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Persona Community Thread |OT6| Where 6 Comes Before 5 (No PQ or P4U spoilers!)

L

Lunar15

Member
When you come to the realization that all stories are completely separate and isolated representations of themes and character progression, you begin to obsess less and less on the elements of plot across a series.

Consistency is always nice, but if each story manages to become self sustaining, canon matters little in terms of satisfaction.
 
MiguelMexMIstery

MiguelMexMIstery

Member
Ganzlinger said:
Actually, he doesn't ask Akihiko, only Makoto. Neither Junpei or Akihiko says which one they prefer.
Click to expand...
Hmm really? I suppose I heard from the manga or something about the female route from P3P, or maybe I'm just wrong.
PK Gaming said:
They have good chemistry with each other, but I never wanted their relationship to be anything but platonic.
Click to expand...
I get what're you saying. I mean, if they don't end up together or if they get to find someone else, I would be okay with it and not complain. But I would be happy if they ended up in a relationship,
 
L

LelouchViBritannia

Member
This canon debate is hilarious

3898460-8864152835-
 
D

Dantis

Member
FluxWaveZ said:
I see. So unless we have a video of the word coming from their mouth, they never said that any of the games were canon or implied it.

Got it.
Click to expand...

FluxWaveZ said:
- You claim that Atlus never stated that the games are canon as some kind of rebuttal to what I had said hours before.
- I prove that they did.
- You then change the premise of what you were stating as "fact" (which was false) and somehow place the blame on me.

Wow, dude.
Click to expand...

Wow, dude.


Seriously, you can't pick and choose what is and isn't 'factually canon' based on whether or not you like it. Wada said that it's a proper sequel (or something along those lines). It absolutely almost definitely is canon, but when you're arguing whether something is or isn't, it's an assumption unless you're told otherwise.
 
G

Ganzlinger

Member
MiguelMexMIstery said:
Hmm really? I suppose I heard from the manga or something about the female route from P3P, or maybe I'm just wrong.
Click to expand...

I checked P3 FES gameplay on youtube before quoting you, he doesn't ask Akihiko and he doesn't state which one he likes.

But it seems you're right about he asking Akihiko in FeMC route on P3P:

Junpei: Psst. Akihiko-senpai, Level with me... Which one is your type?
Akihiko: .....
Akihiko and Junpei are whispering to each other...
Junpei: Huh? Really!?
Akihiko: K-Keep your voice down!
Junpei: Maaan, really? No joke?
Then Yuka-tan interrupts..

I guess it is hinted that he is referring to FeMC.. since I think Junpei wouldn't be that surprised if he had said Mitsuru, but is just my guess.

Pepsiman said:
But is the lobby canon.
Click to expand...

What? A wild pepsiman appears!
 
N

NichM

Banned
Dantis said:
Let's say I finished Persona 3, and I decided that, in my head, Akihiko became a policeman and married Mitsuru, and they lived happily ever after. Arena then comes out after this and says that actually Mitsuru became all kinds of weird and Akihiko became a wandering wild man. I can pretend otherwise, but really, I'd know it isn't true. So the only solution is to not do it.
Click to expand...

This is not really what I'm talking about. I'm talking about respecting the choices that are offered within the game. Persona 3, as an example, is intentionally designed to offer you a choice of what to name the character, who that character hangs out with, what they decide to do on December 31st, and (in one version) what that character's sex is. Atlus has, whenever possible, made choices that honor the player's decisions. Mitsuru in P4A may dress and act in a way the player wouldn't have expected her to, but she doesn't ever refer to "that boy I used to date," because the creators are keeping the possibility open that the player never started her social link, let alone finished it.

Now, sometimes it's not possible to do that while still making games within the shared universe. After all, you can't have a Persona 4 at all without assuming that the player made one decision in P3 and not the other. And in the same way, when the protagonist of P3 makes appearances in noninteractive media like P3M, the producers have their own choices to make about all those things. (Much like Arc System Works can't really fit a name entry screen into a fighting game--but if they could, I expect that they would, just like Persona Q does.)

But I don't see the choices they made as invalidating mine. Just because I chose for the Gekkoukan student with the power of the Wild Card to be a young woman, and the movie and PQ elected to portray that student as a young man, means they're following a different branch of the story--but not the singular, absolutely canonical, and only relevant branch.
 
D

Dantis

Member
NichM said:
This is not really what I'm talking about. I'm talking about respecting the choices that are offered within the game. Persona 3, as an example, is intentionally designed to offer you a choice of what to name the character, who that character hangs out with, what they decide to do on December 31st, and (in one version) what that character's sex is. Atlus has, whenever possible, made choices that honor the player's decisions. Mitsuru in P4A may dress and act in a way the player wouldn't have expected her to, but she doesn't ever refer to "that boy I used to date," because the creators are keeping the possibility open that the player never started her social link, let alone finished it.

Now, sometimes it's not possible to do that while still making games within the shared universe. After all, you can't have a Persona 4 at all without assuming that the player made one decision in P3 and not the other. And in the same way, when the protagonist of P3 makes appearances in noninteractive media like P3M, the producers have their own choices to make about all those things. (Much like Arc System Works can't really fit a name entry screen into a fighting game--but if they could, I expect that they would, just like Persona Q does.)

But I don't see the choices they made as invalidating mine. Just because I chose for the Gekkoukan student with the power of the Wild Card to be a young woman, and the movie and PQ elected to portray that student as a young man, means they're following a different branch of the story--but not the singular, absolutely canonical, and only relevant branch.
Click to expand...

Okay, I actually agree with all of that, and it's something that I appreciated in Arena, and even things like the anime, to a point (in that the anime never says who the canonical love interest is, for example).
 
MiguelMexMIstery

MiguelMexMIstery

Member
Ganzlinger said:
I checked P3 FES gameplay on youtube before quoting you, he doesn't ask Akihiko and he doesn't state which one he likes.

But it seems you're right about he asking Akihiko in FeMC route on P3P:

Junpei: Psst. Akihiko-senpai, Level with me... Which one is your type?
Akihiko: .....
Akihiko and Junpei are whispering to each other...
Junpei: Huh? Really!?
Akihiko: K-Keep your voice down!
Junpei: Maaan, really? No joke?
Then Yuka-tan interrupts..

I guess it is hinted that he is referring to FeMC.. since I think Junpei wouldn't be that surprised if he had said Mitsuru, but is just my guess.
Click to expand...
Ohhh interesting. And yeah, Junpei being surprised does makes your guess likely, since he also wasn't surprised about P3MC liking Yukari.
 
Xenoflare

Xenoflare

Member
MiguelMexMIstery said:
Ohhh interesting. And yeah, Junpei being surprised does makes your guess likely, since he also wasn't surprised about P3MC liking Yukari.
Click to expand...

I always thought Yukari is the "default" girl for the P3MC, maybe it's because she's the first character to be introduced and the only female party member in the party.

Funny how I did't feel that for Chie, her dynamics with Yosuke makes me think that they should go as a pair.
 
N

NichM

Banned
Dantis said:
(in that the anime never says who the canonical love interest is, for example)
Click to expand...

I appreciate that you agree, but this is the mindset I'm trying to shake loose. The anime cannot say who the canonical love interest is, even if it decides to write Chie and Yukiko and Naoto out of the plot entirely and devote half its run time toward every stage of Rise's social link in detail. All it can be is the choice the producers of that adaptation made. You still get to choose differently, and it's no more or less canon than the director of the anime's choice.
 
G

Ganzlinger

Member
I totally agree with NichM, it's exactly what I expected from Atlus. I really doubt they would, for example, finish P3's or P4's story with a "canon" relationship. They need to respect the fanbase experience within the game. Makoto and Yu won't marry anyone unless the game makes every original Social Link a possible candidate, at least the party member ones.
 
C

CorvoSol

Member
pTqGtFi.png


Elly where do you keep getting these flowers you throw around every time you get all misty eyed about weird shit?

It's okay girl, you're still best.
 
D

Dantis

Member
NichM said:
I appreciate that you agree, but this is the mindset I'm trying to shake loose. The anime cannot say who the canonical love interest is, even if it decides to write Chie and Yukiko and Naoto out of the plot entirely and devote half its run time toward every stage of Rise's social link in detail. All it can be is the choice the producers of that adaptation made. You still get to choose differently, and it's no more or less canon than the director of the anime's choice.
Click to expand...

I think you just wrinkled my brain.

It's a nice way to see things, for sure.
 
S

Sophia

Member
NichM said:
Now, sometimes it's not possible to do that while still making games within the shared universe. After all, you can't have a Persona 4 at all without assuming that the player made one decision in P3 and not the other. And in the same way, when the protagonist of P3 makes appearances in noninteractive media like P3M, the producers have their own choices to make about all those things. (Much like Arc System Works can't really fit a name entry screen into a fighting game--but if they could, I expect that they would, just like Persona Q does.)
Click to expand...

They totally should have done that for Yu's story mode in Arena. >_>
 
MiguelMexMIstery

MiguelMexMIstery

Member
Xenoflare said:
I always thought Yukari is the "default" girl for the P3MC, maybe it's because she's the first character to be introduced and the only female party member in the party.

Funny how I did't feel that for Chie, her dynamics with Yosuke makes me think that they should go as a pair.
Click to expand...
Yukari is the true waifu yo. But yeah, I would write about how much I think Yukari is awesome and how she's the true love in the end, but I would rather not argue with anyone else and say her, Aigis and Elizabeth are the love interests for P3MC.

Yup, Chie is supposed to be like your female bro, and while she does have some love options, the games focuses more in Yukiko and Rise in that subject.
 
Xenoflare

Xenoflare

Member
MiguelMexMIstery said:
Yukari is the true waifu yo. But yeah, I would write about how much I think Yukari is awesome and how she's the true love in the end, but I would rather not argue with anyone else and say her, Aigis and Elizabeth are the love interests for P3MC.

Yup, Chie is supposed to be like your female bro, and while she does have some love options, the games focuses more in Yukiko and Rise in that subject.
Click to expand...

I feel Yukiko is more of a default girl than Rise, even though the game decides to devote actual screen time for Rise instead in that matter, non of the other girls get this treatment. Plus I think Rise has the highest priority in terms of this, the shrine visit calls for example, if you haven't started romantic relationships with other girls, she's the first one that texts you.

Oh, and here's to hope that P5's romantic status (if there is any) has a more of an effect on the main plot.
 
G

Gazoinks

Member
CorvoSol said:
pTqGtFi.png


Elly where do you keep getting these flowers you throw around every time you get all misty eyed about weird shit?

It's okay girl, you're still best.
Click to expand...

Obviously the same place Utena got them.

...I really need to actually go back to P1. I got a bit bored of the gameplay after a while, but it's the only big gaping hole in my Persona fandom! :D
 
C

CorvoSol

Member
Gazoinks said:
Obviously the same place Utena got them.

...I really need to actually go back to P1. I got a bit bored of the gameplay after a while, but it's the only big gaping hole in my Persona fandom! :D
Click to expand...

Utena's flowers all come from the Rose garden at school. I dunno if St. Hermelin has one.

Guys, are Elly's flowers canon? No because they weren't in the game or yes because they were in the manga?
 
C

CorvoSol

Member
Come to think of it, maybe Elly doesn't actually pull the flowers out. Maybe there's just a radical series of contrivances that causes them to fall from above each time. Like, a Rube-Goldberg machine sequence of differing and variant events causing flowers to fall every time that she opens her mouth.

Alternatively, Naoya just REALLY wants to bang her and so he sees her in flower vision. I'm not ruling it out because I have the sneaking suspicion that the manga's team wanted Naoya and Elly instead of Naoya and Maki.

A decision I would not have opposed, mind you! Especially since Naoya apparently
isn't around his alleged girlfriend by the time P2 rolls around!

Shoulda done picked Elly, son.
 
P

PK Gaming

Member
NichM said:
This is not really what I'm talking about. I'm talking about respecting the choices that are offered within the game. Persona 3, as an example, is intentionally designed to offer you a choice of what to name the character, who that character hangs out with, what they decide to do on December 31st, and (in one version) what that character's sex is. Atlus has, whenever possible, made choices that honor the player's decisions. Mitsuru in P4A may dress and act in a way the player wouldn't have expected her to, but she doesn't ever refer to "that boy I used to date," because the creators are keeping the possibility open that the player never started her social link, let alone finished it.

Now, sometimes it's not possible to do that while still making games within the shared universe. After all, you can't have a Persona 4 at all without assuming that the player made one decision in P3 and not the other. And in the same way, when the protagonist of P3 makes appearances in noninteractive media like P3M, the producers have their own choices to make about all those things. (Much like Arc System Works can't really fit a name entry screen into a fighting game--but if they could, I expect that they would, just like Persona Q does.)

But I don't see the choices they made as invalidating mine. Just because I chose for the Gekkoukan student with the power of the Wild Card to be a young woman, and the movie and PQ elected to portray that student as a young man, means they're following a different branch of the story--but not the singular, absolutely canonical, and only relevant branch.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I definitely appreciate Atlus's decision to make the Persona sequels as inclusive as possible. They did the same back in P2:EP with the flashback sequence where P1 protagonist states he has to leave, but the reason is unspecified.
 
P

Pepsiman

@iiotenki on Twitter!
LelouchViBritannia said:
LOL! you joker. Pepsi, where have you been man? Its been to long.
Click to expand...

GAF got too heated for my tastes around E3, so I thought I'd take a breather and step out for a while~

Kind of just been busy with life stuff in general, too. I got to have surgery for the first time ever, for instance! That was fun! :D!

But yeah, mostly life being life accounting for my absence. I never intended to forsake you all. Just wanted a break~
 
W

Weiss

Banned
Are we talking about the Persona 1 manga?

Because that thing is legitimately great. It transcends being a good adaptation and becomes its own beast that's probably better than the game it's actually based on.
 
B

buddha0991

Member
Weiss said:
Are we talking about the Persona 1 manga?

Because that thing is legitimately great. It transcends being a good adaptation and becomes its own beast that's probably better than the game it's actually based on.
Click to expand...

The way I see it the P1 manga is the best way to see the Persona 1 story and characters, just like I feel if the P3 Movies continue to stay this quality, they will become the best way to see the P3 story and characters.

2positive edit:

tumblr_n8rq9z4Utl1rpsmato1_500.jpg
 
N

Nachos

Member
Pepsiman said:
GAF got too heated for my tastes around E3, so I thought I'd take a breather and step out for a while~

Kind of just been busy with life stuff in general, too. I got to have surgery for the first time ever, for instance! That was fun! :D!

But yeah, mostly life being life accounting for my absence. I never intended to forsake you all. Just wanted a break~
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, are you still recovering from that?

Anyway, it's nice to see you around again. The thread's been sorely lacking in corgis for a while.
 
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