Support NeoGAF

[Guess Who]

Post 5th dungeon spoilers

Spoiler

WOooooooow

Wow

WOooooooooooowwwwww

So the story's finally taken its first major swerve, and it's totally got me hooked. Shit is absolutely getting real, and I love, love, lovw how the Phantom Thieves have suffered their first major defeat. The death of Haru's dad contributed to this amazing atmosphere of despair and confusion. It's funny, they became Phantom Thieves to liberate themselves and others, but they're trapped more than ever and it's a palpable feeling. The best part is that you totally get the sense that something's off during that arc too. Haru's dad is just so convenient as an antagonist. A paper dragon to make the Phantom Thieves look even cooler. The rising popularity of the Phantom Thieves gave me this Hercules type feel (I wish we could buy Phantom Thief merch) and it's great how it panned out.

I've seen comments how it's the worst arc/dungeon, but I don't really agree. September/October is the set up to biggest arc yet. There's so much to think about, though one thing's been made clear;

Trust nobody.

PS: I'm damn excited for the next "target". I didn't like Kaneshiro as Makoto's obstacle at all, but i'm glad she's finally getting a personal enemy.

Re: dungeon 5, I think

Spoiler

the payoff to dungeon 5 is great. But people mostly don't like how long the dungeon is, how tough some of the enemies can be, and how uninteresting some of the story leading up to the dungeon is (like the Ryuji/Morgana spat). The next dungeon is arguably the best in the game, though.

I don't hate him. I even like his costume and all-out-attack animation and pose. Those really show his characteristics.

Spoiler

I was actually hoping that he somehow survived that and finally join the party for real sometime later. But sadly that never happens. His affinity and spells are also super useful, overpowered even.

Eh, I kinda knew (major post 11/20 spoilers)

Spoiler

once Akechi tried to murder the protag and was revealed to be behind the breakdowns, there was no way he could rejoin the Phantom Thieves. He was too far gone. He got about as happy and positive an ending as he could've hoped for considering the shit he did.

 

[texhnolyze]

Final Dungeon Question:

Spoiler

After Shibuya gets transformed, is there any way to go to the shops?

I don't think so.

Spoiler

I spent most of the money I had fusing persona and converting them to equipment at that point.

Eh, I kinda knew (major post 11/20 spoilers)

Spoiler

once Akechi tried to murder the protag and was revealed to be behind the breakdowns, there was no way he could rejoin the Phantom Thieves. He was too far gone. He got about as happy and positive an ending as he could've hoped for considering the shit he did.

But

Spoiler

even the Phantom Thieves have forgiven him and offered him to join the group in the Arc. Yes he's done all those unforgivable deeds, but he can redeem himself up by joining the Phantom Thieves and set things right by his own hands.

 

[ramyeon]

Spoiler

Goro

being a party member eventually is about as much of a spoiler as Naoto being one in P4, seriously.

I even feel bad spoiler tagging that since it's ridiculous.

 

[texhnolyze]

Spoiler

Goro

being a party member eventually is about as much of a spoiler as Naoto being one in P4, seriously.

I even feel bad spoiler tagging that since it's ridiculous.

Spoiler

Yes, it's obvious. While the whole pancake thing is kinda tricky, but I think most people would've realized it by then that he's suspicious and even the actual bad guy we've been looking for. That was a huge mistake from him which spoiled the rest of the story from that point. There's also the first animation scene where the police stated that there's a traitor among the Phantom Thieves. I think this whole 'hidden hints' stuff in Persona 5 is kinda silly.

 

[Inquisitive_Ghost]

I think Goro ended up being my favorite character in the game.

Spoiler

Most people seem to hate him, but I found him really relatable in a very dark, very human way. His attention seeking behavior and strong desire to be accepted even if he thinks people are garbage is deporable, but as someone who lost 100+ lbs. between high school and college and was suddenly treated like a completely different person, I could sort of tangentially see where he was coming from. He was shunned and accepted and then shunned again at the drop of a hat, and hated people for their shallowness. Then he met someone who was happy with being rejected, and didn't lash out or even feel a need to lash out at being an outcast. His line about the protagonist being happy living in an attic, and how that so deeply pissed him off, was really powerful. It was like the MC completely removed his justification for being the way he was and shattered his worldview entirely. Seeing the Thieves and how close they were with each other and how content they were with their lives, which were more mundane and even terrible compared to his star detective persona, made him realize how empty his revenge quest had been, but he couldn't bring himself to accept that and change. It made it hit even closer to home that the same person that ruined his life is the one who ruined the protagonist's.

His struggle after his defeat is amazing. You can feel him wanting to be a part of the Thieves, but he's just too stubborn and wrapped up in his hate to admit it to them, or to himself. And then before he has a chance to act, he dies. He's a very organically written tragic character, even if his choices make him deserving of his fate in the end. I genuinely felt bad for him, and empathized with him, but I still wanted to see him brought to justice.

I'm quoting this because it is a good post.

I just wish

Spoiler

there was more buildup. The pacing of that part is wacky and his turn almost feels unearned, it's so fast.

 

[Ourobolus]

I don't think so.

Spoiler

I spent most of the money I had fusing persona and converting them to equipment at that point.

Ah, ok. Thanks. I don't think I need it, just figured I'd check.

 

[IrishNinja]

okay, so

i took down Madarame (we've got like 10 days left i wanna say) & met up with the phan-club guy (had the awesome maid encounter) and he put us onto a bully who's blackmailing people or something (it's the 3rd mementos quest) but floor 8 or so is still sealed off for now, and i'm not finding dude on any other floors. am i too early on this one or what am i missing?

 

[Jintor]

It's a combination of various systemic factors which pressure prosecutors to only pursue cases they can win and the fact that most criminal investigations in Japan are based around obtaining a confession.

It's actually pretty interesting from a comparative criminal justice perspective.

Wanna talk shop? Lol

 

[TP]

The constant pausing to point out the obvious in palaces is really starting to bug me

 

[cheesekao]

okay, so

i took down Madarame (we've got like 10 days left i wanna say) & met up with the phan-club guy (had the awesome maid encounter) and he put us onto a bully who's blackmailing people or something (it's the 3rd mementos quest) but floor 8 or so is still sealed off for now, and i'm not finding dude on any other floors. am i too early on this one or what am i missing?

IIRC, you have to find the bully first. I think he's outside of the school.

 

[Jintor]

Speaking of slogs (endgame spoilers)

Spoiler

I really want to see the reaction of people reaching endgame without touching mementos at all.

Since a lot of the slinks are gated by mementos I assume it's not going to happen too much

 

[Nioret]

The constant pausing to point out the obvious in palaces is really starting to bug me

It's clear to me they anticipated this being the first Persona game for alot of newcomers, and as far as my circle of friends goes, that seems to be the case. So I don't mind the handholding.

 

[Zalman]

I was disappointed when I first heard Igor's new voice, but it's been growing on me. Maybe that's a part of the rehabilitation.

 

[Antiwhippy]

Since a lot of the slinks are gated by mementos I assume it's not going to happen too much

They could also not care about confidants.

Which would make the final parts kinda sad actually lmao.

 

[Wolf Akela]

What's the effect of Torrential Rain vs Rainy Season?

 

[TP]

It's clear to me they anticipated this being the first Persona game for alot of newcomers, and as far as my circle of friends goes, that seems to be the case. So I don't mind the handholding.

The handholding where i'm at right now is at a level where they don't think I can read

 

[Laughing Banana]

I don't hate Goro, I just hate

Spoiler

how atlus once against used "LOOK HOW PSYCHOTIC I AM" as a crutch to give the villian a twist.

It's perfectly possible for him to retain the personality he had before even with the twist. Better even. His cheerful, analytical personality would make a much more effective villain.

They have already done that in Persona 4.

 

[Rien]

Damn the thread is going fast..

Well i finished the second Dungeon and the theme/story behind it was just as good as the first one.. does it keep up like that??

 

[Opa-Pa]

Goddamn, uncle Sojiro's rank 7 event almost had me in tears...

Damn the thread is going fast..

Well i finished the second Dungeon and the theme/story behind it was just as good as the first one.. does it keep up like that??

Expect the third to be a step down, but the fourth is just as good as the first two, if not better.

 

[Antiwhippy]

They have already done that in Persona 4.

Eeeh, it was still a change in personality in 4.

Spoiler

Also I wouldn't call adachi analytical.

Basically I feel like they're reusing "LOOK HOW PSYCHOTIC I AM" too much.

 

[PK Gaming]

Re: dungeon 5, I think

Spoiler

the payoff to dungeon 5 is great. But people mostly don't like how long the dungeon is, how tough some of the enemies can be, and how uninteresting some of the story leading up to the dungeon is (like the Ryuji/Morgana spat). The next dungeon is arguably the best in the game, though.

Spoiler

The dungeon is definitely tedious (the fact that the game lies to you based on its "length" doesn't help), but it was more entertaining than say, arc 3 for me. Like the Ryuji/Morgana thing led to Haru's introduction, which was legitimately fantastic and the following scenes where they're messing around in Mementos were arguably too short lived.

Come to think of it, it almost feels like Haru was created for the express purpose of making this arc way more enjoyable. Without it, we care even less about Okumura's death, his confrontation is less interesting, and we're left long dungeon lacking in new characters.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

Damn the thread is going fast..

Well i finished the second Dungeon and the theme/story behind it was just as good as the first one.. does it keep up like that??

Dungeons keep up but space them out a little bit. Don't finish them as soon as they are available cause otherwise you'll be left with big gaps of times without any big story moments and that can really hurt the pacing of story. I finished the 4th dungeon within the first two days and then spent like a whole month (maybe even more) without any major story moment and now I don't really care about the plot and characters anymore.

 

[Espada]

I just finished the 6th palace and got massive story dump on me.

Spoiler

Wow, I'm glad it wasn't just me who thought Goro was sketchy as fuck. I was surprised by how far back the revelation was, but also that the party themselves knew throughout the game. Honestly, the guy is a scumbag and I wouldn't be surprised (or upset) if he gets killed off. That many murders, the conniving and scheming, and the fucked up reason he gave when asked in the Palace? Damn.

Anyways, 6th Palace is probably my favorite palace so far. Great music and theme, shadows were manageable, and the boss was great too. A giant, monstrous woman armed to the teeth whose only interest is winning at all costs. Sae had been successfully built up as a stressed out, overbearing, overachieving career woman with the interrogation scenes, the nasty comments to Makoto, etc... It was the first time since the first two dungeons that they felt they really nailed the palace ruler.

But the big thing was what went down after. I'm glad to see how they got the protag out of that interrogation room. That was phenomenal, and the plan to fuck over Akechi and Shido sounds absolutely brutal.

My opinion of the game took a serious tumble from the span of the Hawaii trip to the end of the

Spoiler

5th palace

. It was when that went down that the game piqued my interest again.

Fake Edit: PK Gaming, that was my impression of that part of the game as well.

 

[Laughing Banana]

Eeeh, it was still a change in personality in 4.

Spoiler

Also I wouldn't call adachi analytical.

Basically I feel like they're reusing "LOOK HOW PSYCHOTIC I AM" too much.

Hehe, well the P4

Spoiler

was doing what he was doing simply because he's bored, which I thought to be quite refreshing, as far as villain's motivation goes

.

Anyways, speaking

Spoiler

of villains, it's pretty telling that every single one costume for Akechi in

every DLC sets are those

Spoiler

worn by the villains of respective games, lol

.

 

[Opa-Pa]

Personally, my issue with palace 5 wasn't that it was too long, but that the majority of it relied on gimmicks and puzzle. I often found myself exhausted while exploring it, but only when I went back to money grind I realized that pretty much the entire second half has no normal rooms, everything is puzzles and gimmicks (making grinding quite tedious too!). So at times I actually wanted the dungeon to keep going but I was just tired of the puzzles, it needed more linearity.

Also unrelated but I feel kinda bad that I feel like Haru doesn't add anything to the game. She isn't even annoying, she's just... Whatever? With everyone else I've felt the game improved after they joined me, but Haru was lame. I can't even care enough to start her social link lol... Also her persona's design sucks.

 

[TetraGenesis]

Alright, so I had to name my group and had no idea what to put there. So we're Nudist Beach now.

Another reminder of how much better the anime cutscenes in this game would be if they were done by Trigger...

 

[Antiwhippy]

Aww, I like Haru.

Her phantom thief self is actually super dorky with her pose.

 

[Opa-Pa]

Aww, I like Haru.

Her phantom thief self is actually super dorky with her pose.

I forgot to say I like her thief self! I like that she wants to be a super hero haha.

She's nice and kinda adorable at times too, but I dunno, she's just doesn't stand out much compared to the rest as far as personality goes, I guess. Kind of like Fuuka in P3? She's another character I technically like but doesn't stand out much.

Her introduction felt kinda rushed too, almost like she was an afterthought. So much wasted potential...

 

[Dragner]

Grab the game again after vacation and deep into 6th dungeon. I dont find it as amazing as gaf said me(Im at 3rd part) and I didnt find the 5th as bad I assumed it was after reading about people hating it.

 

[Antiwhippy]

My only regret is that her confidant needs max proficiency and fuck I did not prioritise proficiency at all.

Same reason why I never got Max yusuke.

To NG+ I go!

 

[darkwing-buck]

 

[PK Gaming]

I forgot to say I like her thief self! I like that she wants to be a super hero haha.

She's nice and kinda adorable at times too, but I dunno, she's just doesn't stand out much compared to the rest as far as personality goes, I guess. Kind of like Fuuka in P3? She's another character I technically like but doesn't stand out much.

Her introduction felt kinda rushed too, almost like she was an afterthought. So much wasted potential...

I felt the same way initially, but she offers this great contrast to the rest of the thieves. They all have varying degrees of jerkassery, but Haru is the only members who's just overwhelmingly kind.

 

[Antiwhippy]

Yusuke is a pure boy.

There's no jerkass in him.

 

[Frimaire]

I felt the same way initially, but she offers this great contrast to the rest of the thieves. They all have varying degrees of jerkassery, but Haru is the only members who's just overwhelmingly kind.

But Jerkasses are the most fun...

 

[PK Gaming]

Yusuke is a pure boy.

There's no jerkass in him.

He's simultaneously the most pure existence in the Persona franchise, but also someone who can dish out some savage burns as well.

 

[Opa-Pa]

Yusuke is so pure, his purity goes reverse and he becomes savage without realizing. He's a treasure.

 

[itchyass86]

Bona fide! Mona fide!

 

[Laughing Banana]

I forgot to say I like her thief self! I like that she wants to be a super hero haha.

She's nice and kinda adorable at times too, but I dunno, she's just doesn't stand out much compared to the rest as far as personality goes, I guess. Kind of like Fuuka in P3? She's another character I technically like but doesn't stand out much.

Her introduction felt kinda rushed too, almost like she was an afterthought. So much wasted potential...

I felt that way for Ann. I mean as soon as the situation with Kamoshida is resolved, in terms of plot she's in the party pretty much only for "WHAT?" reactions, which is unfortunate. I felt the same way about Ryuji.

At least in terms of plot Haru has a much bigger relevance and "reason" for being in the main party, even if she's introduced late.

 

[Toki767]

11/21:

Spoiler

These drawings explaining their plan are incredible. Would've been amazing if they had Yusuke draw these things up on the spot.

 

[Dragner]

Late october eatly november is being a good month for

Spoiler

Ryuji, he stopped being a jackass after Harus father death and is less obnoxious now

 

[Chaos17]

I'm quoting this because it is a good post.

I just wish

Spoiler

there was more buildup. The pacing of that part is wacky and his turn almost feels unearned, it's so fast.

Agree, pacing and story telling are my big grip in this game (+handholding). They kinda ruined the game for me. Otherwise I liked the other parts of the game.

 

[LotusHD]

Lol it was partly my fault for not paying much attention, but damn, I managed to get lost af in Palace 6

Spoiler

trying to find the stupid panels for the terminal so I could cheat the system.

 

[graywolf323]

I agree with this. I played P3 and P4 years ago with Neogaf's advice "don't worry about it and have fun!" Only to of course end up with all of my slink's at level 8 in both games. So now I'm playing P5 with a spoiler free guide because there's too many games in life for me to ever replay a 100 hour RPG.

I think the way the time management is set up is unnecessarily obtuse. I'd be fine if it were a matter of "plan ahead to succeed", but there's absolutely no way of knowing when the game will allow certain actions or interrupt your planned activities. So no amount of planning will ever succeed, and don't believe any different. I'd much rather I didn't need a guide if the requirements were much more lenient and room for error huge. As it is I really can't figure out what it adds to the game.

I'm doing the same thing, I could see myself replaying it down the road but not anytime soon most likely

Honestly there's a chance I might never replay it unless it gets a portable release (Vita or Switch?)

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

How do you build your teammates? They get a a lot of good spells later on that I find 8 slots not enough for each of them.

I Guess Ryuji and Yusuke are tank and rogue, while Ann and Morgana are like Mage and healer type roles or something?

 

[Chaos17]

I agree with this. I played P3 and P4 years ago with Neogaf's advice "don't worry about it and have fun!" Only to of course end up with all of my slink's at level 8 in both games. So now I'm playing P5 with a spoiler free guide because there's too many games in life for me to ever replay a 100 hour RPG.

I think the way the time management is set up is unnecessarily obtuse. I'd be fine if it were a matter of "plan ahead to succeed", but there's absolutely no way of knowing when the game will allow certain actions or interrupt your planned activities. So no amount of planning will ever succeed, and don't believe any different. I'd much rather I didn't need a guide if the requirements were much more lenient and room for error huge. As it is I really can't figure out what it adds to the game.

I would do the same if I ever buy again a Persona. I didn't felt it was necessary before because it wasn't that restrictive, imo. But now ? When the story eat so much of your time even when you're supposed to have free time and also before confidants didn't have perks to make your life easier (looking at temperance).

 

[SuperSaiyanAkuma]

This is my first Persona game, if I loved persona 5, will that guarantee boners for the rest of the series?

Should I go back and play them?

 

[mrmickfran]

Public execution is soooo broken omg

 

[Chaos17]

This is my first Persona game, if I loved persona 5, will that guarantee boners for the rest of the series?

Should I go back and play them?

Yes, totaly, each have their own lore and vibes. So if you like the formula you can dive in the previous ones since the systems didn't change that much.

 

[Frimaire]

This is my first Persona game, if I loved persona 5, will that guarantee boners for the rest of the series?

Should I go back and play them?

The Persona series changed fairly drastically with 3 onward.
If the stuff you really like is the School Life/Confidant stuff, 1 and 2 don't really have it.
You may also miss some quality of life stuff that's present in 5, most notably the inability to directly control party members in 3 (fixed in portable version).
Otherwise, if you liked 5 you'll probably at least like 3 and 4.
I hear 1 and 2s are good, as well.

 

[Szadek]

This is my first Persona game, if I loved persona 5, will that guarantee boners for the rest of the series?

Should I go back and play them?

3 and 4 have the same formula as 5, but 1 and 2 play much more like other SMT games.