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[dano1]

I still love my flat gaming. But PSVR2 is the real deal!!

 

[THE DUCK]

I was gonna say that's not really GREAT but considering they did this without even launching in stores is kinda HUGE. Now that it's hitting retail shelves it's going to sell even more. We'll see in the next 6-12 months how it really shakes out but Sony should be really happy with how its going. Just keep the games coming and the hardware will sell itself. This holiday season SHOULD be huge.

Do you really thing a $549 add-on product is a, oh, I'm at Walmart and I see that on the shelf so I must buy it kind of product?

Also no new AAA games shown at the showcase isn't inspiring confidence, do we know of a single Sony first party AAA major studio working on a vr game?
Sorry but beat saber and re4 isn't going to do it at this point.

 

[mckmas8808]

So here's the thing, why a new PS portable would be different than the VITA, below is a list of things that differ vs the Vita launch:

- It will be dual purpose - hooks to a TV easily and is also a home console
- It will have third party support
- Similar architecture to home consoles, much easier to develop for and will have hundreds more quality games than vita
- It will actually be supported and have multiple Sony AAA games from day one, including day and date 1st party titles from PS5
- Doesn't require an expensive memory cards
- Much better form fact, bigger screen, far nicer to actually use
- Full backwards compatibility with prior generation (very likely could run PS4 games)
- Demand is higher for handheld gaming in general (Switch has proven this)
- Sony is even more entrenched as the long term market leader

You can't honestly say a PS portable that launches with Ratchet and Clank a Rift in Time, GT7, GOW Rognarok, Horizon Forbidden west, Demon souls, etc would sell as much as the crappy hand cramping, under supported, and overpriced memory card Vita?
It's a completely different ball game.

The system you just laid out would cost at least $1,000 and last less than 2 hours on battery.

 

[mckmas8808]

The first one from launch until feb 20th 2017 sold 915,000. Through Nov 2017 ending Dec 3rd Sony announced 2m were sold.

So you mean PS needs to sell another 1.4 million by July of 2024 then. NOT this July.

 

[THE DUCK]

The system you just laid out would cost at least $1,000 and last less than 2 hours on battery.

Take or leave the ps4 compatibility, it's still doable at $399 if valve can do $449 with the steam deck. All of the other positives vs the Vita still apply. Battery life will very, just like the other handhelds on the Market.

 

[mckmas8808]

Take or leave the ps4 compatibility, it's still doable at $399 if valve can do $449 with the steam deck. All of the other positives vs the Vita still apply. Battery life will very, just like the other handhelds on the Market.

But a handheld that you described needs to play PS5 level games for it to matter. Playing PS4 level games isn't good enough.

 

[Minsc]

The system you just laid out would cost at least $1,000 and last less than 2 hours on battery.

Ally is the most powerful handheld we have at the moment right? 1080p, gorgeous screen, but in turbo mode I feel like I read battery life doesn't even last an hour.

 

[THE DUCK]

But a handheld that you described needs to play PS5 level games for it to matter. Playing PS4 level games isn't good enough.

From what we have seen from the Steam Deck and the Ally, this is definitely possible. (of course at lower resolutions)

 

[mckmas8808]

Ally is the most powerful handheld we have at the moment right? 1080p, gorgeous screen, but in turbo mode I feel like I read battery life doesn't even last an hour.

WOW!!!

From what we have seen from the Steam Deck and the Ally, this is definitely possible. (of course at lower resolutions)

Not for $399 though. The PS5 is $399 without the disk drive. Now you want to shrink it and add a nice 8"screen for the same price? It's not possible at that price.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

So you mean PS needs to sell another 1.4 million by July of 2024 then. NOT this July.

No. Doing this a different way that's more clear, approximately 4 months in PS VR2 has sold close to 600,000 as of week 6 from launch, but let's play ball and say that the number is as of last week. That would be 4 months and 8 days I believe.

With the original, it sold over more than 915,000 units in 4 months and 7 days with shortages.

That's a 315,000 difference so this is where Sony stopping their chart at week 6 comes in.

 

[Markio128]

It’d be interesting to see the attach rate of PSVR2 games per unit sold - I’ve personally bought 10+ games since release.

 

[IntentionalPun]

No. Doing this a different way that's more clear, approximately 4 months in PS VR2 has sold close to 600,000 as of week 6 from launch, but let's play ball and say that the number is as of last week. That would be 4 months and 8 days I believe.

With the original, it sold over more than 915,000 units in 4 months and 7 days with shortages.

That's a 315,000 difference so this is where Sony stopping their chart at week 6 comes in.

Which means most likely they have sold under 900k units so far.

But they'll make back the difference this holiday and then some, probably.

 

[R6Rider]

It’d be interesting to see the attach rate of PSVR2 games per unit sold - I’ve personally bought 10+ games since release.

Same. Just bought Red Matter 2 and will probably buy that Cosmodread game.

 

[mckmas8808]

No. Doing this a different way that's more clear, approximately 4 months in PS VR2 has sold close to 600,000 as of week 6 from launch, but let's play ball and say that the number is as of last week. That would be 4 months and 8 days I believe.

With the original, it sold over more than 915,000 units in 4 months and 7 days with shortages.

That's a 315,000 difference so this is where Sony stopping their chart at week 6 comes in.

But that's cheating. You can't just assume the bolded.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Which means most likely they have sold under 900k units so far.

But they'll make back the difference this holiday and then some, probably.

Holiday is 6 months from now, that would be approximately 10 months in, the original sold over 2m in the same amount of months.

But that's cheating. You can't just assume the bolded.

Ok, so then that would instead change the situation entirely and we have to start questioning why Sony only announced PS VR2 was 8% ahead up until week 6, and then cut off the chart. If it sold over 1m they would have announced that, if they were still ahead of the original two weeks ago they would have announced that.

The same chart they gave us also had the PS VR2 slightly below the 600,000 line.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Holiday is 6 months from now, that would be approximately 10 months in, the original sold over 2m in the same amount of months.

Holiday will be over 6 months from now.

And it's incredibly likely it'll have sold over 2 million by then, since it'll have sold through a Holiday season, likely with better stock than what Sony had for PSVR1.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Holiday will be over 6 months from now.

Nov is 6 months from now it's the end of may.

And it's incredibly likely it'll have sold over 2 million by then,

It would need to be ahead of the original to do that. There could be a catalyst within the next 6 months but I'm not sure what that would be.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Nov is 6 months from now it's the end of may.

It would need to be ahead of the original to do that. There could be a catalyst within the next 6 months but I'm not sure what that would be.

Yeah you are right, brain fart, did my math wrong.

Add a month and I bet it'll have beat out PSVR sales for the same time period.

If it's not, then.. well, VR is a bit of a dud. PSVR sales are fine for a 1st entry but the intention is to expand greatly not have a peripheral with such a small amount of users in the end.

 

[yazenov]

Mochizuki from Bloomberg taking another L

Shit "journalist" pulling information from his ass again.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Yeah you are right, brain fart, did my math wrong.

Add a month and I bet it'll have beat out PSVR sales for the same time period.

If it's not, then.. well, VR is a bit of a dud. PSVR sales are fine for a 1st entry but the intention is to expand greatly not have a peripheral with such a small amount of users in the end.

The question is the sales trajectory, and right now Sony stops the chart at week 6 for this announcement which ignores the last 8 weeks and outs it below the 915,000 of the first and below 1m.

 

[mckmas8808]

Holiday is 6 months from now, that would be approximately 10 months in, the original sold over 2m in the same amount of months.

Ok, so then that would instead change the situation entirely and we have to start questioning why Sony only announced PS VR2 was 8% ahead up until week 6, and then cut off the chart. If it sold over 1m they would have announced that, if they were still ahead of the original two weeks ago they would have announced that.

The same chart they gave us also had the PS VR2 slightly below the 600,000 line.

I don't think it's hit million yet and I do think it's behind PSVR now. But it was just released in stores 2 weeks ago. So the comparison now kinda isn't fair. Lets give it a few more months at least.

 

[MasterCornholio]

I don't think it's hit million yet and I do think it's behind PSVR now. But it was just released in stores 2 weeks ago. So the comparison now kinda isn't fair. Lets give it a few more months at least.

But I really would like to see more big games for it. I probably won't get it unless there's a solid library of games that I'm interested in. It's really great hardware though.

 

[Ar¢tos]

But I really would like to see more big games for it. I probably won't get it unless there's a solid library of games that I'm interested in. It's really great hardware though.

What do big games give you that smaller games don't?

Graphics? (Red Matter 2)
MP? (Pavlov and countless others)
Immersion? (again, too many small games nail this)
Play time? Is a longer game always better than a shorter game?

So what exactly is it? The feel of paying 70$ for game makes it somehow better than cheaper ones?

 

[SkylineRKR]

Before someone jumps in and says the PSVR1 was cheaper and the PSVR2 was more expensive, that's why it's impressive, adjusted for inflation and the cost of motion controllers, the PSVR1 was actually more expensive by just a bit.

Motion controllers were optional. I never bought them as I hated the Moves. For the games I played most they weren't needed (Astrobot, RE, Wipeout, Rez).

PSVR2 is more expensive. There is no option to buy a bare bones SKU for 399.

 

[PeteBull]

No quality exclusive games= bomba, rule apply to every console/system, there is a reason switch that is at max 1/3rd of xbox one in power, but still selling over 122m of units(official data ofc, from february https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2...sales-have-now-surpassed-the-game-boy-and-ps4 ).

U got terrible xbox series x/s sales coz that console is lacking quality exclusives.
And so far u got terrible psvr2 sales coz again, same problem- lack of quality exclusives, u need to have some bangers first before u wanna have good sales.

We recently had playstation games showcase, and guess what, there were only few good games shown there, none of them in vr, so u cant expect customers to buy psvr2 in droves if they got no incentive aka reason to do it, till this changes expect this add on to stay niche- its not even the price- imagine if it had by now 5 games at metascore of 90%+, even if it costed 600$ ppl would buy it, but nope, simply no reason for it.

And its not coz ps5 instal base is small- it isnt, ps5 now caught up to ps4 sales and about to surpass it, launch alligned- again- official info https://www.vgchartz.com/article/45...aunch-aligned-ps4-sales-in-the-coming-months/ article is from stupid vg charts site but since its official info from sony- we know its legit in this case.

Again simple math, even if we take official sony data from march 2023 ps5 sold trough 36m of units, psvr2 sold 600k so only 1 out of 60 ps5 users fellt any need to buy VR add on- nuff said.

 

[THE DUCK]

Motion controllers were optional. I never bought them as I hated the Moves. For the games I played most they weren't needed (Astrobot, RE, Wipeout, Rez).

PSVR2 is more expensive. There is no option to buy a bare bones SKU for 399.

We are only talking $500 adjusted for inflation vs $550 here and to properly use psvr1 you needed the controllers, even if you.elected to play it crippled / not fully featured. Like I said, basically the same price.

 

[Ozriel]

Why did they cut off the graph at 6 weeks?

 

[MasterCornholio]

What do big games give you that smaller games don't?

Graphics? (Red Matter 2)
MP? (Pavlov and countless others)
Immersion? (again, too many small games nail this)
Play time? Is a longer game always better than a shorter game?

So what exactly is it? The feel of paying 70$ for game makes it somehow better than cheaper ones?

Its more like I'm someone that likes to sit down for many hours immersed in a big title. So more of the experiences you would get with games like RE Village VR or Resident Evil 4 VR.

But that's just my preference. I have nothing against smaller titles or indies.

 

[Tams]

Ally is the most powerful handheld we have at the moment right? 1080p, gorgeous screen, but in turbo mode I feel like I read battery life doesn't even last an hour.

Yes, but the 7840U handhelds are coming and that's essentially the same 'APU'. ASUS cheaped out on the RAM, so some of those handhelds are going to do quite a bit better on the iGPU.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

I don't think it's hit million yet and I do think it's behind PSVR now. But it was just released in stores 2 weeks ago. So the comparison now kinda isn't fair. Lets give it a few more months at least.

It's already been nearly two more additional months.

The just below 600,000 chart by Sony ends on Week 6, Week 6 ended on April 1st, it's almost June 1st in a few days. Even if we place it at the 600,000 exactly, that means that from Week 6 until now, 8 weeks more, the PS VR2 is below the 915,000 the first one had by this time including those extra 8 weeks.

Sony's message of 8% above the original only applies up to week 6 or they would have added more weeks to the chart. That means since selling 600,000 on April 1st, Sony has not been able to sell 300,000 headsets in the last two months. It may take until July or August for the PS VR2 to sell it's first million.

I want to be optimistic as you are, but without a catalyst announced this is going to be a very long year for the PS VR2. Sony didn't show a catalyst at their showcase which would have been the perfect time to do so. All we got out of recent news is that it was receiving older ports like Beat Saber.

If it's going to continue selling less than 300,000 every two months, then it's going to fall way behind the original quickly, which at this point aligned was resolving its shortages and becoming more widely available, selling more than 2m in 11 months.

Why did they cut off the graph at 6 weeks?

Because of the high probability it starts to fall behind the original after week 6. We are talking two months of data missing from the chart where the original including that missing data sold 915,000 aligned. If the PS VR2 was still ahead by 8% after week 6 they would have extended the chart, if they did much better than the original by this same point they would have announced 1m sold.

If you look at the full PDF, the image the op posted on slide 18 is the only place in the entire document PS VR2 is mentioned.

 

[AlphaMale]

I'll be grabbing up a PSVR2 as soon as I move to my new place in July. Got a games room ready for it!

 

[DeepEnigma]

I'll be grabbing up a PSVR2 as soon as I move to my new place in July. Got a games room ready for it!

You're going to love it. Fantastic piece of tech, especially for the price.

GT7 is a game changer for me.

 

[Minsc]

It's already been nearly two more additional months.

The just below 600,000 chart by Sony ends on Week 6, Week 6 ended on April 1st, it's almost June 1st in a few days. Even if we place it at the 600,000 exactly, that means that from Week 6 until now, 8 weeks more, the PS VR2 is below the 915,000 the first one had by this time including those extra 8 weeks.

Sony's message of 8% above the original only applies up to week 6 or they would have added more weeks to the chart. That means since selling 600,000 on April 1st, Sony has not been able to sell 300,000 headsets in the last two months. It may take until July or August for the PS VR2 to sell it's first million.

I want to be optimistic as you are, but without a catalyst announced this is going to be a very long year for the PS VR2. Sony didn't show a catalyst at their showcase which would have been the perfect time to do so. All we got out of recent news is that it was receiving older ports like Beat Saber.

If it's going to continue selling less than 300,000 every two months, then it's going to fall way behind the original quickly, which at this point aligned was resolving its shortages and becoming more widely available, selling more than 2m in 11 months.

Because of the high probability it starts to fall behind the original after week 6. We are talking two months of data missing from the chart where the original including that missing data sold 915,000 aligned. If the PS VR2 was still ahead by 8% after week 6 they would have extended the chart, if they did much better than the original by this same point they would have announced 1m sold.

If you look at the full PDF, the image the op posted on slide 18 is the only place in the entire document PS VR2 is mentioned.

Comparing holiday numbers vs regular months seems pretty unfair. I mean take a look at any console's holiday sales compared to June or May or whatever and they're like 10:1 sometimes.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Comparing holiday numbers vs regular months seems pretty unfair. I mean take a look at any console's holiday sales compared to June or May or whatever and they're like 10:1 sometimes.

Not sure what you mean. Sony stopped counting after week 6 removing 8 more weeks from their sales count to announce the PS VR2 was 8% ahead of the original during the first 6 weeks, if they were ahead after week 6, or kept ahead of the original they would have used later weeks or announced they sold 1 by now. Holiday sales doesn't really have any impact on this.

If you're saying that holiday sales greatly aided the 315,000 the original is possibly ahead aligned you would have to forget that the original was supply constrained and sales didn't start picking up until after the holiday season. Sony has the stock ready for PS VR2, 2m rumored, ahead in advance in the clear before any other competitor owing the market to itself.

If there's a catalyst Sony can still take advantage of their head start but they haven't revealed any yet ans we just had their showcase for the year.

 

[Minsc]

Not sure what you mean. Sony stopped counting after week 6 removing 8 more weeks from their sales count to announce the PS VR2 was 8% ahead of the original during the first 6 weeks, if they were ahead after week 6, or kept ahead of the original they would have used later weeks or announced they sold 1 by now. Holiday sales doesn't really have any impact on this.

If you're saying that holiday sales greatly aided the 315,000 the original is possibly ahead aligned you would have to forget that the original was supply constrained and sales didn't start picking up until after the holiday season. Sony has the stock ready for PS VR2, 2m rumored, ahead in advance in the clear before any other competitor owing the market to itself.

If there's a catalyst Sony can still take advantage of their head start but they haven't revealed any yet ans we just had their showcase for the year.

Hmm, I thought it had something to do with the Fiscal Year or it counting up through March? Not sure. Anyway, what I was getting at with the Holidays is simply it's very likely had the first 6 weeks of PSVR2 been with retail and over the holidays the PSVR2 would likely have sold higher numbers because of such.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Hmm, I thought it had something to do with the Fiscal Year or it counting up through March? Not sure. Anyway, what I was getting at with the Holidays is simply it's very likely had the first 6 weeks of PSVR2 been with retail and over the holidays the PSVR2 would likely have sold higher numbers because of such.

I doubt this because the PS VR2 has plenty of stock and Sony strangely stopped their chart after week 6 with another 8 weeks missing. The original was in limited supply until after the holidays. If anything the gap is going to be wider in these months leading up to the holiday since it seems most of the growth correlated with Andrew House getting the stock in order. By late fall the original will sold 2m before the next holiday.

 

[Minsc]

I doubt this because the PS VR2 has plenty of stock and Sony strangely stopped their chart after week 6 with another 8 weeks missing. The original was in limited supply until after the holidays. If anything the gap is going to be wider in these months leading up to the holiday since it seems most of the growth correlated with Andrew House getting the stock in order. By late fall the original will sold 2m before the next holiday.

You doubt that more people would have bought PS VR2s in November/December than in February/March? Literally everything gaming related pretty much sees more sales in the holiday months.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

You doubt that more people would have bought PS VR2s in November/December than in February/March? Literally everything gaming related pretty much sees more sales in the holiday months.

If there's nothing on sale and it's sold at regular price I don't see why there would be a monumental difference. The original was supply constrained and had competition, so didn't really start flying until after the holidays. I think you're giving the holiday 2016 too much credit for the originals sales that you think it would make much of a difference for the PS VR2.

 

[Minsc]

If there's nothing on sale and it's sold at regular price I don't see why there would be a monumental difference. The original was supply constrained and had competition, so didn't really start flying until after the holidays. I think you're giving the holiday 2016 too much credit for the originals sales that you think it would make much of a difference for the PS VR2.

I'm not even taking the original in to consideration, I'm simply looking at holiday sales in general. People tend to buy more stuff around the holidays, that's all. And that's immensely true in hardware sales for consoles, and games. Like some consoles could sell 200k in a regular month and 1-2 million in a holiday month.

Likewise since people buy stuff around the holidays, February (soon after) can be a little tricky to budget in another $500-600+ item. Sure the hardcore already planned it and would buy it regardless, but there's really no doubt consoles/games in general sell better in Nov/Dec than most other months.

 

[mckmas8808]

If there's nothing on sale and it's sold at regular price I don't see why there would be a monumental difference. The original was supply constrained and had competition, so didn't really start flying until after the holidays. I think you're giving the holiday 2016 too much credit for the originals sales that you think it would make much of a difference for the PS VR2.

This is an insane take lol. Literally almost every consumer product sells better during the Holiday season versus February. That's not a hot take. It's just a fact.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

I'm not even taking the original in to consideration, I'm simply looking at holiday sales in general. People tend to buy more stuff around the holidays, that's all. And that's immensely true in hardware sales for consoles, and games. Like some consoles could sell 200k in a regular month and 1-2 million in a holiday month.

Likewise since people buy stuff around the holidays, February (soon after) can be a little tricky to budget in another $500-600+ item. Sure the hardcore already planned it and would buy it regardless, but there's really no doubt consoles/games in general sell better in Nov/Dec than most other months.

Yeah consoles sure but not accessories with no deals with limited availability depending on what country you're in. Sony had produced a large number of headset ahead of time for Feb, and the data in this thread from Sony shows Sony had sold 600,000 in 2months and 2weeks.

This is an insane take lol. Literally almost every consumer product sells better during the Holiday season versus February. That's not a hot take. It's just a fact.

This is a misinterpretation by the magnitudes. I don't see a scenario that releasing in Nov results in PS VR2 selling 600,000 in 2months and 2 weeks like it did in February to April 1st. Sony launched it in Feb by choice and intentionally missed the holiday season.

 

[mckmas8808]

I don't see a scenario that releasing in Nov results in PS VR2 selling 600,000 in 2months and 2 weeks like it did in February to April 1st. Sony launched it in Feb by choice and intentionally missed the holiday season.

Well.....duh. Isn't that smart? Nintendo did the same thing with the Switch and it was smart then too.

 

[Tams]

This is an insane take lol. Literally almost every consumer product sells better during the Holiday season versus February. That's not a hot take. It's just a fact.

Didn't mean it's the best time to launch.

There are so many competing products and unless yours is a 'must have' and/or relatively cheap (games), then the competition for people's money is insane.

Also, 'the holiday season' (it's Christmas for fuck's sake - people celebrating Christmas are the big spenders), is not celebrated in many parts of the world. The big spending holidays elsewhere are at other times of the year.

 

[mckmas8808]

Didn't mean it's the best time to launch.

There are so many competing products and unless yours is a 'must have' and/or relatively cheap (games), then the competition for people's money is insane.

Also, 'the holiday season' (it's Christmas for fuck's sake - people celebrating Christmas are the big spenders), is not celebrated in many parts of the world. The big spending holidays elsewhere are at other times of the year.

That's not exactly true though. While they have other holidays that people spend money on........it's very normal for countries not name America to spend big during the holidays. And there's many people spending big money that don't celebrate Christmas, hence holidays.

 

[Klik]

They should have put Pancake lens instead of Fresnel..

 

[hlm666]

They should have put Pancake lens instead of Fresnel..

or even the aspheric ones like the psvr had would have been better even if they are heavier.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Well.....duh. Isn't that smart? Nintendo did the same thing with the Switch and it was smart then too.

The reason Sony did it was because they wanted to be alone and have a huge load of stock ready to sell to consumers instead of competing for space and adjusting demand levels guessing on the fly. Different from Nintendo.

 

[mckmas8808]

The reason Sony did it was because they wanted to be alone and have a huge load of stock ready to sell to consumers instead of competing for space and adjusting demand levels guessing on the fly. Different from Nintendo.

You sure? Because how could you possibility know this? Were you in the Playstation meetings?

 

[Draxon Gamer]

You sure? Because how could you possibility know this? Were you in the Playstation meetings?

"They say, “The dependency on PS5 means that PSVR 2 can’t succeed without a great PS5 install base and releasing a PSVR 2 headset into a world where PS5s are still scarce can not only affect potential PSVR 2 sales but also leave a lot of gamers even more frustrated than they already are” https://webcache.googleusercontent....d=24&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ie&client=firefox-b-1-d

As I said earlier in the thread the focus by consumers was the PS5 and games, releasing back then didn't make sense with competition and the accessory being at regular price.

Remember, Sony needed time to have 2m headsets ready for launch to avoid any shortages and to have plenty of PS VR2 stock available to buyers. Sony has also increased their PS5 availability greatly, now both device have the potential to grow together. Why go through all the trouble of a holiday launch when you have most of the year 2023 to yourself with increased PS5 stock and able to gradually increase PS VR2 availability at retailers with enough stock to prevent shortages?

Anyway PS VR2 has the next 4 months to itself, so there's not too much to worry about yet.

 

[E-Cat]

I gotta say, that PSVR2 trajectory not looking so hot...