Rap is black music, but Eminem does it better than black artists according to 50cent

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I know Jay is hated around here, but real talk, that b side concert he did where he went through decades of classics convinced me that mans catalogue of great shit might be better than any other living rapper. Three undeniable classic albums and they've all aged better than the SSLP and the MMLP.
I don't give a fuck Em killed him on Renegade or that Nas blasted him. Jay killed both of them in the game of life.
 
Angelus Errare said:
The entire notion of ranking is subjective and a person's cultural upbringing will play into that.

I don't disqualify Eminem from GOAT talk, I say he's not in my top 3 because outside of his technical abilities and a few songs, I've never been a fan of his music because he made stuff I just don't mess with. As I previously stated, talking about putting gerbils in your ass, doing vicodin, raping your mom, killing gay people isn't my cup of tea. I don't relate to it, I love my mom for one, two I have no beef with gay people, and three I don't lodge gerbils up my ass. And while they're just joking and for funs, it still does nothing to change how I feel about the songs. Like if you're a black kid who grew up in the boroughs of NYC, Eminem rapping about raping his mom isn't going to move you much since chances are high your mom is the one putting food on the table and working two jobs to keep you feed and roof over your head. Likewise if you're a white kid who lives at home with both of his parents, and your parents have a real good marriage. Nas talking about life disfranchised and seeing people sell drugs and get gunned down on the corner isn't going to move you.

The same can and is being applied to many posters in here who've never heard of Nas, NWA, etc. It's the reason why they can't comprehend why another poster would put them over Eminem. It never occurs to them that those posters might relate more to those artists than Eminem thus they rate them higher, but at the very same time, use the argument of cultural relativism as their reason why Eminem should be rated as the best.

TL;DR - This entire thread is stupid as fuck and is highly subjective without statistics. It ends up being an argument of one person's cultural viewpoint versus another person's.

You can tell this thread is dumb because we have people arguing that Kanye West wasn't influential.
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^^^ all of this.

nothing eminem raps is relevant to me at all. I'm not entirely sure how it's relevant to his fans either but I digress. Maybe loving your daughter? I don't have any children though so once again he misses me personally. When it comes to strictly being witty and delivering a punchline or two that just has the "wow" factor he misses me there as well.

But he raps fast so a lot of people don't care about what he's saying anyway. They probably miss a bunch of the dumb shit he spits.
 
RP912 said:
Seriously.

White America was going crazy for artists like Run DMC, NWA, and even white artists like the Beastie Boys, House of Pain, and even....Vanilla Ice.

What Eminem did was went a controversial route in order to sell records. SSLP sold well, but that's because he was Dr. Dre's protege at the time. I remember when "I just don't give a fuck" came out and dudes were like meh...

It had to take MMLP to folks to gather attention towards him, but it was for the wrong reasons. Songs on the album talked about killing gay people, murdering his mom and baby mother, and other wacky shit doesn't register to the general public at all, unless the person is a sociopath. If Em released Infinite...I bet your bottom dollar no one will give a fuck because it's not on the level of "kill sluts, gays, and fuck my mom" that was on MMLP for folks to buy into the controversy.

Bottom line, black people are not salty that Em beat them at their own game and it's Em fans that have this type of feeling end up being the salty ones, because their beloved messiah looking like Larry Holmes rapping struggle bars about poop in 20 and fucking 15.
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Da-Damn

Starting to feel like Eminem ether is my fetish
 
Last great album Jay put out was Black Album back in 2003. He has yet to put out another hot album...

At least Nas had a hot album every ten year average. We going on 12 years with Jay.
 
Angelus Errare said:
Last great album Jay put out was Black Album back in 2003. He has yet to put out another hot album...

At least Nas had a hot album every ten year average. We going on 12 years with Jay.
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I've always thought American Gangster was underrated. I think Jay still has it, he just needs focus. Kingdom Come was dope as hell until he blew his wad after the first 4 tracks and MCHG is unfocused as hell, had a handful of good records on it though.
 
Holy shit, listening to some Canibus I stumbled on this, wtf.

Canibus - Poet Laureate Infinity 1000 bars

A concept invented by the rapper Canibus in 2007. The song contains 5 different 200 bar layers, for a total of thousand bars. It was originally displayed on a virtual mixing board online. Essentially, you would press play and all 5 sets of 200 bars would play at once, with 4 muted.
You could at any time, mute one, and unmute a different one. And do this every single bar, and no matter what they would flow to make a new rhyme. As it was designed to make infinite rhymes there were countless different mixes that could be created.

Infinite rhyming consists of layers that share the exact same rhyme scheme and flow. By putting each layer into a separate channel of a mixer, it gives the user the ability to switch between layers seamlessly. This while still maintaining a coherent rhyme structure, content, rhythm and flow. Thereby allowing users to create their own songs, or mixes, in an infinite number of ways. This video displays how it was recorded, but as stated above, you can create totally new content with it.
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The result is 53 MINUTES OF ONE INCREDIBLE CANIBUS FLOW.

Amazing, this is perfect. Might deserve its own thread.
 
Infinite said:
American Gangster was good although an excuse for Jay to rap about crack dealing again
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It's the only thing he can rap about. People think there's a cycle to Jay-Z albums one bad, one good. There isn't. you can tell if the album will be good based on what he raps about.

Remember the MCHG thread in which cats thought this would be his "good" album, because BP3 was his bad album and everyone was getting hyped off of youtube vidoes of this dude talkin about "dualities" and shit like he was deep like that?

His drug dealing days? - average to classic.
I has money, Basquiat! - Narcolepsy inducing garbage.
 
Infinite said:
American Gangster was good although an excuse for Jay to rap about crack dealing again
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Exactly my thoughts on it. I liked the album. Bunch of quotable bars and really solid production. But it was the last album from him that I liked at all. So it's still been a minute.
 
Jay will always be known as the "biter". Sure dude is one of the best when it comes down to the raps, but in reality every album felt like a homage to another rapper's album. The only album that stood out in his catalog is In My Lifetime Vol. 1, because it felt honest and to the point.
 
FZZpure said:
? who gives a shit about what people think of him.

Dude has the strongest discography in all of Hip-Hop. His first album popularized backpack rap and got the industry out of the gangster rap shit hole it had been in since the 90s. His fourth album paved the way for Drake, Sean, and many others. He's done more for the genre as a fucking whole than anyone before or after him.

People are just too salty to admit that a middle class black kid from Chicago did more for the genre they hold oh so dear to their hearts than fucking Pac and Biggie did in the 90s. The only sad part about all of this is he will not get any recognition until after he dies.
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Fair enough, salt removed, most of it. I concede your points. I'm just saying when you leave a legacy behind it's not just about your works, it's about who you are inward as a person. At the end of the day, that's what people remember you as. If you cure cancer, great, kind of makes it difficult to appreciate that when all you do is gloat about how you changed the world.
 
Banglish said:
Fair enough, salt removed, most of it. I concede your points. I'm just saying, when you leave a legacy behind, it's not just about your works, it's about who you are inward as a person. At the end of the day, that's what people remember you as. If you cure cancer, great, kind of makes it difficult to appreciate that when all you do is gloat about how you changed the world.
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If someone gets rid of cancer I think they deserve to brag about that shit.
 
.... damn i remember when i thought canibus was going to be the greatest rapper ever. his freestyles that one night on funk flex with DMX and Nore made me think that he would change the game.


then that first album came and damn it
 
Banglish said:
Fair enough, salt removed, most of it. I concede your points. I'm just saying, when you leave a legacy behind, it's not just about your works, it's about who you are inward as a person. At the end of the day, that's what people remember you as. If you cure cancer, great, kind of makes it difficult to appreciate that when all you do is gloat about how you changed the world.
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If you cure cancer, everyone with cancer will look at you like a god...

- thank you Yeezus 🙏🏾
 
RP912 said:
Jay will always be known as the "biter". Sure dude is one of the best when it comes down to the raps, but in reality every album felt like a homage to another rapper's album. The only album that stood out in his catalog is In My Lifetime Vol. 1, because it felt honest and to the point.
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BP1 didn't sound like any rap album that came before it.
 
Malleymal said:
.... damn i remember when i thought canibus was going to be the greatest rapper ever. his freestyles that one night on funk flex with DMX and Nore made me think that he would change the game.


then that first album came and damn it
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To be fair, Wyclef's country fair ass beats ruined the album. It was still a ok album at most though. At least it wasn't this album...

Canibus_-_C_True_Hollywood_Stories.jpg


What a stinker...
 
RP912 said:
To be fair, Wyclef's country fair ass beats ruined the album. It was still a ok album at most though. At least it wasn't this album...

Canibus_-_C_True_Hollywood_Stories.jpg


What a stinker...
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Canibus pretty much always had wack beats sadly. Some remixes really sound great.

https://soundcloud.com/iphaze-mixingmachine/canibus-mbm-2015

https://soundcloud.com/d3fnot3/datmurdashit

FadedRevolution said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZVMvxYQgdc
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This I don't understand. First, it looks fake. Second, why would anyone bring a big pad of notes straight out there? This thing just looked weird.
 
i don't care how good Eminem is technically, he just comes off as a really shallow artist to me. he's constantly trying to be shocking and shit, makes me cringe more than anything.

i like a bit of melancholy and introspection in my rap, it's rappers like Sole, Black Thought, Ka, hell even Prodigy (Mobb Deep) that are true artists to me..
 
Since we're on Jay, Someone has to explain why he is a great. I've listened, I've enjoyed, but I just don't see it. Most others even if I don't love it, something sticks out. With him, it doesn't. He feels bland or a better way to say it, it feels like I've heard it already.

On Em, Is he a great? Sure. Is he the greatest? Not even in competition. With his earlier material, the joke songs hurt it. I know leading to the release with something like "My Name Is" is a great song to get people's attention. But I can't even make it through it anymore now that I'm older. And his older, raged filled, mentality coming from nothing doesn't do shit anymore when your rich, healthy, etc.
 
inner-G said:
I don't care what else it sounds like, Reasonable Doubt is still amazing to this day.
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Can I Live
Coming of Age
D'evils
Aint no Nigga
Brooklyns Finest
Cant Knock the Hustle
Feelin' It
Politics as Usual
Dead Presidents II

Sorry but the SSLP and MMLP havnt aged as well as RD.
Come at me Em stans.
 
Banglish said:
Fair enough, salt removed, most of it. I concede your points. I'm just saying when you leave a legacy behind it's not just about your works, it's about who you are inward as a person. At the end of the day, that's what people remember you as. If you cure cancer, great, kind of makes it difficult to appreciate that when all you do is gloat about how you changed the world.
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If someone doesn't appreciate the person who cures cancer because they're is worse of a person. Cure cancer...gloat till your last breath. If anybody has something negative to say the only rebuttal should be is that mf cured mf cancer.

Btw...kanye's arrogant music is some of the greatest stuff I've ever heard. I mean...for real.
 
Banglish said:
Until they realize the guy that cured them only cured them so that he could say, he cured them.
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But their cancer would still be gone...you know, that nagging disease that was killing them.

Maybe I shouldn't speak on Ye though because I can't fully do it from an unbiased position. I'm a Stan. Ye changed everything.
 
theignoramus said:
Can I Live
Coming of Age
D'evils
Aint no Nigga
Brooklyns Finest
Cant Knock the Hustle
Feelin' It
Politics as Usual
Dead Presidents II

Sorry but the SSLP and MMLP havnt aged as well as RD.
Come at me Em stans.
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I'm feelin it fill the glass to the top with Moet
Feel the Lex pushin up on the set
I'm feelin it through the high that you get from the lie
If you feel it raise your el in the skyyyyyyyyyy

(Although I always thought it said 'the high that you get from the la')
 
dave is ok said:
If Jay Z actually retired after the Black Album like he said he was going to, he'd probably be number 1.
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Jay Z had an amazing run in the 90s up to early 00s. I'd put him over Eminem easily. Even factoring in his newer garbage he at least entertained with his collab with Kanye.

funnily enough his collab with eminem is one of the few songs by Eminem that still holds up.
 
A guy who keeps maintaining small bursts of relevancy by attacking other artist and women is by no means the best rapper, a disgrace if you ask me.
 
He is one of the best that ever did it. Whether or not you place him at the top of the top is up to you but most definitely one of the best.
 
SephLuis said:
Masterful post. I haven't listened to an Eminem album for years and I can think of only a couple of songs that I would like to hear again.

While we are at it, can you recommend a few artists/album that you consider to be great ?
I see some names in the post, but not sure if they are what you would consider great or just sarcasm. I personally don't like meaningless music and there is a lot of those around.
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If I was to make a list of great artists with great albums...off the top of my head in no order. I'm missing tons of people obviously but this is off the top.


Kool G Rap - Live and Let Die; 4,5,6
KRS-One - Criminal Minded, Return Of The Boom Bap
Ice Cube - Amerikkka's Most Wanted, Death Certificate
MF DOOM - Operation Doomsday, Madvillainy, Mm Food
Nas - Illmatic, It Was Written
Ghostface Killah - Ironman, Supreme Clientele, Fishscale
Scarface - The Diary, The Untouchable
Jay Z - Reasonable Doubt, The Blueprint
Pharoahe Monch - Stress: The Extinction Agenda, Desire
Andre 3000 - just about every Outkast album
Mos Def - Black On Both Sides
Common - Resurrection, Like Water For Chocolate, Be

Nearly every album named is better than every Eminem album. Deal with it stans.
 
i like eminem show more than MF Doom's output tbh and put it on the level of Be (or maybe better). But yeah the rest is pretty hard to disagree with.
 
PhoenixDark said:
If I was to make a list of great artists with great albums...off the top of my head in no order. I'm missing tons of people obviously but this is off the top.


Kool G Rap - Live and Let Die; 4,5,6
KRS-One - Criminal Minded, Return Of The Boom Bap
Ice Cube - Amerikkka's Most Wanted, Death Certificate
MF DOOM - Operation Doomsday, Madvillainy, Mm Food
Nas - Illmatic, It Was Written
Ghostface Killah - Ironman, Supreme Clientele, Fishscale
Scarface - The Diary, The Untouchable
Jay Z - Reasonable Doubt, The Blueprint
Pharoahe Monch - Stress: The Extinction Agenda, Desire
Andre 3000 - just about every Outkast album
Mos Def - Black On Both Sides
Common - Resurrection, Like Water For Chocolate, Be

Nearly every album named is better than every Eminem album. Deal with it stans.
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Great list. Just about what I would have put.
 
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