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PoliGAF 2014 |OT| Kay Hagan and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad News

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W

Wilsongt

Member
Aaron Strife said:
I can't believe how much anti-Obama shit Republicans get away with. It's borderline treason. Imagine any of this stuff said by a Democratic congressman or MSNBC host during the Bush administration, especially around 9/11. They'd be crucified.

But these brave patriots just love their country so much *snif*
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Both sides do it.

Remember the Bush = Hitler signs? When people started posting pictures and videos apologizing to the world for reelecting Bush?
 
C

Chichikov

Member
APKmetsfan said:
TheTruth.jpg

Not related to anything but this was funny.
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That is great.
Fort Pillow is a nice touch.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Jooney said:
If the Dems somehow hold on to the senate, can someone please remember to bring up this post.

Any exec order prior to the midterims would have done more to bring out the vote on the GOP side. All the passion seems to be on that side of the debate - you only have to look as far back as early summer to see the vitriol coming from the children at the border crisis.
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As I said it's a lose lose. You could argue that conservatives are going to come out in force no matter what; ultimately the fact that this exec order is going to happen riles up the conservative base, regardless of whether Obama does it now or later. And Obama is currently getting hammered by immigration activists, many of whom thought this was a slam dunk just a week ago.

Ultimately Obama once again looks bad for saying he's going to do something and bowing to pressure. I can see the vulnerable democrat argument against doing the exec order, but I can also see this as just another reason for democrats to stay home in November.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
PhoenixDark said:
As I said it's a lose lose. You could argue that conservatives are going to come out in force no matter what; ultimately the fact that this exec order is going to happen riles up the conservative base, regardless of whether Obama does it now or later. And Obama is currently getting hammered by immigration activists, many of whom thought this was a slam dunk just a week ago.

Ultimately Obama once again looks bad for saying he's going to do something and bowing to pressure. I can see the vulnerable democrat argument against doing the exec order, but I can also see this as just another reason for democrats to stay home in November.
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The win scenario would have been to just keep the blame on the Boehner for the immigration problem and never say anything about "if congress won't do something, I will".
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
A wave could still ultimately occur. A stunning 70 percent of voters believe the country is headed in the wrong direction with the GOP holding a seven point advantage in voter confidence in finding the right solutions to fix the country’s problems, according to George Washington University’s battleground poll last week. But that same poll showed that the biggest reason why voters believe the country is headed in the wrong direction is because they have “issues” with Obama — not because of one issue in particular.
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:lol
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Oblivion said:
MJJDmdS.jpg
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YES! Run it!


Edit: I can't even imagine how they would run things. It would be like an endless SNL skit. But it is not like that is gonna happen. I think it is funny that some people think it could actually happen. It would be like a Kucinich/McKinney ticket . . . too ridiculous to even contemplate.
 
benjipwns

benjipwns

Banned
Avon Barksdale said:
Going back to the previous page, I was trying to find some GOP debates from 1996 and instead, I found some attack ads from Republicans basically accusing each other of being "too liberal".

The more things change...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgYVYdblxUA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPl3sp4F61c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTFLJS-Zs4o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcO4Bhcydek
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I like how Forbes got both Dole and Gramm in the one.

AND STEVE FORBES OPPOSES MANDATORY LIFE SENTENCES GASP

http://www.c-span.org/video/?64839-1/keyes-campaign-speech
MAY 1, 1995
Keyes Campaign Speech
Mr. Keyes talked about his agenda if he is elected president in 1996. He emphasized that the Republican party needs to continue to be firm on moral issues as it is on fiscal and social policy. He also added that he would bring the abortion issue before Congress for an open debate. 
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?63432-1/new-hampshire-republican-forum
http://www.c-span.org/video/?63441-1/new-hampshire-republican-forum
FEBRUARY 19, 1995
New Hampshire Republican Forum
Several aspirants to the Republican 1996 presidential nomination spoke about their opinions on a variety of issues including cutting government size and spending and value issues such as abortion.
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First part/link, they give speeches. Second part is the debate part. With a super young Carl Cameron. And Pat Buchanan starting off his answer by opposing world government. You also get to see Lynn Morley Martin during her shortlived campaign, a pro-choice, anti-tax cuts woman!

http://www.c-span.org/video/?67578-1/republican-presidential-candidates-forum
OCTOBER 11, 1995
Republican Presidential Candidates Forum
During this first televised forum of the 1996 presidential campaign, each of the ten Republican candidates had about eight minutes to speak to the studio and television audience. They each spoke for two minutes, answered moderator questions for about four and a half minutes, and then spoke again for another minute and a half.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?67766-1/republican-presidential-candidate-forum
OCTOBER 24, 1995
Republican Presidential Candidate Forum
Eight of the ten Republican presidential candidates participated in this forum with members of the American Conservative Union and others. They each had two minutes for opening remarks, five minutes for the same written questions and two minutes for closing remarks, although the format was not strictly observed
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?68465-1/republican-presidential-candidates
NOVEMBER 19, 1995
Republican Presidential Candidates
Republican presidential candidates addressed the Republican governors. Following their prepared remarks, they took questions from the governors.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?68684-1/iowa-republican-candidates-forum
NOVEMBER 29, 1995
Iowa Republican Candidates Forum
Republican candidates spoke in Des Moines on agricultural issues and answered questions. Presidential campaign ads were shown from some of the early primary states.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?69279-1/republican-presidential-debate
JANUARY 6, 1996
Republican Presidential Debate
Six Republican presidential candidates answered written questions from each other and the moderator and verbal questions from the audience.
Click to expand...
http://www.c-span.org/video/?69366-1/republican-presidential-candidates-debate
JANUARY 13, 1996
Republican Presidential Candidates Debate
The Des Moines Register and Iowa Public Television sponsored a forum before a large audience for the Republican presidential candidates to debate campaign issues. The Iowa caucuses will occur on February 12. After their prepared remarks, the candidates took questions from the audience.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?69949-1/new-hampshire-primary-debate
FEBRUARY 15, 1996
New Hampshire Primary Debate
In the last debate before the New Hampshire primary, eight Republican candidates answered questions on various issues. Each candidate received 75 seconds for an opening statement, 90 seconds to answer a question, and 60 to rebut another candidate’s answer.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?70099-1/republican-candidates-debate
FEBRUARY 22, 1996
Republican Candidates Debate
Republican presidential candidates debated the issues in Arizona. Senator Dole did not participate.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?70211-1/republican-candidates-forum
FEBRUARY 29, 1996
Republican Candidates Forum
Four Republican presidential candidates debated various issues by answering questions and responding to each other’s answers. In this debate, each candidate responded to his own negative advertisements and those run about him.
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http://www.c-span.org/video/?70269-1/republican-presidential-debate
MARCH 3, 1996
Republican Presidential Debate
Mr. Forbes, Mr. Alexander and Mr. Buchanan took questions from local journalists. They also interacted with each other. Senator Dole was invited to participate but did not attend.
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"I guess I was a Republican, before Republican was cool." - Lamar Alexander (Feb 19, 1995)
 
C

Coriolanus

Banned
speculawyer said:
YES! Run it!


Edit: I can't even imagine how they would run things. It would be like an endless SNL skit. But it is not like that is gonna happen. I think it is funny that some people think it could actually happen. It would be like a Kucinich/McKinney ticket . . . too ridiculous to even contemplate.
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And yet they'd probably still get some 40% of the vote.

Yay...
 
J

JesseEwiak

Member
Wilsongt said:
Oh God no. Pelosi was spitting truth. Tea Party Republicans and Fox News are just stirring the pot.
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One could make the argument, from making sure no Democrat's supported Bush's original SS privatization plan to being one of the leading voices against Iraq in the Democratic leadership to being the main voice within the Democratic leadership after Brown's win ti push forward on HC reform that she's likely the greatest Speaker of the House since Sam Rayburn.
 
benjipwns

benjipwns

Banned
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNQ0jPJWIbw
Greta Van Susteren admitted Friday “Off the Record” that she was called by the Obama White House and told to push FOX reporter Jennifer Griffin to drop her Benghazi investigation.

“Since day one of Benghazi FOX News has been aggressively investigating. It hasn’t been easy. It’s been more like pulling teeth to get answers from the Obama administration. The Obama administration’s behavior post Benghazi has been weird. Like they’re trying to hide something. First that silly story about that video. Remember Susan Rice on all the Sunday talk shows? Even President Obama kept talking about the video for weeks. So FOX continued to press for information… A few weeks later when FOX news reporter Jennifer Griffin said she was told there was a stand-down order at Benghazi, I got a weird call from the Obama administration trying to pressure me to get Jennifer to back down on her report. I thought the call from the Obama administration was dirty. Incidentally, I don’t control my colleagues and they don’t control me.”
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larrd • 13 hours ago
All well and good, but why didn't Greta come out with this information two years ago? I don't doubt her word on it, but it would have been nice to put a little more light on this topic before the 2012 election, no? Sharyl Atkinsson may have appreciated it, as well.

NJK • 9 hours ago
Obama is not legitimate. He's an Islamist. He can't be trusted. I think he's setting this country up for an attack. All of Washington is responsible for letting him do it. Hear that, FBI? You let these attacks happen. You let 9/11 happen, you let the Boston bombing happen, because you were conducting "outreach," to the enemy. No one trusts you anymore. You're all traitors. I hope one day, everyone involved with this creepy liar, can be put on trial and executed, just like the Nazi infiltrators were.
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Is Greta switching from Scientology to Islamism and that's why she sat on this massive scandal for two years?!?
 
J

jamesinclair

Banned
benjipwns said:
From Politico:
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Another fucking Obama special.

The democrat lack of reaction to Ferguson was an amazing way to tell the black vote to stay home.

Now they're setting up billboards to tell the Hispanic vote to fuck off too.

Watch them cry in November that they could have won if it wasn't for the 11% turnout, and then blame the voters and not themselves.
 
C

Cloudy

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
As I said it's a lose lose. You could argue that conservatives are going to come out in force no matter what; ultimately the fact that this exec order is going to happen riles up the conservative base, regardless of whether Obama does it now or later. And Obama is currently getting hammered by immigration activists, many of whom thought this was a slam dunk just a week ago.

Ultimately Obama once again looks bad for saying he's going to do something and bowing to pressure. I can see the vulnerable democrat argument against doing the exec order, but I can also see this as just another reason for democrats to stay home in November.
Click to expand...

Well if they can't wait a few freakin' weeks after waiting years, I don't know what to say. Here's what obviously happened. This plan was announced before the GOP and "Liberal" media successfully demagogued the South American refugee issue into an Immigration issue. I recall that Obama even had to mention the border kids when talking about his future executive action. Probably the last thing he wanted. I'm pretty sure they thought it might even be a vote-getter since the polls show most folks agree with CIR. Fact is, the politics have changed in the short-term.

Doing it before the elections would be a death sentence for the southern Dems and maybe even Jean Shaheen cos the GOP base would be even more fired up and those folks would come out against it for political reasons, alienating Dem voters. It could also even hurt the program itself. How will Obama have any credibility on this when a lot of the critics calling him "lawless" are from his own party? People just bitch and complain about everything he does without examining the enitre situation.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
NBC/Marist has McConnell winning by 8 points. McConnell has 47% to Grimes 39% with 8% going to the libertarian. YouGov also has a poll today putting him up 5.

That race is, sadly, over.
 
Z

zero shift

Banned
Chichikov said:
It's not so much about who you vote for, it's about what you demand from your elected officials.
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When Democratic voters realize that that the main party's candidate doesn't match up their views, their solution is to vote for someone else in the primaries or vote for them anyway in hopes that the nation will be compelled to move to the left after being satisfied with a Democratic candidate.


When Republican voters realize that their main party's candidate doesn't match up with their views their solution is to MAKE them match their views.

This why Democrats and especially the American left ALWAYS LOSES.
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
WayneMorse said:
As much as the people of Kentucky hate McConnell, they were never going to elect a Democrat to the Senate.
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Just as anyone here would never vote for a republican. I don't know why people are so surprised.

A few pages back everybody was talking about how they hate clinton but will vote for her. The inability to apply that logic to republicans is hilarious, it got to be about Obama or something, their racist or something, instead of the fact that they're just partisan and vote that way (a lot of partisanship is drive by some of these things but its not the reason they're not voting out mcconnell)
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
zero shift said:
When Democratic voters realize that that the main party's candidate doesn't match up their views, their solution is to vote for someone else in the primaries or vote for them anyway in hopes that the nation will be compelled to move to the left after being satisfied with a Democratic candidate.


When Republican voters realize that their main party's candidate doesn't match up with their views their solution is to MAKE them match their views.

This why Democrats and especially the American left ALWAYS LOSES.
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Conservatives make Republicans match their views through the primary threat. Liberals simply almost never even put up a fight in the primaries. And a lot of that is because the left of left doesn't have the donation potential the right of right has to get a campaign kicked off.

Aaron Strife said:
Not to disagree but YouGov polls are absolute shit and not even worthy of serious discussion.
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They were apparently better than PPP in 2012.
 
J

JesseEwiak

Member
thepotatoman said:
Conservatives make Republicans match their views through the primary threat. Liberals simply almost never even put up a fight in the primaries. And a lot of that is because the left of left doesn't have the donation potential the right of right has to get a campaign kicked off.
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I'd argue more, simply, liberals, especially more moderate liberals who'd probably agree with all of my policy positions, but stop me wanting to be so mean, aren't just as confrontational as the average Republican primary voter.

Also, remember, self-described liberals only make up 18-20% of the country, depending on polling. Conservatives make up 35-40%. Conservatives can make Republican's listen. OTOH, Democrat's can win primaries just by appealing to moderates and liberals who think self-describe as moderates.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
thepotatoman said:
They were apparently better than PPP in 2012.
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Maybe they were better in their presidential polling (which may have been weighted to produce similar results to what other pollsters had been showing) but their final Senate polls in 2012 were off by an average of 5 points in favor of the Republican.

Arizona - Dem down 7, lost by 3 (-4)
California - Dem up 17, won by 25 (-8)
Connecticut - Dem up 2, won by 13 (-11)
Florida - Dem up 6, won by 13 (-7)
Indiana - Dem up 2, won by 6 (-4)
Maryland - Dem up 24, won by 30 (-6)
Massachusetts - Dem up 7, won by 8 (-1)
Michigan - Dem up 12, won by 21 (-9)
Minnesota - Dem up 28, won by 35 (-7)
Missouri - Dem up 10, won by 16 (-6)
Nevada - Dem down 9, lost by 1 (-8)
New Jersey - Dem up 15, won by 19 (-4)
New York - Dem up 32, won by 46 (-14)
Ohio - Dem up 2, won by 6 (-4)
Pennsylvania - Dem up 8, won by 9 (-1)
Texas - Dem down 21, lost by 16 (-5)
Virginia - Dem tied, won by 6 (-6)
Washington - Dem up 18, won by 21 (-3)
Wisconsin - Dem up 1, won by 6 (-5)

The only two races where they erred in favor of the Democrats were New Mexico (off by 1) and Tennessee (off by 13).

They suck. In this latest batch Begich went from leading by 12 points to losing by 6. There is nothing going on in Alaska to turn this race around 18 points in less than a month. They also don't include independents in their polling which is why they're not releasing their Kansas poll as they stupidly didn't include Greg Orman as an option.
 
Rhomega Beta

Rhomega Beta

Member
What is PoliGAF's opinion on corporate tax rates and companies moving overseas to avoid paying taxes? Greedy corporations or are our taxes too high?
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
Rhomega Beta said:
What is PoliGAF's opinion on corporate tax rates and companies moving overseas to avoid paying taxes? Greedy corporations or are our taxes too high?
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I don't care too much about the corporate tax rate. Tax rich people and incentives helping their employees and consumers. I don't think either of those requires taking money from companies as entities. Its borne our of the incorrect idea that the government needs to fill its coffers to spend.

I don't think right now its an issue and it won't help really anyone
 
Angry Fork

Angry Fork

Member
Rhomega Beta said:
What is PoliGAF's opinion on corporate tax rates and companies moving overseas to avoid paying taxes? Greedy corporations or are our taxes too high?
Click to expand...

Don't know why anyone should tolerate this unless they're robber barons/friends of them, it's stealing from the public. Deport any ceo caught doing this and ban them from the country indefinitely. The state should take everything they/their company has stolen and expropriate it back to the public in the form of social welfare programs.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
speculawyer said:
I didn't know the race had a big spoiler. That person will get much of the "I hate McConnell but fuck dem liberulz" vote.
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Yeah, but head to head polls aren't looking much different. He's probably stealing just as many "I hate liberulz but fuck McConnell" votes.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
PhoenixDark said:
It's been over for awhile. Good job having nothing to say about healthcare, Grimes. Even Mark Pryor is showing some balls and running on the law.
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Yep. It's all Obama, the ACA, and immigrations fault. The senate will flip Republican. The ACA, will be destroyed, Obama impeached, and Romney retroactively elected. America will rejoice, the economy will boom, ISIS will surrender, Russia will leave Ukraine alone, Ebola will be cured, and the deficit will disappear.

In all serious, the American electorate is full of apathetic, uninformed idiots.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
Man...can you imagine how insufferable the media/right wing would be if Romney was president and we had six straight 200k jobs monthly reports, as we've had before this month with Obama?
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Pryor does appear pretty dead, but he isn't exactly a must win either.

Aaron Strife said:
Maybe they were better in their presidential polling (which may have been weighted to produce similar results to what other pollsters had been showing) but their final Senate polls in 2012 were off by an average of 5 points in favor of the Republican.
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Fair enough. That does explain the big Alaska gap and republicans leading every single competitive race in that poll.

Rhomega Beta said:
What is PoliGAF's opinion on corporate tax rates and companies moving overseas to avoid paying taxes? Greedy corporations or are our taxes too high?
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I'm certainly ready to look at revenue neutral changes we can make in the tax code to make things more simple fair, and it seems like democrats should be able to come up with something that republicans have no choice but to accept, or be seen as the obstructionists they really are. It bugs me they aren't going down a route like this.
 
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