I don't think that's going to happen, but I don't think that's an absurd thought at all (it's one I had thought about, as well). I don't see them regressing when it comes to the dates the Persona games are set inespecially considering the themes that Hashino wants to tackle are deliberately made to be "with the times"but I could also see a scenario where P Studio goes "screw it" and rids themselves of any shackles related to something like that. A main Persona game set in the past or whatever (though, again, I don't expect that because "modern Japan" is pretty much a core part of the franchise).
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Persona Community Thread |OT8| Coming Winter 2014
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I don't think that's going to happen, but I don't think that's an absurd thought at all (it's one I had thought about, as well). I don't see them regressing when it comes to the dates the Persona games are set inespecially considering the themes that Hashino wants to tackle are deliberately made to be "with the times"but I could also see a scenario where P Studio goes "screw it" and rids themselves of any shackles related to something like that. A main Persona game set in the past or whatever (though, again, I don't expect that because "modern Japan" is pretty much a core part of the franchise).
CrimsonFist
Member
The phones are evidence enough that it's set around now.
Though that wouldn't preclude it from being set in 2011. If anything, the P4 crew's phones were out of date for when the game took place in, but I think that was either officially or reasonably explained away as it being an element of living in a small town like Inaba.
Morning Star
Member
Yeah, people were really excited: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1dqsHzCreU
Also, I think it would be 100% terrible, despite whatever reason they gave for it.
A Dead Diehard
Member
That still leaves Yu, who just came from the city, but that's ignorable.
Going to tag this first bit just to play it safe.
I'm pretty open to the idea of "20XX" being the result of some end-game reveal but that still seems somewhat contradictory to what P5 has set itself up to be. However, I guess we'll just have to wait and see on that given how the game is almost built on defying expectations.
P-Studio simply becoming discontent with time catching up on them is something I could easily believe though. Still, given that the calendar year means "20XX" can only describe 3 different years I also have a hard time thinking of an actual worthwhile reason to go along with it.
I know some people would rather not think about it right now but I guess they could always leave it as 20XX and then set it to 2016 in spinoffs. ¯\_(ツ
_/¯Edit: While I love P2 I'd always take new characters over aged old ones as party members.
Seeing the time skip and returning characters in Innocent Sin single-handedly made Persona 1 worth it. Still, there's something that I think made it uniquely work in the transition from P1 to P2 that I don't think would have worked for P3 and P4, and now P5. Perhaps it's the fact that the games have a greater sense of independent identity now (certainly more than P1) that would perhaps result in a clash if characters were to be directly inserted into the next entry.
I think 20XX is going to be what they go with. When you're doing fictional towns, it's a bit easier to get away with a specific year. Tougher in a real city since there's so much associated with a real time and place.
Anyway, while they'll never make a persona game set in the past, I could really, really go for something like that. Like one set in the 70's or some kind of Raidou Kuzunoha spinoff in old Japan. (spinoff-ception)
Anyway, while they'll never make a persona game set in the past, I could really, really go for something like that. Like one set in the 70's or some kind of Raidou Kuzunoha spinoff in old Japan. (spinoff-ception)
Ah, that's right. Combined with the fact that they can't pull the near future card anymore since P5 was presumably set to take place in 2016, maybe that's part of what would push them to abstract things into 20XX.
Weird stuff, though kind of understandable...? A way to reduce any form of dissonance players could experience regarding when the game takes place in, especially for Japanese players.
StarSketch
Banned
Why 20xx instead of like 201X though?
I think the dates that exist in game only occur on 2016 in that timeframe, hence 20XX.
'Cause that would narrow things down to the point where the "X" would be utterly useless when we look at the actual dates (it'd be 2016). From what 84X has been saying, "XX" can also narrow things down based on hints of when the game takes place in (modern day), but it casts a wide enough net that it's actually nebulous, not to mention that it makes it so that most players won't look into what days match what years and will just accept "20XX," making that pretty much the only recognized time Persona 5 takes place in.
I don't really like it, though.
A Dead Diehard
Member
Because it wouldn't be Atlus without being really cynical about the capacity for human progress?
Or maybe they're trying to say that they want the game to be timeless?
CrimsonFist
Member
Maybe the moon base is an actual moon base rather than an analogue to a real world location, and the 20XX is to justify that.
TurnipFritters
Member
It's 2020.
A Dead Diehard
Member
Scrooge McDuck
Member
I resent that "boonies" implication. Flip phones were still really popular among the city high school demographic as late as 2013, at least.
I'm not a huge fan of it either, and I think they could have gotten away with 2016, or even just jacked it up to 2017. It could be that there's some cameos from P3/4 characters, or even mentions of them, so they're worried about date/age weirdness due to the game getting delayed.
Somewhat related to the moon base theory:
I can't really tell if the Casino we keep seeing is part of Palace or if it's actually real. My gut says it's part of palace since we clearly see a casino dungeon and it's so huge from the outside that it looks odd in modern day Tokyo. But we also see cut scenes of the protagonist jumping around in there while there's tons of seemingly normal people walking around in it. It's a really important dungeon, that's for sure.
In Japan? I was a high school kid in 2010 and that doesn't ring true to me at all, at least where I live.
Though I dunno if the small town would actually matter regarding that or not; it's only the conclusion I remember people (or the developers) coming at.
Scrooge McDuck
Member
Yar, I meant in Japan.
Ah, gotcha. That makes sense, then. P Studio even opted for flip phones in Catherine, which came out in 2011. Of course, smartphones are ubiquitous in Japan now, and #FE and Persona 5 reflect that.
Speaking of Catherine: checking the wikia page, this is the first time I've ever seen that (Catherine spoilers)
we actually see two of Catherine's alternate forms for how she appears to others in the novel. To Steve: http://i.imgur.com/Ba8mNQ8.png. To Orlando: http://i.imgur.com/TOByxpr.png
Never saw that before. These days, maybe we would have seen some of the expanded media stuff for Catherine released outside of Japan. Well, at least the art book...
A Dead Diehard
Member
I dunno, maybe they just picked flip phones cause opening them makes for a better animation than just swiping the screen.
yeah in japan. smartphones only really started getting more popular in the inaka around 2012 or so I think.
Olengie
Member
I remember reading that.
To add to this, we didn't get to see much of the P1 cast in their source game. Contrast this with P3 and P4 where both games make you spend considerably more time with the main cast.
It was extremely cathartic seeing Reiji and Maki as an respectable adults after P1.
Spoilers for Ultimax/Arena in this post, also some Persona 5 speculation at the end.
This is the difference between how Persona 1 characters were handled in Persona 2, and how the Persona 4 cast was handled. They actually went somewhere with the Persona 1 cast in Persona 2. They weren't just there as fanservice; they had stories to tell in Persona 2. Most importantly, because they actually had new stories to tell, you didn't need to know about the events of Persona 1. It was a nice bonus, fanservice, but it wasn't relevant to their stories in Persona 2. Someone playing Persona 2 first could play through the entire game without realizing that Yukino was a major character in the original Persona, because while they do reference the events of Persona 1, it's bonus material to her role in Persona 2.
Contrast this to the Persona 4 cast, who wonderfully end up as pointless fanservice in their own fucking spinoff games. When your previously silent protagonist is basically an advertised extra, you have a problem.
This is why, in regards to Persona 5, if they must include references to past games then
This is the difference between how Persona 1 characters were handled in Persona 2, and how the Persona 4 cast was handled. They actually went somewhere with the Persona 1 cast in Persona 2. They weren't just there as fanservice; they had stories to tell in Persona 2. Most importantly, because they actually had new stories to tell, you didn't need to know about the events of Persona 1. It was a nice bonus, fanservice, but it wasn't relevant to their stories in Persona 2. Someone playing Persona 2 first could play through the entire game without realizing that Yukino was a major character in the original Persona, because while they do reference the events of Persona 1, it's bonus material to her role in Persona 2.
Contrast this to the Persona 4 cast, who wonderfully end up as pointless fanservice in their own fucking spinoff games. When your previously silent protagonist is basically an advertised extra, you have a problem.
When you have to shoehorn a silly reason for him to have one final battle against a reformed antagonist, just so that you can say that the Persona 4 side is the "canonical" side, you have a problem. When you have entire story modes where the characters are just there for mere moral support, you have a REALLY BIG PROBLEM.
Arena and Ultimax are ultimately (pun not intended) Labrys's story, with the Persona 3 characters being her supporting protagonists, and the Persona 4 cast being there as fanservice and nothing more. And that's probably the most disappointing aspect of them. They didn't know where to go with the cast, and the story really had more to do with the Labrys and the Persona 3 cast, but marketing caused them to shoehorn them in there anyhow. And the worst part is, they weren't devoid of ideas. They actually went somewhere with most of the Persona 3 cast. We got to see tons of character development for basically every character, and they even started new plotlines. Makes you wonder why the hell they were unable and/or unwilling to give the Persona 4 cast the respect they deserve too.
Arena and Ultimax are ultimately (pun not intended) Labrys's story, with the Persona 3 characters being her supporting protagonists, and the Persona 4 cast being there as fanservice and nothing more. And that's probably the most disappointing aspect of them. They didn't know where to go with the cast, and the story really had more to do with the Labrys and the Persona 3 cast, but marketing caused them to shoehorn them in there anyhow. And the worst part is, they weren't devoid of ideas. They actually went somewhere with most of the Persona 3 cast. We got to see tons of character development for basically every character, and they even started new plotlines. Makes you wonder why the hell they were unable and/or unwilling to give the Persona 4 cast the respect they deserve too.
This is why, in regards to Persona 5, if they must include references to past games then
I'd like them to just do the Shadow Operatives, without any specific character references. Continue the new plotline they started, but without being majorly bogged down by past entries. It's also thematically appropriate for Persona 5's story, what with the protagonists being a bunch of anti-heroes who are clearly not on the good side of the law.
A Dead Diehard
Member
I agree with Sophia. My problem with Ultimax' story was that it wasn't ambitious enough, but on reflection, I think that's the lesser of two evils, given their handling of these characters.
edit: Its funny that I can find entirely different ways to be disappointed in almost all of these characters (along with a few others you didn't name).
edit2: Oh sure, the outline's easy, but hammering it out is where your soul ends up on the business end of a Black Viper. ;P
edit: Its funny that I can find entirely different ways to be disappointed in almost all of these characters (along with a few others you didn't name).
edit2: Oh sure, the outline's easy, but hammering it out is where your soul ends up on the business end of a Black Viper. ;P
My problem wasn't that they weren't ambitious enough. My problem is that, with one exception, they didn't even bother to try in the first place.
Yu Narukami?
Never had a Shadow Self in Persona 4 proper. Instead of having his Doppelganger shadow killed off anticlimactically by Yosuke, why not use that to show that he actually has an insecure side about always being the leader? Doesn't have to be anything heavy, just have him face it down in the first third/half of the story mode. You could easily take a page from the anime/manga, and have Narukami reflect on his friendless background, and then relate that side of him to Sho at the end of the game. Would have been far better than the stupid shounen "I'll fight you to understand your feelings" bullcrap they did. :\
Yosuke?
Actually has the only interesting story mode in Arena, including significant development with Labrys and Aigis. It goes nowhere in Ultimax of course. Why let these plotline drop? Play up his insecurity in regards to the Persona 3 cast, and reflect upon how that's the kind of big star power that his Shadow always implied he wanted.
Chie?
She wants to become a police officer. That's the extent of her character. Why not have her have some more serious interactions with Akihiko and better flesh out this side of her. Akhiko has always been a good source of wisdom, maybe use some of that instead of having him talk about meat all the time? She'd also be a good foil to Junpei, which isn't really played up either.
Yukiko?
Should have played the Yukiko/Labrys angle up more. They kind of portray her as a big sister figure to Labrys, but it's never really played up in favor of a dull storyline about her lunches. Ultimax also goes nowhere with this, because she never really gets a good chance to interact with Labrys again. Would have been really fantastic to show some character of hers for the Shadow Labrys returning scene.
Teddie?
THERE WAS AN ENTIRE PLOTLINE ABOUT TEDDIE NOT BEING HUMAN IN THE FIRST ARENA. THERE WAS ANOTHER ENTIRE PLOTLINE ABOUT KAGUTSUCHI WANTING TO USE TEDDIE AS A HOST. Why drop these two plotlines? Why brush them aside? He had some great interactions with Labrys, Naoto, and Aigis in the first game, yet in Ultimax the only scene of note he gets is one with Aigis on the Persona 3 route. The rest of the time he's just humor or fanservice.
Kanji?
Ultimax actually did him decent enough. They played up the worst aspects of his character in the first Arena for the sake of a joke, but he actually has some decent interactions with Ken... on the P3 side. Spread the love to the Persona 4 side too, so we see Kanji's point of view on it.
Rise?
Was actually really good in Ultimax, and is exactly the kind of thing we needed from the rest of her cast. She had a new storyline, and it actually went somewhere even if it was handled in the first 1/3rd of Ultimax. They also paired her up with Fuuka and Yukari very well. No complaints here.
Naoto?
Exists purely to link the Persona 3 side of the story. That's about it. No actual character development for herself. They also leave the only plot thread that directly involves Naoto (that being the Public Safety one) on a cliffhanger that basically relies on a third Arena game being made. Which won't happen anytime soon. Lame.
.... I just wrote a better storyline for almost all of the P4 characters in Ultimax in 20 minutes. Let that sink in for a second.
My problem wasn't that they weren't ambitious enough. My problem is that, with one exception, they didn't even bother to try in the first place.
Yu Narukami?Never had a Shadow Self in Persona 4 proper. Instead of having his Doppelganger shadow killed off anticlimactically by Yosuke, why not use that to show that he actually has an insecure side about always being the leader? Doesn't have to be anything heavy, just have him face it down in the first third/half of the story mode. You could easily take a page from the anime/manga, and have Narukami reflect on his friendless background, and then relate that side of him to Sho at the end of the game. Would have been far better than the stupid shounen "I'll fight you to understand your feelings" bullcrap they did. :\
Yosuke?Actually has the only interesting story mode in Arena, including significant development with Labrys and Aigis. It goes nowhere in Ultimax of course. Why let these plotline drop? Play up his insecurity in regards to the Persona 3 cast, and reflect upon how that's the kind of big star power that his Shadow always implied he wanted.
Chie?She wants to become a police officer. That's the extent of her character. Why not have her have some more serious interactions with Akihiko and better flesh out this side of her. Akhiko has always been a good source of wisdom, maybe use some of that instead of having him talk about meat all the time? She'd also be a good foil to Junpei, which isn't really played up either.
Yukiko?Should have played the Yukiko/Labrys angle up more. They kind of portray her as a big sister figure to Labrys, but it's never really played up in favor of a dull storyline about her lunches. Ultimax also goes nowhere with this, because she never really gets a good chance to interact with Labrys again. Would have been really fantastic to show some character of hers for the Shadow Labrys returning scene.
Teddie?THERE WAS AN ENTIRE PLOTLINE ABOUT TEDDIE NOT BEING HUMAN IN THE FIRST ARENA. THERE WAS ANOTHER ENTIRE PLOTLINE ABOUT KAGUTSUCHI WANTING TO USE TEDDIE AS A HOST. Why drop these two plotlines? Why brush them aside? He had some great interactions with Labrys, Naoto, and Aigis in the first game, yet in Ultimax the only scene of note he gets is one with Aigis on the Persona 3 route. The rest of the time he's just humor or fanservice.
Kanji?Ultimax actually did him decent enough. They played up the worst aspects of his character in the first Arena for the sake of a joke, but he actually has some decent interactions with Ken... on the P3 side. Spread the love to the Persona 4 side too, so we see Kanji's point of view on it.
Rise?Was actually really good in Ultimax, and is exactly the kind of thing we needed from the rest of her cast. She had a new storyline, and it actually went somewhere even if it was handled in the first 1/3rd of Ultimax. They also paired her up with Fuuka and Yukari very well. No complaints here.
Naoto?Exists purely to link the Persona 3 side of the story. That's about it. No actual character development for herself. They also leave the only plot thread that directly involves Naoto (that being the Public Safety one) on a cliffhanger that basically relies on a third Arena game being made. Which won't happen anytime soon. Lame.
.... I just wrote a better storyline for almost all of the P4 characters in Ultimax in 20 minutes. Let that sink in for a second.
Having just finished reading that and thinking back to both Arena and Ultimax, its quite disturbing to really see the lack of an interesting narrative. Which, when I let it sink it, I'm shocked at how incredibly half-assed the storyline for all the P4 characters are compared to even a lighter version of what you wrote. Heck, you managed to connect threads between both sets of casts and games. I still can't believe these were complete games that people were paid to create.
Aadrian1234
Banned
I wouldn't say it's a song no one knows about, it's rather depressing and iconic of the events going on at the time
I can't wait to see your cosplay
but have you thought that the person interrogating the protagonist is Mitsuru.....wait....
Inquisitive_Ghost
Member
I've been expecting the alternate world of P5 to heavily bleed into the real world in a much more direct way than in P3 and 4. There are weird things like human guards that turn into/oust themselves as Shadows. Also, their thief outfits themselves are a manifestation of their Personas, and they clearly use them in the real world. Plus the fact that people have some awareness of what they're up to.
Edit: OR it's something like (P4 spoilers)
The end of P4, where Inaba was being absorbed into the TV world.
Ultimately, the P4A games were meant to be good fighting games first and foremost (which is why the primary developer on the titles was ASW), and they succeeded at that.
Persona 3 escape game spin-off: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vx1ioDtDyCg
You read it in Japanese or is there some translation of the Catherine novel floating somewhere? Seeing some new pictures from it, especially (Catherine spoilers)
Catherine's alternate forms
this form in motion in the actual game; she looks completely different.
Also (re)ignited my desire to see something in the vein of Catherine. I'd take just Catherine but gender switched, too.
I've seen the first one before but not the second. Pretty interesting.
Also, I think that art might actually be Soejima, which I wouldn't have expected.
EDIT: Something I keep forgetting to mention:
When I finished P4D mooooonths ago, I noticed in the credits that huge amounts of the game were actually outsourced, and a presumably small amount was made in-house. As I recall, the credits listed outsourcing for everything, right down to 3D assets.
Pretty interesting.
I like how
Steve and Orlando have more "grounded" Catherine's, whereas Vincent has this incredibly over the top anime girl with ringlets as his ideal girl.
A Dead Diehard
Member
Makes sense,
considering Vincent already has a 'grounded' girl, and a pretty one at that. Though that could just demonstrate that Steve and Orlando are after companionship, and not an unrealistic 'babe', which Vincent has far more reason to yearn for, given his current situation.
Heh... Now I'm starting to remember people joking/thinking that Joker was Vincent and Katherine's son.
What I like in those Catherine pics is just how well you can tell
The wait for Persona 5 is making me think weird things like: "What if this was a Catherine successor instead?"
the personality types the guys she preys on are into the most based on her appearance and disposition. Somehow, I feel like Vincent's Catherine is the closest to how her "real" personality is, and that's part of why she spent the most time with him. (which would make sense, as a Succubus).
The wait for Persona 5 is making me think weird things like: "What if this was a Catherine successor instead?"
TurnipFritters
Member
Speaking of Catherine, didn't one of he 5/5 videos show that Persona 5 has the in-game player poll things?
PV04:
And I'm pretty sure that's not opinions from the players, but
a bar showing off the influence the "Phantom thieves" have on the city. I think the question was translated to "Do you believe in the Phantom thieves?" with an answer like "I'm a middle school kid and even I know better." I guess the 6% would signify the number of people in the city who would answer "Yes" to the question, which will increase the more stuff you do.
A Dead Diehard
Member
Maybe that's what determines what kind of ending you get? Or at least having an effect on what happens when
you get arrested later on?
.
At 6% the answer bar is labeled ゲームのやり過ぎだと思う - "I think you're playing too many video games." It probably shows how you're going to change 'reality' as the game progresses. It'd be cool if it influences which ending you get. For some reason, this statistics screen has me salivating more for the game than all the battle or dungeon scenes released so far, haha. RPGs are strange that way.
I wonder if the 20XX in the upper left corner will be replaced with 2016 before the game releases?
I wonder where I got the middle school kid thing from; maybe it was from a scan? Or it was someone's mistranslation.
From the discussion above, it seems the consensus is that it could go either way. Perhaps slightly leaning more towards the possibility of it remaining 20XX.
MudoSkills
Volcano High Alumnus (Cum Laude)
Setsu? Is that you?
It would be really cool if that poll is part of the Cooperation system, and your actions affect communities' consensus about you, which then in turn affect which ending of the game you get. Which would also essentially mean that the SLink successor actually affects story progress this time around.
But I think it might get as frustrating or as annoying as trying to get P4s true end if like you are at a point where everyone hates you and you are heading towards a bad ending and there's no way to increase societies opinion... unless there are like a bunch of side quests where you can help people or do god deeds or shit to get a better standing or something. Haha
But I think it might get as frustrating or as annoying as trying to get P4s true end if like you are at a point where everyone hates you and you are heading towards a bad ending and there's no way to increase societies opinion... unless there are like a bunch of side quests where you can help people or do god deeds or shit to get a better standing or something. Haha
A Dead Diehard
Member
Who knows, maybe there'll be 'cheating' sidequests available as DLC where you give a big shot some random junk and he'll put in a good word for you and your meter shoots up?
I dunno, some way to cut out the difficulty and any effort that comes with overcoming it.