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Rev controller WTF from Iwata!!!

T

ThongyDonk

Banned
New to me

Strange theory on the Rev being the controller itself, How the Frick would that work!!!!!!!

Rest indicates it won't be XBox360/PS3 level of graphics, but will no doubt be a lot of fun.



Nintendo eyes casual gamers with `Revolution'

THE GUARDIAN , LONDON
Sunday, Jul 10, 2005,Page 12

Nintendo has always been driven by a strong gaming franchise, stoically asserting that great games sell hardware, not the other way round. With long-running titles such as Mario, Zelda and Metroid under its belt, and 2 billion units sold in 20 years, the company has certainly put its money where its mouth is.

"We remain all about the game; actions speak louder than words," said Nintendo's president, Saturo Iwata, at this year's E3, where Nintendo unveiled the first details of its next generation console, the Revolution.

While Microsoft and Sony have been all teraflops and anti-aliasing in the promotion of the Xbox 360 and the PlayStation3, Nintendo has taken a more laid-back approach. Even weeks after E3, little has been revealed about the Revolution's capabilities. All the world knows is that it will have 512MB of internal Flash memory, two USB ports, built-in Wi-Fi access and will also allow users to download the company's back-catalogue of N64, SNES and NES games.

However, much of the speculation surrounding the system has been about what form the controller will take. Although Iwata has been careful not to reveal too much about the Revolution -- Nintendo is planning to release more details at the end of the year -- he has expressed reservations about the controllers gamers currently use.

"There are too many buttons and sticks on controllers for novice players, which is likely to discourage them from ever playing games at all," he says. "We want the Revolution's controller to be relevant to everybody and we really want people to feel like they want to touch and play with it."

Capturing the casual gaming market -- something Microsoft also wants to achieve -- should be an easy ride for Nintendo, which remains family-friendly in terms of content. Nowhere is this more evident than in Japan, where gaming is intrinsically rooted in the entertainment culture.

"Nintendo is very good at creating games that can appeal to the whole family," says Iwata. "There have been a lot of games created around excessive violence in the past few years and it seems to be escalating. From the business point of view, it doesn't make sense for us to follow suit.

"We cherish our hardcore gamers, but we always try to attract as many people as possible and expand the existing gaming population."

Nintendo recently unveiled its free-to-use worldwide DS Wi-Fi gaming service. The company has been sceptical about the potential of online console gaming, and Iwata still does not feel that Xbox Live is indicative of success because the number of Xbox owners playing on Xbox Live is still low.

As far as Nintendo is concerned, the future of multiplayer gaming is in Wi-Fi, not the Internet.

"If Nintendo sells 5 million DSs with Wi-Fi capabilities, then we want 5 million people to play with Wi-Fi," he said.

Nintendo is very proud of its portable wing and, as Reggie Fils-Aime, chief marketing officer of Nintendo, says: "For 16 years, Nintendo has owned the portable game space. We created it, and we're not moving out."

This has lead to speculation that the Revolution is designed to be portable, as its size and storage cradle suggest.

Nintendo's secrecy has also sparked theories that the controller is somehow contained within the Revolution -- that the machine itself is the controller.

Whatever transpires, Nintendo could use its heritage and innovation to provide gamers with an interesting alternative when the next-generation war finally arrives.
Click to expand...
 
Coul the controller be....jesus?

20.jpg


Pain is the REVOLUTION!
 
Another Revolution controller speculation thread? It'd really be nice if these actually had concrete information, instead, it's the same fumes we've been running on for months.
 
Time for someone to post that picture of a one button controller that said.. what did it say.. Win?
 
Controllers are becoming far too complex, I agree.
2 analog sticks, 4 face buttons, 2 shoulder buttons, and gyro would be perfect and is what I expect.
 
I read the topic title and thought there was new info on Rev or Rev controller.

Thank you for disappointing me. :( How about you edit "(NO NEW INFO)" in the title?
 
ThongyDonk said:
No its a new from The Guardian In the UK yesterday.
Click to expand...
The article itself may be new, yes, but the "gaming is too complicated let's aim for the casuals and have a really simple controller" theme has been repeated many a time, just with slightly different words. I'm not faulting Nintendo, obviously they're not ready to reveal exactly what makes this so different, but whatever. Don't let me rain on your parade.
 
olimario said:
Controllers are becoming far too complex, I agree.
2 analog sticks, 4 face buttons, 2 shoulder buttons, and gyro would be perfect and is what I expect.
Click to expand...

How is this less complex? lol
 
i expect it'll have as many buttons as the XB360/PS3 so as to get games ported over, or it way just go and play in its own corner and demand its own exclusive games or control style like DS type ports of games?
 
I keep telling people but no one listens. It's a ham sandwich, THAT MULTIPLIES! Now who wouldn't put their hands on that.
 
Ruzbeh said:
I read the topic title and thought there was new info on Rev or Rev controller.

Thank you for disappointing me. :( How about you edit "(NO NEW INFO)" in the title?
Click to expand...

I didn't say there was new info. I said a WTF at his comments and the stupid built in controller non sense

The article itself may be new, yes, but the "gaming is too complicated let's aim for the casuals and have a really simple controller" theme has been repeated many a time, just with slightly different words. I'm not faulting Nintendo, obviously they're not ready to reveal exactly what makes this so different, but whatever. Don't let me rain on your parade.
Click to expand...

Have they said before this way? actually being specific and sayong there is too many buttons and sticks, AND we want you to TOUCH AND PLAY WITH IT
 
El_Victor said:
Could the controller be a... penis?
Click to expand...

No, because they want to pull in non-traditional gamers like girls, who unless they are trannies, wouldn't be equipped ot play the latest games.
 
ThongyDonk said:
Have they said before this way? actually being specific and sayong there is too many buttons and sticks, AND we want you to TOUCH AND PLAY WITH IT
Click to expand...
Iwata has always said that they want something that attracts nongamers and make they go "Hey I would like to try that". Because those people are dismissing GC, PS2 and Xbox thinking it's no fun for them. So Iwata basically used different words.

And the console being a controller is a retarded idea. Nintendo confirmed the controllers are wireless. So it should be able to hook up to a TV wirelessly, and get power wirelessly (batteries? hell no fool!).
 
Wyzdom said:
How is this less complex? lol
Click to expand...

Controllers this gen already have clicks on the analog sticks, 4 shoulder buttons, black and white buttons, and a d pad on top of what I mentioned. Looks like the PS3 has even more things to fuck with on the backside.
 
what Nintendo FAILS to understand that it's NOT the controller that makes the game complex...it's the GAME DESIGN. We've already seen simple games played on current-gen controllers. Monkey Ball, Katamari, RPGs (menu driven)

Iwata no WANTA!!!!!

show_me_the_ending.gif
 
Time for someone to post that picture of a one button controller that said.. what did it say.. Win?
Click to expand...

A real Nintendo single-button controller would actually say, "COLLECT"
 
I actually had a dream about the Revolution controller around E3. I had somehow managed to get hold of a Revolution, and sat down to play it at home. But as I picked up the controller, I discovered that it was nothing more than a bowl filled with earth and some seeds. The controller was a plant. So I watered the seeds and sat down to wait for the controller to grow.
 
Ruzbeh said:
And the console being a controller is a retarded idea. Nintendo confirmed the controllers are wireless. So it should be able to hook up to a TV wirelessly, and get power wirelessly (batteries? hell no fool!).
Click to expand...

I highly doubt that the controllers will get power wirelessly. At my university there is a project to get a keyboard to be wirelessly powered and it works... but only at about a foot away from the powersource. Also, the technology uses really high frequency waves and not very many studies have been done to figure out the heath effects. It's a much bigger deal than your standard "cellphones next to your head" fear mongering.

edit: on further inspection I have no idea if you were being serious or not. Either way... it's not happening.
 
Zaxxon said:
I highly doubt that the controllers will get power wirelessly. At my university there is a project to get a keyboard to be wirelessly powered and it works... but only at about a foot away from the powersource. Also, the technology uses really high frequency waves and not very many studies have been done to figure out the heath effects. It's a much bigger deal than your standard "cellphones next to your head" fear mongering.

edit: on further inspection I have no idea if you were being serious or not. Either way... it's not happening.
Click to expand...
??

I was referring to the 'speculation' that the Revolution console (you know, the tiny box Nintendo showed at E3) would be the Revolution controller. But since Nintendo confirmed that the controllers will be wireless, and that the Revolution will connect to the TV, this is very unlikely because it will have to connect to the TV wirelessly (not possible) and get power wirelessly OR have batteries inside. I don't think batteries is possible. And like you said, wireless power is pretty much impossible. Meaning, the thought of the console actually being the controller is utterly retarded. And I would love to beat the crap out of the person who thought of it.
 
I'm almost to the point where I don't care what the controller is anymore. I'll be happy no matter what they show because the speculation will just stop heh.
 
"Touching is good, but feeling is better"
-- Iwata

"... if you just think about it, we're going to have the ability through wireless internet to download all of your great games from NES, SNES, N64. Think about it: Each of those controllers were different. How are you gonna play? That captured some the imagination of what our controller needs to be able to do, and certainly as you get into the meat of that type of innovation with the developers, their eyes truly light up because they start to imagine what's possible with that type of configuration, which is vastly different than a sheer horsepower type of game."
-- Reggie

I know it has been stated that the Rev controller won't have a touch screen, but I believe the quote regarding this is that it won't have a touch screen ~like the DS~. Instead of a touch screen, imagine a touch *panel*, haptic-enabled.

Depending on the control configuration desired, regions on an otherwise blank controller light up, representing buttons, d-pads, or analogue sticks. When these lit-up regions are touched, a simple touch sensation is delivered to your fingertips. We have some of this haptic-touch technology where I work (we make medical software), and while it is very expensive, this is because the level of force feedback we have to deliver requires surgical precision.

Nintendo, on the other hand, would have to adapt this for very simple sensations, like a button press or the slight springback of an analogue stick.

This isn't my theory, either. Other than the gyroscope, this is the theory that pops up most often. While we know the controller won't have a screen on it, this still doesn't rule out some sort of touch-interaction. And arguably the best controller mockup we've seen yet (and the only one which hasn't been flat out revealed as a fake) is simply a bare, black controller: the Rev controller before a certain configuration "lights up".

http://www.igniq.com/2005/06/revolution-controller-sans-buttons.html

Iwata has compared the revolutionary controller feature several times (usually in the context of the competition stealing their ideas) to the rumble pack, another force-feedback device. Perhaps we can consider haptic touch technology to be the ultimate refinement of the rumble pack.

Is there some reason why we shouldn't consider this the most likely possibility? Why after investing so much into touch-enabled technologies with the DS would Nintendo not try to leverage that investment and take touch to the next level? Why does Reggie compare the delight of 3rd parties seeing the DS for the first time to when they see the Rev for the first time? Why was a force-feeback company (makers of the "falcon") set up so close to the Nintendo booth during E3?

And how else is Nintendo suppose to deliever a controller that will:

1) Play all previous Nintendo consoles
2) Simplify the controller layout
3) Allow 3rd parties to port XBox360 and PS3 games to the Rev

With the ability to change the controller layout, you could also simplify the layout because you don't have to use a "one-size-fits-all" kind of scheme: every genre can have a layout custom-fit to what the game does. A 2D fighter would have a d-pad instead of an analogue stick. A FPS would have dual analogues. Simple games "for the whole family" could have really easy layouts of just one or two buttons. Likewise, most RPGs would only need two or three buttons.

And with the ability to create any kind of touchable region you wanted, developers could easily invent new, highly-specialized kinds of buttons that would be too gimmicky for a general-purpose controller but perfect for their exact game. Super Monkey Ball uses a trackball. A DJ game lights up little records (like the iPod interface) for you to "scratch" to. Online games could let you quickly switch the control to a little Blackberry-like thumb keyboard for quick text messaging. Heck, you could put little pianos or little drums on there to tap with your thumbs, or have the buttons quickly light up and move around for a crazy new kind of puzzle game.

The possibilites are endless! WTF else could the Revolution be? A controller that breaks apart and lets you piece together SNES, NES, and N64 components? Bleh!

Here's a website with some info on haptic touch and lightkey technology:

http://www.advanced-input.com/Touch_Feedback1.html
Click to expand...

How bout that? From the ign boards.
 
Ruzbeh said:
??

I was referring to the 'speculation' that the Revolution console (you know, the tiny box Nintendo showed at E3) would be the Revolution controller. But since Nintendo confirmed that the controllers will be wireless, and that the Revolution will connect to the TV, this is very unlikely because it will have to connect to the TV wirelessly (not possible) and get power wirelessly OR have batteries inside. I don't think batteries is possible. And like you said, wireless power is pretty much impossible. Meaning, the thought of the console actually being the controller is utterly retarded. And I would love to beat the crap out of the person who thought of it.
Click to expand...

Ummm.... what?

* reads again *

WHAT?

* reads again *

* steps backwards slowly *
 
ejdonk said:
"Touching is good, but feeling is better"
-- Iwata

How bout that? From the ign boards.
Click to expand...
Iwata never, ever said that. It was some little boy on nintendo forums pretending to know what Revolution was all about.
Chittagong said:
Ummm.... what?

* reads again *

WHAT?

* reads again *

* steps backwards slowly *
Click to expand...
From what ThongyDonk posted:
Nintendo's secrecy has also sparked theories that the controller is somehow contained within the Revolution -- that the machine itself is the controller.
Click to expand...
All I said was that whoever thought of that is crazy, because Nintendo confirmed the Revolution would connect to a TV and that the controller would be wireless. You can't connect to a TV wirelessly, you can't get power wirelessly either. Which means that the controller being the machine itself is a crazy, utterly ridiculous idea.

Did I make sense now?
 
ejdonk said:
I know it has been stated that the Rev controller won't have a touch screen, but I believe the quote regarding this is that it won't have a touch screen ~like the DS~. Instead of a touch screen, imagine a touch *panel*, haptic-enabled.

Depending on the control configuration desired, regions on an otherwise blank controller light up, representing buttons, d-pads, or analogue sticks. When these lit-up regions are touched, a simple touch sensation is delivered to your fingertips. We have some of this haptic-touch technology where I work (we make medical software), and while it is very expensive, this is because the level of force feedback we have to deliver requires surgical precision.

Nintendo, on the other hand, would have to adapt this for very simple sensations, like a button press or the slight springback of an analogue stick.

This isn't my theory, either. Other than the gyroscope, this is the theory that pops up most often. While we know the controller won't have a screen on it, this still doesn't rule out some sort of touch-interaction. And arguably the best controller mockup we've seen yet (and the only one which hasn't been flat out revealed as a fake) is simply a bare, black controller: the Rev controller before a certain configuration "lights up".

http://www.igniq.com/2005/06/revolu...ns-buttons.html

Iwata has compared the revolutionary controller feature several times (usually in the context of the competition stealing their ideas) to the rumble pack, another force-feedback device. Perhaps we can consider haptic touch technology to be the ultimate refinement of the rumble pack.

Is there some reason why we shouldn't consider this the most likely possibility? Why after investing so much into touch-enabled technologies with the DS would Nintendo not try to leverage that investment and take touch to the next level? Why does Reggie compare the delight of 3rd parties seeing the DS for the first time to when they see the Rev for the first time? Why was a force-feeback company (makers of the "falcon") set up so close to the Nintendo booth during E3?

And how else is Nintendo suppose to deliever a controller that will:

1) Play all previous Nintendo consoles
2) Simplify the controller layout
3) Allow 3rd parties to port XBox360 and PS3 games to the Rev

With the ability to change the controller layout, you could also simplify the layout because you don't have to use a "one-size-fits-all" kind of scheme: every genre can have a layout custom-fit to what the game does. A 2D fighter would have a d-pad instead of an analogue stick. A FPS would have dual analogues. Simple games "for the whole family" could have really easy layouts of just one or two buttons. Likewise, most RPGs would only need two or three buttons.

And with the ability to create any kind of touchable region you wanted, developers could easily invent new, highly-specialized kinds of buttons that would be too gimmicky for a general-purpose controller but perfect for their exact game. Super Monkey Ball uses a trackball. A DJ game lights up little records (like the iPod interface) for you to "scratch" to. Online games could let you quickly switch the control to a little Blackberry-like thumb keyboard for quick text messaging. Heck, you could put little pianos or little drums on there to tap with your thumbs, or have the buttons quickly light up and move around for a crazy new kind of puzzle game.

The possibilites are endless! WTF else could the Revolution be? A controller that breaks apart and lets you piece together SNES, NES, and N64 components? Bleh!

Here's a website with some info on haptic touch and lightkey technology:

http://www.advanced-input.com/Touch_Feedback1.html
Click to expand...
this is the theory i keep gravitating towards, and i like it!

from the advanced input link:

Key Advantages
• Creates the perception of touching physical buttons and switches
• Works with a wide range of touch screen sizes and technologies
• Provides fast, tactile response synchronized with sound and graphics
• Enhances usability, particularly for noisy or distracting environments
• Helps improve user performance, productivity, and safety
• Programmability can be used to further enhance usability
• Diminishes the effects of device complexity
• Generates performance and differentiation advantages

Advanced Input Systems can help Original Equipment Manufacturers heighten the level of interactivity and build a more engaging user experience with TouchSense® technology. This programmable technology by Immersion® adds tactile feedback to touch screens. And sensory-based touch screens that “touch back”, supply distinct benefits and give users a new and more satisfying experience—one that’s more interactive, engaging, intuitive, and fun.
Click to expand...
 
And with the ability to create any kind of touchable region you wanted, developers could easily invent new, highly-specialized kinds of buttons that would be too gimmicky for a general-purpose controller but perfect for their exact game. Super Monkey Ball uses a trackball. A DJ game lights up little records (like the iPod interface) for you to "scratch" to. Online games could let you quickly switch the control to a little Blackberry-like thumb keyboard for quick text messaging. Heck, you could put little pianos or little drums on there to tap with your thumbs, or have the buttons quickly light up and move around for a crazy new kind of puzzle game.

I wonder how much something like this would cost?
 
Hasn't Iwata already ruled out the controller having a touchscreen?


And aren't haptic touchscreens just normal touchscreens that vibrate when you touch them? They provide feedback for pressing something, but you still have no physical indication of the location or shape of the buttons/controllers. So a touchscreen controller like this would still mean taking your eyes off the TV screen.

Also, would they be able to detect more the 1 point of contact for multiple button presses? And shoulder-buttons/z-trigger can't really be implemented in a usable fashion.
 
Nash said:
...aren't haptic touchscreens just normal touchscreens that vibrate when you touch them? They provide feedback for pressing something, but you still have no physical indication of the location or shape of the buttons/controllers. So a touchscreen controller like this would still mean taking your eyes off the TV screen.

Also, would they be able to detect more the 1 point of contact for multiple button presses? And shoulder-buttons/z-trigger can't really be implemented in a usable fashion.
Click to expand...
and then there's battery life [for wireless].

mmm...
 
Nash said:
Hasn't Iwata already ruled out the controller having a touchscreen?
Click to expand...
If you read more closely:
I know it has been stated that the Rev controller won't have a touch screen, but I believe the quote regarding this is that it won't have a touch screen ~like the DS~. Instead of a touch screen, imagine a touch *panel*, haptic-enabled.
Click to expand...
And he did say that.
 
olimario said:
Controllers this gen already have clicks on the analog sticks, 4 shoulder buttons, black and white buttons, and a d pad on top of what I mentioned. Looks like the PS3 has even more things to fuck with on the backside.
Click to expand...

What an amazing spin! You should get a prize for that.
No, controllers don't have 4 face shoulder buttons. Only the dual shock has 4. The xbox button only has 2 (Which is the reason for the B&W buttons), The cube has 3. The way you said it, one would think all the current gen controllers have 4 face buttons + B&W buttons + 4 shoulder buttons, a D-pad and 2 analog sticks that are clickable.
What you described in you first post isn't simple either. Fact is, novice gamers probably don't know about the clickable analog sticks because they will be intimidated too soon to find out. Same with the stupid gyro you mentiond (Which is really overated. If that's the revolutionary part about the controller color me unimpressed).
A simple controller is something that LOOKS simple, but can be really complex (Like with the DS. Didn't the Splinter Cell DS review mention how COMPLEX the game was on the handheld console that was supposed to make everything more simple?). I would expect the Revolution controller to have the same basics of the PS3 and X360 controllers, so that ports would be possible, but with new stuff except that. 4 face buttons + D- pad + Analog stick (That is not clickable, but has two levels. Kind of like a pen) and maybe stuff like very strong rumble force with precision + gyro so that recoil will be possibel + the revolutionary part.
 
Neex said:
...Has to be the stupidest thing I've heard.
Click to expand...
Novice players is how he refers to people who hardly ever play games (not kidding).

I assume it's a translation problem or something.
 
Neex said:
...Has to be the stupidest thing I've heard.
Click to expand...

This topic has been discussed here before. Everytime it's come up someone has shared a story about how someone they know would not play or got frustrtated with a game because of too many buttons.

So if it's the stupidest thing you've ever heard -- it's just you.
 
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