Lapidus' Beard
Member
Trackmania VR today? I'm going to need to put a bucket next to me...
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PlayStation VR Launch Thread: Welcome to The Real World
- Thread starter Sangetsu-II
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Yeah, I'm worried they may have cherry-picked/created tracks that specifically are less crazy than what is otherwise playable.
Trailer does a bit of a poor job showing how VR works in the game too.
JetBlackPanda
Member
I get that people get sick in VR however nothing makes me sick. So I hate that I can't turn off comfort controls.
More options are better devs
More options are better devs
Which is exactly why this aspect of VR shouldn't be ignored. Comfort goes both ways.
Played Super Hyper Cube (has that demo always been there?) and Bound in VR for the first time last night.
SHC made soo much more sense in the headset than when I was watching it off screen from streams. They don't really give you much of a sense of how much depth and viewing angle you have in the headset vs. what is shown in 2d. I'd really like to have it but not @ 30$ right now.
Bound in VR is a little....off for me. I had trouble with the camera, it always seemed like I was looking 90 degrees to the right to follow the character, or otherwise not straight on. I could see getting a neck ache after playing for a while. This is also another game where holding option to try and recenter does nothing. Really wish they would standardize that on the OS level.
Also watched Alumette. Felt a little cut off at the end from a narrative point of view but really interesting experience to show how you could be in a story as it unfolds around you. Would definitely be interested in more like this.
SHC made soo much more sense in the headset than when I was watching it off screen from streams. They don't really give you much of a sense of how much depth and viewing angle you have in the headset vs. what is shown in 2d. I'd really like to have it but not @ 30$ right now.
Bound in VR is a little....off for me. I had trouble with the camera, it always seemed like I was looking 90 degrees to the right to follow the character, or otherwise not straight on. I could see getting a neck ache after playing for a while. This is also another game where holding option to try and recenter does nothing. Really wish they would standardize that on the OS level.
Also watched Alumette. Felt a little cut off at the end from a narrative point of view but really interesting experience to show how you could be in a story as it unfolds around you. Would definitely be interested in more like this.
Animation-Imp
Member
Why oh why didn't I buy trackmania when it was on sale...
It looks so good in vr.
I can find it on disc for next to nothing, but I like to keep my vr games all digital.
It looks so good in vr.
I can find it on disc for next to nothing, but I like to keep my vr games all digital.
GoldenCrow
Member
It is a real problem but only for those that suffer from it but a reviewer that gets nausea give zero indication to another individual if they will suffer from it in the slightest as it is extremely subjective and down to how the brain processes the data. Not only are people that get motion sickness not qualified to review a product because they can't play it they shouldn't be forced to do it as a job because it is interfering with their wellbeing. It is up to the individual to understand what their limits are with the technology because nobody can do that for them. Ideally a VR review should detail what the experience is and what options there are if any to change that so they can assess if it is something they can handle.
Simulation sickness in VR isn't going anywhere anytime soon, as it requires something to interfere with the inner ear, which the technology for has currently hit a massive brick wall in terms of a consumer product due to everyones brain interpreting the signals completely differently. There are things that people can do to reduce nausea such as scopolamine transdermal patches but that is an extreme solution.
Teknopathetic
Member
Don't get too scared of Trackmania Turbo VR. From what I played of the demo (on PC), it is just the 40 tracks they designed for VR. The reason why is, from the tracks that were in the demo, there aren't any hair pins or 90 degree turns or anything like that. The tracks are relatively straight. There's no artificial rotation or side-to-side motion at all. The camera just moves forward and the car moves independently of the camera.
Because there's no side to side motion or rotation, it shouldn't really pose a motion sickness problem to most people.
Because there's no side to side motion or rotation, it shouldn't really pose a motion sickness problem to most people.
You are still missing the point. If a game causes VR sickness then it is flawed because it has failed to properly support varying levels of comfort. This is a very important factor that can't be ignored, period.
In fact it is arguably THE most important factor, since the tech is still in its infancy and if the general populace can't play the majority of games without being sick then it WILL die very quickly.
Mine at least.
it's a very real problem for some people. and i think that's the big problem in the review space. should someone who can't handle the experience rate a game lower because of that? or should someone who can handle the experience write a review that more accurately represents the game? would you want someone who gets sea sick reviewing cruises?
maybe there needs to at least be 2 people reviewing VR titles to offer both ends of the scale. because if this thread has proved anything, it is that there is no game that unanimously makes people nauseous.
Teknopathetic
Member
The exception to the "no hairpins" or 90 degree turns thing is when there's a big wallride/loop or something like that, where they bring the camera in to a bumper view.
Again, this is just based on the demo, but I'd imagine that's how the rest of the tracks are designed. When you consider most people's reaction to Trackmania in VR is "Well, i'd better go get a bucket," it makes sense that they designed tracks with those limitations and a camera on a straight path.
Again, this is just based on the demo, but I'd imagine that's how the rest of the tracks are designed. When you consider most people's reaction to Trackmania in VR is "Well, i'd better go get a bucket," it makes sense that they designed tracks with those limitations and a camera on a straight path.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb3sH9FxVj4&feature=share...What
This is going to be the disappointment of the year, isn't it?
There is one of the maps. Looks pretty okey to me
Teknopathetic
Member
"There is one of the maps. Looks pretty cool to me"
It's important to know that that is a ridiculously simple and tame track by Trackmania standards.
It's important to know that that is a ridiculously simple and tame track by Trackmania standards.
Yes, definitely. The game has failed to properly accommodate and needs to be called out for it.
That's why reviews exist in the first place. A review that simply praises the product and ignores its problems is not a review anymore, it's a glorified PR spiel.
digita1alchemy
Member
Jesus. First GT Sport and now this. If not for Rez, I'd probably be regretting my purchase. Why even bother with VR for Trackmania if they have to dumb the game down for it?
Yeah I know, played them all. I changed the cool to okey
after I saw the full video.Edit: there is loops in the update
Videogamer had everyone in their office play Driveclub and noone could do it.
but i'd argue it isn't the games fault that some people are prone to sickness. some people are more prone to car sickness, should cars get called out for it because they fail to "properly accommodate"
it seems like an unrealistic ask. and i can't say i agree with you at all tbh. i wouldn't expect someone who gets sick riding roller coasters to give me a valid review of a roller-coaster. same with my example of a sea sick cruise reviewer. and blame can't really be placed on those activities either.
who said anything about "simply praising" a product? i want the game to be reviewed as all games are. separate from that person's inability to handle motion. i want to know if the campaign is long, exciting, fun, what the sound design is like. if it's a good game or not. whether that person felt sick playing it has nothing to do with the game itself. i play driveclub for hours in VR, some people can't play for more than 5 minutes, should either statement be in a review? no.
i wouldn't want to read a review of a 2 week cruise that basically finished with "i got sea sick, 1/10" or someone rating halo 5 a 2/10 because they got motion sick...it's a largely redundant statement in the context of a review and has nothing to do with the game itself.
No but it is the game's fault for ignoring that fact and not providing adequate settings for comfort.
Real-life sickness inducing activities are irrelevant to this discussion because they are inherently impossible to provide comfort settings compared to VR.
JetBlackPanda
Member
I think its cool they made VR specific tracks but why not just unlock VR mode for everything and let us figure it out?
If we can handle it great, if not VR mode is still a thing.
If a game makes me sick I'm not going to play it. If it doesn't make me sick I want to know how good/bad it is.
A review that says "this game made me sick" is useless to everyone.
somme
Member
My VR legs are getting pretty good now. Haven't felt nauseated in over a week, and to be honest it was only really RIGS and Scavenger's Odyssey that really made me unwell anyway.
There should be safety options on all games - mainly because, if someone buys VR next year they may not have VR Legs yet.
But they should also be very customisable. I don't need them anymore and so would like the option to remove them.
There should be safety options on all games - mainly because, if someone buys VR next year they may not have VR Legs yet.
But they should also be very customisable. I don't need them anymore and so would like the option to remove them.
digita1alchemy
Member
I wonder if part of the reason for these separate VR modes in some games is performance related. As in, they can't easily get the "normal" game running at a high enough frame rate to work well with VR.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Mandates are one thing. It doesn't mean they still aren't running faster on the Pro.
Teknopathetic
Member
"but i'd argue it isn't the games fault that some people are prone to sickness. some people are more prone to car sickness, should cars get called out for it because they fail to "properly accommodate" "
It'd be a flawed argument because there are numerous things VR that are known to be more likely to cause motion sickness. These aren't things that are inherent to VR, but rather due to the way some developers are designing their game and implementing locomotion in VR. These are things that are known and can be avoided. Car sickness is a physical response to something that is inherent to cars. If people were getting VR sickness simply from being in VR, regardless of what game or experience they're in, your argument would be valid.
It'd be a flawed argument because there are numerous things VR that are known to be more likely to cause motion sickness. These aren't things that are inherent to VR, but rather due to the way some developers are designing their game and implementing locomotion in VR. These are things that are known and can be avoided. Car sickness is a physical response to something that is inherent to cars. If people were getting VR sickness simply from being in VR, regardless of what game or experience they're in, your argument would be valid.
it's also impossible to provide comfort settings for VR if someone is prone to sickness. it isn't a "normal" sensation. just like bobbing up and down on waves despite having your feet firmly planted on a cruise ship isn't a "normal" sensation. they both have means to help lessen the effects of sickness, but if you're prone to it, you're prone to it. if you're not, you're not. neither fact should be in a review about a game. it never was concerning regular motion sickness some people experience playing some first person shooters. i fail to see why it should here.
people are
my dad feels sick after 5 minutes no matter what he tried, even passive experiences like the kitchen demo made him nauseous.
Do it. We should do a GAF-PSVR-reviews-thread
DJ Lushious
Member
Firing up Eagle Flight for the first time was another one of those "VR" moments, where the realization that this feeling cannot be recreated in standard 2D displays. And, absolutely no spoilers, but that intro for the single-player campaign?
And I, too, have stopped to wait for the Pro. Only two more days! Potential buyers beware, Eagle Flight features Ubisoft's Collectathon®!
Because they'd need to add a cockpit (or at least improve bumper cam).
Sounds like they've tried to make it work in third person, which comes with enough restrictions to make it pointless.
So frustrating. I thought the need for first person was so obvious that it was guaranteed to be in. I'd pay full price for a Trackmania VR, but this is gonna be just another side mode with token amount of content
Rubik8
Member
What a bunch of wimps! Build up those VR legs for maximum enjoyment!
(Big talk from someone that doesn't get VR nausea)
somme
Member
Was gonna ask where the best place to actually post these reviews would be? Do people normally have review blogs?
JetBlackPanda
Member
If you have the time you should. Nobody else is really focusing on it right now.
No Idea, but I think it would be cool with a dedicated thread with member reviews. But dunno if its allowed on gaf
digita1alchemy
Member
What are these things? I've been trying to pinpoint myself what it is about certain games that make me nauseous, but I am still not sure. I feel like frame rate is a big part of it, especially in games where the camera is panning independently of where you may be looking looking, like rounding turns in Drive Club. Conversely, the demo for COD Jackal demo wasn't so bad for me, which I attributed to so much of the panning screen just being black, since you are in space. I wish VR games had to state what frame rate mode they use, because I have no idea how fast either of those games run. Is there a database of this somewhere?
Teknopathetic
Member
The main things are artificial locomotion (particularly side-to-side motion), rotation, and frame rate. I'm not sure why Driveclub is causing so much trouble for people when racing games on PC (assuming they run well) don't seem to be causing as much of a problem.
"my dad feels sick after 5 minutes no matter what he tried, even passive experiences like the kitchen demo made him nauseous."
The people reviewing these games are not. Which is why they're dinging games for inducing motion sickness in themselves, because they know that other games do not.
"my dad feels sick after 5 minutes no matter what he tried, even passive experiences like the kitchen demo made him nauseous."
The people reviewing these games are not. Which is why they're dinging games for inducing motion sickness in themselves, because they know that other games do not.
Sangetsu-II
Member
Do it, been wondering where to find trusted reviews where the review the game based on the content and not just motion sickness.
Like right now for example, Robinson has 5 reviews that mention motion sickness yet they don't tell me what the content is like.
I can take most motion based games just tell me what the games like.
Is there some online leaderboard?
Just to be 100% clear...you can't play the existing tracks in VR?
somme
Member
Not that I could see. It was the VR tracks only.
GoldenCrow
Member
Really disappointed in Trackmania. I think for those looking for a more accommodating driving experience then this is probably it as the HMD is set to the track rather than the vehicle. On the second arcade track when it locks onto the car this is a far more engaging experience but because I can't do this at all times my interest has completely gone.
Enjoying Eagle Flight but the amount of eagle in my vision is distracting, the beak is fine but the rest of it is too much as I want to see as much as possible, the banking darkness and when you get closer to the ground is just damn annoying. Same with the water splash, it just looks a bit shit and not needed as it doesn't really add anything.
Enjoying Eagle Flight but the amount of eagle in my vision is distracting, the beak is fine but the rest of it is too much as I want to see as much as possible, the banking darkness and when you get closer to the ground is just damn annoying. Same with the water splash, it just looks a bit shit and not needed as it doesn't really add anything.
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