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[GhaleonEB]

His response today seems to be getting some attention.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080414/D901BHN85.html

And Drudge linked to the video. I wonder if this could backfire on her at all.

 

[CoolTrick]

What? She has pounced on him for Wright, saying she wouldn't have stayed in the church.

Oh, PLEASE. The Clintons 99% left that issue the hell alone. She was directly asked about it, and she said, personally, I would've left the church.

HARDLY what the GOP will do with it.

And Drudge linked to the video. I wonder if this could backfire on her at all.

Don't you mean Obama? I really haven't seen Obama be that smarmy before. I was pretty surprised. I don't think Clinton yelling at Obama "Shame on you" did her any favors, either.

 

[Particle Physicist]

... blah.

 

[AniHawk]

His response today seems to be getting some attention.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080414/D901BHN85.html

And Drudge linked to the video. I wonder if this could backfire on her at all.

That response rubbed me the wrong way. Seemed a little too Hillary Clintonish for my liking.

 

[thegreyfox]

Because they seem to clearly believe he can't win, because they owe it to their supporters to keep going, because they've gone for too long to give up now.

Frankly, I think this reasoning is so off-base it's borderline a lack of common sense as to why she hasn't dropped up.

If this was true, then why not run as an independent?

 

[monchi-kun]

Oh yes but they've been comparatively soft than what they COULD be saying. McCain's not only going to be more blunt about it, but he'll be able to compact that message into soundbytes to make it stick.

3am Phone call was "Soft"?

 

[reilo]

Heh.

Hillary lying and everybody knowing is a liar is going to help her in the generals [if she gets that far...]

Obama responding to Hillary calling him an elitist in a bit more forceful and angrier tone is Obama being smarmy and it will backfire on him.

Lovely.

 

[schuelma]

Oh yes but they've been comparatively soft than what they COULD be saying. McCain's not only going to be more blunt about it, but he'll be able to compact that message into soundbytes to make it stick.

:lol :lol You want to talk about soundbytes?

All McCain needs to do is use the Clinton quote on McCain passing the commander in chief test and Obama not.

 

[GhaleonEB]

That response rubbed me the wrong way. Seemed a little too Hillary Clintonish for my liking.

He was openly mocking her, which I haven't seen him do before. I think he did it about as well as you can, but there's an argument that he shouldn't have gone there. I think at this point he needed to hit back that hard.

 

[CoolTrick]

did you cringe when hillary did it? just curious.

Why don't you bother to fucking read what I said about it before asking me again? I already addressed it.

If this was true, then why not run as an independent?

This is one of those "arguing for the sake of it" points. That's not a particularly realistic scenario for obvious reasons.

 

[CoolTrick]

3am Phone call was "Soft"?

Uh, yeah, it was.

All McCain needs to do is use the Clinton quote on McCain passing the commander in chief test and Obama not.

He won't do that. Why do that when McCain can say it himself? That makes no sense.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

He was openly mocking her, which I haven't seen him do before.

It might have something do with this stuff.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/13/clinton-gore-and-kerry-we_n_96452.html

May be old, but I thought it was interesting nonetheless.

 

[Clevinger]

He won't do that. Why do that when McCain can say it himself? That makes no sense.

Because she's a fellow democrat... :lol There's something wrong when you critisize a fellow party member and compliment your rival party candidate in the same breath.

 

[Particle Physicist]

Why don't you bother to fucking read what I said about it? I already addressed it.

wow.. so testy... are you going to cry now?

 

[reilo]

Oh, I get it now.

Hillary's attacks on Obama have been soft so far, and Hillary should have hit Obama even harder, because it would have only benefited her.

Obama using a harsher tone than usual while addressing Hillary's record will backfire on him.

Interesting.

 

[schuelma]

He won't do that. Why do that when McCain can say it himself? That makes no sense.

You don't see how using the words of a prominent democrat to make that attack means more than McCain himself saying that? Really?

 

[monchi-kun]

Uh, yeah, it was.



He won't do that. Why do that when McCain can say it himself? That makes no sense.

to take advantage of the splintered democratic voter...maybe he can get some Hillary supporters to vote for him instead of Obama during the general election.

 

[CoolTrick]

He was openly mocking her, which I haven't seen him do before. I think he did it about as well as you can, but there's an argument that he shouldn't have gone there. I think at this point he needed to hit back that hard.

I don't think that was a good approach. He was lacking of factual evidence to attack her on. I think Hillary justified it when she did it because she believed Obama deliberately attacked her health care plan wrongfully, but here, Obama's already responded to these claims, and then suddenly started mocking her for no real additional reason. He didn't cite any statement in particular, either. He kind of just offered some general "She takes special interest money and helps Wall Street" points, which is nothing new.

 

[reilo]

I don't think that was a good approach. He was lacking of factual evidence to attack her on. I think Hillary justified it when she did it because she believed Obama deliberately attacked her health care plan wrongfully, but here, Obama's already responded to these claims, and then suddenly started mocking her for no real additional reason. He didn't cite any statement in particular, either. He kind of just offered some general "She takes special interest money and helps Wall Street" points, which is nothing new.

What? Obama addressing her NAFTA record was factually wrong? Obama addressing her ties to lobbyists were factually wrong? Obama addressing Hillary's chief strategic advisor's ties to Columbia were factually wrong?

Did you even watch the video?

 

[CoolTrick]

You don't see how using the words of a prominent democrat to make that attack means more than McCain himself saying that? Really?

It might be beneficial if McCain himself was lacking on experience, but since he's not and it's OBVIOUS he's not, it makes no sense for McCain to have Hillary Clinton (who McCain also has more experience than) say that about Obama when McCain can just say it himself and provide a greater contrast.

 

[killakiz]

Is there anyway t watch the forum online?

 

[CoolTrick]

What? Obama addressing her NAFTA record was factually wrong? Obama addressing her ties to lobbyists were factually wrong? Obama addressing Hillary's chief strategic advisor's ties to Columbia were factually wrong?

Did you even watch the video?

CNN showed Obama mocking Hillary. I'm assuming it's 75% the same video at minimum -- I have no real desire to watch it again especially since I read the transcript of the rest of it.

He's addressing things that aren't really anything new. Thus it kind of comes across as petty and desperate, just like you all accused Hillary of being when she did it (and at that point, she kind of was). C'mon guys, don't be blatantly hypocritical. You guys I'm sure are all on record as responding to that Clinton "Shame on you" ad.

 

[schuelma]

I think Obama's response was appropriate. Hillary morphing into a gun toting shot takin rural housewife needed to be called out.

 

[reilo]

CNN showed Obama mocking Hillary. I'm assuming it's 75% the same video at minimum -- I have no real desire to watch it again especially since I read the transcript of the rest of it.

No... it's not. Watch the entire 9 mins. You are just taking a soundbite and generating an entire opinion about what he said... Can't say I am shocked.

He's addressing things that aren't really anything new. Thus it kind of comes across as petty and desperate, just like you all accused Hillary of being when she did it (and at that point, she kind of was). C'mon guys, don't be blatantly hypocritical. You guys I'm sure are all on record as responding to that Clinton "Shame on you" ad.

DID YOU NOT JUST ADVOCATE FOR HILLARY TO ADDRESS OBAMA'S PAST WITH STUFF LIKE REVEREND WRIGHT?

Good lord man.

Who is being hypocritical?

You advocated for Hillary to lambast Obama on Wright, his experience, and other things, but it's hypocritical and bad when Obama addresses Hillary's past failures?

 

[CoolTrick]

What? No I didn't. I said that she DIDN'T pounce on him to the extent that she COULD'VE if she really wanted to. I'm not saying she should've. People are saying she's thrown everything she's been able to at him.

I said, no, she hasn't.

 

[gkryhewy]

That response rubbed me the wrong way. Seemed a little too Hillary Clintonish for my liking.

Needs more gravely nodding along to own points.

wow.. so testy... are you going to cry now?

Posts per page and CAPS PER POST increasing. Another meltdown imminent.

 

[killakiz]

Is there anyway t watch the forum online?

Never mind its finally up on CNN video.

 

[XxenobladerxX]

White women begin to turn away from Hillary Clinton IN PA.


http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/33411.html



Take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Clevinger]

From the article:

Jane Dovel, 68, an artist in Doylestown, turned away from Clinton after hearing the New York senator's reaction to Obama's comments that Ronald Reagan had been a "transformative political figure."

Clinton fired back that Republicans hadn't had better ideas. "I don't think it's a better idea to privatize Social Security," she said. "I don't think it's a better idea to eliminate the minimum wage."

That's not what Obama had said, recalled Dovel. "What Clinton said was a blatant lie," she said. "From that moment on, she was history. She was not to be trusted."

Oh hey, another petty thing Clinton pounced on Obama with...

 

[CoolTrick]

White women begin to turn away from Hillary Clinton IN PA.

I saw that.

1) The poll IS a few days old.

2) Hillary didn't lose virtually any white women support. A small percentage of white women just decided to go with Obama.

C'mon now. Infact, this reaffirms with what SurveyUSA found: There's virtually no change in Clinton's support amongst her demographics.

 

[APF]

hey guys i just did my taxes today and wow i really feel like maybe i outta go to church or learn to hunt or maybe join those minutemen guys or something because my heads just swimming you know?

 

[Cheebs]

Because they seem to clearly believe he can't win, because they owe it to their supporters to keep going, because they've gone for too long to give up now.

Frankly, I think this reasoning is so off-base it's borderline a lack of common sense as to why she hasn't dropped up.

But what she is doing is also turning away a lot of Obama supporters who supported Bill in the 90's. Not turning them away as in votes, but as in respect.

I became interested in politics and a true-blue democrat because of Bill, I stood by him 100% during Monica-gate. I worshiped him and read his autobiography multiple times and met him in 2002 and when I did I was so nervous because he was my hero. And that goodwill made me a ardent defender of Hillary through 2007 despite the fact I supported Obama because well, I adored Bill and she was his gal so she was ok with me.


Now whenever I see Bill's face on TV I look at him with anger and disgust. This is something I never expected to happen. And it depresses me.

In a way you could say Bill Clinton broke my heart. I am still in shock over it.

 

[CoolTrick]

From the article:





Oh hey, another petty thing Clinton pounced on Obama with...

Oh, hey, but when Obama makes colossal mistakes (that are much greater than THAT story), they go away! Amirite lolz?!

 

[ralexand]

You guys are really off the mark if you guys don't think there's been restraint from the Clintons on what they can attack Obama with.

There certainly has been.


As far as I know.

 

[Clevinger]

Oh, hey, but when Obama makes colossal mistakes (that are much greater than THAT story), they go away! Amirite lolz?!

We were talking about Clinton attacking Obama with whatever she can, not about Obama making mistakes. Good try, though.

hey guys i just did my taxes today and wow i really feel like maybe i outta go to church or learn to hunt or maybe join those minutemen guys or something because my heads just swimming you know?

Didn't you post this yesterday? Come up with some new material.

 

[CoolTrick]

But what she is doing is also turning away a lot of Obama supporters who supported Bill in the 90's. Not turning them away as in votes, but as in respect.

Sure, his favorability numbers have dropped, but considering Obama's coalition as a whole is more solidly Democratic than Clinton's, I think as you pointed out, it doesn't really translate into votes.

I became interested in politics and a true-blue democrat because of Bill, I stood by him 100% during Monica-gate. I worshiped him and read his autobiography multiple times and met him in 2002 and when I did I was so nervous because he was my hero. And that goodwill made me a ardent defender of Hillary through 2007 despite the fact I supported Obama because well, I adored Bill and she was his gal so she was ok with me.


Now whenever I see Bill's face on TV I look at him with anger and disgust. This is something I never expected to happen. And it depresses me.

In a way you could say Bill Clinton broke my heart. I am still in shock over it.

Newsflash you're not considering: When the Obamania stops if he wins the general election, and has to start making concrete decisions, a LOT of people are going to be disillusioned, shocked, and pissed off.

 

[CoolTrick]

We were talking about Clinton attacking Obama with whatever she can, not about Obama making mistakes. Good try, though.

Oh, then, what exactly is so wrong with what Hillary did there? Mitt Romney and McCain were ten times worse for crying out loud and that lasted only a few weeks. That was such a bad argument to suggest that Hillary has thrown everything she'd be able to at him.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Good gravy, CoolTrick. Are you really that much of a fan of Hillary or what?

 

[monchi-kun]

Newsflash you're not considering: When the Obamania stops if he wins the general election, and has to start making concrete decisions, a LOT of people are going to be disillusioned, shocked, and pissed off.

republicans?

 

[Clevinger]

Oh, then, what exactly is so wrong with what Hillary did there? Mitt Romney and McCain were ten times worse for crying out loud and that lasted only a few weeks. That was such a bad argument to suggest that Hillary has thrown everything she'd be able to at him.

It's another example that she's using everything she can, no matter how petty. Keep bringing up different subjects, though.

Deflect, deflect, deflect.

 

[Cheebs]

Sure, his favorability numbers have dropped, but considering Obama's coalition as a whole is more solidly Democratic than Clinton's, I think as you pointed out, it doesn't really translate into votes.

I saw a poll this year that has Jimmy Carter over-taking Bill Clinton as the most popular living ex-president for the very first time since Bill Clinton left office. You don't think there is something very noticeably odd about this?

Votes don't matter anymore for the Clintons, it's their legacy thats left. And Bill Clinton's legacy is imploding.

 

[grandjedi6]

Oh, hey, but when Obama makes colossal mistakes (that are much greater than THAT story), they go away! Amirite lolz?!

 

[CoolTrick]

Good gravy, CoolTrick. Are you really that much of a fan of Hillary or what?

Are you all THAT much a fan of Obama?

Apparently so. I definitely think Hillary and her campaign has their faults. But people here are so unwavering and stubborn and inside their own bubble that no one's willing to actually discuss or cede an inch.

 

[harSon]

Are you all THAT much a fan of Obama?

Apparently so. I definitely think Hillary and her campaign has their faults. But people here are so unwavering and stubborn and inside their own bubble that no one's willing to actually discuss or cede an inch.

Seriously dude, look in a mother fucking mirror. I think most of us are well aware of our personal bias, how about you come to grips with yours?

 

[APF]

Didn't you post this yesterday?

...no, I posted it like 15 minutes ago.

 

[siamesedreamer]

hey guys i just did my taxes today and wow i really feel like maybe i outta go to church or learn to hunt or maybe join those minutemen guys or something because my heads just swimming you know?

Did you beat the Obamas in charitable contributions?

 

[PhoenixDark]

I saw that.

1) The poll IS a few days old.

2) Hillary didn't lose virtually any white women support. A small percentage of white women just decided to go with Obama.

C'mon now. Infact, this reaffirms with what SurveyUSA found: There's virtually no change in Clinton's support amongst her demographics.

I've stopped paying attention to PA polls - she's going to win the state and some people in the media will make it sound like a big important victory. I'm interested in Indiana as well as how Obama carries himself between now and June 1st. I'd imagine superdelegates are thinking about these landmines he's stepping in, and how they'll play out in October and November. Granted I thought his "bitter" point was spot on, but I'm interested to see how it plays out with white blue collar workers. The media will spin it negatively, saying he lost Penn. because of the comment (which isn't true), but I think we'll see the effect (if any) in Indiana.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

I definitely think Hillary and her campaign has their faults. But people here are so unwavering and stubborn and inside their own bubble that no one's willing to actually discuss or cede an inch.

What bubble? Why do you find it fair to sit there and call out anyone who doesn't agree with you as a blind follower?

You're not making very good arguments in the first place, so I wonder why so many bother with your posts. And while I am a fan of Obama, he's done nothing in this campaign as stupid or plainly flip-floppy as Clinton has. That much is self-evident. Hillary could start a hat store with how many she's donned in the last few months. Consistency and strength of message is not her strong suit and that is what has gotten her in hot water time and time again. If you're angry about her campaign being called out, perhaps you should be more constructively criticizing her clusterfuck of a campaign.

 

[Clevinger]

...no, I posted it like 15 minutes ago.

Oh, I was thinking this:

hey guys i just did my taxes today and wow i really feel like maybe i outta go to church or learn to hunt or maybe join those minutemen guys or something because my heads just swimming you know?

For some reason looked strikingly similar to this:

oh no al might start clinging to religion and guns an bein fraid of teh immigrants now what a shame poor al

from yesterday

 

[CoolTrick]

Why do you find it fair to sit there and call out anyone who doesn't agree with you as a blind follower?

I'm sorry, but frankly, I can tell when someone has a valid argument and when they're just being stubborn and spinning for the damn sake of it. I'm more than happy to argee to disagree and have in the past in this thread, and I'm happy to point out some of Hillary's faults. But people here are so obsessed with thinking this guy does no wrong that it's just as responsible for preventing nice discussion as I'm accused of doing.

Shit like "Why doesn't she run as an independant", or "Rev. Wright didn't permanently hurt Obama because the Gallup daily tracking says so", or "The Clintons are just as bad as the GOP will be in attacking Obama", give me a friggin break.