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PoliGAF Thread of Republican's Turn at Conventions (Palin VP - READ OP)

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F

Fatalah

Member
The Obama camp has to remain positive and keep on campaigning across the country. Forget these polls, keep on donating, keep on changing stubborn minds across America.
 
M

mrmyth

Member
Guybrush Threepwood said:
worst%20mccain%20photo.jpg
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Not surprised its as black as his heart.
 
M

monchi-kun

Member
King_Slender said:
You really sit and talk down fact check with your own mother for 30 minutes on her candidate of choice? REALLY? Must be a fascinating Thanksgiving at your place.
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as opposed to what....keeping her in a state of ignorance...oh wait, isn't that what the politicians want? :lol
 
S

sevenchaos

Banned
King_Slender said:
Small town cadidate who is a woman.

Is that more or less change than a machine politics product who is black?

You decide.
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I thought we were voting on issues. Not a person's race, gender, where they come from.
 
M

minus_273

Banned
soul creator said:
the whole surge debate is incredibly silly. No one disputes the idea that if you throw a shitload of troops in Iraq, you can temporarily stop the increase of violence. But last time I checked, the goal of the surge wasn't just "slowing down violence".

Never mind the fact that if the surge "worked" and we've "won" doesn't that mean troops can come home? But wait, as soon as that's proposed, Republicans say "but the violence will go back up if we're not there!"
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no mccain position is to reduce violence and leave. a major part of his spending cuts is the reduction of expenses in iraq.
 
S

Slurpy

*drowns in jizz*
King_Slender said:
...except John McCain...
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The surge honestly could have gone either way. Obama is repeatedly on record admitting it went much better than he expected. What is there more to say? At least he has a history of admitting when things turn out differently than he expects, unlike most politicians who back peddle and are unwilling to cede any ground for fear of losing pride.
 
K

Kildace

Member
King_Slender said:
Small town cadidate who is a woman.

Is that more or less change than a machine politics product who is black?

You decide.
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Well as long as we're not talking qualifications McCain should just have picked an hermaphrodite midget PTA member. Now that's change I can believe in!
 
O

Odrion

Banned
Mercury Fred said:
I just had a depressing chat with my mom who lives in Ohio. She voted Bush in 2000 and Kerry in 2004. She LOVED Palin's speech. I spent 30 minutes debunking most of the "points" from the speech and underlining Palin's hypocrisy (earmarks and sex ed to begin with).

When it comes down to it, I think a lot of middle America sees Obama as "scary" and Palin as someone to whom they can connect. Ugh.
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It was idiotic for Obama not to go after Palin. Everyone kept going "Oh no! They'll appear sexist" but now the Republicans has successfully defined Palin while simultaneously labeling Democrats as sexist anyways.
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
NullPointer said:
really?

really?

/bettenhausen
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He always said the surge worked for slowing violence. But remember, the surge was meant to help the Iraq government focus on resolving conflicts from Basra and Sadr City. Which hasn't happen.
 
M

Mercury Fred

Banned
King_Slender said:
You really sit and talk down fact check with your own mother for 30 minutes on her candidate of choice? REALLY? Must be a fascinating Thanksgiving at your place.
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It's not her candidate of choice. She calls McCain "damaged goods."

And as far as Thanksgiving being fascinating, actually, it is.

I come from a big family of Catholic, old school blue collar Democrats with lots of aunts, uncles and cousins. My grandparents DESPISED Reagan and my grandpa, a WWII vet and factory worker, would throw zingers out about the Reagans during those years. The family is politically engaged, quirky, silly and likes to drink and get loud at holidays. Card games, the aunts and uncles being goaded into playing beer pong, myself and a cousin commandeering the stereo to treat the extended family to M.I.A. or something similarly inappropriate, yes it is fascinating :D

I'm sure the can of Alpo you share with your troglodytes is far more fascinating though.
 
Y

Yaweee

Member
Why are people paying any attention at all to the 'Tie' poll? It is the one of smallest polls of ANY of the ones listed in the poll of polls since the beginning of the campaign.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...neral_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html#polls

God, the only thing worse about this campaign than watching the Republican Convention is listening to people make absolutely ridiculous poll interpretations. You're every bit as bad as the crackpots that analyze lotto numbers and roulette tables to discover the 'patterns'.
 
A

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Mercury Fred said:
It's not her candidate of choice. She calls McCain "damaged goods."

And as far as Thanksgiving being fascinating, actually, it is.

I come from a big family of Catholic, old school blue collar Democrats with lots of aunts, uncles and cousins. My grandparents DESPISED Reagan and my grandpa, a WWII vet and factory worker, would throw zingers out about the Reagans during those years. The family is politically engaged, quirky, silly and likes to drink and get loud at holidays. Card games, the aunts and uncles being goaded into playing beer pong, myself and a cousin commandeering the stereo to treat the extended family to M.I.A. or something similarly inappropriate, yes it is fascinating :D

I'm sure the can of Alpo you share with your troglodytes is far more fascinating though.
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Bring up the fact that it was Catholics that Obama was helping as a community organizer in Chicago and the Republicans shitted on them yesterday.
 
M

Mercury Fred

Banned
Agent Icebeezy said:
Bring up the fact that it was Catholics that Obama was helping as a community organizer in Chicago and the Republicans shitted on them yesterday.
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Yeah, I didn't realize that until after we got off the phone =/
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Tyrone Slothrop said:
i'm interested in what obama has to say about the surge tonight. it was always his weakest issue.
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From that quote, I don't like the way he handled it.

I agree that pointing out the main goal was for the failed reconciliation.

However, I'd also put my trademark left-conservative spin on it . . . the surge largely succeeded by having the USA pay salaries to all these former Sunni militants. We basically 'bought off' a huge slice of the people that could be out there fighting.

In other words, the "surge" has largely been an expensive welfare program for foreigners where American citizens fit the bill. So . . . is that the new GOP policy? No welfare for Americans . . . just massive welfare for foreigners so we can look like we are 'winning' a military occupation?

Seriously . . . have we really had much in terms of military battles in this "surge"? There were some early-on. But most of the success has come from the 'sunni awakening' . . . which is largely powered by welfare payments. And this is something that started before the surge even began. Putting more troops on the street definitely helped, but I submit that buying off the militants was probably a bigger factor.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
speculawyer said:
From that quote, I don't like the way he handled it.

I agree that pointing out the main goal was for the failed reconciliation.

However, I'd also put my trademark left-conservative spin on it . . . the surge largely succeeded by having the USA pay salaries to all these former Sunni militants. We basically 'bought off' a huge slice of the people that could be out there fighting.

In other words, the "surge" has largely been an expensive welfare program for foreigners where American citizens fit the bill. So . . . is that the new GOP policy? No welfare for Americans . . . just massive welfare for foreigners so we can look like we are 'winning' a military occupation?

Seriously . . . have we really had much in terms of military battles in this "surge"? There were some early-on. But most of the success has come from the 'sunni awakening' . . . which is largely powered by welfare payments. And this is something that started before the surge even began. Putting more troops on the street definitely helped, but I submit that buying off the militants was probably a bigger factor.
Click to expand...

One thing that actually scares me a bit, if Bushco and team are going to announce troop withdrawals to coincide with the ending of the SOI program.
 
F

Fatalah

Member
Yaweee said:
God, the only thing worse about this campaign than watching the Republican Convention is listening to people make absolutely ridiculous poll interpretations.
Click to expand...

Do you follow fivethirtyeight.com?
 
F

Father_Brain

Banned
http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/09/obama_on_oreilly_a_sneak_peek.php
Bill O'Reilly: "Do you believe we are in the middle of a War On Terror."

Barack Obama: "Absolutely."


Bill O: "Who's the enemy?"


BO: "Al Qaeda, the Taliban, a whole host of networks that are bent on attacking America, who have a distorted ideology, who have perverted the faith of Islam and so we have to go after them."


Bill O: "The next President of the United States is going to have to make a decision about Iran whether to stop them militarily, because I don't believe, if diplomacy works - fine, but you've gotta have a plan B and a lot of people are saying look Barack Obama's not going to attack Iran...

BO (interrupts): "Look, look here's where you and I agree. It's unacceptable for Iran to possess a nuclear weapon. It would be a game changer and I've said that repeatedly. I've also said I would never take a military option off the table."
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Not that I expected Obama to ever actually challenge the WoT framework, but I can't say I'm thrilled with this.
 
Xisiqomelir

Xisiqomelir

Member
W

WedgeX

Banned
Agent Icebeezy said:
Bring up the fact that it was Catholics that Obama was helping as a community organizer in Chicago and the Republicans shitted on them yesterday.
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And I can provide the link!

The group Catholic Democrats today issued a strong rebuke of Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin’s sarcastic mocking of Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama’s work as a community organizer during the 1980s.

“I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a community organizer, except that you have actual responsibilities,” Palin, former mayor of a small town in Alaska, said during her speech to the Republican National Convention Sept. 3 in St. Paul, Minn.

The speech by Palin, currently governor of Alaska, followed one by former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, who also belittled Obama’s work as a community organizer, drawing laughs from the assembled Republicans.

“It is shocking that a vice presidential candidate would disparage an essential component of the Catholic social tradition with her condescending attack on urban community organizing,” said Dr. Patrick Whelan, president of Catholic Democrats, an association of state-based groups advancing understanding of Catholic social teaching.

The group criticized Palin for mocking Obama’s work “in the 1980s for the Catholic Campaign for Human Development.” The Catholic Campaign for Human Development is an arm of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops and it partially funded Obama’s activities in Catholic parishes on the South Side of Chicago. At the time it was known simply as the Campaign for Human Development.

Community organizing was work Obama undertook “instead of pursuing a lucrative career on Wall Street,” according to a statement from Catholic Democrats.

Referring to Palin’s speech, the statement said: “Her divisive rhetoric, repeatedly pitting small towns against urban communities, demonstrates not only a lack of charity toward the needs of some of the least among us but a fundamental disrespect for those who dedicate their lives to overcoming poverty across our country.”
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http://ncronline3.org/drupal/?q=node/1766

Knocking community organizing...so much for my thinking that she might support McCain's increasing of national service (aka....community organizing).
 
K

Kildace

Member
Father_Brain said:
Not that I expected Obama to ever actually challenge the WoT framework, but I can't say I'm thrilled with this.
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On Fox News in front of Bill O'Reilly 2 hours before McCain gives a speech calling Obama weak on terror and unable to protect America? Fat chance.
 
N

NullPointer

Member
King_Slender said:
You really sit and talk down fact check with your own mother for 30 minutes on her candidate of choice? REALLY? Must be a fascinating Thanksgiving at your place.
Click to expand...

I do this all the time as well. My mother and I couldn't be farther apart in political outlook. Believe me.

At least we agree on the constitution, so that's where we always start.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
minus_273 said:
"Admittedly there is a risk in any course we follow other than this, but every lesson in history tells us that the greater risk lies in appeasement, and this is the specter our well-meaning liberal friends refuse to face--that their policy of accommodation is appeasement, and it gives no choice between peace and war, only between fight and surrender."
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Yeah, it really sucked that we left Vietnam only to have them invade us and occupy the USA.

And while we are on the topic of 'appeasement' . . . what do you call our paying of tens of thousands of Sunni militants not to attack us?

That's right . . . the surge = appeasement by Paetraes. Oh noes!
 
F

Freedom = $1.05

Banned
speculawyer said:
From that quote, I don't like the way he handled it.

I agree that pointing out the main goal was for the failed reconciliation.

However, I'd also put my trademark left-conservative spin on it . . . the surge largely succeeded by having the USA pay salaries to all these former Sunni militants. We basically 'bought off' a huge slice of the people that could be out there fighting.

In other words, the "surge" has largely been an expensive welfare program for foreigners where American citizens fit the bill. So . . . is that the new GOP policy? No welfare for Americans . . . just massive welfare for foreigners so we can look like we are 'winning' a military occupation?

Seriously . . . have we really had much in terms of military battles in this "surge"? There were some early-on. But most of the success has come from the 'sunni awakening' . . . which is largely powered by welfare payments. And this is something that started before the surge even began. Putting more troops on the street definitely helped, but I submit that buying off the militants was probably a bigger factor.
Click to expand...

Helps that Sadr has his followers on lockdown at the moment. He can flip that switch at any time, though.
 
D

Diablos

Member
Tamanon said:
Oh god, I forgot the Cheebs-Diablos Dominohnoez effect.
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Where exactly did I imply a omgonoz effect? Besides, ever since Rudy started giving his speech this entire thread has been "omgonoz" and "fuck off Republicans". I am simply stating that Palin, as a VP nominee that the country knew absolutely nothing about as of just a few days ago, is helping McCain this much is QUITE interesting, don't you think? She had about as many viewers as Obama did -- and she's the vice presidential nominee. That's unbelievable. VP's are supposed to matter, yes, but not this much.

There's a huge difference between omgmonz and realizing that in some ways Palin is proving herself to be a game changer and having a bigger key role in the campaign than anyone initially imagined, love it or hate it.

A six point drop prior to all of the polls that reflect her speech being released is never a good thing. It could go up, it could go down even further. Is it the end of the world? Omgonoz? Chicken little? No, but it still isn't a good thing, either. To simply suggest that this could spell trouble doesn't mean I think Obama should pack his bags and go home, y'know.
 
N

NullPointer

Member
King_Slender said:
Small town cadidate who is a woman.

Is that more or less change than a machine politics product who is black?

You decide.
Click to expand...

Are you kidding me? That's how you see this election?

I'll remember not to take you seriously again.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Tamanon said:
One thing that actually scares me a bit, if Bushco and team are going to announce troop withdrawals to coincide with the ending of the SOI program.
Click to expand...

Yeah, there is a lot of work that needs to be done there. Right now, we (the USA) are paying all these Sunnis. And we are trying to get the Iraqi government (with their many billions surplus) to start paying them. They have been saying "No". They had damn well better wise up.

If we leave and those payments stop, civil war is sure to follow. And honestly, I won't really feel too sorry for that government if they refuse to work out some deal to de-fuse the situation.
 
K

kevm3

Member
I really don't understand why Obama is playing so nice with the opposition when they are assassinating his character. It's tiring. No more of that good friend and war hero McCain nonsense. HIT THESE GUYS. And Ireally don't understand Obama coming out on Fox news talking about the surge was successful beyond our wildest dreams. Awesome way to give the republicans ammo and to give them something to back up "McCain's judgment."

The American people aren't going to care about your claims about what you can dofor the country if the Republicans successfully paint you as some sort of elitist, secret muslim terrorist, antichrist... You have to hit the republicans back... not laugh, act like it didn't happen and then give them some ammo. I mean Bush won two elections in a row using the same tactics and the Dems may lose again if they play soft again and let Obama be some kind of sacrificial lamb. You don't have to go assassinate their character, but hit them back! Attack their hypocrisy and lack of serious policy hard
 
N

NullPointer

Member
Deus Ex Machina said:
He always said the surge worked for slowing violence. But remember, the surge was meant to help the Iraq government focus on resolving conflicts from Basra and Sadr City. Which hasn't happen.
Click to expand...

Yeah. And I think he stated his position about a million times, exactly as you describe. He always presumed that there would be a temporary lull or reduction in violence, but that what it was missing was an actual long term strategy. Or as Biden puts it - "Ok, then what?"

The "really, really" bit was just my incredulity at seeing Obama's position so misconstrued.
 
O

omgimaninja

Member
Diablos said:
Where exactly did I imply a omgonoz effect? Besides, ever since Rudy started giving his speech this entire thread has been "omgonoz" and "fuck off Republicans". I am simply stating that Palin, as a VP nominee that the country knew absolutely nothing about as of just a few days ago, is helping McCain this much is QUITE interesting, don't you think? She had about as many viewers as Obama did -- and she's the vice presidential nominee. That's unbelievable. VP's are supposed to matter, yes, but not this much.

There's a huge difference between omgmonz and realizing that in some ways Palin is proving herself to be a game changer and having a bigger key role in the campaign than anyone initially imagined, love it or hate it.
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She had tons of viewers simply because people were curious to see who she was. I had no interest in watching the RNC but I tuned in to hear her speak. I watched a few minutes, and have no interest in hearing her speak again.
 
Y

Yaweee

Member
Fatalah said:
Do you follow fivethirtyeight.com?
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Not too closely, but I appreciate what they do. Any sort of well-organized collation of data earns my respect. They cite their sources, link to a ton of stories about voter statistics and tendencies, and represent many different interpretations and combination of data. I'm a huge fan of detailed statistics, and what that site does (alongside the Poll of Polls) is far, far, faaaaaar more tolerable than a single cable news channel perpetually shitting a break as their internal polling makes six-point swings every three days.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Agent Icebeezy said:
Bring up the fact that it was Catholics that Obama was helping as a community organizer in Chicago and the Republicans shitted on them yesterday.
Click to expand...

Yeah, well . . . that's just that whore church anyway, right? :lol

It is a Hagee joke, OK!?!?!
 
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