Davao's statistics show otherwise unfortunately!
Philippine President-Elect Urges Public to Kill Drug Dealers
- Thread starter Spoiled Milk
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Davao's statistics show otherwise unfortunately!
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Yeah, amen. It's so easy to recline in a leather chair, munch on a pizza, and philosophize about what Filipinos should or shouldn't do. Then shut off your computer and go to bed, safe and sound in Thousand Oaks, California.
My opinion of Duterte comes directly from Filipinos themselves (and I have heard both sides).
Also, I'm very upset by the dogwhistles here. Fuck the Philippines? Why are the Filipinos incapable of choosing good candidates? How could they be so dumb for picking Duterte? Some of you are seriously tone deaf.
The more privileged supported Aquino.
PastorOfMuppets
Banned
I think it's kind of difficult to judge the compromises a developing country has to make in order to clean up its institutions. I grew up in Canada and to be honest myself, I sometimes feel the worthlessness of arresting Mafiosos and Hells Angels only to see them back in the news a couple of years later blowing up restaurants and assassinating each other and I think for a second, just a fleeting minute "Man, it would be nice if we could just kill all of them on the spot." Then I stop and think about the legal precedents and human rights outrage it would cause and think "We gotta let it slide in order to keep the integrity of the country."
Maybe, just maybe, in countries like Mexico, Brazil and the Philippines don't have that luxury yet.
Maybe, just maybe, in countries like Mexico, Brazil and the Philippines don't have that luxury yet.
They fucking elected Pacquiao as SENATOR. That says a lot about the masses.
Pacquiao the stupid uneducated, bible spouting bigot. The man who has the worst attendance in the congress.
Pacquiao said 'it won't be difficult' to be a senator because he 'can memorize biblical verses'
Seriously, FUCK YOU.
Yeah man, I totally joked about it when he won his seat in Congress, but with his senate win and the fact Duterte won by a large margin. Ugh, I don't know what to say anymore.
Boxing aside, but Pacquiao should be nowhere near elected office.
Nah, im a filipino and i live here but this is just common sense, mindanao is not luzon, you cant fix what is not broken, you can improve yes, but as whats hes saying now, he'll destroy our whole country with this policy of his, killing is not the solve to our problem.
Isn't this what you're doing? You won't directly experience the effects of Duterte's actions since you live in the US yourself.
A lot of people in power supported Duterte. He had the backing of a major political party rooted in political dynasties. My wealthy relatives supported him. And in the rich community where I live the polling results show that Duterte got an overwhelming share of the votes. It's a myth to paint Duterte's win as the poor getting the better of the rich. It's simply a "fuck you" to the status quo. I understand and partially agree with that sentiment but I don't believe Duterte to be the solution. Not one person is, or ever will be.
EYEL1NER
Member
What's crazy about this thread is the speculation that this will lead to abuse? The stuff people ITT have theorized that this could lead to? That shit had already been happening for years. A pretty easy-to-find article from the Human Rights Watch breaks down some data about who the targets of the DDS are. Duterte may only be saying "Kill the drug dealers" but who actually gets killed? Street kids, drug users (not kingpins or majors pushers), purse- and phone-snatchers, general 'delinquent youths,' and more. Maybe these target could get violent if they were given the chance but quite a few of them are killed while eating outside a store, while riding away from a police station in a jeepney after being released with no charges, or in their own home with their loved ones clutching them close and begging for mercy. Giving people free reign to take out the bad guys sees them actually going after the undesirables (in addition to people critical of the administration or its policies, or the people that someone has a grudge against or rivals, or whoever else is getting murdered without deserving it like those with a similar name or appearance to someone who committed a petty crime).
Here is a quote I read from a site a earlier today, the last sentence being particularly disgusting:
Here is a quote I read from a site a earlier today, the last sentence being particularly disgusting:
http://www.cbcpnews.com/cbcpnews/?p=76531 said:
Wild guess. You're not a visayan are you?
Anyways, it'll be interesting to see how it all plays out with his "3-6 months" promise.
More importantly if he can do what no others have done, solve the MLF/AS crisis and revive the BBL.
titiklabingapat
Member
I'm Filipino, I grew up in the Philippines most of my life before migrating to California. The political system is so highly dysfunctional that candidates win by personality more than anything else, and party alliances are decided by whether or not this person here likes the other person there. It's not based on platforms and policies at all. The whole left-right thing simply doesn't exist in the Philippine political sphere. In countries with a First Past the Post voting system like the Philippines, you will naturally revert to two parties vying for your votes. The Philippines having so many parties and candidates each election cycle should tell you how broken it is.
I don't want to say that the electorate is dumb, but it sure looks that way when you have Duterte and Pacquaio making political headlines. I already see President Pacquiao being written on the wall.
that death squads still aren't a good thing?
"You've never even set foot in Rwanda, why you so resolute the Tutsi genocide was a bad thing? You've never even had to live here."
Endorphineforeverybody
Member
So where are these drug dealers he is talking about? Ruining my favorite country for vacation, thank you.
the_batman
Banned
any time you have death squads, it's a bad thing.
they better be hiding, with bounties on their heads
LiveFromKyoto
Member
"Duterte, a longtime Davao mayor, has been suspected of playing a role in many killings of suspected criminals in his city by motorcycle-riding assassins"
There's a part of me that read too many comic books and thinks this sounds badass.
There's a part of me that read too many comic books and thinks this sounds badass.
Endorphineforeverybody
Member
What i was saying is, i never noticed a drug scene in the Philippines except in the north. Do they export their product? What drugs is he talking about, weed?
Meth is everywhere, coke and x are popular among the moneyed crowd, and smoking weed is socially acceptable among a large subset of the population. Mind, that's just from my own personal experience circa the early 2000s. I doubt much has changed.
Endorphineforeverybody
Member
Strange, never noticed that. Thx for the infos.
even if you're fed up with crime and corruption how can you support this guy? there will still be official corruption, just involving him and the people he likes
is it just about getting drug dealers off the street corners? what about the political assassinations, murders of journalists, and intimidation/disappearing of criminal witnesses? i guess you can't make an omelette without brutally killing hundreds of people who don't deserve it.
is it just about getting drug dealers off the street corners? what about the political assassinations, murders of journalists, and intimidation/disappearing of criminal witnesses? i guess you can't make an omelette without brutally killing hundreds of people who don't deserve it.
Coriolanus
Banned
You will seldom get news from a dictatorship saying that crime is up simply because dictatorships do not allow any semblance of a free press, nor will they have any interest in creating institutes that would accurately gauge how widespread crime is, which is something that can be quite easily noticed (unless one actually believes that Iran and North Korea are as safe or safer than Uruguay). In the same vein, the only way one could consider crime down during a dictatorship is if one does not consider the dictator's acts crimes. Good luck running a story on kidnappings and murders being up when it is the government doing a significant share of the kidnapping and murdering.
Additionally, if Tough On Crime solved anything, sharia law countries would be the safest in the world.
To that, factor the lack of internet in the 70's and 80's. Why yes, the news that the only crime happening was minor offenses was widespread. How could it ever be anything else?
That cop is a pussy compared with Duterte
The guy is insane when comes to security but his job in other areas is quite interesting, shame that he is completely bonkers
Says the person not living there?
And if you're supporting someone who talks about raping women and making "hostile" journalists disappear, you should just come out and say you're hoping for a cult-of-personality dictator to make all of your problems right again. "Law and order" is the dogwhistle here, especially since you're only getting order, at best.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Out of context guys. Let me clarify to you since the news definitely don't have any context.
The guy just talks casually when he mentions that. He isn't even declared as a president and he mentions that he just talks crass but promises to fix himself up when he actually is inducted. If you actually listened to his talk, it sounded more like a guy joking around - like how one would say "man I want to blow up this planet" kind of deal.
Personally I think the mass media, especially the mainstream ones here, are very sensationalist and they have tendency to act dumb and ignorant, and most are even under the paychecks of the families/dynasties of competing presidencies (yes - oligarchy hidden in democracy!). The fact that certain channels aired a smear campaign without hesitation.
And I'm not even going with the stupidity of the "Commission of Human Rights", a.k.a. pointless shit that you'd think this country has first world problems. They are very selective of their shit.
The guy just talks casually when he mentions that. He isn't even declared as a president and he mentions that he just talks crass but promises to fix himself up when he actually is inducted. If you actually listened to his talk, it sounded more like a guy joking around - like how one would say "man I want to blow up this planet" kind of deal.
Personally I think the mass media, especially the mainstream ones here, are very sensationalist and they have tendency to act dumb and ignorant, and most are even under the paychecks of the families/dynasties of competing presidencies (yes - oligarchy hidden in democracy!). The fact that certain channels aired a smear campaign without hesitation.
And I'm not even going with the stupidity of the "Commission of Human Rights", a.k.a. pointless shit that you'd think this country has first world problems. They are very selective of their shit.
That's a terrible context.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
yeah, I'm going to agree that "haha just joking around" isn't accurate when they already do have vigilante justice in Davao.
I don't even know where to start with this post.
The context doesn't even matter when the president-elect nonchalantly says it's okay to assassinate corrupt journalists (and it's even worse when his example is that or a journalist whose corpse was found in the river after trying to criticize him). Don't give me that "it's just a fucking joke" either. He is the president and people will look up to him when he speaks. He's in a delicate position to even joke around, and jokingly being okay with killing just empowers people to do vigilante killings.
This is coming from a guy who writes satire, btw.
Oh and yes, sure, the media has biases, and some of them are definitely paid off, but a good amount of idealistic journalists have been objective throughout the campaign period. One of the journalists who critiziced Duterte for catcalling actually followed Duterte during the campaign trail and was pretty positive on how grass-roots Duterte approached the campaign. Lumping all the media as corrupt isn't constructive, especially at a time when news start-ups have sprung up to become legitimate alternative (read: much less bias and more inclusive) news outlets.
In fact, this criticism isn't exclusive to Duterte. Aquino went through the same lenses and also got criticized heavily, despite some outlets being, as you allege, paid off by the oligarchy he sprung up. Duterte is just going through the same lenses and writers who are very critical, even perhaps to a fault (especially of sensationalizing).
I am just sick of people excusing what Duterte said because "fuck media, fuck CHR." Just admit it: you agree with him. You agree that it's okay to kill allegedly-corrupt people without due process. Whether or not that makes you proud of yourself is your problem, but don't give me that "he got taken out of context" bullshit.
PS: and yes, I am from Davao. Vigilante killings happen there. Targets include petty criminals (not drug lords, lol Duterte doesn't even have the balls to go against them), and allegedly people running against his vested interests.
If you want proof, an uncle got hit with a threat for a reason I still don't know.
Frozenprince
Banned
Can't wait for when he loses the next election and turns the state into either a military dictatorship or starts his own insurgency.
He won't lose power again.
He won't lose power again.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
What happens when someone just accuses another person of being a drug dealer and shoots them?
President is just a 1 term (6 years) in the Philippines. So there's no re-election for him unless he change the law during his 6 years tenure.
AnathemicOne
Banned
Oh I know, I've been there thrice with my most recent being last year (half-filipino) visiting some family. People are generally nice but unfortunately ignorant to things beyond family and basic social economy. Oh and Catholic - indoctrinated to the extreme which is offputting. I'll never visit the country out of my own decision.
The thing with this situation is that I find this is the type of government and man that will basically turn on whoever will get them an immediate boost. Often people defending these types don't realize they're next on the chopping block when things get bad. I guess it may be a lack of education how these types of governments get into power but its often by filling a void or replacing something "worse". Not to shut down the differing opinions but this guy looks like he's taking the textbook steps to gain power both through populist methods and through more cut throat ones like destroying any kind of vocal opposition to him, literally and figuratively.
I guess what I ask to the people who are defending him is what happens when he runs out of drug dealers and crooks to murder to sate the public bloodlust? What keeps him from turning on you and making you into the next public pariah to hang before the public before looking for the next guy. Yeah your home is safer but at what costs and what of the long term effects?
These are the type of governments that tend to do horrible things if stuff goes against them. What happens when there is a natural disaster and resources become extremely scarce? These are not the types to just give it out freely but would probably turn their own people on one another to keep the attention off themselves.
Any government that relies on scapegoating like this is a horrible thing in the long run because they'll start eating themselves in the process of trying to stay on the good side of public opinion and if that means friend becomes enemy... oh well.
I guess what I ask to the people who are defending him is what happens when he runs out of drug dealers and crooks to murder to sate the public bloodlust? What keeps him from turning on you and making you into the next public pariah to hang before the public before looking for the next guy. Yeah your home is safer but at what costs and what of the long term effects?
These are the type of governments that tend to do horrible things if stuff goes against them. What happens when there is a natural disaster and resources become extremely scarce? These are not the types to just give it out freely but would probably turn their own people on one another to keep the attention off themselves.
Any government that relies on scapegoating like this is a horrible thing in the long run because they'll start eating themselves in the process of trying to stay on the good side of public opinion and if that means friend becomes enemy... oh well.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I don't even agree with him and I didn't even vote for him (I voted for Miriam). I'm not even defending his actions on that issue and I think his fanboys are really rabid (judging by the social media posts my brother shared to me). It's just that the media is really corrupt that it's hard not to take them seriously, as well as the whole ordeal when you know the context. My main gripe isn't him as much as it is about the sensationalists in this country as well as the terrible-sighted CHR.
This is the media that lapped on Aquino's shit as well as his party. These people are used to his sweet talk that even his followers like Robredo use a lot, that it feels outright disgusting. And give me a break - the only place you'll find the media criticizing Aquino is on few channels and not on the big ones, and especially not on ABS-"Aquino Approved"-CBN.
You know why this makes me rage? Because last election the media went out of its way to criticize Gordon not because of something important, but because he is 'assertive'. Fuck this shit and fuck this country, I really hate the mass media here which slowly drained to mediocrity and stupidity.
It makes a bit more context locally but yeah it's hard to explain.
Lol Aquino was criticized every step of the way, even in ABS-CBN, despite how biased it can be. I remember how many articles were written about the PDAF Scandal, his refusal to attend Jennifer Laude's wake, the Mamasapano/SAF 44 incident, and Aquino deciding to skip the arrival of the bodies. Heck, he and Mar Roxas (whom Aquino wanted to succeed) got a lot of crap pn Yolanda and how slow rehabilitation and how fund/good allocation wasn't as transparent, only for the media to later discuss more about what they did right amidst the wrongs.
Aquino's trust rating also dropped during this period, so the media had done quite well with discussing controversies in Aquino's administrarion. Heck, his fans blame the media (yes, even ABS-CBN) for being biased against him (lol right?) and smearing his name.
Case in point is, the media is just critical. Oh, it can be sensationalized, but it's going to do its job of putting the truth out there. There are corrupt journalists, but there are enough good journalists to counter them.
Duterte is just going through the same motion as every elected official. Sorry if the media makes him appear negative, cause, idk, maybe he can be batshit insane?
Anyway, this has diverged from the topic so I'll just leave it at that.
EDIT: Replying below, I work in a media outlet so I am aware with all media channels. Guess which one (lol, I may have even mentioned it in past threads)
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Basically I don't really care much about Duterte as much as the media. And yeah you point that out, but you've never been drenched in ABS-CBN's channel (somehow my family only watches it). They do criticize him, but it was more like a pat than an actual criticism, and they'd do a "counter" of sorts like afterwards they'd show something he did "positively". You actually have to go to other outlets to get their crap be seen.
Frozenprince
Banned
Authoritarian repression has never worked to transition a country and stamp out corruption. I have no idea why anybody in their right mind would ever conceive of that being what's going to happen here.
Fascism doesn't work. This has been proven again and again and again and again.
Fascism doesn't work. This has been proven again and again and again and again.
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