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PoliGAF Thread of Republican's Turn at Conventions (Palin VP - READ OP)

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H

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
omg rite said:
... Because her daughter is seventeen.
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Chef%20south%20park.gif

"Hey, she's ready."
 
T

Tyrone Slothrop

Banned
besada said:
For the record, I don't care about Palin's daughter's baby. I didn't care about Edward's possible baby. I didn't care about Bill getting a blowjob. I didn't care about Bush Senior's supposed affair. I didn't care about Reagan's estranged family. I didn't care about Carter's "lust in his heart".

I care about the issues. I care about what they're going to do in office. I don't care where they put their genitals, or what they do with them.
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in this respect i wish we were more like france. their presidents have had all kinds of kinky affairs and bastard children, yet nobody gives a shit.
 
R

ronito

Member
JayDubya said:
Also, I'm sure you realize that your support for abortion is completely against the position of your church, you're an extreme minority, and I'm sure some of your peers would decry you as not really being a supporter of the church no matter what other values you may share with them, which sounds kind of familiar and relevant to what we're talking about.
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Whoa whoa whoa. Badafucup!

Who said I was pro-abortion or even pro-choice? I thought we discussed this at length before? I am neither. I'm pro-education and pro-contraception and most definitely against anything after the first trimester. Just because I can see a modern feminist's point of view and just because I understand what the pro-choice crowd is saying doesn't mean I'm all for abortion.

ass/u/me?
 
S

Stoney Mason

Banned
besada said:
For the record, I don't care about Palin's daughter's baby. I didn't care about Edward's possible baby. I didn't care about Bill getting a blowjob. I didn't care about Bush Senior's supposed affair. I didn't care about Reagan's estranged family. I didn't care about Carter's "lust in his heart".

I care about the issues. I care about what they're going to do in office. I don't care where they put their genitals, or what they do with them.
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I don't either. I do care about a party that pretends it has the lock on family values. That aggressively pushes abstinence only education as a moral decision for education and that asks us to aggressively uses "values" as judgments as the basis for selecting who is worthwhile to serve and transmit those values.
 
T

Tyrone Slothrop

Banned
delirium said:
When are the new polls released? Did Obama get a post-convention bounce, and did McCain gain or lose with the Palin pick?
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according to fivethirtyeight the 'post convention bounce' was above average when you factor in that the VP megaton was announced the day after.
 
P

PS2 KID

Member
Amir0x said:
How does this happen? Is this a joke?

Do you know how many parents across the country PREACH to their kids to use condoms if they must have sex? How many parents PREACH to their kids to stay away from drugs?

How does this happen?

It's the real world. Kids don't listen to parents.
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Amirox, nice one. *thumbs up*
 
B

besada

Banned
Tyrone Slothrop said:
in this respect i wish we were more like france. their presidents have had all kinds of kinky affairs and bastard children, yet nobody gives a shit.
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Holding politicians to standards that "We the people" don't meet just increases their willingness to lie to us. When Clinton got cornered, rather than lie, I wish he simply would have said "It's none of your fucking business." Because it's not.

A certain decrease in privacy for public figures is to be expected, but we're talking sex, the thing we all kept the most private. I don't see any good reason, other than playing "gotcha" politics (which is a waste of time) for us to care about who our leaders are fucking, so long as it's consensual.
 
A

aceface

Member
Personally I don't have a problem with this. Teenagers have sex, always have, always will. I want to say her parents should have better educated her on contraception, but even then, birth control isin't always 100% effective.

It's the religious right this might affect, people who think that no one should be having sex before marraige and that having a pregnant 17 year old daughter reflects badly on the parents. Might get some of them to stay home on election day.
 
B

besada

Banned
Stoney Mason said:
I don't either. I do care about a party that pretends it has the lock on family values. That aggressively pushes abstinence only education as a moral decision for education and that asks us to aggressively uses "values" as judgments as the basis for selecting who is worthwhile to serve and transmit those values.
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I agree that it's obnoxious that the Republican party likes to intrude into people's bedrooms. I think it's wrong when they do it, but I can't do it myself and not think it's equally wrong.
 
A

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
aceface said:
It's the religious right this might affect, people who think that no one should be having sex before marraige and that having a pregnant 17 year old daughter reflects badly on the parents. Might get some of them to stay home on election day.
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This is exactly who does not like this. I wonder if the media is going to try to find the father.
 
H

HolyStar

Banned
Also I doubt that Palin's daughter doesn't know what a condom is in her Sex Ed classs in where the say abstinence is the only way to remain STD and pregnant free.
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
Amir0x said:
How does this happen? Is this a joke?

Do you know how many parents across the country PREACH to their kids to use condoms if they must have sex? How many parents PREACH to their kids to stay away from drugs?

How does this happen?

It's the real world. Kids don't listen to parents.
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Exacta-fucking-mundo.

This is the real world, not some Christian fantasy world where if you tell kids not to have sex and preach to them about abstinence only, it'll work.

I was fully being sarcastic (thanks for expanding on my point!): Christian family values don't work. Abstinence only doesn't work (kids are going to do the deed anyways). Telling kids not to do it before they're married doesn't work.

The religious right fails to understand this and always think "Not my daughter, no way, she's a good Christian girl" and yet, time and again, it's exactly those who have been denied proper education and access to contraception that end up in the situations which the same people condemn.
 
S

Stoney Mason

Banned
besada said:
I agree that it's obnoxious that the Republican party likes to intrude into people's bedrooms. I think it's wrong when they do it, but I can't do it myself and not think it's equally wrong.
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The issue for me isn't the kid being pregnant. The issue for me is hypocrisy with reality and their stated platform. I don't have an issue with Palin. I have an issue with the talking heads of the republican party and their actual policies derived from there.
 
C

Crayon Shinchan

Aquafina Fanboy
Nono... don't get distracted by the daughter people. She's a red herring! The only point that's worth noting is that she's just a further example of how poorly vetted Palin was, and how poor McCain's judgement was in making the choice.

How can you trust a commander in chief that flies blind by the seat of the pants?

You can't afford to have him crash this ride. He won't be the only POW this time!
 
A

Amir0x

Banned
CharlieDigital said:
Exacta-fucking-mundo.

This is the real world, not some Christian fantasy world where if you tell kids not to have sex and preach to them about abstinence only, it'll work.

I was fully being sarcastic (thanks for expanding on my point!): Christian family values don't work. Abstinence only doesn't work (kids are going to do the deed anyways). Telling kids not to do it before they're married doesn't work.

The religious right fails to understand this and always think "Not my daughter, no way, she's a good Christian girl" and yet, time and again, it's exactly those who have been denied proper education and access to contraception that end up in the situations which the same people condemn.
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Ok, let me put it in simple terms.

Children not listening to their parents is not proof that something does not work. The idea is to improve effectiveness, since nothing is 100%. Now while I am certainly against abstinence only education, it is a really horrendous counter argument to that teaching to say that "if a kid doesn't listen, that means it doesn't work."

In other words. Teaching abstinence-only education isn't full-proof, teaching use of contraceptions isn't full-proof. Teaching a mix isn't going to be full-proof either. People don't defend the Christian Values as an end-all-be-all perfect methodology. I don't even think the far Christian right will believe it works all the time, or even close!
 
K

Kildace

Member
Hitokage said:
Heh, this whole thing is a good example of why smear campaigns are so prevalent. Old Politics are easy and fun. :p
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It's also imo due to frustration from the left when things that would cause a Democrat's downfall are done by a Republican and everyone just shrugs.
 
B

besada

Banned
Stoney Mason said:
The issue for me isn't the kid being pregnant. The issue for me is hypocrisy with reality and their stated platform. I don't have an issue with Palin. I have an issue with the talking heads of the republican party and their actual policies derived from there.
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Agreed. I wish all parties could simply agree that matters of the heart and genitals can't effectively and shouldn't be legislated.
 
A

Atrus

Gold Member
besada said:
I care about what they're going to do in office. I don't care where they put their genitals, or what they do with them.
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Which is good, but issues like these are used salaciously as political ammunition. The Republicans regardless of their socially idiotic platforms, are at least politically intelligent enough to use this ammo to great effect and intimidate the opposition toward impotency when similar situations occur in reverse.

The Democrats don't have the political intelligence to exploit minor issues and turn them into bigger ones. This may be a more high brow approach to some but the majority of the American electorate aren't intelligent people.

They care more about a Presidential sex scandal than a dysfunctional administration. So long as you give the mob enough entertainment value, you can have your way with them.

It takes a democrat running against a lengthy inept war, against 8 years of one of the most least liked administrations, possessing some of the most capable qualities of leadership in order to barely poll better than the Republicans.

The Republicans on the other hand could probably make a tame ape President. (They came awfully close with the last one).
 
A

AniHawk

Member
Oh shit. I was wondering why the pregnancy thing got brought up again and why no one was saying anything.

So weird. Was this all a coincidence, or did some rumors cross the streams?

Regardless, I hope now everyone can move on to actual things to get Sarah Palin for.
 
R

ronito

Member
Amir0x said:
I don't even think the far Christian right will believe it works all the time, or even close!
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Oh ho ho. But here's where you're wrong. Fact is the left might snigger and say "oh another one." but the far right will eat her alive, or at least would if they had another choice, they'd use that whole "have your own house in order" set of scriptures. Already I've seen on a right leaning religious site from a female poster, "If she can't keep her house in order how can we trust her to keep the country in order?"

I think you misunderestimate the far right in this.
 
JCreasy

JCreasy

Member
I see right through this BS

In 4 months, Bristol will mysteriously have a "miscarriage." But at least we will have all believed that the changes in her body were because she recently pregnant, and not PREVIOUSLY pregnant with Trig . . .
 
F

FoneBone

Member
While we're on the subject of Palin's "feminist" credentials -- Feminists for Life, the group with which she has allied herself, takes a less-than-enthusiastic stance on contraception, and, like far too many abortion groups, exists pretty much solely to work to ban abortion, instead of actually putting effort behind policy changes that might reduce it:
http://www.alternet.org/election08/96991/sarah_palin_and_feminists_for_life/
No woman, argues Foster, should ever have to choose between having a child and a career. "Abortion is a reflection that society has failed women," she tells high school and college students as she tours the country.

"Women deserve better choices," she says and points to practical alternatives and resources available to a young woman who has an unwanted pregnancy. She can choose single parenthood and use food stamps or temporary assistance to needy families. She can choose adoption. Or, college-age women can pressure school campuses to offer child care and family housing so that they never, ever, have to choose between a pregnancy and an education.

Feminism is all about having choices, Foster told me, after her talk. I couldn't agree more. Young women, she says, should have the right to bear a child and have access to high-quality, affordable child care. Again, I heartily agreed.

But Foster is cleverly disingenuous. When I asked what she does to promote child care, her answers were vague and evasive. When I read the organization's brochures aimed at campus physicians and psychologists, I found nothing about campaigning for child care. The real goal is to convince professionals to persuade young women to "choose" to bear a baby.
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G

Gaborn

Member
AniHawk said:
Oh shit. I was wondering why the pregnancy thing got brought up again and why no one was saying anything.

So weird. Was this all a coincidence, or did some rumors cross the streams?
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Considering the daily kos speculator lied about the date of the photo they used to "prove" the daughter was pregnant it's a coincidence.
 
Q

qwertybob

Member
CNN said:
Republican presidential candidate McCain was aware of Bristol Palin's pregnancy before he chose her mother for his running mate, the aide said.

"Senator McCain knew this and felt in no way did it disqualify her from being vice president," said the aide. "Families have difficulties sometimes, and lucky for her she has a supportive family."
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I beleive this :lol
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
Hitokage said:
*rubs forehead*

Let's not start a trend of claiming sarcasm to back out of earlier statements...
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I'm not backing out, I'm fully aware how this happens :D it's because of the lack of proper sex-ed.

I'm fully on board with the idea here that the big story is that McCain didn't properly vet her.

But, the other point here that's not to be overlooked is that this woman supposedly stands for the religious right and their Christian family values and she'd have no problem forcing them into your school systems. Yet, either this same woman has failed to apply them OR the values and practices themselves have failed miserably in preventing the very things that these people would condemn (premarital sex, child out of wedlock, etc).

I fully understand and accept that kids will have sex no matter what (heck, I did the deed early as well), but the point is that my value system doesn't say that this is a bad thing. It acknowledges that sex is a natural behavior. It acknowledges that education about this behavior and how to prevent undesired results from occurring (contracting VD, pregnancy, etc) can be successful in prevention of the undesired.

So to Palin and the (R), I say: No thanks! I don't want your abstinence only programs for my kids in my school. Keep that backwards thinking out of NJ, please! No thanks! I don't want you to talk to me about morality and "family values"; you take care of your own, I'll take care of mine.
 
D

Diablos

Member
Amir0x said:
Well now we know, hopefully that kills the baby conspiracy forEVER.

The actual conclusion is nothing special. As a parent, you can only do so much to prevent your child from doing this sort of thing no matter what you preach. That difficulty was probably compounded by the fact that Palin was a hard working mother who was obviously not able to be there all the time.

I don't think many Americans will give a shit, or if they do it'd be in the form of minor sympathy. Millions of Americans have teenagers who get pregnant, unfortunately.
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Most Americans won't care. But what about the pro-life, pro-values base? Getting pregnant before even marrying is probably something they'll reluctantly be forcing themselves to overlook.
 
P

Primethius

Banned
I'm going to sound like a complete moron (and I am) but how sure are we that the daughter is keeping the baby because she wants to rather then for the campaign? Sorry if it's been covered, I didn't read the full story but that's the first thing I thought of.

Also, I agree, that this is a non-issue but I was keeping up with this thread, refreshed once, and the thread jumped from 69 to 72 pages as soon as this hit.
 
R

ronito

Member
First lady Laura Bush said today that sexism aimed at Sarah Palin was a very real prospect and suggested Democrats watch what they say about the Alaska governor and John McCain's ticketmate.

“The other side will have to be particularly careful," Bush said in an interview on Fox News from St. Paul, "because that’s something we all looked at."

Questioned about whether Palin may face sexism from the media in the way Hillary Rodham Clinton supporters claim she did, Bush said: "I think that's a possibility."
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LOL. We used these tactics on you. It'd be bad for you to use this on us!
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
I'm really getting the feeling liberal blogs/this site are scared of this pick. All the hooplah over this pregnancy is only going to make women gravitate toward Palin. I guess people didn't learn the lesson after New Hampshire.

Is it hypocritical that someone so intent on parenting the country's children (and adults) can't even keep her own daughter from getting pregnant? Of course. But considering the religious right has been successfully winning elections and growing for two decades - fueled solely on prejudices and cognitive dissonance - I doubt another bout of hypocrisy will do any damage.
 
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