Support NeoGAF

[ari]

Jesus christ. With grammar like this, it's no wonder you're struggling with that Iowa test. What the hell are you trying to say here?

What are you talking about?

 

[v1cious]

a spy?

 

[DeathbyVolcano]

McCain titties yum

 

[Frank the Great]

anybody watching verdict with dan abrams?

i would totally stick my peins into this laura schwartz chick

 

[Tamanon]

anybody watching verdict with dan abrams?

i would totally stick my peins into this laura schwartz chick

The hot blonde one? Yeah, I'd run that.

 

[Frank the Great]

The hot blonde one? Yeah, I'd run that.

yeah. kind of looks like a rabbit cause of her teeth, but i'd definitely bone

 

[Cheebs]

yeah. kind of looks like a rabbit cause of her teeth, but i'd definitely bone

 

[Frank the Great]

why must you crush my dreams

 

[Particle Physicist]

Whaa? Charlie Rose gives dates. McCain says not that long. What's so hard to understand???

you completely ignored all of my questions. once again, what is not that long, 10 years? 15 years? 19 years? dont know about you, but all of those are a long ass time to me and most people i know.

 

[APF]

you completely ignored all of my questions. once again, what is not that long, 10 years? 15 years? 19 years? dont know about you, but all of those are a long ass time to me and most people i know.

*sigh* is it or is it not less than 100 years? Did or did not his response indicate he didn't see the viability of a S Korea / Japan / Europe -type standing presence in Iraq? Your questions are red herrings, and you've already said you agree with these points. So I'm not sure why you're still talking.

 

[PhoenixDark]

The Obama/Matthews date was entertaining. Lots of soft ball questions but considering I love Matthews...I can't hate. It'll be interesting to see what happens IF Hillary accepts the invitation lol

 

[Particle Physicist]

*sigh* is it or is it not less than 100 years? Did or did not his response indicate he didn't see the viability of a S Korea / Japan / Europe -type standing presence in Iraq? Your questions are red herrings, and you've already said you agree with these points. So I'm not sure why you're still talking.

*le sigh* thats not even what im arguing. that wasnt Star Power's point, which you had initially responded to.

Obama (and Clinton.. and Howard Dean... basically every Democrat) really has intentionally distorted McCain's " 100 Years" comment. That said, Wesley Clark made a great point yesterday on Dan Abrahms : this notion that the US will occupy that region peacefully in any capacity for long period of time is ridiculous, and shows that McCain doesn't have much of an understanding of the middle-east

 

[Tamanon]

BTW, I wasn't aware that REM supported Obama, found out reading an article about their new album.

And the new album rocks. Probably their best since Monster.

 

[sangreal]

McCain intentionally distorts Obama's statements and says he wants to bomb Pakistan. News at 11

 

[xs_mini_neo]

Rove has been more favorable to Clinton in his appearances on FOX, he's working behind the scenes for someone, I have no idea who.

BTW, doing the Hardball college tour is great press. They've been playing snippets and discussing it on every single MSNBC show so far. They'll probably do the same for McCain tomorrow.

Since I don't like watching FUX (or any other politically charged channel), I didn't catch those. But I think it's strange how neo-cons have polluted the Clinton camp so far. I can picture them sabotaging Hillary, then doing something to Obama later. So, yeah, this is probably the most skeptical I've been as far as politics go. I long for the simplicity of '04-'00-and 96/92.

I'm not trying to start shit... but it shouldn't matter what he thinks anyhow.

But really, Im sure if he would've gave Obama props, you guys would've said that would be icying on cake. If he gave props to Hillary, you guys would've call them both out. If he called out hillary, you guys would agree with him. Its like the whole Edwards thing. The knee jerk reaction was quite predictable.

He did sort of give him props before, but I stress the sort of. It was most likely a backhanded thing. But him being more favorable to Hillary is suspicious because the Clinton hate is strong with the repubs. It is basically a right of passage. ...'08 is such a pain in the ass.

 

[APF]

*le sigh* thats not even what im arguing. that wasnt Star Power's point, which you had initially responded to.

You're literally arguing in circles. The Charlie Rose interview addressed the point. You're being a brick wall. Pathetic.

 

[Cheebs]

The Obama/Matthews date was entertaining. Lots of soft ball questions but considering I love Matthews...I can't hate. It'll be interesting to see what happens IF Hillary accepts the invitation lol

The last time Matthews got near hillary earlier this year he grabbed hillarys cheek and gave her a little "love" smack on the face.

So yeah, ain't happening.

 

[Tamanon]

Plus a college crowd might be a bit hostile, it definitely should be for McCain tomorrow.:lol

 

[Cheebs]

Plus a college crowd might be a bit hostile, it definitely should be for McCain tomorrow.:lol

McCain did a college thing with Matthews a few months ago with Matthews and got booed to one of his answers.


Also does anyone take Obama's claim he is going to rip up the bowling alley Truman built in the white house and replace it with a basketball court? :lol

 

[Deus Ex Machina]

Sen. Barack Obama kicks off Hardball College Tour!



The videos are up!

Obama on civil unions and education

Obama gets personal

Obama on 3 a.m. phone calls

Obama on how to get out of Iraq

Obama answers questions from students

Full video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JnJo4XMUq4

photo's by Zeth

 

[siamesedreamer]

and there is the problem. the 'stay the course' strategy is a scary proposition.

I'm not sure McCain has even said "stay the course". But, I would argue the exact opposite. The downside risk of an Obama withdrawal is the scary proposition.

 

[Amir0x]

Hannity was uh defending Obama today for the photography thing. Said he thought he handled it with a lot of grace

whatever pigs flying

 

[Particle Physicist]

You're literally arguing in circles. The Charlie Rose interview addressed the point. You're being a brick wall. Pathetic.

:lol im arguing in circles? im trying to get you to respond to my actual argument, not some cockamamy dispute you are purposely trying to misconstrue.

I'm not sure McCain has even said "stay the course".

he didnt say 'stay the course' but im pretty sure its been implied that he plans on continuing with the war.

But, I would argue the exact opposite. The downside risk of an Obama withdrawal is the scary proposition.

thats a very valid point. and i agree that if the withdrawal is done too hastily, there will be dire consequences. im hoping that obama does indeed keep to his word, that he will listen to the generals and withdraws at a pace that is reasonable.

 

[User 10639]

I think, had Karl Rove "endorsed" Obama or had he shown him any level of support whatsoever, I personally would have immediately grown suspicious of Barack and my personal desires to see him as President would have diminished greatly.

So, yeah.

 

[scorcho]

yeah. it's damn scary we could actually end a morally wrong war that continues to take a major toll on the average Iraqi's life. let's stay there for as long as we can, even if no one else wants us there, and even if our presence attracts greater attacks and fighting.

 

[Incognito]

Also- Obama's graphic designers are really quite impressive... coming from a designer, the consistent quality and certain "brand image" they have built for him are something the other candidates should really take notes on.

(I've noticed this for a while, and I know its been said before, but that Dave Matthews poster really exemplifies the idea)

How the Obama brand is working on you

Seeking expert opinion, I tested my hypothesis on leading graphic designer and critic Michael Bierut, who was kind enough to dissect Obama's unprecedented branding campaign--and show me how it's helping his candidacy. Excerpts:

(*UPDATE: A reader points out that "Reagan had one hell of a marketing strategy." No doubt. Every presidential candidate since Richard Nixon in 1968 (at least) was actively "marketed" to the American public--I'm not denying that. The point I'm trying to make is that Obama's marketing is much more cohesive and comprehensive than anything we've seen before, involving fonts, logos and web design in a way that transcends the mere appropriation of commercial tactics to achieve the sort of seamless brand identity that the most up-to-date companies strive for. Apologies for the misunderstanding. I definitely could have been clearer.)

What are the elements of the Obama brand?
To start, he has this way of writing Obama in upper and lowercase in a serif font and juxtaposing it with that "O" symbol he has--the blue ring with red and white stripes disappearing into it, making the white form inside the blue look like what I suppose is meant to be a rising sun. [See photo above]

That's his "logo," right?
Right. A lot of times when he's at a podium what you'll see is, centered right beneath him, at the very top of the blue field that usually says something like "Change You Can Believe In," it'll be just that little symbol, functioning in the same way the Nike swoosh does. People look at that and know what it means, even though it's just an "O" with some stripes in it.

Has any other campaign ever "pulled a Nike"?
Well, Bush did that the last time around with the letter "W," to some degree. You would see somebody with the letter "W" on a bumper sticker, and it would kind of work that way. But Obama has gotten there much quicker and a little more gracefully, if you ask me.

How else is Obama's design different than what has come before--or what rival campaigns are doing?
He's the first candidate, actually, who's had a coherent, top-to-bottom, 360-degree system at work. Whereas, I think it's more more common for politicians to have a bumper-sticker symbol that they just stick on everything and hope that that will carry the day.

The thing that sort of flabbergasts me as a professional graphic designer is that, somewhere along the way, they decided that all their graphics would basically be done in the same typeface, which is this typeface called Gotham. [See "Change We Can Believe In" sign, above] If you look at one of his rallies, every single non-handmade sign is in that font. Every single one of them. And they're all perfectly spaced and perfectly arranged. Trust me. I've done graphics for events --and I know what it takes to have rally after rally without someone saying, "Oh, we ran out of signs, let's do a batch in Arial." It just doesn't seem to happen. There's an absolute level of control that I have trouble achieving with my corporate clients.

Then if you go to the Web site, it's all reflected there too--all the same elements showing up in this clean, smooth, elegant way. It all ties together really, really beautifully as a system.

Is Obama's stuff on the level with the best commercial brand design?
I think it's just as good or better. I have sophisticated clients who pay me and other people well to try to keep them on the straight and narrow, and they have trouble getting everything set in the same typeface. And he seems to be able to do it in Cleveland and Cincinnati and Houston and San Antonio. Every time you look, all those signs are perfect. Graphic designers like me don't understand how it's happening. It's unprecedented and inconceivable to us. The people in the know are flabbergasted.

Rest at link. It's a piece from February so I think most people here have already read through it. Nonetheless, it's still a good read.

 

[APF]

:lol im arguing in circles? im trying to get you to respond to my actual argument, not some cockamamy dispute you are purposely trying to misconstrue.

Whaa? How am I misconstruing Obama's lie, or McCain's interview? You're off in left field here. Your arguments literally have nothing to do with what I was saying, yet you're trying to make it seem like you're providing some substantive disagreement to my points. Whatever.


Incognito: yeah, that touches on a point I've been talking about for a while now. Gotta give them props.

 

[tanod]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XpaK-cGO9U

What the hell? ANOTHER Red phone ad?

And now there are economic crises at 3 AM.

Quick check: In America at 3AM, which countries have banks or financial markets that are even open?

 

[scorcho]

Rest at link. It's a piece from February so I think most people here have already read through it. Nonetheless, it's still a good read.

read that too, and also saw Helvetica (which that designer is featured in). Obama's team have gotten the branding side down solid.

 

[Particle Physicist]

Whaa? How am I misconstruing Obama's lie, or McCain's interview? You're off in left field here. Your arguments literally have nothing to do with what I was saying, yet you're trying to make it seem like you're providing some substantive disagreement to my points. Whatever.

oy vey! talk about arguing in circles!! you are misconstruing my argument, which has nothing to do with how obama and co. have been distorting what mccain said. i was backing up Star Power's point, which you responded to

 

[tanod]

So basically Obama favors gay marriage in everything but name only.

Marriage is a religious ritual. According to the law, it is a mean to an end (legal rights).

Every dedicated couple deserves the same legal rights and responsibilities that go with being legally joined.

 

[User 10639]

yeah. it's damn scary we could actually end a morally wrong war that continues to take a major toll on the average Iraqi's life. let's stay there for as long as we can, even if no one else wants us there, and even if our presence attracts greater attacks and fighting.

It terrifies me, too, how the people in power in our country can act so nonchalantly towards this. It's not like this is fucking Korea, people.


Iraqi's don't want us there.

"So?"

American civilians don't want us there.

"So?"

The troops don't want us there.

"So?"

/cheney

 

[scorcho]

marriage is a cultural ritual that has taken on more of a legal interpretation over the last few decades. denying homosexuals the title but giving them the legal rights is akin to the old policy of 'separate but equal'.

 

[Incognito]

Or if you know someone with a disability

Obama disability fact sheet (PDF) About 9 pages. Good stuff.

 

[tanod]

marriage is a cultural ritual that has taken on more of a legal interpretation over the last few decades. denying homosexuals the title but giving them the legal rights is akin to the old policy of 'separate but equal'.

No, you're implying that a same-sex civil union enacted on the federal level wouldn't have exactly the same effect as being married. Saying that it would be akin to the "separate but equal" policy would be totally ignoring the fact that the policy was not at all equal in the first place.

 

[User 10639]

Or if you know someone with a disability

Obama disability fact sheet (PDF) About 9 pages. Good stuff.

But we had a disabled man in the White House elected to more terms than any other president. Doesn't that meant that disabled people don't need help anymore?

 

[Tamanon]

marriage is a cultural ritual that has taken on more of a legal interpretation over the last few decades. denying homosexuals the title but giving them the legal rights is akin to the old policy of 'separate but equal'.

To be fair, "separate but equal" was a stepping stone to full integration. Baby steps.

 

[StoOgE]

marriage is a cultural ritual that has taken on more of a legal interpretation over the last few decades. denying homosexuals the title but giving them the legal rights is akin to the old policy of 'separate but equal'.

i think the government should only recognize civil unions and leave 'marriage' to religion.. your church can marry whoever it wants

 

[siamesedreamer]

Saying that no one wants us in Iraq anymore is utterly LOLz-worthy.

The only people who don't want us there are short-sighted partisans in America and those Iraqis who seek power through any means necessary.

 

[User 10639]

No, you're implying that a same-sex civil union enacted on the federal level wouldn't have exactly the same effect as being married. Saying that it would be akin to the "separate but equal" policy would be totally ignoring the fact that the policy was not at all equal in the first place.

Not according to the Supreme Court:

Segregation of white and Negro children in the public schools of a State solely on the basis of race, pursuant to state laws permitting or requiring such segregation, denies to Negro children the equal protection of the laws guaranteed by the Fourteenth Amendment -- even though the physical facilities and other "tangible" factors of white and Negro schools may be equal.

 

[ToyMachine228]

If you guys really want to have a discussion about gay marriage, you should look at the varying policies about same-sex union in Europe. Some countries have policies that allow for straight up gay marriage, while other countries have policies that allow various makeups of couples to join in union including same sex partners, but also unions such as life long friends, and other make ups. It's not "marriage" but it's something, and it's something that people like life long friends wouldn't want to be "married" but they want to be able to claim each other as dependents, leave possessions after death or in emergencies, etc.

There is no magic policy that's going to work here. Allowing some sort of "union" that isn't marriage will be criticized by some as not going far enough by not allowing same-sex couples to get straight up married, while some will criticize it for allowing anything at all.

What Senator Obama has promised to do is veto any legislation that bans same sex marriage, but he hasn't promised to pass any legislation allowing it.

 

[APF]

oy vey! talk about arguing in circles!! you are misconstruing my argument, which has nothing to do with how obama and co. have been distorting what mccain said. i was backing up Star Power's point, which you responded to

Uhh, I responded to the idea that McCain's hypothetical situation revealed him to be ignorant of the socio-cultural situation in Iraq, by providing a transcript of him saying he felt such a standing presence wouldn't materialize due to the unique socio-cultural situation there. Then you ran in and breathlessly ranted about my not saying when McCain would pull out troops, ie a red herring. This is becoming a pattern: you feel you can't let me simply make a good point, so instead you come in with irrelevant red herrings or straw men. It's ok, evil horrible monsters like me sometimes make good points, and you don't have to make an ass of yourself when it happens.

 

[scorcho]

Saying that no one wants us in Iraq anymore is utterly LOLz-worthy.

The only people who don't want us there are short-sighted partisans in America and those Iraqis who seek power through any means necessary.

so anyone who's not for the US occupation are either 'short-sighted partisans' or power-hungry Iraqis? good to know.

dude. it's seriously not even worth arguing against you because nearly everything you're espousing is pure bullshit at this point. take a look at this poll and see for yourself how much Iraqis think our presence is helping them, or not.

too bad it looks like the poll only interviewed power-hungry Iraqis, who were likely up to no good and want to bomb shit and stuff. how fucking stupid of them.

 

[Particle Physicist]

Uhh, I responded to the idea that McCain's hypothetical situation revealed him to be ignorant of the socio-cultural situation in Iraq, by providing a transcript of him saying he felt such a standing presence wouldn't materialize due to the unique socio-cultural situation there. Then you ran in and breathlessly ranted about my not saying when McCain would pull out troops, ie a red herring. This is becoming a pattern: you feel you can't let me simply make a good point, so instead you come in with irrelevant red herrings or straw men. It's ok, evil horrible monsters like me sometimes make good points, and you don't have to make an ass of yourself when it happens.

no i didnt.

i think the problem here is that you see any sort of discussion, or opposing view as some sort of personal attack. get over yourself. seriously.

 

[scorcho]

There is no magic policy that's going to work here. Allowing some sort of "union" that isn't marriage will be criticized by some as not going far enough by not allowing same-sex couples to get straight up married, while some will criticize it for allowing anything at all.

hey. i'm all for African Americans getting the same rights and opportuinties as me in the job market, but do i really have to share the same bathroom or schools with them? seriously - this goes against the way i was raised.

 

[thegreyfox]

63% of Americans want to be Kings of Iraq with a slice of short-sighted partisans.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-02-12-troops-poll_x.htm

 

[Tamanon]

hey. i'm all for African Americans getting the same rights and opportuinties as me in the job market, but do i really have to share the same bathroom or schools with them? seriously - this goes against the way i was raised.

Look, a lot of people agree with you, but unfortunately, a TON of people don't. It takes time to change views, you can't just drop in and fix everything. Besides, he wouldn't get congressional support for a full equalization of marriage amendment.

BTW, Carter is probably Obama-bound.

http://www.thisdayonline.com/nview.php?id=107611

Former President of the United States, Jimmy Carter has hinted that he might cast his vote for Senator Barack Obama to aid his emergence as the candidate for the Democrats in America’s bid to elect a new President.
Carter, who is a Super Delegate from Georgia State, gave this hint at a media interaction after the Carter Center Awards for Guinea Worm Eradication in Abuja yesterday.
Carter, who was accompanied by his wife Rosalynn, did not profess a direct support for Obama but rather choose to make a veiled statement.
“We are very interested in the primaries. Don’t forget that Obama won in my state of Georgia. My town which is home to 625 people is for Obama, my children and their spouses are pro- Obama.
My grandchildren are also pro- Obama. As a Super Delegate, I would not disclose who I am rooting for but I leave you to make that guess," he said.

 

[siamesedreamer]

63% of Americans want to be Kings of Iraq with a slice of short-sighted partisans.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-02-12-troops-poll_x.htm

Thanks for posting a poll 14 months old.


Scorcho, if you want to agree to disagree, that's fine.

 

[User 10639]

Holy shit! al-Maliki has a better approval rating over in Iraq than Dubya has over here. :lol

Also, Jimmy Carter needs to get a sense of subtlety. "Well, he won my home state, and my family loves him, and the local town loves him, and I've committed adultery in my heart with him, but I'll leave it up to you to guess whether I'll vote for him or not!" He's so adorable.

 

[scorcho]

SD, if you don't want to look at the March 08 poll i posted and continue to paint all Iraq War opponents are either 'short-sighted partisans' (in the US) or power-hungry (in Iraq), then it's not a simple difference of opinion. it's fucking cognitive dissonance and a blatant distortion of the opposition.

but hey, if you like posting stupid, inelegant shit...