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PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale |OT| Use Supers to Smash your Bros!
- Thread starter TheMink
- Start date
TimeEffect
Member
Good session, Smith, PS3 froze -_-
Oh well, Battlefield time!
Oh well, Battlefield time!
JStein0222
Member
I swear GAF could balance this game better than whoever the heck is in charge now
Probably, but most people have an opinion which often does not take into account all variables. It's great throwing out ideas, but it takes an extraordinary amount of planning and testing to balance these things.
Which is not in reference to the Sly comment, and in the case of PS All-Stars, it's clear that Superbot are not displaying those attributes.
MaverickHunterAsh
Member
Is it really SuperBot's fault at this point, though? Every fighting game is unbalanced when it's first released. They did at least nerf Sackboy, and they probably had plans to release more balance patches, but then Sony cut their ties with them and that was that. They didn't even get to finish the first/only four DLC characters they had made for the game. So at this point, I feel like SuperBot had good intentions that were dashed by their contract with Sony ending so soon. Business is business, so I don't necessarily blame Sony for that, but at this point it falls upon Sony Santa Monica to balance the game since they've officially taken over the game's post-release development, and if they don't, I'd say that's on them.
They over-nerfed Sackboy though. I haven't seen him online in months. They shouldn't have reduced the AP gain on his jelly ball (takes ages to start up), and they shouldn't have raised the Super cost for all of his supers. His level 3 was the only one people complained about, and frankly, I don't think it was that bad. I never saw anyone get more than 6 kills with it. The cupcake spam was the worst part. Now if only they had done something about Drake's barrel...
JStein0222
Member
I agree with all of the above...It really isn't that hard.
Hopefully they fix him up a bit, I really love Sackboy but man it's hard to get a decent amount of level 1 supers in FFA
christiankid7
Member
They should have made you respawn not in the bubble when you die. Sackboys level 3 was busted and that might have balanced him.
It's all about strategic placement. If you see that Sackboy is about to get a level 3, you must position yourself either
A: As far away from Sackboy as possible
or
B: Near a point on the stage that is either too high to reach without skill (most spamming sackboys did not have skill or the brains to use his jetpack boost/grapple), or in a location that is impossible to reach without falling off the stage.
Preferably you can get both.
A: As far away from Sackboy as possible
or
B: Near a point on the stage that is either too high to reach without skill (most spamming sackboys did not have skill or the brains to use his jetpack boost/grapple), or in a location that is impossible to reach without falling off the stage.
Preferably you can get both.
JStein0222
Member
Yeah that actually might have worked. I've always thought that or just lowering the time the super is active by a smidge would have done the trick
christiankid7
Member
You wanna play me? I just keep getting RQers
TimeEffect
Member
yup!
I'm disappointed because they made it sound like patching tweaks was going to be easy. So, I expected patching to be done consistently enough. Sackboy should have had his jelly buffed a long time ago, for example.
As a Heihachi player, I hate Sackboy. Though...I only mess around as Heihachi...
TimeEffect
Member
Not disagreeing with this, but for that effort, Sackboy deserves some better AP, compared to say, Kratos who puts in relatively less work for more AP.
I just am bothered by the jelly and maybe the super AP requirement changes
MaverickHunterAsh
Member
If we're talking about characters who deserve more AP for the effort they have to put in to get it, we should be talking about PaRappa way before Sackboy... and he doesn't even have OP Supers like Sackboy.
#1 defender
Member
So after all my venting about quitters unfairly setting me back 60-70 points on my road to the next belt shortly before the end of last season, i still managed to reach the brown belt, only for the titles not to be unlocked when the current season started.
At least now i won't feel compelled to put up with quitters in ranked and can just play quick match for fun. Not that there aren't any quitters, but at least it won't be as aggravating as in ranked.
From what i've read i'm not the only one that didn't get his titles though. I thought they fixed this in early february, or has the recent patch undone the fix? It's as if Naughty Dog's MP people have followed me to PSASBR.
At least now i won't feel compelled to put up with quitters in ranked and can just play quick match for fun. Not that there aren't any quitters, but at least it won't be as aggravating as in ranked.
From what i've read i'm not the only one that didn't get his titles though. I thought they fixed this in early february, or has the recent patch undone the fix? It's as if Naughty Dog's MP people have followed me to PSASBR.
I dont doubt it.
But being good is one thing. People can be good with Sir Dan and Toro, and they will own people online. But that doesnt mean those characters aren't underpowered.
J is definitely one of those people who are great with sackboy. And hes asking for a buff based on a ton of experience. So im inclined to agree.
I dont play as Sackboy so i cant really make an educated assumption based only upon fighting againts them. But based solely on fighting them i havent had any trouble so i would say a little buff could be a good thing.
But ultimately there are five other characters that need to be buffed and nerfed far more than sackboy so im not pushing the issue.
JStein0222
Member
The thing is, I win with Sackboy enough that I can still get along with him. But, I feel like to have a good game I really need to be on it so to speak. If I just get abused for awhile then I'm completely toast. Meanwhile there are other characters who for whatever reason (build AP much faster, looking at you Kratos) can win a match because of what they do in about 1 minute of it.
Also thanks Mink <3 haha who are you reppin these days?
Tips for dodging Kratos's lvl 3 super... Stay close to him and time your dodges.
I usually hop over him back and forth, dodging and air dodging at the right time. It's much easier as you can focus on him and see his swing startup more clearly-- it also forces him to kind of focus on you so that he almost forgets that the other players are there, meaning there's a higher chance he won't target them and less kills for him. This tactic requires practice w/ the timing of his attacks, but it's much better than trying to run away as his blast move has a large area of effect so it's difficult to dodge.
The final reason it's good is because you can get a jump on the Kratos when it's over. Utilizing this method, I've been 99% successful in dodging his attacks in all of my matches, and also harassing him to the point where he nets less kills since he's more focused on the one guy (me) who's hovering around near him.
I usually hop over him back and forth, dodging and air dodging at the right time. It's much easier as you can focus on him and see his swing startup more clearly-- it also forces him to kind of focus on you so that he almost forgets that the other players are there, meaning there's a higher chance he won't target them and less kills for him. This tactic requires practice w/ the timing of his attacks, but it's much better than trying to run away as his blast move has a large area of effect so it's difficult to dodge.
The final reason it's good is because you can get a jump on the Kratos when it's over. Utilizing this method, I've been 99% successful in dodging his attacks in all of my matches, and also harassing him to the point where he nets less kills since he's more focused on the one guy (me) who's hovering around near him.
MaverickHunterAsh
Member
I don't know how relevant this is to our interests or what kind of hope it provides (or takes away), but IGN just posted some interesting data about the best-selling PlayStation Store games and content in February:
- All-Stars was the 18th best-selling digital PS3 game in February
- All-Stars was the 4th best-selling digital Vita game in February
- "Fearless" was the 8th best-selling PS3 DLC in February
So... not amazing stats, but not horrible ones either. At first it worried me that Kat and Emmett didn't even make it on the list for best-selling DLC, but then it occurred to me that they were free for two weeks, and this list is only for best "selling" DLC, so that may have a lot to do with it.
It'll be more interesting to see how Kat, Emmett, Zeus, and Isaac do when the March list rolls around.
- All-Stars was the 18th best-selling digital PS3 game in February
- All-Stars was the 4th best-selling digital Vita game in February
- "Fearless" was the 8th best-selling PS3 DLC in February
So... not amazing stats, but not horrible ones either. At first it worried me that Kat and Emmett didn't even make it on the list for best-selling DLC, but then it occurred to me that they were free for two weeks, and this list is only for best "selling" DLC, so that may have a lot to do with it.
It'll be more interesting to see how Kat, Emmett, Zeus, and Isaac do when the March list rolls around.
Your welcome!
Dante, ive really gotten a lot better with him since we last played. Hes my best character by far.
Nariko, Kratos, and Kat are all interchangeable as a sub.
Kratos is so effortless though compared to Kat and Nariko. 150 AP every combo, its so fast and easy. Bascially impossible to interupt.
I pride myself on being able to Burst combo with every character that doesnt require a wall bounce though ^_^
JStein0222
Member
Your welcome!
Dante, ive really gotten a lot better with him since we last played. Hes my best character by far.
Nariko, Kratos, and Kat are all interchangeable as a sub.
Kratos is so effortless though compared to Kat and Nariko. 150 AP every combo, its so fast and easy. Bascially impossible to interupt.
I pride myself on being able to Burst combo with every character that doesnt require a wall bounce though ^_^
Cool cool cool. I do really like Kat, more in 1 v 1 then anything else I think. But you're right about Kratos. It's just effortless in comparison. Funny, Dante may be my least played character in the game
Im not surprised He is soooo different than every other character.
As long as we are on the subject im fairly certain that 90% of all of Dantes tech is unitended haha.
Empty Bold Cancel, Hunger loop? Totally on accident, thats a fluke.
His Hunger Sythes usage in general seems to be made for air only. (Its right square in air, but only after a triangle to angel dash, so basically inteded to be situational)
But its applied usage is as a combo starter and hit confirm for grounded opponents.
His right square on the ground gives 4 AP if the opponent is behind you.
4? 4 AP? Where the hell did that number come from? Every single attack in the game is in increments of 5 but that does 4? Doesnt make jack sense haha
As long as we are on the subject im fairly certain that 90% of all of Dantes tech is unitended haha.
Empty Bold Cancel, Hunger loop? Totally on accident, thats a fluke.
His Hunger Sythes usage in general seems to be made for air only. (Its right square in air, but only after a triangle to angel dash, so basically inteded to be situational)
But its applied usage is as a combo starter and hit confirm for grounded opponents.
His right square on the ground gives 4 AP if the opponent is behind you.
4? 4 AP? Where the hell did that number come from? Every single attack in the game is in increments of 5 but that does 4? Doesnt make jack sense haha
I'd like to see a head to head between you an my cousin. I agree with a lot of what you said, but I think that can be said for most characters outside of the top 7 or 8. The balance is so shifted towards the top that the characters like sackboy or parappa (my main) get the shaft in a lot of areas.
My opinion on sackboy, and maybe you can comment.
-His shockpad is incredible. Alows for you to bait your opponents in while using the fan to cancel out ranging.
- At the same time as this you can range your opponents out.
- The Jam does need a buff I agree.
- The Cake is incredible. Like a massive landmine that stays on the ground until you shoot another one, and gives 20 AP with each hit.
- Super elusive and very small. can jump very high, and his spawn portal is incredible for escaping supers.
- He has multiple hit confirms for his lvl 1.
- He has multiple ways to start up his AP burst combo
- He has the grab midair, which is a nice attack to get position on your opponent.
- He has a throw into a lvl 1 hit confirm
- His lvl 1 is weak made good by confirms, his lvl 2 is pretty much a guaranteed kill, and lvl 3 is the best in the game.
- There is no better character in the game when his back is against a wall.
I kinda think thats all people want honestly, and perhaps his lvl 1 could cost less. Instead of 150.
What else did people want?
And the grab confirm only works on some opponents.
Ehh the grab confirm while a nice one, is definitely not the first option for a confirm, just saying it's in there with his bag of tricks, which is something he has a lot of. Hell he can have 2 landmines of the ground at once with the shockpad and cupcake. His jam session and cupcake should split AP amounts or something, but other than the Jam being borderline worthless, he's fine from what I've seen.
There are definitely more pressing concerns that need to be dealt with before Sackthing, that's for sure.
That's my thing, the amount of talk in this thread seems to imply that he's just a bottom of the barrel character, when IMO his still mid to upper mid tier. I think Big Daddy and Sir Daniel need more help first big time. Even before all of this though, the more important thing is to take down the invincibles. Which again as of recently Good Cole has FLEW into the top tier. His lvl 1 confirms... he has a limitless amount. He can confirm you from the ground, from mid air, from downward attacks, it's INSANE.
So after all my venting about quitters unfairly setting me back 60-70 points on my road to the next belt shortly before the end of last season, i still managed to reach the brown belt, only for the titles not to be unlocked when the current season started.
At least now i won't feel compelled to put up with quitters in ranked and can just play quick match for fun. Not that there aren't any quitters, but at least it won't be as aggravating as in ranked.
From what i've read i'm not the only one that didn't get his titles though. I thought they fixed this in early february, or has the recent patch undone the fix? It's as if Naughty Dog's MP people have followed me to PSASBR.
Yep, stopped playing ranked as soon as I realized they haven't fixed the title unlocking bug too. Players in unranked have use more varied characters and they don't ragequit, it's so much better than ranked.
Yeah and IMO the better players have shifted to unranked as well. This major shift happened after the first season ended I think, at least from what I've seen from personal experience.
TimeEffect
Member
That's it, actually. Just a jam buff, and his super 1 to cost a bit less, like 100-120
There are some serious issues they need to fix.
- Sly's teleport is too strong. It can make it near impossible to get an attack on a good player.
- Ratchet's move where you suck the person up, throw them against a wall and use level 1 needs to go. Really I'm not a fan of any combo that can lead to an instant level 1 kill. (Kat is another one).
- Part of me feels that you shouldn't be allowed to avoid supers by rolling.
I'm forgetting some things, but I'll come back to this.
- Sly's teleport is too strong. It can make it near impossible to get an attack on a good player.
- Ratchet's move where you suck the person up, throw them against a wall and use level 1 needs to go. Really I'm not a fan of any combo that can lead to an instant level 1 kill. (Kat is another one).
- Part of me feels that you shouldn't be allowed to avoid supers by rolling.
I'm forgetting some things, but I'll come back to this.
Rolling to dodge needs to stay. Combos into confirms are ridiculous and should be gone, especially Kats. Ratchets confirm is broken for a few reasons.
1. it's entirely too easy.
2. he can confirm from anything that knocks you down as well.
3. and finally he hits you with it even if you aren't anywhere near the bullets, but instead inside him for lack of a better term.
Yup, I know exactly what you mean. Also, I'm starting to think that Slys invisibility should be limited to say 8 seconds at a time. After that you have to 'recharge'.
I actually don't think his invisibility is a problem, I can usually see him fine. He has a ton of other problems though, as you mentioned his teleport, his lvl is absolutely god tier, his moves that are mostly unpunishable... guy is just a beast. Still put Drake a cut above him.
His invisibility would be fine if he didn't have the fastest teleport and counter in the goddamn game. I really don't know what they were thinking when they "balanced" Sly Cooper. I wouldn't neessarily put Drake above him though. I've seen very few people bother using all of Sly's cheap tactics, but the ones that do are pretty much unbeatable since they have every possible advantage against you no matter who you're using. I can't say the same for Drake, who (despite being obnoxious and overpowered) can be matched by fellow top tiers like Kratos and Raiden.
Also, getting rid of the ability to roll to dodge supers would be awful. You can't block them and jumping rarely works, how else would you avoid them?
I agree on Sly's teleport. It's kinda ridiculous and can hit on certain projectiles from across the map. Wut.
Ratchet's confirm is easy but it's not unlike a lot of others... I think in a perfect world, the only level 1 confirms would be obvious ones like Spike and Sweet Tooth's, if that. Else it becomes like it is now, guy gets a level one and then it is total turtling mind games because you know exactly what confirm(s) they are going to bust out.
Cole's confirmed level 1 also has to go. I was playing stock limited free for all, and it was down to me with 3 lives, and cole with 2. I thought I had this locked down. However because I was using Toro, he got me down to 1 life with his confirmed kills. He gets me into a short combo, uses his level 1 while I'm knocked down, and am still thrown to the wall defenceless. My level 1 however has to be timed just right in order to kill someone, which can be very hard in a 1v1 situation. Cole had a huge advantage over me. I did manage to win however. I got lucky with the items and turn him to stone for my first kill. Then I shot him with a gun which stunned him, and killed him just as he was getting up. He was yelling the mic lol.
Every time I fight a Cole I go into major rage mode. I hate fighting Coles. I would literally prefer to fight 3 Kratos' than a single Cole. Hell even, 2 Nates (not 3 Nates, that's quite possibly the most awful thing ever)
That said, Toro has a pretty solid hit confirm.
I think Sly (like most people think lol) just needs a cooldown on his counter. Otherwise I think he's fine personally.
Random aside - I love fighting Raidens.
Haha i know that feel, still have a hard time understanding why the nerfed the fuck out of his level 2 and left his godly level 1 as it is...
I think when used properly Drake is broken period. As for sly yeah he's disgustingly OP but again his invisibility is not really a problem just his other stuff is. Raiden has fallen off the map compared to those guys as far as I'm concerned. He's still top tier, mainly because of his ridiculous supers, but Drake destroys both him and Kratos. Also Kat is the goddess tier all of god tier.
That's not his teleport you're talking about, it's his counter, but either way that is overpowered as well, given the little punish time it has. Ratchets confirm is the easiest in the game... it can be down anywhere on the map, all it takes is either knocking down the opponent or grabbing them and walking them over to an edge. On top of this he has a pain in the ass throw loop, which is very difficult to work your way out of.
I said this a few posts up actually. As of late Cole has found his way into the God tier OP characters. He can confirm SO easily. He can confirm from his lightning drop, he can confirm if he knocks you down, he can confirm from his tether, he has incredible range, so on, so forth. I don't know why he wasn't found out like this until recently, but he is insanely OP with the amount of lvl 1 confirms.
Yeah that hit confirm is sweet.
Yeah, as a Cole main I feel he's top tier. He has a shield that absorbs projectiles, kill confirms from midair (and from his up throw in certain situations), a good melee and ranged game, and nice supers. Plus, great grounded and aerial mobility thanks to his Grind, Tether, and Ice Jump.
He is more execution heavy and less brain-dead to use then Evil Cole however.
He is more execution heavy and less brain-dead to use then Evil Cole however.
This is all just my opinion, sorry if you disagree:
A character like cole shouldnt be prioritized for nerfs because have a lot of confirms, and is therefore tough to fight 1v1. I get that a lot of people like stock unranked, which also inevitably leads to 1v1 situations, but nerfing a character based off those experiences doesnt make much sense. This game isnt really meant to be played 1v1, its meant to be 2v2 and ffa. In 2v2, cole is top tier, but DEFINITELY not god tier. In ffa he cant rack up the kills NEARLY as fast as kratos/kat/raiden/drake/sly.
It seems like a lot of you cry "nerf" for upper tier characters, and "buff" for mid tier characters. It should be the god tier characters in ffa and 2v2 that are nerfed way before cole, and the bottom tier characters (radec, sir dan, BD) that are buffed way before sackboy.
I mean seriously, someone above mentioned that parappa should be buffed, when the boom box ap glitch hasnt even been fixed yet (to my knowledge)
Some of you really should prioritize your complaints haha
A character like cole shouldnt be prioritized for nerfs because have a lot of confirms, and is therefore tough to fight 1v1. I get that a lot of people like stock unranked, which also inevitably leads to 1v1 situations, but nerfing a character based off those experiences doesnt make much sense. This game isnt really meant to be played 1v1, its meant to be 2v2 and ffa. In 2v2, cole is top tier, but DEFINITELY not god tier. In ffa he cant rack up the kills NEARLY as fast as kratos/kat/raiden/drake/sly.
It seems like a lot of you cry "nerf" for upper tier characters, and "buff" for mid tier characters. It should be the god tier characters in ffa and 2v2 that are nerfed way before cole, and the bottom tier characters (radec, sir dan, BD) that are buffed way before sackboy.
I mean seriously, someone above mentioned that parappa should be buffed, when the boom box ap glitch hasnt even been fixed yet (to my knowledge)
Some of you really should prioritize your complaints haha
JStein0222
Member
1. Isn't that for us to decide?
2. Cole main? I personally have seen Coles rack up sick amounts of kills. It really doesn't take that long for him to build to a level 1 if he's good
3. The reason behind us all calling for buffs of mid tier characters is because we're trying to suggest ways to make X character competitive. It's easier to talk about and adjust characters that are almost there than characters like Sir Dan where we don't even know where to start.