but I'm sure it won't be terrible.
 
H

Hardline_Pro

Banned
How the heck are they gonna wrap the series up in 13 episodes?

We still have several open plots:
-Rebuilding the machine
-Finishing the war with Samaritan
-Elias (he's obviously still alive)
-Shaw (obviously she is coming back and the writers say they already have this whole arc laid out for her)
-John and Iris
-And the endgame...there has to be an endgame to this show which reveals the fate of the machine and our Fantastic Four/Five, and we don't even know what it is yet
 
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
That feels easily solveable in 13 episodes. If they go full serialized mode.

I find it more worrisome of how they'll integrate (if at all) the content of the other 2 seasons they had planned.
 
D

danielcw

Member
What would you think about a "bad" ending, like Samaritan wins, all heroes die, and the world is kinda okay with that?

EDIT: and the last thing we hear is a version of the opening, that tells us how Samaritan handles things from now on...
 
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
The world would never know. And if it's done well, I can take it.
 
A

Apoc29

Member
Hardline_Pro said:
How the heck are they gonna wrap the series up in 13 episodes?

We still have several open plots:
-Rebuilding the machine
-Finishing the war with Samaritan
-Elias (he's obviously still alive)
-Shaw (obviously she is coming back and the writers say they already have this whole arc laid out for her)
-John and Iris
-And the endgame...there has to be an endgame to this show which reveals the fate of the machine and our Fantastic Four/Five, and we don't even know what it is yet
Click to expand...

One thing for sure has to happen: Iris dies and John storms the White House while listening to sick beats.
 
Futurematic

Futurematic

Member
Hardline_Pro said:
How the heck are they gonna wrap the series up in 13 episodes?

We still have several open plots:
-Rebuilding the machine
-Finishing the war with Samaritan
-Elias (he's obviously still alive)
-Shaw (obviously she is coming back and the writers say they already have this whole arc laid out for her)
-John and Iris
-And the endgame...there has to be an endgame to this show which reveals the fate of the machine and our Fantastic Four/Five, and we don't even know what it is yet
Click to expand...
  • First 2-3 episodes.
  • Whole season, obviously, but if the show isn't serialized hard then 3-part ending.
  • Only 13 episodes, he can be cut if needed.
  • If the writers have an arc for her, 2-3 episodes in the middle.
  • A kiss, wake up in bed post-sexytimes (she is his romantic part of his acceptance/happiness, though so boring)
  • Finch and Reese die to save the world after they've finally resolved/accepted their issues, flashing back to their season 1 conversation. I'd be cool with Samaritan winning though, or some kind of Samaritan/Machine combo that cares about humans but still kills most of the bad guys.
Now that I think about it 3 3-part arcs (Machine back, Shaw, end) + 4 standalone episodes: (some/all of: British Spy, alt-Facebook billionaire guy, Leon, other cool minor characters) sounds about right.

Other unresolved points:
  • Root's hacker trio from the end of season 3, what are they doing?
  • Subway. You can't have a subway train and not use it. I would love it if they tied it into New York's (sadly gone in real life) pneumatic subway line.
  • Control isn't dead, she'll play a part.
  • Various minor characters (mentioned above) that would be awesome to see come back.
  • Bear needs another awesome moment or twenty
 
B

Bluth54

Member
danielcw said:
What would you think about a "bad" ending, like Samaritan wins, all heroes die, and the world is kinda okay with that?

EDIT: and the last thing we hear is a version of the opening, that tells us how Samaritan handles things from now on...
Click to expand...

I wouldn't mind seeing a "bad" ending like that. The heroes can't always win.
 
F

firehawk12

Subete no aware
If we're going crazy endings, you might as well end with world armageddon with all electronics being fried and humanity being reset in order to escape the machine.
 
P

Patryn

Member
Hardline_Pro said:
How the heck are they gonna wrap the series up in 13 episodes?

We still have several open plots:
-Rebuilding the machine
-Finishing the war with Samaritan
-Elias (he's obviously still alive)
-Shaw (obviously she is coming back and the writers say they already have this whole arc laid out for her)
-John and Iris
-And the endgame...there has to be an endgame to this show which reveals the fate of the machine and our Fantastic Four/Five, and we don't even know what it is yet
Click to expand...

- Definitely can fit in the 13
- Definitely can fit in the 13
- He's dead, move on
- She's busy, we don't get to see that arc
- Definitely can fit in the 13
- Definitely can fit in the 13

I fail to see the problem. The only real bummer is the Shaw thing, but I can maybe see getting her back for 1--2 episodes, but I can also see that as a potential hanging thread that doesn't get resolved.

Also, it looks like PoI is going to be on at mid-season (think early 2016), so we have a long wait ahead of us before Season 5.
 
F

Frog-fu

Banned
I watched the season finale last night. It was fantastic all round. I had thought season 5 was confirmed a while ago, but I'm okay with the 13 episode order. The series has reached its final stage and everything it's been working towards steadily is about to pay off. I'll be sad to see it go, but I'll be happy it lasted 5 wonderful seasons. I don't need or want any spinoffs. Instead, gimme a new show by the same creatives if possible.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
13 episodes?

Mid season?

Gotta wait until january after that ending?

Fuck.

*flips tables*

Where am I suppose to get my Amy Acker fix in the fall?
 
L

Lonestar

I joined for Erin Brockovich discussion
Ratings tanked in the last 2-3 episodes. Still lead its timeslot for most of the year, but oh well. Not like having your lead in be a 1.6-1.9 NCIS show to give yourself hope of survival.
 
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, it was kind of dumb that they thought of only giving the show one last chance considering it was on the last episodes and with better scheduling it would've been better.
 
F

Frog-fu

Banned
I blame the disappointing ratings at least due in part to PoI's terrible scheduling. Far too many breaks this seasons and last. I wonder how well it performed on DVR though.
 
Futurematic

Futurematic

Member
Season 3.

The timeshift move to 10pm on a different day cost 1-2 million viewers on average for the first half, the back half of season 3 was the ratings collapse post-Carter's death and fallout. Season 3 episode 15 set a new low at 11 million people, episode 16 also set a new low at 10.64 million, followed by another new low with episode 22 10.5 million. Heck the show hadn't previously dipped below 12 million viewers since the first half of season 1!

Season 4 managed a handful of episodes above 10 million (1, 2, 11 (If-Then-Else :) ), 12).

So the timeshift move cost them, but they then held steady until a couple episodes after Carter died which is when ratings headed downwards. If the show was getting season 1 or 3 average viewership (14.34 or 14.05 million) or especially season 2 (16.07 million) it'd be fine. Half the people that watched in season 2 are gone.

Frankly I'm shocked that killing Carter--or the change in team dynamics, or losing HR, or whatever--alienated that many people since I feel the back half of season 3 was amazing.

(Edit: I used total viewer numbers because that was easier, and frankly it was a more stark illustration of how the audience vanished)
 
P

Patryn

Member
Juan29.zapata said:
Yeah, it was kind of dumb that they thought of only giving the show one last chance considering it was on the last episodes and with better scheduling it would've been better.
Click to expand...

It's a show in its fifth season. Barring some crazy exception like NCIS, shows don't grow in their fifth season. In fact, PoI was losing viewers rather than gaining.

I'm a PoI fan, but from the data, CBS would have been totally justified cancelling it.

We were given a gift of 13 final episodes. Be happy with that.
 
F

faridmon

Member
13-epsode finale is a bad news imo.
You can't conclude a series that was planned for at least 2 full seasons with just mere 13-episodes. People who say that, they might cut out fillers, I say there aren't any fillers. Every episode, gave little insight on the world, advanced the story a little or introduced a new avenue. Every episode was emotional and we won't get that in 13-episodes. What we will get is Samarian Vs Machine storyline paced like it was on steroid!

No thanks


.... But at lest its coming back!

Patryn said:
Because its ratings tanked, and 13 episodes was frankly a gift from CBS.
Click to expand...

How is it a gift when they were its downfall?
 
P

Patryn

Member
faridmon said:
How is it a gift when they were its downfall?
Click to expand...

Because the alternative was just straight cancelling it.

Again, CBS would have been totally justified pulling the plug on PoI. It makes nothing from syndication (it doesn't own the show), and the numbers on it aren't great.

Instead, they gave them an abbreviated season to conclude things.

They did the same thing for the Mentalist.

It's a gift.
 
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
Patryn said:
It's a show in its fifth season. Barring some crazy exception like NCIS, shows don't grow in their fifth season. In fact, PoI was losing viewers rather than gaining.

I'm a PoI fan, but from the data, CBS would have been totally justified cancelling it.

We were given a gift of 13 final episodes. Be happy with that.
Click to expand...

I'm happy with that, I've said it already dammit.
 
N

Nobility

Banned
No official word on Blu-ray/DVD news just yet, based on past years, we should get it in a few weeks.

But Amazon and bluray.com is showing the cover, I like it based on what occurred this season. I wouldn't expect this to be the final cover since it shows only Bluray (unless they are getting rid of the combo option). Also, there should be Ultraviolet copies and that quote at the bottom of the cover.

124264_front.jpg
Click to expand...
 
F

funkystudent

Member
Finished S4 the other day.

Felt the finale wasn't as strong as past ones which have always been incredibly strong but its a interesting set up for the future.


But in the grand scheme of things I still think if S5 is the end, and they go in with that in mind I would be ok with it. Other then Shaw story probably getting nerfed I think they could tie everything else up well enough.

And Shaw was probably just going to return as some kind of brain washed Samaritan commando anyway and that just sounds dumb.


Gonna miss that one Samaritan lady who got her neck snapped by Root super anti climatically. A entire season with her and she is just randomly killed off. Sure! Thats the kind of left turn this show does I guess
 
T

Tugatrix

Member
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
LaunchpadMcQ said:
This sounded weird to me, but I checked my BDs and apparently you're right, they've done it on the other releases. Pretty lame, but I never really noticed it before.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry I ruined it for you.
 
F

foxtrot3d

Banned
The Dutch Slayer said:
OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG PoI FANS EVERYWHERE ! :D

USA network has a new show coming up called MR Robot.

Its about a hacker (Neo / matrix bla bla bla)
But seriously just watched the pilot man THIS SHOW GUYS THIS SHOW :D
(Sure its not PoI good but still).

Watch the pilot here (to all international viewers use vpn for USA website or you other favorite internet source).

http://www.usanetwork.com/mrrobot/videos/eps10hellofriendmov
Click to expand...

Well despite the fact that you were yelling at everyone I decided to check the pilot out and was pleasantly surprised. That's a pretty damn good pilot, also I don't know why you say its not "POI good" the pilot was damn good although the two shows are completely different. I'm interested to see where this series goes and whether the quality will keep up but my interest is definitely piqued. That said, I do find the parallels to "Dexter" a bit too much.
 
T

The Dutch Slayer

Member
foxtrot3d said:
Well despite the fact that you were yelling at everyone I decided to check the pilot out and was pleasantly surprised. That's a pretty damn good pilot, also I don't know why you say its not "POI good" the pilot was damn good although the two shows are completely different. I'm interested to see where this series goes and whether the quality will keep up but my interest is definitely piqued. That said, I do find the parallels to "Dexter" a bit too much.
Click to expand...
Sorry about that just a little exited :$ all for the poi gaf <3
 
D

Deleted member 80556

Unconfirmed Member
Awesome to know that they've started already, and considering that S5 will air much later than we thought, it gives them way more time to finish this up very well.
 
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