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PoliGAF 2016 |OT7| Notorious R.B.G. Plans NZ Tour

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T

thebloo

Member
nature boy said:
I propose a new thread title:

Cl0AUSYWgAATkjL.jpg
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This guy is like a movie script.

https://youtu.be/U-PHPMPXnQA

"what would it take for Trump to lose your vote"
People are nuts.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Maledict said:
I honestly don't understand how the EU has suddenly become a massive Neoliberal corporatist machine. The same EU which introduced continent wide consumer rights? Worker protections? Has taken endless big corporations to court for bad business practice?
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Because when they say "Neoliberal" what they really mean is "Not socialist/communist".
 
I

itschris

Member
Politico Magazine: Make Yourself Great Again!

A group of millennial bros find salvation in the teachings of Donald J. Trump.

Christopher Cantwell, a controversial anarchist-libertarian blogger from New Hampshire who has also credited Trump with helping him treat his drug addiction, is one of the denizens of this site. “There’s certainly an attitude toward the striking back against the emasculation of men,” Cantwell told me. “Let’s promote rugged masculinity—and that would be striving to be a more dominant strong, assertive person.” In an hour-long conversation, Cantwell riffed on the MYGA theme to describe his frustration that transgenderism isn’t treated as a neurological disorder; why taking the stigma out of mental illness was misguided; and how he was fired from his job as a radio host when his boss worried he was insinuating that other races are genetically inferior to whites. All such things, he suggested, violate the principle of MYGA. (He also, in a Trumpian effort to grab the initiative in our interview, recorded an introduction that tried to frame the interview as a “conversation,” as if I had been a guest on his online radio show, and told me he’d release it if I misquoted him.)
Click to expand...

EDIT: Oops, didn't notice the May 19th date - I thought this was a new article!
 
E

East Lake

Member
kirblar said:
Because when they say "Neoliberal" what they really mean is "Not socialist/communist".
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No it generally means neoliberal as you'd read on the wikipedia page, and it happens to be accurate. The eurozone is clearly a failed experiment at this point with pretty embarrassing growth numbers.
 
I

itschris

Member
New York Times: A Born-Again Donald Trump? Believe It, Evangelical Leader Says

Mr. Dobson, the founder of Focus on the Family and one of the country’s most prominent social conservatives, gave his account at a meeting Mr. Trump had in New York on Tuesday with hundreds of evangelicals.

In an interview recorded at the event by a Pennsylvania pastor, Michael Anthony, Mr. Dobson said he knew the person who led Mr. Trump to Christ, though he did not name him.

“I don’t know when it was but it has not been long,” Mr. Dobson says. “I believe he really made a commitment, but he’s a baby Christian.”
Click to expand...
 
K

kirblar

Member
East Lake said:
No it generally means neoliberal as you'd read on the wikipedia page, and it happens to be accurate. The eurozone is clearly a failed experiment at this point with pretty embarrassing growth numbers.
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The Eurozone's primary failing is the Euro.

You cannot have an independent budget capable of running deficits and have your hands tied w/ monetary policy.

In the US you get away with having radically different economies under one roof because state budgets have to be balanced.
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
Okay, I'm Diablos'ing now. Michael Bloomberg said that BREXIT means "disintegration of the EU". It's going to happen in our lifetimes.

Also, Bernie's back to trying to steal leadership positions from women:

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/284552-bernie-sanderss-awkward-return-to-the-senate

In an interview with C-SPAN released Wednesday, Sanders said he wants to lead the Health, Education, Labor and Pensions (HELP) Committee, which has jurisdiction over many of the health and educational issues he has raised during his campaign.

But it’s not clear whether Sen. Patty Murray (Wash.) will give up her post as senior Democrat on the panel.

“Sen. Murray has said that she won’t be making any decisions like these until after the election and after conversations with her colleagues and constituents,” said Murray spokesman Eli Zupnick.

“But she loves the work she is doing on the HELP Committee to fight for policies that help women, students, families, seniors, workers and the economy — and there is a whole lot more that she’d like to get done,” he added.

If Democrats were to recapture the Senate majority in November, Murray or Sanders would serve as chairman of the panel. Otherwise, one of them would serve as ranking member.

“Bernie seems startled that people aren’t more deferential,” observed one Senate Democrat, who noted that Sanders was waiting for colleagues to come to him instead of going to them to initiate friendly chatter. “He thinks he’s bigger than just the Senate. He’s the head of a movement and his colleagues aren’t quite there.”
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B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
T

Trouble

Banned
Kristoffer said:
Okay, I'm Diablos'ing now. Michael Bloomberg said that BREXIT means "disintegration of the EU". It's going to happen in our lifetimes.

Also, Bernie's back to trying to steal leadership positions from women:

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/284552-bernie-sanderss-awkward-return-to-the-senate
Click to expand...

I might be biased because she is my Senator, but Patty Murray is awesome and Bernie can go fuck himself.

Maria Cantwell is awesome, too.

E: Also, Brexit might not mean the end of the EU, but it will mean the end of Britain. Scotland and Northern Ireland are going to peace out post-haste.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Okay, I'm Diablos'ing now. Michael Bloomberg said that BREXIT means "disintegration of the EU". It's going to happen in our lifetimes.
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When people like Johnson say there's "no need for urgency" what they really mean is "F*CK WE NEED TO STALL FOR TIME TO FIX THIS SOMEHOW".
 
B

Bowdz

Member
Kristoffer said:
Okay, I'm Diablos'ing now. Michael Bloomberg said that BREXIT means "disintegration of the EU". It's going to happen in our lifetimes.

Also, Bernie's back to trying to steal leadership positions from women:

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/284552-bernie-sanderss-awkward-return-to-the-senate
Click to expand...

There are so many varying opinions from highly respected analysts about what the EU and UK will look like in the near to mid future that I'd take most with a gain of salt. Politico has a great article from 17 analysts and there are some wide ranging views in it. We are entering into uncharted territory and nobody really has a roadmap as to exactly what will happen. It seems like the only consensus was starting to be reflected in reality on Friday and that is that the UK is in for a rough period economically in the near term.
 
E

East Lake

Member
kirblar said:
The Eurozone's primary failing is the Euro.

You cannot have an independent budget capable of running deficits and have your hands tied w/ monetary policy.

In the US you get away with having radically different economies under one roof because state budgets have to be balanced.
Click to expand...
The primary failure is that there's no political unity, the currency merely exposes that and allows separate countries to police each other through what can fairly referred to as neoliberal policies. That a big bureacracy which sits on top occasionally throws a bone to the small guy doesn't fundamentally change the picture of austerity.

The US also doesn't get away with it only because of balanced budgets, but also because of transfer payments and reinvestment. It's taken for granted that tax payments in Cali end up poorer states and it doesn't result in economic warfare or resentment.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Bowdz said:
There are so many varying opinions from highly respected analysts about what the EU and UK will look like in the near to mid future that I'd take most with a gain of salt. Politico has a great article from 17 analysts and there are some wide ranging views in it. We are entering into uncharted territory and nobody really has a roadmap as to exactly what will happen. It seems like the only consensus was starting to be reflected in reality on Friday and that is that the UK is in for a rough period economically in the near term.
Click to expand...

Pretty much. It's almost impossible to predict what will happen from here. It's all going to depend on how the EU and UK handle the next six months to a year. There's absolutely nothing we can use to model something like this, it's literally unprecedented. (I say, fully expecting Benji to come in with some obscure example of this happening to make me feel stupid.)
 
I

itschris

Member
AP: Draft of Dems' policy positions reflects Sanders' influence

Deliberating late into Friday, the group considered language on the Israel-Palestinian conflict, an issue that has divided Democrats. The committee defeated an amendment led by Zogby that would have called for providing Palestinians with "an end to occupation and illegal settlements" and urged an international effort to rebuild Gaza.

The draft reflects Clinton's views and advocates working toward a "two-state solution of the Israel-Palestinian conflict" that guarantees Israel's security with recognized borders "and provides the Palestinians with independence, sovereignty, and dignity."

In many cases, Clinton's side gave ground to Sanders. The document calls for the expansion of Social Security and says Americans should earn at least $15 an hour, referring to the current minimum wage of $7.25 an hour as a "starvation wage," a term often used by Sanders.

Sanders has pushed for a $15-an-hour minimum wage. Clinton has supported efforts to raise the minimum wage to that level but has said states and cities should raise the bar as high as possible.

Sanders' allies wanted the draft to specify that a $15 per hour minimum wage should be indexed with inflation. Clinton's side struck down that idea, noting the document included a call to "raise and index the minimum wage."

The committee also adopted language that said it supports ways to prevent banks from gambling with taxpayers' bank deposits, "including an updated and modernized version of Glass-Steagall."

Sanders wants to reinstate the Depression-era Glass-Steagall Act, which prohibited commercial banks from engaging in investment banking activities. Clinton does not, but says her proposed financial changes would cast a wider net by regulating the banking system.

Also in the draft is a call for the abolition of the death penalty. Clinton said during a debate this year that capital punishment should only be used in limited cases involving "heinous crimes." Sanders said the government should not use it.

Sanders, a vociferous opponent of the Trans-Pacific Partnership, was unable to get language into the document opposing the trade deal. As a result, the party avoided an awkward scenario that would have put the platform at odds with President Barack Obama.

Clinton and Sanders have opposed the deal. Committee members backed a measure that said "there are a diversity of views in the party" on the pact and reaffirmed that Democrats contend any trade deal "must protect workers and the environment."

In a setback for Sanders, the panel narrowly rejected amendments that would have imposed a tax on carbon and imposed a national freeze on fracking.

The panel deliberated for about nine hours following several late nights and long hours of policy exchanges between the two campaigns and the Democratic National Committee.

Sanders, in a statement, said he was "disappointed and dismayed" that the group voted down the measure opposing the TPP. But he was pleased with the proposals on Glass-Steagall and the death penalty - and vowed to fight on.

"Our job is to pass the most progressive platform in the history of the Democratic Party," he said.
Click to expand...
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
Jesus christ, is there nothing you people in this thread don't worry about? 3 days ago it was "I'm worried about Trump being replaced" now it's "I'm worried about Brexit." How do you get through life like this?
 
D

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
B-Dubs said:
That last quote is worrying.
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He's held this opinion of himself since at least the beginning of the year. No one's been caving to any of his meaningful requests yet. No reason now for someone to give up their ranking position just because he wants it. He gives nothing back to anyone. He's entitled to nothing special for abandoning his job for 5 months only to lose the primary by a much wider margin than the 2008 race.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
itschris said:
Politico Magazine: Make Yourself Great Again!

A group of millennial bros find salvation in the teachings of Donald J. Trump.



EDIT: Oops, didn't notice the May 19th date - I thought this was a new article!
Click to expand...
I always think it's funny that the anarchists are usually the people who benefit most from our current form of society, and support anarchy because they feel like they're being oppressed by society.

Also wonder if they realize that if anarchy actually did break out they'd probably be the first ones to die.
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
I really don't like the draft Democratic policy platform. I don't like that banning fracking almost made it in there, I don't like that the minimum wage is supposed to be $15, etc. I'm really not that leftist, so if the Democratic party is moving away from fact based economic decisions and closer to populist handwringing, I'm not happy with my party anymore.
 
E

excelsiorlef

Member
Kristoffer said:
Okay, I'm Diablos'ing now. Michael Bloomberg said that BREXIT means "disintegration of the EU". It's going to happen in our lifetimes.

Also, Bernie's back to trying to steal leadership positions from women:

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/284552-bernie-sanderss-awkward-return-to-the-senate
Click to expand...

I love that after spending most of his campaign attacking the Democratic party, he believes that Dem senators should just give him what he wants, without him having to work for it, because he's Bernie fucking Sanders.

This fucking guy.
Sanders pulled up to the Capitol for a vote Wednesday morning in his motorcade, with police lights flashing and sirens wailing. The pomp didn’t necessarily befit a vote on an amendment to the commerce, justice and science appropriations bill.
Click to expand...

Kristoffer said:
I really don't like the draft Democratic policy platform. I don't like that banning fracking almost made it in there, I don't like that the minimum wage is supposed to be $15, etc. I'm really not that leftist, so if the Democratic party is moving away from fact based economic decisions and closer to populist handwringing, I'm not happy with my party anymore.
Click to expand...

It's not 15$, Sanders folks lost that fight, it's a commitment to raising it (probably around 12$, aka what Clinton has been talking about)
 
E

excelsiorlef

Member
So I've been thinking, did the wrong part of Occupy Wall-Street win out?

I mean yes income inequality is talked about, but since Occupy I've noticed a rise is "anti-establishment" bullshit, anti-intellectualism, etc...


People seem more to want to yell and oppose the rich as people rather than as a system. I think that plays in part to Clinton derangement syndrome, we've hit a point where just being rich means you're the enemy rather than the system being the problem.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
excelsiorlef said:
So I've been thinking, did the wrong part of Occupy Wall-Street win out?

I mean yes income inequality is talked about, but since Occupy I've noticed a rise is "anti-establishment" bullshit, anti-intellectualism, etc...


People seem more to want to yell and oppose the rich as people rather than as a system. I think that plays in part to Clinton derangement syndrome, we've hit a point where just being rich means you're the enemy rather than the system being the problem.
Click to expand...

Well, that's the easier one to become popular, because nothing actually needs to be done to foster it. You don't need proposals or studies. You don't need ideas. You just need an enemy.

Kinda a liberal version of the whole anti-immigrant wave on the Republican side.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Tamanon said:
Well, that's the easier one to become popular, because nothing actually needs to be done to foster it. You don't need proposals or studies. You don't need ideas. You just need an enemy.

Kinda a liberal version of the whole anti-immigrant wave on the Republican side.
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Trump blames Immigrants for everything, Bernie blames Wall Street for everything.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
In terms of Brexit I tend to think, as one analyst said, that the markets are overpricing the global crisis and underpricing the local crisis. Once the banks relocate out of the U.K. things should be reasonably stable on a worldwide level, at the cost of significant and long-term disruption for the UK itself.
 
I

itschris

Member
Kristoffer said:
The article itschris linked said the minimum wage "should be" $15. Maybe I'm just confused.
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I think there's some confusion because they voted down Keith Ellison's amendment that would have made support for $15 more unambiguous and forceful. Here's a different article (from Salon):

Clinton’s representatives argued the platform already expresses support for a $15 minimum wage, although the language is weak and offers no mechanism for getting there. Sanders’ supporters called for the explicit demand of an indexed $15 federal minimum wage.

Rep. Keith Ellison, who was appointed to the committee by Sanders, proposed an amendment to the DNC’s platform that would make support for a $15 per hour federal minimum wage absolutely unambiguous.

The platform originally simply stated that the Democratic Party hopes to “raise and index the minimum wage,” with an earlier implication that this could be $15. Ellison proposed that the language be made clearer and stronger, changed from mere support to a demand to “raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour and index it.”

...

Ellison, however, wanted clearer language that explicitly states that the Democratic Party supports a $15 minimum wage.

While bringing up the specter of Donald Trump, Booth acknowledged the Fight for 15 movement and applauded the “gutsy” workers fighting for an increase in the minimum wage and the right to organize the union. Yet he still opposed Ellison’s amendment.

Booth claimed the language suggests that the Democratic Party supports moving toward a $15 minimum wage, but added, “we affirm and support different ways of getting there in different states.”
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I couldn't find anywhere online with the actual draft text, but it seems like it's closer to Clinton's position ($15 is a good goal, but it might not be possible everywhere right away, etc.).
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
That's not bad, then. I'm not sure anyone else will agree with me here on the death penalty being important, though.

Also, I think the language about trade deals enables a greater hostility to trade in the future. Does every future trade deal have to explicitly include increased funding for education, healthcare, etc.? If it negatively impacts any sector at all, what are you supposed to do? Isn't a trade deal supposed to redistribute capital anyway? If nothing changed, why would you have a trade deal?
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Crocodile said:
I miss NYC :(
Click to expand...

You should come for a visit :)

pigeon said:
In terms of Brexit I tend to think, as one analyst said, that the markets are overpricing the global crisis and underpricing the local crisis. Once the banks relocate out of the U.K. things should be reasonably stable on a worldwide level, at the cost of significant and long-term disruption for the UK itself.
Click to expand...

I tend to agree with this. If the banks really are relocating in the wake of this then the international ramification will be relatively small, minor, and will only last for a short time. The UK on the other hand just stabbed themselves in the eyeball with a pen and jiggled it around a bit just to see what would happen.

Exports into and out of the UK will be affected, but we'll be getting good deals on their stuff while they get the shit end of the stick. We've basically got them over a barrel in regards to trade without having to really do anything.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
thebloo said:
Is the platform in any way relevant past the convention? I thought everyone agrees it's not.
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The GOP can use it to attack individual candidates if it's too extreme. "So and so supports this thing that would kill our local economy," and things that like. There's something to be said for a bit of vagueness in the platform. Make it so people know what you're for, but let each candidate hash out the details themselves.
 
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