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Persona Community Thread |OT5| Pull up a chair! [NO PQ OR P4U SPOILERS!]

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C

CorvoSol

Member
P2I

D'aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaw. Eikichi stood up for Kozzy when the assholes from his school called her fatty and cut her face. That's ridiculously sweet. Probably the most endearing moment in the whole game so far. Definitely the first time I've really liked Eikichi.
 
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SpacePirate Ridley

Member
DryEyeRelief said:
On the subject of Chie and Yosuke, I never saw anything. They fight but it's Junpei Yukari-esque fighting.
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It's a typical trope, most clearly seen with Ron and Hermione.
Doesn't have to be consumed (as it happens with Chie and Yosuke), but the traits are there. You are right that theres no other love indication from them apart from that though.
 
C

CorvoSol

Member
SpacePirate Ridley said:
It's a typical trope, most clearly seen with Ron and Hermione.
Doesn't have to be consumed (as it happens with Chie and Yosuke), but the traits are there. You are right that theres no other love indication from them apart from that though.
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I dunno there sure is one hell of a tease for them in Arena.
 
P

PK Gaming

Member
DryEyeRelief said:
That's not true lampshading. Lampshading has to do with acknowledging story tropes/holes/conventions within said story. It's like Naoto acknowledging that her social link has nothing to do with current events, but they're going to solve riddles anyway because it pisses her off.
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I'll concede that it was a poor choice of words on my part; my other points still stand.

Secondly, you telling me she's defined by it is enough. She doesn't have to be this accessory...just the simple fact that her former career path is what specializes and individualizes her among everyone else. Rise isn't a real person, and thus isn't going to appeal to people the same way an actual celebrity would. But it's about what she represents within the story. On another note, it's funny I say this because I recall reading people liking Rise because Laura Bailey voices her. Heh.
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Right, but I don't see how any of that makes her a "shameless" character. She spends most of the game as a former idol, clearly conflicted over which path to take in life, and it's honestly pretty intriguing.

To compare another character, Yukiko was characterized initially the same way. She was this girl who was desired by every guy at school. But that was never talked about beyond the beginning of the story. It was just a springboard for Chie and Yukiko's later development. When I hear person first, disposition second. I think of something like that. Not Rise.
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Well I can't argue with your opinion, but I think it's funny that you bring up Yukiko when she spends most of her social link being a textbook nadeshiko (Hell, she professes her love before the romance flag) which is a lot more shameless than a "former" idol. I mean P4 does a good of subverting it with Yukiko, but they literally re-invoke it in her social link. Her romantic scenes were positively dripping it.

You make it sound like the letter was the impetus for her change when it wasn't.
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It was one of the key motivators for sure. She elaborates on this in her 11th slink rank.

There's also an NPC that asks you whether or not Naoto and Rise are dating. BFD. I think them being together is similar in the way Yosuke, Yukiko and Chie are with P4MC most of the time. They're in the same grade, and they are both involved with Personas, so they're going to interact more. Yukari and Junpei in P3 is another good example.

And as far as genuine friendship is concerned, most of what you describe is one sided. Maybe I'm biased because I favor Kanji but all I remember is his tepid response to Rise in the Beauty Pageant compared to his enthusiasm for the other 3 girls.

Again I'll emphasize that if Yosuke walked around saying "Moronji" then Acid08 would have another reason to hate him.
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I brought up that NPC to outline the reality of their relationship. It's an indisputable fact that they spend a significant amount of time together (in and out of school), and there's very little evidence to support that share an unhealthy relationship. And don't be ridiculous; there's a very clear difference between an affectionate nickname, and offensive putdowns.

They're not retreads. You didn't actually pay attention to all of them if you think that. Or maybe you just don't understand my criticism with Rise's. The social links are topical in regards to what happened in the dungeons but they aren't retreads, because they actively build off of the conclusions made prior. Rise's is the only exception.

Secondly, spending time with Rise with no real defined story. This isn't pandering?
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Yukiko realizes that her desire to leave Inaba is just a form of escapism, Kanji just wants to be accepted at , Naoto... eh i'll skip her, and Rise realizes that there are many aspects to herself and decides to embrace all of them. Retread was a strong word, but there's some definite overlap between the social links and the shadow confrontation. I agree that the social links are fairly topical, but I'm of the opinion that it applies to Rise as well.

Regarding your second point; No? Because that's precisely what you do with your other friends. There are plenty of s.links that incorporate moments were you just hang out and they benefit because of it. (Yosuke, Kou/Daisuke, Chie, etc)

You think a lack of involvement makes it a good social link? One of the reasons why Dojima's link was so good was because of your involvement. You were his moral compass, you called him out on shit that he didn't want to hear. Call it cliche but in a story where the theme is facing truth and your interactions with others, you being the catalyst to that change is crucial.
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Please don't put words in my mouth. You are involved with Rise, but you just aren't the reason she gets her life together. And that's fine, because it works within the context of her social link social link (all she needed was a little support). The protagonist taking on a more active presence in other social links (such as Dojima's, Daisuke and Yosuke) works just as well.

As far as Rise's link being wish fulfillment, it's not because of you being her prince charming, solving all her problems. It's like you're her diary for no reason. She has moments even before rank 9 where you're on the hill just listening to whatever her current declaration in life is. She's perfect. Your famous, idol girlfriend is so down-to-earth, smart and perfect. Most characters don't get to this point until the last scene.
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No reason..? You're her friend. That's precisely what friends do, they lean on each other. You make the conscious effort to hear them out when they're bothered by something because you're friend; you don't need a reason beyond that. As an aside, your repeated attempts of misattributing Rise's character by presenting facts that don't pertain to her character (glossing over how she's a former idol for the majority of P4 and claiming that she's perfect) comes across as incredibly disingenuous.

heh, I can't argue if someone says "People aren't machines" regarding written characterization flaws. But I'll say this much, I don't know why people hate the added band scene so much from Golden because that's actually where Rise's best characterization comes from. The way she accepts Yosuke's pleas despite it being something she would never want to do. Her confidence in herself and her friends putting up a great show. When everyone is nervous she gets the group together and imparts her own experiences in dealing with stage fright. It was better than anything in her BS social link.
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Considering how P4 characterization heavily leans towards realism, i'd say it's a perfectly valid argument. Your contention doesn't even make sense; you're assuming she's undercutting her previous decision to quit being an idol, but she gains new reasons for wanting to be an idol, and starts to appreciate her old reasons for wanting to be an idol as well. The main takeaway is that she's proud of the fact that she's an idol this time.

I'll agree with you on that last point; Rise's characterization in the band scene was pretty good. P4G Rise content is generally great.
 
C

CorvoSol

Member
I really enjoyed Rise being a down-to-earth celebrity because I had known people like that. What impressed me most about Persona 4 when I first played it was that the characters' problems and personalities reminded me a great deal of everyday people I had known in my life.
 
L

LelouchViBritannia

Member
CorvoSol said:
I really enjoyed Rise being a down-to-earth celebrity because I had known people like that. What impressed me most about Persona 4 when I first played it was that the characters' problems and personalities reminded me a great deal of everyday people I had known in my life.
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Yup, this is what made the cast of P4 so lovable. I'd be amazed if anyone could play P4 and not relate to one of the characters to some extent.

Great job on Atlus's part, as most games dont tackle the issues that are shown in Persona 4.
 
B

buddha0991

Member
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Mobile Suit Gooch

Mobile Suit Gooch

Grundle: The Awakening
Soooooo....uh I just discovered that the Japanese version of Persona 4 Golden, has a "channel?" were Marie interviews the Japanese actors of each character even her own. Anyway, it was pretty cool seeing that.
 
K

Kazzy

Member
buddha0991 said:
He wants to hire Kanji at Junes for his impressive ability to organize things, also the heart to heart the three guys have at the beach. Also his internal monologue in P4A shows he actually has a lot of respect for Kanji but would never tell it to his face for pride lel.
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To hopefully jump in on this discussion (and hopefully not miss something egregious by doing so), Yosuke's aloofness really does belie his true intentions.

And, well, that's kind of his point. Yosuke is a fairly accurate portrayal of the typical teenager, flattering or otherwise. He is uncomfortable around things he doesn't understand, and reacts accordingly. It just so happens that this is usually in the most ham-fisted way imaginable!

I can understand that some will forever find his character contemptible because of these aspects (particularly in regards to how he behaves towards Kanji), but I think that the game does a good job of portraying all of this without clumsily admonishing him. Instead, it's the characters around him that reform him, and there is a genuine sense that his continued interactions within the group begin to curb those more negative traits. His ignorance is ultimately born out of his own immaturity, and it's something that the game highlights as a hurdle towards people accepting him - both in his own S-link, as well as Yu's.

A lot of the game concerns itself with the theme of identity, and that is precisely what Yosuke is searching for. I think most could empathize with a similar lack of clarity at that age.
 
J

JoseOle5990

Member
I did not like Ai one bit in my first run of P4G. I did like three levels and maybe got reversed, I think? BAIL OUT.

However, in order to get the platinum trophy I had to max her S. Link. I actually ended up liking her a fair amount, more so than I thought I ever would. So yeah, don't judge a book by its cover? themoreyouknow.jpg
 
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