Support NeoGAF

[Effect]

The manual tells you that you can use the d-pad to equip, change, and put away tools. I have the digital copy but it's the third page that list all of the controls. Sadly you can only speed up dialogue by pressing B.

 

[D-e-f-]

[1]The game doesn't tell you about the D-pad shortcuts. Since I read about that on Twitter, I've been using it constantly. It definitely helps.

[2]Now, what's the input shortcut to skip dialogue in the shops/museum? ;-)

[1] I'd argue that switching the item (or weapon usually) you have equipped via the d-pad has been part of the common gaming-vocabulary for a very long time now. Stacking fruit, though, that should either have been explained with a brief line OR happen automatically. :/
(That was a rare occasion where I learned something useful on the Bombcast)

[2] Sadly, that is a chronic illness that Nintendo games have been suffering from ever since they started using a lot of text. I believe that is not curable

The manual tells you that you can use the d-pad to equip, change, and put away tools. I have the digital copy but it's the third page that list all of the controls. Sadly you can only speed up dialogue by pressing B.

What is a "manual" and what skill pack do I need to microtransact to make use of this item?

Spoiler

 

[nckillthegrimace]

Kid Icarus is just different strokes. We are fully aware that people love that game, but both James and I gave it a fair shot and still couldn't enjoy it much.

There seems to be a chronic inability among the western press to adapt to the controls. The game is perfectly designed for the speed and precision the touchscreen controls afford, and the suggested alternatives just wouldn't work. Two sticks or a wii-style bounding box are simply not fast enough. Your assertions that the game is fundamentally poorly designed and that Sakurai is so arrogant/up his own ass seem born of that inability to cope with a new control scheme rather than an actual critique of the game's design.

As for the chatter, even if you don't like it, at least it never stops the gameplay like in a Naughty Dog game or something.

 

[zroid]

Taking advantage of Gui's absence to bash

Spoiler

GOTY 2012

KIU?

Get Neal on some time to balance it out.

 

[D-e-f-]

There seems to be a chronic inability among the western press to adapt to the controls. The game is perfectly designed for the speed and precision the touchscreen controls afford, and the suggested alternatives just wouldn't work. Two sticks or a wii-style bounding box are simply not fast enough. Your assertions that the game is fundamentally poorly designed and that Sakurai is so arrogant/up his own ass seem born of that inability to cope with a new control scheme rather than an actual critique of the game's design.

As for the chatter, even if you don't like it, at least it never stops the gameplay like in a Naughty Dog game or something.

Not talking about the NWR crew here specifically but I have noticed this as well. Western games are so standardized in terms of control layouts and functionality that very often when there's a game that doesn't follow these standards, it gets looked at as a negative almost immediately.

 

[Colonel Mustard]

The controls in Kid Icarus are fantastic. Fable 3 is hot doo-doo though.

 

[Jonnyboy117]

I coped with those controls for over ten hours. I do agree that replacing the controls with something more familiar probably wouldn't alleviate my problem with the game (and tried to state this very clearly on the show). I think the game has more intrinsic design problems that are independent of the control scheme, though some are perhaps exacerbated thereby. My main issue with KI is that even in the moments where I wasn't fighting controls (including the flying segments), I wasn't actually enjoying it very much and would become frustrated with various other things, such as the level design and weapon systems.

I've been on the other side of this kind o debate with games like Fluidity. In that case, I freely admit that the controls are difficult to learn and don't always provide the precision I'd want (though there are some advantages, arguably) -- I just felt happy to deal with any control gripes because the underlying game is so perfectly attuned to my tastes. Kid Icarus is not. So this obsession with controls really overlooks what I think are other, equally serious problems with that game, which are rarely discussed.

 

[Fantastical]

This podcast is so good, especially when compared to Go Nintendo's. They don't talk about the news at all in any sort of in depth way. RMC just reads Nintendo's PR statements with maybe one comment.

 

[OMG Aero]

The game doesn't tell you about the D-pad shortcuts. Since I read about that on Twitter, I've been using it constantly. It definitely helps.

I've had a villager tell me about the D-pad shortcuts so the game definitely does tell you about them.
The issue is that you have to get lucky and have a villager say that to you rather than any of the other hundreds of things they can say.

 

[Katsuragi]

The issue is that you have to get lucky and have a villager say that to you rather than any of the other hundreds of things they can say.

Do games really have to tell us literally everything, though? What happened to gamers wanting to discover things on their own? Back in the day, one of the first things I did in a game was to experiment with the controls. New Leaf is my first Animal Crossing, so naturally I wanted to get familiar with the controls by pressing all the buttons on my 3DS in order to see what they're for. Don't get me wrong, this is not an excuse for poorly explained or overly complicated controls in games, but sometimes it makes me a bit sad to see that in today's world everything has to be spelt out (eg. Y Can't Metroid Crawl).

 

[Jonnyboy117]

In a game where the owl tells you how to donate items every single time you visit the museum, complete with bad jokes and wistful musings on the charitable spirit of townsfolk across three or four pages of text, you can see how many players would expect Animal Crossing to explain itself.

 

[silks]

I'd also say that a fundamentally helpful control trick isn't something that should be left to the player to figure out like an Easter Egg.

 

[krpiper]

Any spoilers for last of us?

 

[Jonnyboy117]

Nope, you can listen safely!

 

[tanooki141]

Cool to hear a Gaf shoutout in the last episode.

I have to say that I agree with Johnny likening Kid Icarus with the Subspace Emissary from Super Smash Bros. I can definitely see the quality in both but they aren't something that I actually want to play.

Awesome to hear someone else really appreciates Pro Controller support being added, I don't know how I'll play Rayman, DKCR:TF or Wind Waker HD if they don't support it.

 

[Fantastical]

Their take on the Kid Icarus conversations and dialogue was disappointing. Those were on the best parts of the game.

 

[Katsuragi]

In a game where the owl tells you how to donate items every single time you visit the museum, complete with bad jokes and wistful musings on the charitable spirit of townsfolk across three or four pages of text, you can see how many players would expect Animal Crossing to explain itself.

Fair enough! I can see where you're coming from.

Since you're already here: I just finished listening to the new Radio Trivia episode. This is such an excellent podcast (and has been one for many, many years). I know that you usually pimp it at the end of RFN, but how about hosting it on your feed to make more people aware of it? It deserves a wider audience and since the show is now (more or less) released on a monthly schedule, I think it would be a great fit (just like the Famicast)! It's probably the kind of podcast that not a lot of people would seek out on their own. Personally, I have all 118 episodes on my phone!

 

[Zornica]

Now, what's the input shortcut to skip dialogue in the shops/museum? ;-)

[2] Sadly, that is a chronic illness that Nintendo games have been suffering from ever since they started using a lot of text. I believe that is not curable

Besides the owl, whats there to dislike?/what bothers you?

 

[Worthintendo]

My heart broke during the Kid Icarus trash down I loved that game soo much. Hopefully James is more open to Code of Princess next week.

 

[Brianimaniac]

I'm new to the podcast (I discovered it through this thread a couple months ago), and I'm already feeling like I need to drop it because of James. His take on most of what he plays seems to alternate back and forth between being really reductive and being hyperbolic about how weird/crazy things are.

I've listened to all the "retroactive" episodes (thanks for listing all of those), and those are generally pretty good. I think I'll continue listening to those even though I won't be following the weekly show anymore.

 

[Katsuragi]

I'm new to the podcast (I discovered it through this thread a couple months ago), and I'm already feeling like I need to drop it because of James.

Have you listened to the E3 episode which James hosted? I think he did an absolutely fantastic job! In my opinion, he complements the crew perfectly. There are quite a lot of games which wouldn't get covered if it weren't for James (e.g. Project X Zone).

 

[Somnid]

I find when James isn't starting every sentence with "My brain.." he usually comes across as one of the most articulate of the bunch. When he does or doesn't like something he seems to be able to explain some underlying reasons why. But yeah, I think talking about how weird something is tends to just be meaningless filler because he does it too often for things that don't warrant it.

 

[Brianimaniac]

Have you listened to the E3 episode which James hosted? I think he did an absolutely fantastic job! In my opinion, he complements the crew perfectly. There are quite a lot of games which wouldn't get covered if it weren't for James (e.g. Project X Zone).

I actually agree that he did a good job hosting that episode. I wish that's how he was on normal episodes, where he typically seems "off his meds".

I also forgot to mention that I think Greg is great, and I was sad when I finished all those Retroactive episodes and found out he wasn't part of the regular cast anymore.

 

[Jonnyboy117]

There won't be a new episode of RFN this weekend (due to 4th of July and James moving). However, Danny just posted the recording of Famicast's 25th episode live event. It's already on the subscription feeds, and you can download it directly from here.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/famicast/34852

RFN will return next weekend -- thanks for your patience!

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

So Guillaime didn't do a one man show, huh? That's a shame.

 

[Ondore]

A most melancholy RFN suddenly turns Japanese so fast, the Vapors filed a copyright infringement lawsuit.
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/rfn/34901

This week's RFN begins on a melancholy note, as the crew mourns the untimely passing of Giant Bomb's Ryan Davis. We offer our thoughts on a podcasting legend who was gone all too soon.

But as always, there are games to be discussed. Thanks to the Fourth of July break we're all full to the gills with Freedom Fries, and whatever type of celebratory cuisine they enjoy up in Quebec. Speaking of Quebec, Guillaume returns in full force and kicks off a tour of Japan with his thoughts on the demon-taming mayhem that is Shin Megami Tensei IV (3DS). Jon follows up with a discussion of Kokuga (3DS), the highly anticipated shooter brought to us by the creator of Radiant Silvergun and Ikaruga. James then makes all of that look positively sane by comparison with 3DS tactical crossover RPG (yes, that's a genre) Project X Zone (3DS). Just when things are threatening to get a bit too Japanese, Jonny takes us back to the West side (arguably the best side, according to several rappers) with the Renegade Kid-developed titles Mutant Mudds Deluxe (Wii U) and ATV Wild Ride 3D (3DS).

We also hit the mailbag and discuss Nintendo's relationship with third parties, use of the Wii U Gamepad, eShop game prices, and relaunching Wii U. It's a jam-packed show that you won't want to miss!

Time: 1'59"45
Downloads: MP3 | AAC
Fuck, Ryan Davis shirts: Now available, proceeds go to the family
I still can't buy: Kokuga. What the hell?

 

[Silver_DNA]

Last week I had two road trips for interviews and had an hour there and an hour back both times. I booted up some recent older episodes of RFN to listen to so that I wouldn't have to fiddle with a radio or iPod while driving.

The two episodes I listened to were the one right after the amazing January Direct with the Majora's Mask retroactive and the post E3 show with James, John, and Greg. Great episodes. I miss hearing Greg on the show, but it's not like the quality took a dip or anything.

Also, I really liked the live E3 Direct reaction show. It would have been better if Nintendo and/or UStream could get it's act together, but I still enjoyed it. If the Directs were more predictable and at more convenient times I'd recommend more real-time reactions, but I'm sure the crew have actual lives to attend to or something.

I'll give the newest episode a listen tomorrow.

 

[zroid]

Jonny did a great job of articulating how Ryan Davis's passing has affected so many people who never knew him personally so deeply. Word-for-word pretty much echoed my sentiments, even the "surprise".

 

[Suzzopher]

I hope John and Guillaime bring their Twitter argument from yesterday into this week's show

 

[OMG Aero]

I hope John and Guillaime bring their Twitter argument from yesterday into this week's show

You can't post this without a link or explanation.

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

I'm confused. Is the Retroactive poll up or not?

 

[Suzzopher]

You can't post this without a link or explanation.

https://twitter.com/MrDiamondJ/status/357155624318009346 and https://twitter.com/GuillaumeNWR/status/357135569823870976

Guillaime's views on Uncharted 3 are a little extreme and completely wrong too.

 

[demidar]

Twitter is the worst place to have an in-depth conversation.

 

[bomb]

I really thought I would enjoy this podcast but the first one I heard they were discussing the big nintendo direct with all the wiiU reveals like yard yoshi, etc. The host and I believe one other said that they havent even bought the WiiU yet. How am I suppose to take them seriously if they cant even shell out 300 bucks on the main console?

 

[silks]

I don't own a Wii U at the moment, correct. James, Jonny, and Gui all own the system so there's plenty of coverage there. I'll pick one up soon enough, when Nintendo releases certain games I (and many others) have been waiting on.

Thankfully, between 3DS eShop and a massive back catalog there's always something Nintendo-related to discuss.

I hope you won't let my lack of a Wii U turn you off from the podcast; I'm sure if you stick with it you'll find something you like about it. Thanks for listening.

-jon

 

[Suzzopher]

I quite like having a person on the show without a Wii U, it gives a good balance.

 

[nron10]

Taking advantage of Gui's absence to bash

Spoiler

GOTY 2012

KIU?

Get Neal on some time to balance it out.

Word. (or just listen to Connectivity where when Patrick returns, we could easily slip back into a "...and this week in Uprising online multiplayer..." routine)

 

[bomb]

I don't own a Wii U at the moment, correct. James, Jonny, and Gui all own the system so there's plenty of coverage there. I'll pick one up soon enough, when Nintendo releases certain games I (and many others) have been waiting on.

Thankfully, between 3DS eShop and a massive back catalog there's always something Nintendo-related to discuss.

I hope you won't let my lack of a Wii U turn you off from the podcast; I'm sure if you stick with it you'll find something you like about it. Thanks for listening.

-jon

Thanks for the quick response. I would never have asked someone from the actual podcast to respond to me so it is appreciated. I believe this was in feb/march so maybe at the time two of the members did not have a wiiU(could be wrong) and it just seemed like complaining session from individuals that did not even own the hardware. Again, I could be wrong.

Anyway, I will definitely listen in again because I am a Nintendo fan and I really like that there is a podcast that is solely on Nintendo.

 

[Katsuragi]

A wild Lindy appears! I always thought Jonny was the only Gaffer.

I quite like having a person on the show without a Wii U, it gives a good balance.

Agreed! I always think of Jon as a "lapsed" old school Nintendo fan. It's very interesting to hear his thoughts on the company.

 

[Suzzopher]

A wild Lindy appears! I always thought Jonny was the only Gaffer.



Agreed! I always think of Jon as a "lapsed" old school Nintendo fan. It's very interesting to hear his thoughts on the company.

I am a Nintendo fan who also hasn't bought a Wii U, like Lindy I need a reason and so far still waiting for a reason.

 

[v0yce]

I really don't understand what arguments these guys are trying to make.

ZombiU had too much development and too much marketing? ...What?!

"I buy all my 3DS games digitally even though they're $39.99 same as retail, but I can't recommend anyone buy SMT4 digitally because its priced the same as retail. It's a really raw deal. I just want parity."

Huh? I get that it'd be nice if Atlus didn't charge the same as the premium physical copy, but if you don't have a problem with Nintendo and other companies still charging the same amount as the physical copy with box, art, manual, shipping, etc etc then how does the $10 difference warrant such an extreme attitude shift?

I miss Greg.

 

[demidar]

I really don't understand what arguments these guys are trying to make.

ZombiU had too much development and too much marketing? ...What?!

"I buy all my 3DS games digitally even though they're $39.99 same as retail, but I can't recommend anyone buy SMT4 digitally because its priced the same as retail. It's a really raw deal. I just want parity."

Huh? I get that it'd be nice if Atlus didn't charge the same as the premium physical copy, but if you don't have a problem with Nintendo and other companies still charging the same amount as the physical copy with box, art, manual, shipping, etc etc then how is the $10 difference warrant such an extreme attitude shift?

I miss Greg.

ZombiU was retooled way more than normal, which added to development costs. That's why "not making back it's development" is a bit deceptive because it's similar to the cost of two B-level games rather than one.

It's unfortunate that SMTIV costs the same $50 as it does in retail. The reason they do it it because they don't want to piss off physical retailers by undercutting them. If a person doesn't care about the bonuses that increase the cost by $10, shouldn't they be able to buy a sku that's $40 for just the game, and shouldn't that translate to the eShop version?

 

[Fantastical]

ZombiU was retooled way more than normal, which added to development costs. That's why "not making back it's development" is a bit deceptive because it's similar to the cost of two B-level games rather than one.

But do we know how far they even went with the other concept?

 

[demidar]

But do we know how far they even went with the other concept?

Dunno, but I think it was in a semi-playable state?

 

[Tripon]

Dunno, but I think it was in a semi-playable state?

I think they shown a playable demo at a E3 in 2011.

 

[Bending_Unit_22]

I really thought I would enjoy this podcast but the first one I heard they were discussing the big nintendo direct with all the wiiU reveals like yard yoshi, etc. The host and I believe one other said that they havent even bought the WiiU yet. How am I suppose to take them seriously if they cant even shell out 300 bucks on the main console?

You should try more of them. RFN is hands down the best Nintendo related podcast I've come across. As the thread title says it's for "grown ups", so some inconvenient truths will be discussed, and more lately than at other times. At the moment it is the fact that the Wii U is vastly underperforming. I'm a Nintendo fan (fanatic in my earlier years) of 25 years standing and I have no interest in the Wii U at the present time. Such an opinion is welcome if you ask me (as are the others).

 

[Ondore]

We interrupt this round of RPG goodness for some RFN goodness..
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/rfn/34980

It's business as usual for only half of the show this week, as Jonny has to cut and run to make some prior commitments that almost certainly have something to do with the exploration of outer space (with Jonny, they always do).

However, that doesn't stop us from discussing new business, and Guillaume starts us off with his raw, uncut opinions of the new StreetPass games on 3DS. Yes, he bought them all, but he'll let you know which ones YOU should buy. Jon had a chance to (finally) check out Wii U and New Super Mario Bros. U at Best Buy, giving us his fresh hands-on perspective after hearing about the system for so many months. Jonny dissects The Legend of Zelda: Oracle of Ages, and James talks about the successes and failings of the strange retro RPG Evoland.

For the second half, James, Jon and Guillaume go over the news from the latest Nintendo Direct and completely ignore some game called Earthbound (total lie). They then move on to their main topic, which is the impact of what has now become a summer ritual for gamers of all types: the Steam Sale. What can Nintendo learn from it? What can we, as gamers, learn from it, and how has it taught (or trained) us? It's a fun, Metts-free discussion, and you can't beat that with a bat.

ALSO: Be sure to check out the poll for our next edition of Retroactive! Cast your vote here.

Time: 1'51"08
Downloads: MP3 | AAC
James hates Earthbound fans: Don't encourage him

 

[Zornica]

I moved to tokyo a few days after these games came out in Europe, so naturally I bought them.
and I can tell you: with 10-50 street passes a day, you will probably tell that boring gardening games to go fuck itself pretty quickly.
most of the time I only play the detective and the army game. the latter because those guys around here have ridiculously big armies (saw one with over 1 million troops...) and I need to crush them all.
but to my surprise, I don't get that many more street passes here on a daily base than I did back at home in Europe. except for akihabara, but that's not really fair.

If the wiiu wasn't region locked, john could just buy a really really cheap European one.

 

[Ondore]

This week in RFN, eBay scalpers am cry. Also, emails! But no James...
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/rfn/35028

James couldn't join us this week, so we bring back TYP as one of our favorite substitutes/guests. New Business carries an odd batch of games, starting with Jon's first impressions of Shantae for Game Boy Color, the cult classic. Three of the four guys have been trying it this week, and they all agree that the game has a rough start but great potential. TYP then checks out Darksiders... 1, which is well-worn territory on this podcast but still a game worth checking out, especially for 3D Zelda fans. Guillaume has an actual new release with Guild 02's Attack of the Friday Monsters. It seems like a very charming game, though not quite as exciting as you might hope for in the wake of Pacific Rim. He also spent some time observing his girlfriend play A Link to the Past, which gives us all a chance to heap adoration on the SNES classic. Jonny wraps up the segment with a long-brewing follow-up on Ni no Kuni, which he's finally about to complete.

A diverse edition of Listener Mail kicks off with thoughts on Earthbound and future prospects for Mother 3 in the West. We continue with Wii U as part of the tablet fad, and whether it should have been launched a year later (or even a year earlier). Then we have corrections on the topic of eShop credits, and a witch hunt for the person most responsible for recent troubles at Nintendo. Finally, the perennially popular subject of Virtual Console returns to this segment. Please help us keep the show filled with great conversation by submitting your own questions and ideas for Listener Mail!

There are only a couple of days left to vote on the upcoming, Wii-themed RetroActive, so be sure to do that right away!

Time: 1'57"16
Downloads: MP3 | AAC
Off-TV play: Yes. Very yes.

 

[Jonnyboy117]

Heads up: only one day left to vote on RetroActive. The link is above. Nominees (all Wii games) are:

PoP: Forgotten Sands
Pandora's Tower
Wii Sports Resort
Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: The Crystal Bearers

This should be a fun edition no matter what wins, so I'd like to see good participation from the GAF crew!