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[lochnesssnowman]

I'm not so sure. I think the impact of Ghoulies would be minimal. It might have been heartening to know Rare were still there, but I think a lot of people would be wondering what was going on with Rare if all they had released by now was SFA and Ghoulies. In the same way they are now on Xbox..think about it, by this time in the N64's life we had a lot more titles, and of a lot higher quality. If Rare was still on GC, people would expect the same, but Rare haven't delivered in the same way they did last gen...some people ARE downing on Rare because they're still bitter that Rare isn''t with Nintendo, but some of us are just genuinely disappointed as Rare fans. Personally I'm hoping they're still just finding their feet, and next gen will see more frequent, and higher quality output.

Also, my point about Microsoft's investment wasn't assuming Nintendo got all the money. I was simply saying that Microsoft had spent 375m on Rare, and Nintendo had gained 170 or whatever, in the transaction. So from the perspective of that transaction alone, Microsoft was down 375, Nintendo up 170 i.e. roughly a 550m gap (and yes, I know this is simplistic..i'm just looking at the cash flow here, and not even thinking of how much of that 170 was profit for Nintendo on their own investment in Rare etc.). Forgetting about Nintendo, if we're talking about Microsoft's ROI on Rare, it could be quite some time before they see anything. I'd be surprised if they make a return on it next gen. That wasn't an observation from bitter-land, simply something that hit me while reading the thread.

Please don't write off "negative commentary" about Rare as simple Nintendo fan bitterness. I hope, as much if not more than anyone here, that Rare starts delivering the goods, whatever platform they're on. It's just difficult to be positive about Rare's recent past.

This is closer to home.

Sure, a small number of comments might be from bitter Nintendo fans still eaten up inside 2 years later but to hit everyone that comments negatively on the Rare situation with a blanket statement is wrong.

I buy every console going in general to get the best selection on games but with the Xbox, Rare were definitely a big influence in my purchase. I followed them from the 8 bit days back when they were Ultimate and they've been very consistent if slow with quality output. The N64 was saved with a slew of hit Rare titles. This generation, however, they have slipped up in quality and Starfox, GBTG and Banjo have all been fairly average if sometimes charming.

Sure, it might be an investment, but nobody can claim that the buyout has been successful as of right now. And for me personally, having shelled out on an Xbox with Rare being a big reason, right now figures pretty highly in my reckoning. I can't complain with the other Xbox titles I've bought but I'd still kill to see some quality Rare games.

With Rare we can't wait three generations, after MS has thrown $1billion at them, and when they finally throw out a quality PD0 and say, 'Man, what a great investment MS!'. If MS bought Acclaim, I'm sure that with enough time and 'investment' they could get them to churn out a decent title. The point is, with enough money, you could polish a shit and send it to the ball. Rare were class to begin with and shouldn't need two generations of cash or time to produce the goods.

Conker looks great aesthetically, but at heart it's the same game I bought 4/5 years ago. Albeit a great one. And Kameo still has to win me over, as it still doesn't seem to have found a settled look yet. I really hope they turn out great though. They really can turn out some class goods and even smaller titles like Blast Corps on the N64 were class.

I, as a Rare fan, hope they get back to winning ways.

 

[open_mouth_]

This Gen:

GBTG = Average game
Konker = AAA, Awesome single player w/ great graphics and a lovely multiplayer aspect
Kameo = Looking more polished every day with that Rare glow. Could be AA or better.

Next Gen:

Perfect Dark 0
Killer Instinct
Banjo Kazooie
Kart Racer

Rare is going to close out this gen strong and they're going to be a HUGE part of Microsoft's Xenon line-up next-gen, so imo, they were well worth the 375$ spent on them. Not only does MS get the valuable properties, they get lots of talented, experienced developers.

 

[Shiggy]

http://www.raretopia.com/news/2003/10/13.html

Was this article fake?

 

[Deg]

Rare are in a mess.

 

[Prine]

MS completely changed Kameo direction,and as it seems for the better,there are 2 dozen expierenced MS employees at Rare now overseeing the company.

Btw its old new,those people left 2 months ago and half or third of them were management not happy about losing ability to make decisions alone.

Good. MS must have learnt Rare were planning GBTG 2 and jumped in

Kameo looked real goofy before, and its reception at e3 proves that the new look was for the better.

 

[P90]

It has already helped the Xbox by hurting the Gamecube. .

StarFox Adventures was just so the system seller.

Rare has gone down hill since GoldenEye.

 

[jarrod]

As for the 5 games, it wasnt just Xbox games, check the PR on MS' site, Rare only have 3 xbox teams, and the only game which MS actually continued was Kameo, I do agree though that all 3 teams should have had one game out by now (they will have released 3 non-nintendo GBA games by the november), but it was MS that delayed them, not rare (although i did hear from one Rare employee that Kameo would be finished quite a while before its eventual release if everything went to plan).

Actually Rare has 4 teams, the handheld team (which is further subdivided) is seperate from the console teams.

 

[Vennt]

Anyone that thinks that things are rosy at Rare (and that Rare is the same beast it once was, for that matter) is seriously blinkered.

I'm not saying this as a Nintendo fan (I sold my Gamecube long ago).

I'm saying this as a resident of Leicester


Freeburn.

 

[Catchpenny]

Look at this holiday season for Gamecube, the big Nintendo titles are Metroid Prime 2 and Paper Mario 2. That's it.

Look at this holiday season for Xbox, the big Microsoft titles are Halo 2 and Fable. That's it.
Funny how Rare's titles don't make Microsoft's list either!

I'll agree that you can't really judge the success of the Rare acquisition until Xenon comes out. Rare has a huge task ahead of them, though...they need to first get Perfect Dark 0 out for launch and have it sell systems. Then they need to attract a new audience to Xbox with their platformers/cart games/adventure titles. That's what Microsoft really wanted them for in the first place.

 

[jarrod]

It has already helped the Xbox by hurting the Gamecube. The Gamecube would have been doing at least a little bit better than it is right now if Rare had been releasing 1 or 2 games every year for Gamecube. As a result the Gamecube lineup has been constantly lacking. Look at this holiday season for Gamecube, the big Nintendo titles are Metroid Prime 2 and Paper Mario 2. That's it. I think it's safe to say that stuff like Donkey Kong Racing probably would have been million sellers.

StarFox has huge potential on GameCube, provided it's up to standard. If RE4 makes it this year it'll be GC's biggest release, and Mario Party 5 & Baten Kaitos should be good performers also (Mario Tennis too if it makes it). All the above mentioned titles have more sales potential than Kameo or Conker really...

*editied for clairifaction.

 

[dog$]

StarFox has huge potential on GameCube, provided it's up to standard. If RE4 makes it this year it'll be GC's biggest release, and Mario Party 5 & Baten Kaitos should be good performers also (Mario Tennis too if it makes it). Nintendo's 2005 lineup looks way better already though, I have to admit.

Yeah so how about that Rare company.

I heard they're losing more staff.

 

[Prine]

Halo 2, Fable, DOA U, KOTOR 2, Splinter Cell 3, DOOM 3

Potentially huge sellers this xmas for Xbox

And then theres Outrun 2, Burnout 3, Forza, etc

 

[Redbeard]

Disgruntled Rare employees: "Now they want us to finish games on schedule?! That's bollocks. Mabye Lionhead is hiring."

 

[Prine]

Disgruntled Rare employees: "Now they want us to finish games on schedule?! That's bollocks. Mabye Lionhead is hiring."

lol

 

[Renegade]

And we're sure how that it wasn't the quite large (as a whole) handheld teams that lost members?

 

[jarrod]

And we're sure how that it wasn't the quite large (as a whole) handheld teams that lost members?

The handheld teams comprise less than 30 people between them. And given their prolific output (6 games post buyout) to the various console teams (3 games post buyout) I'd have to say it isn't likely.

 

[evilromero]

i guess when you haven't had a good release on your system in a while you have a lot of time to think about what might have been.

I guess I better put away Four Swords, Tales of Symphonia and Mega Man Collection.

 

[worldrunover]

Rare is the Jason Giambi of developing.

 

[DrGAKMAN]

Nintendo had, what like, 49% of RARE making them a 2ND party, while the Stamper Bros. (and a rich friend of their's) had the controlling stake of 51%. RARE got the money from MS to buy back their shares from Nintendo and in turn gave those shares to MS. So tell me, does ANYONE know if RARE is a 2ND party of MS, or are they wholy owned by them? I don't think they are! If so, then the Stamper Bros. woulda cashed in their stakes and left the shell of a company to MS and laughed all the way to the bank...but they didn't. I think they're still holding onto their controlling stake in RARE so that they could some day go to the highest bidder and still have control of where RARE goes. Before they were given the rights to make DKC they were once buddy buddy with Sega, before then C64. Then there's this "contract" in where RARE has to make 5 games for the X-BOX in 2 years??? Ummm...if they're wholy owned by MS, why would they be contracted to do 5 games in 2 years? You contract outside/seperate entities...not ones that you flat out OWN!

I don't think we ever knew the whole story here...wouldn't surprize me if the Stamper Bros. went wheelin'n'dealin' next generation too. Not like it matters, the "rumors" are true...alot of people don't like working at RARE and alot more already left...it's convieniant that the Stamper Bros. haven't yet though!

 

[Solid]

I do not want to believe this news

 

[puck1337]

IP means very little if you don't have someone to develop games based on it. And it's always nice when those people actually finish the game they're working on. Developer churn is a bitch. Plus, the more time that passes without a Perfect Dark or a Banjo game, the less relevant those brands become. These aren't series that are the gold standard in their respective genres. They were great for their time, but they stand the risk of being replaced by newer franchises if they aren't kept in the public eye. If there is a major problem at Rare, it needs to be fixed.

That all said, my personal benchmark for Rare's purchase being a success is 4 Xenon/Xbox titles that sell 1-1.5 million+ in North America/Europe combined. That's about 1 big seller every 1.5 years for the next 6-7 years. Rare's games are expensive to make, so that won't even come close to paying off MS' investment, but I think it's probably close to what MS had in mind with the purchase if not a little low.

 

[NWO]

This Gen:

GBTG = Average game
Konker = AAA, Awesome single player w/ great graphics and a lovely multiplayer aspect
Kameo = Looking more polished every day with that Rare glow. Could be AA or better.

Next Gen:

Perfect Dark 0
Killer Instinct
Banjo Kazooie
Kart Racer

Rare is going to close out this gen strong and they're going to be a HUGE part of Microsoft's Xenon line-up next-gen, so imo, they were well worth the 375$ spent on them. Not only does MS get the valuable properties, they get lots of talented, experienced developers.

Kart Racer is the Mario, Zelda, GTA, GT, MGS, Final Fantasy, Madden, and Halo killer all built into one.

 

[gofreak]

Nintendo had, what like, 49% of RARE making them a 2ND party, while the Stamper Bros. (and a rich friend of their's) had the controlling stake of 51%. RARE got the money from MS to buy back their shares from Nintendo and in turn gave those shares to MS. So tell me, does ANYONE know if RARE is a 2ND party of MS, or are they wholy owned by them? I don't think they are! If so, then the Stamper Bros. woulda cashed in their stakes and left the shell of a company to MS and laughed all the way to the bank...but they didn't. I think they're still holding onto their controlling stake in RARE so that they could some day go to the highest bidder and still have control of where RARE goes. Before they were given the rights to make DKC they were once buddy buddy with Sega, before then C64. Then there's this "contract" in where RARE has to make 5 games for the X-BOX in 2 years??? Ummm...if they're wholy owned by MS, why would they be contracted to do 5 games in 2 years? You contract outside/seperate entities...not ones that you flat out OWN!

I don't think we ever knew the whole story here...wouldn't surprize me if the Stamper Bros. went wheelin'n'dealin' next generation too. Not like it matters, the "rumors" are true...alot of people don't like working at RARE and alot more already left...it's convieniant that the Stamper Bros. haven't yet though!

IIRC, the Stamper Brothers *did* sell their stake to Microsoft. As part of the agreement, they committed to staying on at the company for X number of years..presumably they are happy to do so, now free of any financial responsibility etc. I remember at the time they said it would let them focus completely on realising their own ideas in games.

 

[xsarien]

It has already helped the Xbox by hurting the Gamecube. The Gamecube would have been doing at least a little bit better than it is right now if Rare had been releasing 1 or 2 games every year for Gamecube

1 or 2 games a year? Nintendo cut the cord because they couldn't even manage the low end of that scale.

 

[human5892]

The debatable quality of Rare in the past five years aside, one of the biggest problems of the MS-Rare team from the beginning of the deal has been the questionable fit of Rare to the Xbox platform. Rare found success with Nintendo not only because many of their games were quality, but because the type of games they made were a perfect match to Nintendo. With Microsoft, that's just not true; anyone who thinks that GBTG or even Kameo would've sold worse or even the same on GameCube is seriously delusional. Therein lies the biggest problem for MS with many of Rare's "valuable" IP, such as Banjo-Kazooie -- if the Xenon's demographics are anything like the Xbox's, it will be an incredibly inappropriate fit.

Of course, not to mention that many of these franchises have diminished in prominence since their heyday -- it's been almost 10 years since a new KI game, and there's not a new one in sight, and Conker was never that popular to begin with. Banjo-Kazooie is more recent and sold well in its day, but is there a place in today's gaming world -- especially on the Xbox or Xenon -- for a 3D platformer about a banjo-playing bear and a bird that lives in his backpack?

IMO, these are the more pertinent issues of the Rare-MS deal, moreso than Rare's oft-debated quality or rumored defection of employees.

 

[LuckyBrand]

i dont give a shit if rare has 10 employees, 1000 or 100000 that i know of..

all i know is that I loved grabbed by the ghoulies, and that was considered one of their "bad games"...

needless to say, I cant wait for Conker and Kameo... specifically Conker on Xbox live, that looks like it will rule..

i also really loved sabrewulf and banjo on GBA, and look forward to banjo pilot... my guess is they are building up the brand name on GBA again to then release a banjo game on xenon at some point and try to steal some kids that like GBA.

so many bitter nboys in here.

 

[Ghost]

The debatable quality of Rare in the past five years aside, one of the biggest problems of the MS-Rare team from the beginning of the deal has been the questionable fit of Rare to the Xbox platform. Rare found success with Nintendo not only because many of their games were quality, but because the type of games they made were a perfect match to Nintendo. With Microsoft, that's just not true; anyone who thinks that GBTG or even Kameo would've sold worse or even the same on GameCube is seriously delusional. Therein lies the biggest problem for MS with many of Rare's "valuable" IP, such as Banjo-Kazooie -- if the Xenon's demographics are anything like the Xbox's, it will be an incredibly inappropriate fit.

Of course, not to mention that many of these franchises have diminished in prominence since their heyday -- it's been almost 10 years since a new KI game, and there's not a new one in sight, and Conker was never that popular to begin with. Banjo-Kazooie is more recent and sold well in its day, but is there a place in today's gaming world -- especially on the Xbox or Xenon -- for a 3D platformer about a banjo-playing bear and a bird that lives in his backpack?

IMO, these are the more pertinent issues of the Rare-MS deal, moreso than Rare's oft-debated quality or rumored defection of employees.

It's not the 'problem with buying rare' its the entire point of buying rare, MS bought them to bring the kind of gamers that were attracted to the Playstation brand by games like Spyro, Jak and R&C (this has already been mentioned in the thread by someone else), and in theory games like Conker, Kameo and Banjo should do just that, but only time will tell if they do or not.

 

[human5892]

It's not the 'problem with buying rare' its the entire point of buying rare, MS bought them to bring the kind of gamers that were attracted to the Playstation brand by games like Spyro, Jak and R&C (this has already been mentioned in the thread by someone else), and in theory games like Conker, Kameo and Banjo should do just that, but only time will tell if they do or not.

Well, that's the problem -- that the entire point of buying Rare was misguided. ^_^

It was a noble effort on Microsoft's part to try and lure those types of demographics, but I think a better alternative could've been found for much less money...not to mention a speedier turn-around time on projects.

 

[LuckyBrand]

I think people ignore the fact that a purchase of this size was also meant to prove to everyone in the business that MS was here to stay and wouldnt be getting out anytime soon...

and also to remove a vital asset of Nintendo's...

we dont know how badly this hurt nintendos image or brand; we never will, but it certainly had some effect.

 

[GDGF]

and also to remove a vital asset of Nintendo's...

Nintendo removed that 'vital asset' themselves, remember? Nintendo had the option to rebuy Rare, but didn't want to. They were sold off, not stolen away.

 

[ge-man]

I think people ignore the fact that a purchase of this size was also meant to prove to everyone in the business that MS was here to stay and wouldnt be getting out anytime soon...

and also to remove a vital asset of Nintendo's...

we dont know how badly this hurt nintendos image or brand; we never will, but it certainly had some effect.

How would this hurt Nintendo? They sold their own shares off to MS. They were NOT interested in supporting RARE--there wasn't an elaborate coup to undermine Nintendo.

edit: beaten by Lost Weekend

 

[human5892]

and also to remove a vital asset of Nintendo's...

The problem with this line of thinking is that Nintendo were selling Rare of their own free will. It's not as if Microsoft somehow stole them away, or Rare turned "traitor" and defected. Nintendo knew what they were doing, which was getting rid of a resource-hogging company that could not even have a game ready for their console's launch despite having development kits before virtually anyone else in the entire industry. All at a handsome price, too. ^_^

Perhaps Microsoft believed that Nintendo misjudged the situation, but really, outside of the mental advantage Rare might have held in the minds of the Nintendo hardcore, I think they were pretty spot-on. Isn't the fact that they've only been able to release one console game in over two years (which was a bomb sales-wise and mediocre-to-poor critically) proof of this?

Rare could rebound and get better in time for the next generation, but if their output for Microsoft is any indication, they certainly wouldn't have been any great advantage for the GameCube.

EDIT: Beaten to the punch by ge-man and Lost Weekend. ^_^

 

[CrimsonSkies]

I'll judge Rare based on the first year of Xbox 2. It's obvious that's what they are targeting for most of their games. If they suck then I'll rail them. Until then, I refuse to pass judgement on them. A lot of folks still upset about them leaving Nintendo. Get over it.

 

[LuckyBrand]

Nintendo didnt own all of rare, MS could have still bought a controlling stake in RARE while Nintendo kept their shares, since it wasnt a controlling stake (50%+)...

What choice did nintendo have at that point? Stamper Brothers knew they could get mroe money overall from MS than Nintendo, and had been planning to leave the Nintendo fold for a while...

you can believe what you want, but rare wanted out of nintendo so they could have more flexibility as well as get more money, and nintendo knew they were just better off getting the money for their non-controlling stake....

so , nboys, believe what you want.. but 375 million out of the billions MS loses isnt goign to hurt them.. and the 170million Nintendo got from that, will that really matter in the end? Trust me, nintendo would rather have RARE still without having to actually pay rare for the other 51%.. that was an ideal situation for them.

but the real story of RARE will be xenon, and to a lesser degree conker and kameo..

i think we can all agree conker is looking kick arse.

 

[human5892]

LuckyBrand
I don't know shit

Hmm.

 

[Flatbread]

human5892 had it right, rare makes games that do not fit the primary xbox demographic. MS hopes to change that, and maybe next generation they will try harder to do that. I think part of the reason we arent seeing many games from RARE is that MS realizes that they dont have the fan base for games like kameo, gbtg, or a brand new single player conker to succeed. Thats why were seeing a live conker game, I wouldnt be surprised if they delay kameo until next generation even.

Its been said that xbox is a long term project, and despite losing 1-2 billion dollars, (or so?) we are seeing an xbox 2(much to the chagrin of all those that say THEY CANT KEEP LOSING MONEY LIKE THIS, ..... can they?). Perhaps a better effort will be given to making xbox 2 a more accessible console for the kids and fans of platforming type games. If and when that comes RARE will be ready with the banjoes, kameos, saburwolf and whatever else.

In the end I think it hurt nintendo more than it helped MS to buy RARE, its impossible to put and quantative value on it though. Games like GBTG, kameo and whatever else RARE might have come out with for the GC would have sold much better than on the xbox. If RARE was still on board those games would have helped give some recognizable talent to the GC lineup, which has the least amount of titles of the 3 consoles in terms of quantity(and many would argue quality too). They may have been on a downward trend, but those starfox adventure sales are pretty good. 800,000 in the US alone is pretty damn good for the GC and Xbox.

Obviously the best way to spin the rare purchase for MS is to say its an investment, and remains to be seen if it ever becomes positive in any way. It could be intepreted that the MS purchase is leading to the further market share erosion of nintendo, though I think Sony and nintendo own behavoirs are more to do with that. One thing for MS is that it has the money to burn, and 375 million seems like alot, but in 1 quarter they make over 2 billion dollars in net income. If your sitting where MS is presently, this deal was small potatoes.

 

[human5892]

One thing for MS is that it has the money to burn, and 375 million seems like alot, but in 1 quarter they make over 2 billion dollars in net income. If your sitting where MS is presently, this deal was small potatoes.

That's a good point, I hadn't thought of that. To MS, it probably seemed like Rare was for sale for the equivilant of $10 in the funds of most other companies.

 

[Bregor]

I find it difficult to believe that MS could not have found a better alternative than spending $375 million on an unproductive developer, whether their objective was credibility, or to undermine Nintendo, or games aimed at a certain demographic.

 

[MetaKnight]

3. As much as 10% (25 employees aprox) of the company during the transition from GC to Xbox according to a previous report from IGNCube's Matt C.

Link?

 

[ge-man]

LuckyBrand--Even if Rare knew they could get a better deal from MS, that doesn't mean that it was some big win for MS and a loss for Nintendo. The lack of struggle indicates to me that Nintendo wasn't too worried.

If you have been paying attention recently you might realize that Nintendo no longer believes in the 2nd party system. Silicon Knights was let go of and Nintendo recently stated that they are far more interested in 3rd party partnerships that are easy to get into and out of.

 

[CrimsonSkies]

"I find it difficult to believe that MS could not have found a better alternative than spending $375 million on an unproductive developer, whether their objective was credibility, or to undermine Nintendo, or games aimed at a certain demographic."

While the question of whether there might have been better companies to go after is legit. One can't look past the fact that Microsoft got a lot of IP with the Rare purchase. Conker, Banjoo, Perfect Dark, etc. That alone was worth the purchase for them. Also to add in the fact that said games would have been hyped to the extreme by Nintendo and their loyal fanbase. As we have all witnessed time and time again here.

 

[xsarien]

While the question of whether there might have been better companies to go after is legit. One can't look past the fact that Microsoft got a lot of IP with the Rare purchase. Conker, Banjoo, Perfect Dark, etc.

Intellectual properties mean precisely jack and shit if the talent isn't there to make a good game out of them.

 

[jedimike]

It's kind of funny that this single buyout still stirs so many emotions in gamers. Despite what little Rare has done for Xbox in terms of game production, it has done a lot for Microsoft. Buying Rare was really the turning point for Xbox. Microsoft, at that point, proved to the gaming industry that they were very serious about the industry and they were here to stay. At the same time, they kind of took the wind out of Nintendo's sales.

Did Nintendo want to get rid of Rare? Was Rare a shadow of it's former self? Were they costing Nintendo too much money? I don't know, but it really doesn't matter.

The perception was that MS was getting the upper hand. This perception possibly led to more developer support for MS, possibly some Nintendo fans bought Xboxes, possibly it led to the eventual lead over Nintendo in Europe.


When MS purchased Rare, they were trailing in Europe and only had about 20 more games on the shelves than Nintendo. Perception is impossible to measure, but I think the Rare purchase certainly helped MS in many ways besides just game sales.

 

[CrimsonSkies]

"Intellectual properties mean precisely jack and shit if the talent isn't there to make a good game out of them."

But the lack of IP was one of Microsoft's biggest problems the first year and a half on their console. So obviously it does mean jack and shit.

 

[xsarien]

"Intellectual properties mean precisely jack and shit if the talent isn't there to make a good game out of them."

But the lack of IP was one of Microsoft's biggest problems the first year and a half on their console. So obviously it does mean jack and shit.

And who's to say that, perhaps, Microsoft would've better invested that money in developing their own properties?

 

[CrimsonSkies]

"And who's to say that, perhaps, Microsoft would've better invested that money in developing their own properties?"

Well I suppose you must have missed it. They tried to and failed miserably with several. Most gamers aren't willing to give new franchises a chance. There are of course exceptions and Microsoft is actually helping creating some new IP with their partners. The likes of Fable and Jade Empire spring to mind.

 

[xsarien]

"And who's to say that, perhaps, Microsoft would've better invested that money in developing their own properties?"

Well I suppose you must have missed it. They tried to and failed miserably with several. Most gamers aren't willing to give new franchises a chance.

And they're ruthless with known ones that have degraded in quality.

 

[gofreak]

Nintendo didnt own all of rare, MS could have still bought a controlling stake in RARE while Nintendo kept their shares, since it wasnt a controlling stake (50%+)...

What choice did nintendo have at that point? Stamper Brothers knew they could get mroe money overall from MS than Nintendo, and had been planning to leave the Nintendo fold for a while...

you can believe what you want, but rare wanted out of nintendo so they could have more flexibility as well as get more money, and nintendo knew they were just better off getting the money for their non-controlling stake....

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Nintendo have first refusal on the Stamper stake? In that case, they did have control over what was going on. The 170-odd million it would have cost them to buy the Stamper's out would have been small change to them also..it's not like money was standing in their way. As much as I hate to say it, Nintendo probably chose not to acquire Rare wholly because it just wasn't worth it to them. And it was their choice..they effectively could have prevented Microsoft buying Rare if they wanted to (though I remain open to correction on this, if Nintendo didn't actually have first refusal on remaining Rare shares, but I think they did).

Also, Rare have said on a number of occasions that they had all the freedom they wanted under Nintendo, and I think that is proven in that they're still making the same kind of games today with Microsoft. They were always just the games they wanted to make.

Anyway, all of this was been debated ad nauseum when the news of the deal initially broke..

edit - all of the above said, I would agree almost fully with what jedimike said...I remember people thinking very differently about the Xbox here after they bought Rare, mostly because of the promise of Rare's future games. I'd say it helps them less now, though, given how (in)visible Rare has been on the platform.

 

[Azih]

Yeah it was completely Nintendo's option to jettison Rare. LuckyBrand is the only one who believes otherwise.

 

[Bluemercury]

Blast Corps and Jet Force gemini were really great great games.......