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Pokémon XY |OT4| Don't Bank On It
- Thread starter ColtraineGF
- Start date
Aggrotek
Member
3v3 is way too fast for this kind of thing.
Sleep Clause in singles is pretty important.
An Elite Four might be cool, actually. Make them the best leaders by winrate or something, and give them the fexibility of either going monotype or themed.
I find this to be an odd hold over from previous Gens honestly. Safety Goggles, Chesto and Lum Berries, plus Grass type immunities to Spore and Sleep Powder make Sleep Clause less important. Hypnosis has questionable accuracy, and Dark Void Smeargle is the only other thing that could pose a problem. Plus a number of things like Flame Orb Clefable or Toxic Orb Gliscor totally shut down status effects.
Aggrotek
Member
There is only 1 grass gym. And gym leaders shouldn't be forced into using items that will only stop it once. Singles is a completely different metagame. I think it is important.
I usually more in favour of 6v6 but because this is a Gym/mono-type setting I figure it will be much more fun for the Gym leaders if they get to pick what to use against foe. You can only pick one mega if you go 6v6. If you go 3v3, you can have 2 mega on your team and that item won't be wasted slot. It's also much harder to cover your base when you go mono-type.
Lol. I went fairy when I remembered your clefairy build. Loved it.
You got the choice to use M.Gardevoir and M.Mawile!
Start moving erratically and praise Helix.
OK, here are the assignments that are forced given people's choices:
Normal: macklelol
Fighting: Alchemy
Flying: one_kill
Poison: Wichu
Ground: Spiritfox
Rock: Boogiepop
Bug: JulianImp
Ghost: Usobuko
Steel: KiraFA37
Fire: El_Chino
Water: Professor Beef
Grass: PreyingShark
Electric: fek
Psychic: Aggrotek
Ice: B-Dubs
Dragon: Quest1
Dark: OceanBlue
Fairy: SeZMehK
The only unassigned people are myself and JulianImp - since we both want Poison and one other unassigned type, there isn't currently a 'correct' assignment. I suggest waiting for a final leader to choose their preferred type of the three:
Last leader chooses Poison: I go Dark, JulianImp goes Bug
Last leader chooses Bug: I go Dark, JulianImp goes Poison
Last leader chooses Dark: I go Poison, JulianImp goes Bug
EDIT: Gets a bit problematic if that person is OK with both Bug and Dark... In that case, we'll have to settle it with a battle >
EDIT 2: OceanBlue has taken Dark, so everything seems to be sorted.
Normal: macklelol
Fighting: Alchemy
Flying: one_kill
Poison: Wichu
Ground: Spiritfox
Rock: Boogiepop
Bug: JulianImp
Ghost: Usobuko
Steel: KiraFA37
Fire: El_Chino
Water: Professor Beef
Grass: PreyingShark
Electric: fek
Psychic: Aggrotek
Ice: B-Dubs
Dragon: Quest1
Dark: OceanBlue
Fairy: SeZMehK
Last leader chooses Poison: I go Dark, JulianImp goes Bug
Last leader chooses Bug: I go Dark, JulianImp goes Poison
Last leader chooses Dark: I go Poison, JulianImp goes Bug
EDIT: Gets a bit problematic if that person is OK with both Bug and Dark... In that case, we'll have to settle it with a battle >
EDIT 2: OceanBlue has taken Dark, so everything seems to be sorted.
Aggrotek
Member
I think that is what makes it challenging though. And if we give the Leaders the opportunity to mix up there teams 2 times a month I think it will be more fun.
Even with player made gyms, there's no Dark gym LOL.
Still, certain types would lend themselves better to winning matches more often, while others would be at a distinct disadvantage. Perhaps the leaders could challenge E4 members much in the same way regular players could challenge the leaders, and winning on a best of three match would let them swap places and play a looser theme based around a looser theme (like, say, ancient pokémon, which encompassed 'mons such as the fossils, Bronzong, Ninetales, Xatu, among others).
I picked Ghost because I have the most ghost type ready.
Misdreavus, Gengar, Banette, Cofagrigus, Chandelure, Trevenant, Gourgeist, Sableye, Golurk, Aegislash .
Asked the top 4 of the double tournament to be Elite 4. No champion like Red/Blue. If they are already in the Gym leader, they'll get upgraded to E4 except they will still go with the mono-type they choose.
Misdreavus, Gengar, Banette, Cofagrigus, Chandelure, Trevenant, Gourgeist, Sableye, Golurk, Aegislash .
Shouldn't we have a E4 or something?
Asked the top 4 of the double tournament to be Elite 4. No champion like Red/Blue. If they are already in the Gym leader, they'll get upgraded to E4 except they will still go with the mono-type they choose.
Poison, Psychic, Bug, Flying, Fighting, Fairy, Water, Dark, Rock, Ice, Steel, and Ghost all have dual type Grass Pokemon they can use. Plus there is Electric Terrain, Misty Terrain, Safeguard, and Substitute users that can block Sleep moves. Sleep isn't that hard to overcome anymore, I think Smogon is just a little set in their ways.
If this was B/W2 I'd probably argue for Sleep Clause though. I just find it to be rather easy to play around now.
I'd say leaders are allowed to change their teams around at will, mostly to give them more versatility at the expense of taking longer to breed and raise more than six pokémon.
Poor Karen must be crying somewhere.
The only thing that changes is how fast Pokemon level, what moves* they learn and at what level. Stats aren't impacted by evolving late.
Aggrotek
Member
These are all things I shouldn't be forced into using. I really think that Sleep Clause (for singles) is very important.
Pokémon only level faster if they're past the level where they'd normally evolve (meaning you stopped them from evolving). In the case of Duoblade, it won't get extra experience since its later evolution is item-forced, rather than by level.
Oh, didn't know about that. Figured all evolutions just jacked up the level curve.
This I don't really agree with, bringing specific Pokemon/Items/Moves to a fight to counter specific threats is half the game. Should we ban entry hazards because it forces people to bring Rapid Spin/Defog? Should we ban moves that hit more than one opponent in doubles because it forces me to bring Wide Guard?
Sleep is a good status condition to use, but it also has many counters and has been significantly weakened this generation. Especially with the sleep counter not resetting on switching. It is by no means an instant win button that breaks things if Sleep Clause isn't enforced.
Just to catch up on my personal opinions since I jump-started it, but if people would prefer to go other ways, that's cool too.
At least my initial idea was gyms+league, so no real space for an Elite Four. Though we could tweak things in such a way such that the "best" gyms are marked as the E4 (so like a title based on record), or something to that effect. And I was personally thinking doubles with your normal VGC rules (though I definitely wouldn't want the Kalos Dex exclusive rules, since I don't think monotype teams need their pulls restricted outside of what's reasonable). Though I think keeping the "Kalos-bred" restriction could be nice to keep the whole move tutor stuff under control.
But yeah, since things seem to have properly evolved beyond me, feel free to proceed however, just my 2 cents on things.
Oh, but we should definitely try to get an artist on board for badges at least, if only because poor Dark still lacks a badge to steal from the games. And we'll need to make a thread once we have the basics worked out. I also think it could be cool if we all keep some nice breeding rejects to offer to people who win our badges, since giving out TMs doesn't work ever since they became infinite.
At least my initial idea was gyms+league, so no real space for an Elite Four. Though we could tweak things in such a way such that the "best" gyms are marked as the E4 (so like a title based on record), or something to that effect. And I was personally thinking doubles with your normal VGC rules (though I definitely wouldn't want the Kalos Dex exclusive rules, since I don't think monotype teams need their pulls restricted outside of what's reasonable). Though I think keeping the "Kalos-bred" restriction could be nice to keep the whole move tutor stuff under control.
But yeah, since things seem to have properly evolved beyond me, feel free to proceed however, just my 2 cents on things.
Oh, but we should definitely try to get an artist on board for badges at least, if only because poor Dark still lacks a badge to steal from the games. And we'll need to make a thread once we have the basics worked out. I also think it could be cool if we all keep some nice breeding rejects to offer to people who win our badges, since giving out TMs doesn't work ever since they became infinite.
Aggrotek
Member
Sleep is a huge condition. You are unable to do ANYTHING. And you aren't guaranteed to wake up for 1-5 turns. Even if I brought a Grass type or a Pokemon holding an item to prevent sleep. It only stalls it. Once that thing is gone, the opponent has free reign to put my entire team to sleep, setup while I can't act whatsoever and win without me having a chance to legitimately play the game.
Playing with even 1 of your pokemon asleep is not FUN. When 2 or 3 of them are put to sleep basically ensures victory for the other player because you have to wait out the turns while taking damage or being set up on.
The consensus seems to be doubles.
I'd be OK with Kalos-bred only - no point in disadvantaging people just because they don't have access to older games.
I would also consider allowing an off-type Pokémon if it fits with the theme, as done by several Elite Four in the actual games. Stuff like Drapion on a Bug team, Venomoth on a Flying team, or Florges on a Grass team. I don't know what everyone else thinks about this, though.
Oh, and I can do badges if needed
We still need an 18th Gym Leader, I think.
Professor Beef
Banned
Pokemon League of Legends
Aggrotek
Member
I don't really wanna do doubles.... I think my proposal is a good example of how we could do it.
If there's enough people, we can set up separate singles and doubles leagues. That'll also allow more people to participate, especially those not used to doubles.
Aggrotek
Member
This is my choice.
I think we could do it so that you have to get at least ~10 badges to challenge the E4.
Well, I'd prefer if we were consistent and had a full set of doubles gyms - challengers wouldn't need to train both a singles and a doubles team (and we'd avoid needing to switch teams and the potential to accidentally bring the wrong team). Again, if people are up for it, having two full sets of gyms, for both singles and doubles, could work. People more comfortable playing singles would collect the singles badges, while the rest would collect doubles badges.
and now I really want a rotation battle league
But then we could end up having more leaders than actual challengers. >_>
You can just have the gym pick from any of the Battle Spot formats or just Singles or Doubles and copy the rules verbatim. Singles and Doubles on Battle Spot are pretty well playtested formats that don't have rules change randomly from month to month. They're also enforceable in-game and don't last four hours.
Why not allow leaders to challenge gyms and collect badges too? Obviously leaders wouldn't be able to get their own badge (or we could say that leaders start with their own badge).
As I said, I would prefer gyms be consistent, to minimise confusion for challengers and not require them to have mastered multiple formats.
...though now that I've said that, that actually sounds pretty cool - testing challengers in different ways. I think I actually agree with this (do we have to limit it to Battle Spot formats?)
Oh man, the Normal gym would be a pain in the ass. Par for the course for Normal gyms, then
Dang, now you've made me sad. It is crazy that they came up with a neat idea like inverse battles and then limited it to one trainer.
Anyway, some more of my 2 cents: I think leaders should definitely be allowed to participate, if only so we don't cut the pool of people playing too heavily. Though the question remains as to whether they get a bonus (start with their badge), or a handicap (can't earn their badge). Oh, and if one or two people want to do a singles gym that sounds cool to me since it'd add a little flavor, though I do think we should primarily stick to one type for the sake of consistency.
The only unassigned people are myself and JulianImp - since we both want Poison and one other unassigned type, there isn't currently a 'correct' assignment. I suggest waiting for a final leader to choose their preferred type of the three:
Last leader chooses Poison: I go Dark, JulianImp goes Bug
Last leader chooses Bug: I go Dark, JulianImp goes Poison
Last leader chooses Dark: I go Poison, JulianImp goes Bug
EDIT: Gets a bit problematic if that person is OK with both Bug and Dark... In that case, we'll have to settle it with a battle >
I'll take Dark then. I guess I need to start breeding, lol.
Can challenging leaders use their own team or are they limited to their gym team? Would be cool if they can challenge as a trainer or as a gym leader.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Being able to do it as either would be neat, with the potential for gym badges on the line for both sides!
So I guess that puts me as Poison. JulianImp, are you fine with Bug?
I'd say they can use a different team. They're free to use their gym team if they want more of a challenge - enforcing gym teams will basically turn this into a monotype tournament
I'm planning on building both doubles and singles teams anyway, so I'll be ready for either. Not sure what you mean by 'preferential' rules - does the challenger pick a ruleset or something?
Aggrotek
Member
Like sleep clause, item clause ect. Not like how many pokemon you bring and 1 mega evolution.