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PoliGAF 2016 |OT2| we love the poorly educated

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K

Krowley

Member
If the situation were reversed, I doubt the Clintons would become meek and mild "message" candidates.

There'd be attacks about Bernie's Soviet honeymoon, and other nasty stuff. There would be lies and mischaracterizations. Of course she would use surrogates for a lot of it, to keep her hands clean, but she would do everything possible to tear Bernie down. Because her only path to victory would be to destroy him with extremely negative tactics.

But that would be different right? She would be trying to save the party from an unelectable insurgent idealogue...

Hint: It's not actually very different. You don't want a unelectable insurgent ideologue. I don't want another big money, wall-street, free-trading neoliberal. Our country has suffered enough of that garbage.
 
O

Overlee

Member
shinra-bansho said:
That's a generally unrelated issue to why people like Trump and Sanders are capitalizing on anti-trade sentiment.

I'm not sure what exactly the proposed remedy is? Reverse things like NAFTA and China's integration with the global economy?
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How about we move away from dead industries like automotives and begin re-skilling our population to be their own producers? We shouldn't be pouring money into propping up bad business practices. We certainly don't do it for the average American.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
shinra-bansho said:
That's a generally unrelated issue to why people like Trump and Sanders are capitalizing on anti-trade sentiment.

The crux of it is "they took our jobs" not biologics intellectual property protections are too stringent or ISDA provisions too broad.

I'm not sure what exactly the proposed remedy is? Reverse things like NAFTA and China's integration with the global economy?

Reduction of trade barriers has been an essential tool in reducing global abject poverty.
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They did take the jobs of those people though. A lot of manufacturing jobs are gone and not all of those people could become managers or engineers. And the general response from the Democratic party has been "Tough, we've got other priorities get yourself some bootstraps". I don't think ignoring that is particularly awesome.
 
O

Overlee

Member
Elaugaufein said:
They did take the jobs of those people though. A lot of manufacturing jobs are gone and not all of those people could become managers or engineers. And the general response from the Democratic party has been "Tough, we've got other priorities get yourself some bootstraps". I don't think ignoring that is particularly awesome.
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You sound like you're talking right of the GOP playbook!
 
S

Suikoguy

I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
The GOP has been talking about penises more than Adam does.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
Overlee said:
You sound like you're talking right of the GOP playbook!
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To be fair, some of it's not inherently a problem with free trade, it's the bizarre asymmetry on free trade that corporations are at best given a blind eye on and at worst given explicit protection for. It's perfectly okay to send off production to wherever you can do it cheapest but The Almight Market forbid that people should be able to import products from where it's sold the cheapest (which would actually offset the general fall in wages).
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
shinra-bansho said:
That's a generally unrelated issue to why people like Trump and Sanders are able to capitalize on anti-trade sentiment.

The crux of it is "they took our jobs" not biologics intellectual property protections are too stringent or ISDA provisions too broad.

I'm not sure what exactly the proposed remedy is? Reverse things like NAFTA and China's integration with the global economy?

Reduction of trade barriers has been an essential tool in reducing global abject poverty.
Click to expand...

They did take our jobs but there is no way to stop it short of shitty policy. I really dislike sanders's opinion on this and agree with you completely. The problem is america's golden age was had at the cost of everyone else and not many people get that.

Tl;dr I agree 100%
 
S

shinra-bansho

Member
I mean, I'm not sure if I've somehow given the impression that I oppose the idea that governments, not just the in the US, haven't done enough to retool their labour forces towards areas in which they have comparative advantage as a more globalised economy has rendered other industries at a disadvantage.

I certainly think more should have been, can and should be done.

But that's not being against trade liberalization conceptually - which is something that seems to be the sentiment displayed by people like Sanders, or some of his supporters, when it's talked about. That's more about the support structures around the execution of reducing those barriers.
 
E

Elaugaufein

Member
ugaboga232 said:
They did take our jobs but there is no way to stop it short of shitty policy. I really dislike sanders's opinion on this and agree with you completely. The problem is america's golden age was had at the cost of everyone else and not many people get that.

Tl;dr I agree 100%
Click to expand...

I think part of the issue there is, that it's not the people who can afford to suffer a bit that are taking it, it's like the middle of the middle class and below who've mainly copped it from these agreements. It's hard to blame these people for not being particularly grateful that living standards in BRICS countries have increased greatly while there's has dropped through the floor, while the top parts of America continue doing obscenely well.
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
shinra-bansho said:
I mean, I'm not sure if I've somehow given the impression that I oppose the idea that governments, not just the in the US, haven't done enough to retool their labour forces towards areas in which they have comparative advantage as a more globalised economy has rendered other industries at a disadvantage.

I certainly think more should have been, can and should be done.

But that's not being against trade liberalization conceptually - which is something that seems to be the sentiment displayed by people like Sanders, or some of his supporters, when it's talked about. That's more about the support structures around the execution of reducing those barriers.
Click to expand...

Yea the concept is good for humans and thats what I care about in the long run. There is exploitation in non US countries which should be worked on which is part of the point of things like TPP (though it also seems to be a vehicle for some pretty swarmy policies).

Elaugaufein said:
I think part of the issue there is, that it's not the people who can afford to suffer a bit that are taking it, it's like the middle of the middle class and below who've mainly copped it from these agreements. It's hard to blame these people for not being particularly grateful that living standards in BRICS countries have increased greatly while there's has dropped through the floor, while the top parts of America continue doing obscenely well.
Click to expand...

Yea thats the rub, people are getting screwed and we have to fix that and the whole situation is kinda a pick your poison type thing. Which group of humans are you gonna screw? Id rather just fix the ~system~ and move forward that way but I can keep waiting, im still young.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
They have legit given up on Rubio.

What the hell is the game plan now. Mwahahahaha. I think it's Rmoney and a brokered covention. I really do. Or else they've just accepted Trump.
 
H

hawk2025

Member
shinra-bansho said:
I mean, I'm not sure if I've somehow given the impression that I oppose the idea that governments, not just the in the US, haven't done enough to retool their labour forces towards areas in which they have comparative advantage as a more globalised economy has rendered other industries at a disadvantage.

I certainly think more should have been, can and should be done.

But that's not being against trade liberalization conceptually - which is something that seems to be the sentiment displayed by people like Sanders, or some of his supporters, when it's talked about. That's more about the support structures around the execution of reducing those barriers.
Click to expand...


Signed, signed, signed.
 
H

Holmes

Member
Yeah even if this tape exists, I don't see NYT releasing them because it would jeapordize their credibility and integrity.
 
M

Makai

Member
I still can't get over Trump confirming he had a big dick. Then he called Rubio LITTLE MARCO and he came back with BIG DON
G
 
Tarkus

Tarkus

Member
adam387 said:
Rubio has completely given up. It's almost sad. Almost.

Sorry Sour. <3
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It's OK. I checked out on Tuesday. My picks have no chance. Screw it. I'll be dissatisfied with Hillary, but at least she's not Sanders, the American dream destroyer.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
adam387 said:
They have legit given up on Rubio.

What the hell is the game plan now. Mwahahahaha. I think it's Rmoney and a brokered covention. I really do. Or else they've just accepted Trump.
Click to expand...
I feel like "Rmoney and a brokered convention is our only hope" is the most perfect example of giving up. That's like a Democrat saying if Hillary was indicted and Bernie died, Biden would be our only hope.
 
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