Remember, they don't get a penny if they don't hit $500k.
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Republique Kickstarter by Ryan Payton - NOW FOR PC AND MAC! [Ended, $555K funded]
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Remember, they don't get a penny if they don't hit $500k.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I like how this was listed as a feature. Games are so sad these days.
Haunted
Member
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
If they had went for a hundred thousand they could've used that money. They went in big and will most likely not get anything.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Don't they need to raise the 500k in order to get the 500k from private investors? That's how I read that page anyway.
Haunted
Member
Well maybe not in an immediate cause and effect like this, but it stands to reason that a successful Kickstarter is a good thing to have in your pocket to secure additional funding.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I'm assuming they couldn't have made a game with 100k though.
Hydrogen Bluebird
Member
They could make a game though. The question now is whether they'll rethink and pitch this project for platforms that support 1-2 million dollar budgets like XBLA, Steam and PSN, rethink it as a smaller budget iOS game or move on to a different project altogether.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
A game, but maybe not the game as described on the page.
And you know, since Shane is over at Sony managing indie projects, Ryan should ask him for some of that Sony money to bring the game to PSN.
slaughterking
Member
And on the other hand, a Kickstarter that failed to reach its goal by a really wide margin will be difficult to sweep under the rug. In the end this KS will not only not get them 500k, but it will also mark the whole project as a very (even more) risky endeavor. Can't be a good thing when you're looking for investors.
FTL uninteresting?
Couldn't be more wrong - probably the most fun I've had playing ANY game in the last few years was playing the FTL demo on OnLive.
I'm gagging for the beta (which I really hope doesn't come out until after I go on holiday or I may well end up wasting the trip on my laptop)
fizzelopeguss
Banned
With a dog collar and that face?
Good points, and after browsing kickstarter I can say reason number one is why this is failing. Every single ios kickstarter is bombing. Every one. Ryan can at least know Republique is doing the best of any ios kickstarter, but unfortunately this silver lining doesn't help the project get done.
Not every PC kickstarter succeeds, but there are much more successes than failures. A bunch of obscure PC projects are already funded.
Ryan needs to get the PR speak out of his kickstarter description as well. Look at this paragraph:
Was this really needed? The people funding his project aren't corporate suits. We don't need to read this garbage. If anything the failure of ios kickstarters just goes to show active user base is more important than total user base.
B_Rik_Schitthaus
Banned
This got me thinking, and thinking got me clicking, and clicking got me this.
STAR COMMAND: Sci-Fi meets GameDev Story for iOS and Android
$36,967 made on a
$20,000 goal
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/starcommand/star-command-sci-fi-meets-gamedev-story-for-ios-an
Proppa（プロッパ）
$6,186 made on a
$5,000 goal
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1256521023/proppa
Prof. Cat's Mazing Machine
$3,438 made on a
$3,000 goal
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/arcadetale/prof-cats-mazing-machine?ref=search
Crowman & Wolfboy - iOS Adventure
$6,124 made on a
$4,000 goal
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2079929955/crowman-and-wolfboy-ios-adventure?ref=search
All these have got more then 100%, I don't see Paytons project ending up at less then 50% any sort of silver lining.
Haunted
Member
Republique already having roughly double the money of all of these combined yet being nowhere close to their goal just goes to show how out there the 500k goal for a single platform iOS game really is compared to the smaller indie efforts you mention.
edit: OT but just an observation: pretty crazy that backing Star Command doesn't actually get you the game.
I don't think that 3rd point really counts against it in this context. The most successful gaming kickstarters go completely against broader gaming industry trends.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Are they really going to ride this out for the remaining 22 days hoping some under-dog effect is going to kick in? Theyre doing irreparable damage to the game and their studio's rep if so, as the internet's collective lack of fuck giving will tar this project for other investors, and possibly even the final thing if it ever arrived on different platforms "oh its that game nobody cared about, meh".
Can they even call it a day early themselves and go back to the drawing board and either pitch to pubs or come back to Kickstarter with a PC focus? Is that an option?
Adapt or die. Those not sitting on comfortable cushions of unending cash do not have the luxury of stubbornly ignoring any and all possible compromises required to even make a game in the first place. Its a bit maddening to watch someone throw away so much work to 'prove a point' in... to be frank... a kind of blind fanboy way.
Can they even call it a day early themselves and go back to the drawing board and either pitch to pubs or come back to Kickstarter with a PC focus? Is that an option?
Adapt or die. Those not sitting on comfortable cushions of unending cash do not have the luxury of stubbornly ignoring any and all possible compromises required to even make a game in the first place. Its a bit maddening to watch someone throw away so much work to 'prove a point' in... to be frank... a kind of blind fanboy way.
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
I do think that Ryan is doing himself a disservice by stubbornly refusing to just talk with us. He invested all that effort in the traditional PR route, getting attention from every media outlet he could, and what good has it done? Kickstarter is a grassroots thing, you have to start at the bottom up, not top down. It may be a product of his background, but so far Ryan has had a very corporate approach to communication rather than an indie one: Solicit media exposure, stay on message, ignore anything that doesn't go according to plan and hope that it goes away.
I feel that approach is turning off a lot of people who would otherwise love to support him. I mean I wish the man well and everything, but people just aren't going to be excited about a developer that doesn't give a fuck about what they want. Ryan said that he's taking the Field of Dreams approach, but that is idealism and not a strategy. What is your target audience, Ryan? You've said that you were hoping core gamers would be your first customers, but I can guarantee that that will not be the case if you continue to completely ignore them.
Build a field on some farmland and they might come. Build it on top of a live volcano and you're on your own.
Vyse The Legend
Member
Yeah, he bailed out of this thread once the Kickstarter bombed.
Father_Brain
Banned
At the rate funds been coming for the past few days, it'll be lucky to reach 90K by the end of the funding period. Sad.
slaughterking
Member
I wonder what 8-4 will say about this tomorrow.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I totally agree. The whole approach comes off like he's already an established developing house that doesn't even need Kickstarter or fans. It's weird how corporate it feels compared to even something like Double Fine, who is an established developer that has experience putting out big budget games.
I'm starting to think that this post earlier in the thread might be accurate:
yes, where is the free-to-play $0 pledge option?
This is my fault. Sorry I haven't been in here these past few days and talking. Even though friends warned me that running a Kickstarter campaign takes a lot of time, I didn't anticipate it would occupy my every waking moment!
Please help me understand what you mean by not me caring about what people want. We've received hundreds of requests from the community asking for Republique on PC, Mac, Android, Windows Phone, PlayStation Vita...so our team is currently investigating all of above that have touch screens. You could say that's because we're stubborn, and maybe there's some truth to that -- we designed and wrote Republique for mobile, touch devices and I don't know what else to say. We want to be as many platforms as possible, as long as we have the budget to support them properly and they make sense for the player experience.
I agree. We're definitely trying to do something different. It's interesting to get feedback from friends who now say, "You shouldn't known your game wouldn't blow up on Kickstarter! It's specifically for classic PC game revivals."
I think that's easy to say now in retrospect, but I'm very proud of the fact that we're out there trying this. It's funny -- I have emails from well-respected industry veterans who saw our trailer and video before we launched our Kickstarter campaign and they suggested we seek an even bigger goal like Wasteland's... So yeah, this has been a really interesting journey so far.
I still believe we'll reach our goal, and hope that we can pave a path for future iOS and/or new IP projects from other teams. I believe we're still in the early stages of how Kickstarter / crowd-funding is going to change the industry.
Why not just promise that they'll come after launch if sales are good enough to support it? I mean 500k was for the whole shebang on mobile, but after the fact ports could conceivably be proper cheap (relatively). I think you would get more people investing were it that they could actually play the game. Flexibility is what has helped kickstarters.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I'm curious - is the reason why you are pursuing iOS over Vita because of the larger audience share? Certainly there are more iOS users... but the flip side is that are more "hardcore" players on Vita who are starved for content at the moment.
Thank you Ryan for setting up this Kickstarter. I agree that up front it was not clear what the ceiling for this Kickstarter would be. In hindsight it is easy to find explanation for the difficulties, but it might have been also a great success (and then we would have explanations found for that as well, lol).
Though to reach your goal you need to kickstart your Kickstarter (sorry for the pun) and might also need some endorsement from some other industry veterans. Hardcore Tactical Shooter was able to turn the tide, so you might be able to do it as well. But the deck is stacked against you currently...
I would increase my pledge if Vita support is included.
But offering Vita support without talking to Sony first is not wise (i.e. what happens if Sony rejects the game later?). And Sony is probably not fast enough to commit within the timeframe of the Kickstarter (if they bother at all, since the project might also not be funded at all and hence the effort spent would be wasted).
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Hrm, yeah, that's true. It does make sense that none of these game projects are on any closed platforms, now that I think about it.
slaughterking
Member
Wish you the best of luck, but I hope you're not deluding yourself and you have a plan B.
B_Rik_Schitthaus
Banned
Plan B should be to do everything to be the next Chair, those are the people leading where Payton seems to want to go.
One of the things that really attracts me to iOS is just how international it is. Back on Metal Gear and Halo, I knew the majority of our audience was in North America and the UK, so it's really exciting for me to know that Republique will be played by people in so many more countries just because of how ubiquitous iOS has become.
With that said, I really like the Vita and we're interested in bringing the game to the platform if Sony is interested.
You know, PC's are also very internationally "ubiquitous" , especially more than an expensive smartphone/tablet. Just saying
Give me more than your 2 cents, man!
I'm really proud of the work the team's done, the trailer, our video, the creative thought we've put into the pledges, and being honest about what we're setting out to do and what it'll take to get us there, but this certainly isn't a perfect Kickstarter campaign. What would you have done differently?
I understand why you don't want to change your vision what the game should be, but what happens if the kickstarter doesn't meet its goal? If the options are either "stuck to your vision and don't get funded" or "adjust your vision and get funded", is it really worth to chose the former?
One thing that really impressed me is the fact that you had a working prototype as well as a lot of quality footage of the game. This is already a great, great way to appeal to potential backers and puts you far ahead of competing Kickstarter projects.
However, the fact that the targeted consumers (iOS) are not reacting seems to point towards that either they don't know the want it (in which case you have to convince them *why* a 10$ iOS AAA game is the next best thing) or that you have to adjust your product to appeal to the people who already want your game, but can't due to various reasons. You could try to identify the wishes and see what's feasible and extrapolate which wishes would result in the most new backers. There have been some recommendations and criticisms throughout this thread that might help you.
But I understand you already have a design and code in place that make it difficult to adjust to other platforms or other backer requests. And there is also a point in that you obviously intend to create a certain experience, which any potential adjustments would hamper/obfuscate. I admire your ambition and vision. Unfortunately the conditions of the iOS market and the rest of the gamers' attitude towards this type of game make this whole Kickstarter much more difficult to be successful.
In general, I would point towards the Shadowrun Kickstarter and their video updates to see how they have handled their PR and their vision. It seems very much like they listen to their fans, while constantly giving updates to what the money will be used for. But keep in mind that the Shadowrun case is different in terms of an already established IP, the founder being associated with it, and the appeal of classic 90's game design.
I'd say the most important thing with a Kickstarter campaign like this is knowing the audience you're pitching the game to. You're basically pitching a core experience on a platform that those users either don't want a core experience on or aren't convinced will work/be fun on said platform. The venn diagram intersection between Kickstarter users who want; iOS only games, different core experiences, and new IP from a fairly unknown developer would be a small subset of the much larger pool of 'core' gamers. I have my doubts as to how much traffic video game Kickstarters get from the casual audience so you'd have to make sure you're hitting an underserved niche audience, like a lot of the recent Kickstarter hits, or you're angling your pitch directly at the wider core audience in a manner that they would find appealing.
It's possible that iOS users might not know they want this game yet because it's so different from their typical game experience. If Ryan can maintain mind share with gamers via outlets like Weekend Confirmed it's certainly still possible to hit their goal. Keep engaging with the potential audience in any manner you can. The more evangelists you can create fueling word of mouth the better.
You haven't really shown why this is the case though. What is about the game that requires the use of a touch screen? You haven't shown any gameplay mechanics at all so it just looks like a trailer for a game that could be on any device or console. You need to show people why they want this for ios and why it cant be done on another system.
Republique looks great. I can't wait to actually play it. The way I see it though, you're 1)not as famous as Tim Schafer, 2) not a beloved brand (this goes for Shadowrun, but there's been an awful lot of winking around Wasteland from people who feel that they're getting a new 2d Fallout out of it) 3) There's a market for top-shelf games on iOS, but the ceiling is right around $10. I have a itunes wishlist full of Square/Taito games that are $10+ that I probably won't buy until they go on sale. I'd love to get the intelligentsia edition, but man, for that price I could get 10-20 other really solid games.
Anyway, you have my $10. Good luck.
I keep going back and forth on this. A part of me is like "fuck yes, serious iOS games, winning team, don't compromise your initial vision, blah blah blah", and another part of me is like "FFFFFUUUUUUU! Offer it to everyone under the sun so I can play this on some device, some day."
I just want to give you my money Ryan...
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
Thank you for responding. If you have the time, I recommend that you go back a few pages and just read some of the comments that people have made since you last posted. There's a lot of good perspective there. Here's just a few examples:
thetrin: Republique fills no underserved market.
Me: The difference between core and phone gamers.
Dreams-Vision: Gotta do what you gotta do.
areal: The pitch is not good.
I believe the simple fact is that core gamers by and large do not want to play on iOS. If you look at the successful Kickstarters, one common theme you will find is that they all serve existing, passionate, and generally neglected demographics. No such demographic exists on iOS. You yourself have articulated very well many of the problems we've had with iOS gaming, but the disconnect comes when you say that you want to change this and make iOS a platform that is essential to the core gamer.
We don't want iOS to be that platform. We are happy right where we are and always have been, on the PC. As more and more companies slouch towards Apple, we are told that it is inevitable that they will swallow core gaming as well. Whether that is true or not, it will certainly not happen with our facilitation. You are essentially asking us to help realize the future we fear most.
Just look at the comments in this thread and even on your own Kickstarter. People love your concept. But the platform is an absolute dealbreaker. We already know that you have a vision for this game that revolves around touch, but you also conceded it would be possible to revise it for PC and at one point it was even planned for Steam. Your refusal to make that adjustment is what we mean by not caring. The demand is loud and clear. We are banging on the door, Ryan, as loudly as we can. Let us in.
PC should be the lead platform. I have no doubt that you would have made your Kickstarter goal if it had been. Core gamers have a long memory. Don't leave us out in the cold.
Please don't think Ignis up there speaks for "core" gamers.
I used to spend $80 or more to import copies of Cave games for the PS2. I love that I can play faithful ports on my phone for less than $10 now.
The explosion of creativity around smartphone gaming (really, iOS) has been amazing, and as good as the GBA and DS libraries are, it's incredibly refreshing to have such an open mobile platform.
I used to spend $80 or more to import copies of Cave games for the PS2. I love that I can play faithful ports on my phone for less than $10 now.
The explosion of creativity around smartphone gaming (really, iOS) has been amazing, and as good as the GBA and DS libraries are, it's incredibly refreshing to have such an open mobile platform.
Dog Problems
Banned
Myself and many others, including people here on GAF, do want this to happen. I personally believe that it needs exclusives like Republique and given time people will "warm up" to the idea of having an iPhone or iPad as a legitimate gaming device like the 3DS and Vita. I mean, it's going to take time and I think iOS gaming is still in it's infancy but Republique has the potential of being one of many steps in the direction of iOS gaming taken more seriously
There's still other obstacles in the way, of course. The idea that games should be free or just $.99 needs to change and I'm not sure how to go about that. As I've mentioned before in this thread I believe Apple would have to take gaming more serious and no one but Apple knows if that will ever happen.
The "core gamer" stuff is rubbish, but what I quoted is dead on. Kickstarter works when it taps into an existing market not being served, but it's useless for creating new markets from scratch.
Ignis Fatuus
Banned
You yourself admitted that you're a small minority. Even Dreams-Vision, the loudest evangelist at the beginning, saw the writing on the wall. The proof is in the pudding. When your life savings are on the line, you ignore these warnings at your own peril.
Funny that you would quote and approve a description of the core gamer in the same sentence that you deem the notion rubbish.
Simply astonishing that you would use these words to describe iOS.
Dog Problems
Banned
You're right, I am in the minority and the amount of people in total who see an iOS device as a legitimate gaming device is probably rather small. But it's growing as time goes by and a game like Republique has the potential to change the view of others as well as inspire other developers to do the same.
In the end, I just want to play the game and I want Ryan to do whatever it takes to get it out to the public.