NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
I'm sad they killed the milf off screen, personally. She was really nice to look at.
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Cyberpunkd
Member
Good article from Polygon:
www.polygon.com
Spoilers from the first three episodes. I cannot believe what I am reading:
That is so incredibly stupid and insulting to Tolkien. I am not watching this shit, get fucked Amazon, all you had to do was to make great vistas and ambiance, instead you had to fuck it up with shit plot.
Rings of Power is introducing moral grayness to a series that doesn’t need it
Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power makes the morality of Tolkien’s world more complicated, but it doesn’t actually make it better
www.polygon.com
Spoilers from the first three episodes. I cannot believe what I am reading:
The Elves knew that Sauron made or helped in making the Three, and still put them on?
That is so incredibly stupid and insulting to Tolkien. I am not watching this shit, get fucked Amazon, all you had to do was to make great vistas and ambiance, instead you had to fuck it up with shit plot.
The ghost army sweeping the battlefield in an instant like a nuke going off is probably my biggest complaint about the PJ trilogy. Many characters lack their nuance from the book, too, but they get the general point across. A few too many death fakeouts, too.
Obviously the movies are not a substitute for Tolkien, just a very good companion to LotR that manages to capture its spirit in a way that seems like an impossible task for today’s world.
Tams
Member
So, I went back on my word a bit. I watched the first two episodes via... means that won't give Amazon statistics. If I'm going to shit on this, I should at least try watching some.
Yeah, nah. Season 2 is not only unsurprisingly more of the same, but worse and doubles down in shittiness.
If you like this... well that's subjective and good for you. But if you think that a single thing about RoP is good in anyway; then you're an idiot.
Yeah, nah. Season 2 is not only unsurprisingly more of the same, but worse and doubles down in shittiness.
If you like this... well that's subjective and good for you. But if you think that a single thing about RoP is good in anyway; then you're an idiot.
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Cyberpunkd
Member
What I want to know is: Galadriel and Sauron hate fuck when? You know it’s coming.
GymWolf
Member
ManaByte
Gold Member
Tolkien's own words from Letter 154:
“Some reviewers have called the whole thing simple-minded, just a plain fight between Good and Evil, with all the good just good, and the bad just bad. Pardonable, perhaps (though at least Boromir has been overlooked) in people in a hurry, and with only a fragment to read, and, of course, without the earlier written but unpublished Elvish histories. But the Elves are not wholly good or in the right. Not so much because they had flirted with Sauron; as because with or without his assistance they were 'embalmers’.
They wanted to have their cake and eat it: to live in the mortal historical Middle-earth because they had become fond of it (and perhaps because they there had the advantages of a superior caste), and so tried to stop its change and history, stop its growth, keep it as a pleasaunce, even largely a desert, where they could be 'artists' - and they were overburdened with sadness and nostalgic regret.
In their way the Men of Gondor were similar: a withering people whose only 'hallows' were their tombs. But in any case this is a tale about a war, and if war is allowed (at least as a topic and a setting) it is not much good complaining that all the people on one side are against those on the other. Not that I have made even this issue quite so simple: there are Saruman, and Denethor, and Boromir; and there are treacheries and strife even among the Orcs.” -J.R.R. Tolkien, Letter 154
Cyberpunkd
Member
Interesting take, I could imagine Tolkien's Christianity might have also played a role as well: Elves are not mortal, thus they are not pressed to live their lives to the fullest as Men are.
Buying his letters right now, thanks.
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NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
Letters is great but kinda sad. You see a man who has a lot of hopes, a lot of disappointments. There is a growing realization he is never going to finish hos work
Tams
Member
The whole thing is gaudy and poorly produced.
That's because the show writers expect them to behave more like elected politicians than a sovereign class. Hollywood only really knows 2 types of royalty. The horrendous oppressor/abuser tyrant or the noble totally self sacrificing type. Rarely anything inbetween.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
I think you can see the money in the sets and effects. Costumes look weak at times. Especially armor.
There is a bot of art to making fantasy stuff look good on screen but there is no excuse for this show, they could have made all the sets and outfits FOR REAL with their budget and years of production time.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
When you watch the LOTR behind the scenes and see that WETA made real chain mail and real swords. And you can see the armor shirts in this.
Tams
Member
The sets look like sets, and the effects like effects. That's rarely a good thing.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
They are nice sets. You can tell it is a sound stage. But it looks nice.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
I finished episode 2.
I think they miss things or they are not in my head the way the show does them. I always thought Sauron learned from Celebrimbor, and then went and smithed the rings on his own. He didn't work with him to make all the rings. And in my head the elves did not make their rings until after the rings for men and dwarves were made.
I think they miss things or they are not in my head the way the show does them. I always thought Sauron learned from Celebrimbor, and then went and smithed the rings on his own. He didn't work with him to make all the rings. And in my head the elves did not make their rings until after the rings for men and dwarves were made.
Melon Husk
Member
Mind blown. So there's nuance in the good vs. evil we didn't get to see in LOTR.
There should be a TV series expanding on this subject. I want to see that show!
Jokes aside, the first half of episode 1 was kinda good. After 30 minutes I lost interest. Pacing is a big problem, I think 30 minute episodes could counterbalance the slowness. 7/10 because the good bits were flashbacks that should have been part of season 1. Ensemble cast, multiple subplots AND non-linear storytelling? LOST made it all work but in RoP it leaves me annoyed and confused.
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Insane Metal
Member
I enjoyed the first 3 episodes, apart from the orc baby scene. That was show-abandoningly bad.
Cyberpunkd
Member
I was watching Ep. 1 with one eye during Diablo 4 run on a Steamdeck, I almost puked when I saw Gil-Galad singing, immediately reminded me of "The Power of Many" BS.
Ulysses 31
Member
'The Lord Of The Rings: The Rings Of Power' Season 2 Premiere Viewership Reportedly Suffers Nearly 50% Decline From Season 1
The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power Season 2 premiere reportedly suffered a nearly 50% decline in viewership compared to its Season 1 premiere.
thatparkplace.com
Kacho
Gold Member
Not surprised at all. The show isn’t generating the same amount of hate-discussion this time. People have accepted the show sucks and moved on.'The Lord Of The Rings: The Rings Of Power' Season 2 Premiere Viewership Reportedly Suffers Nearly 50% Decline From Season 1
The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power Season 2 premiere reportedly suffered a nearly 50% decline in viewership compared to its Season 1 premiere.
And they're committed to THREE MORE YEARS! Wonder if we will see a showrunner shake up, faith in their course and carry on, or some more quiet retooling, lots of PR spin, and fingers crossed for season 3.'The Lord Of The Rings: The Rings Of Power' Season 2 Premiere Viewership Reportedly Suffers Nearly 50% Decline From Season 1
The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power Season 2 premiere reportedly suffered a nearly 50% decline in viewership compared to its Season 1 premiere.
You can find lots of issues with the show, but I can point to some VERY obvious signs that "this ain't the LOTR you wanted" they could have EASILY side-stepped. Just a colossal misunderstanding of the IP, the audience, and woefully inexperienced team.
Kacho
Gold Member
That’s what I don’t get. How do they not have someone there to nitpick the script? Anyone with a basic understanding of Tolkien would be able to point out the very obvious issues.
A DJ on our local rock station was talking about Rings of Power the other morning. Said they fell asleep watching the new season. Great word of mouth.
NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
They had someone. He quit over the changes they wanted to make.
Ulysses 31
Member
I thought they kicked Tom Shippey out over some interview he gave?
Artoris
Gold Member
She looks like she is flying a broom stickImagine having an erection while she look at you like this
NecrosaroIII
Ultimate DQ Fan
I can't remember exactly, but I guess my point was they had some one and they parted ways over creative differences.
I always thought that after Helm's Deep Jackson just treated battle scenes like a table-top recreation that exists in a separate reality from the rest of the movies.
In the Hobbit EEs battle becomes literal Warhammer too (but in the worst way possible).
But yea most of the battle of Pelennor Fields was a big middle finger to fans of source material. It had none of the tension, the CG was mostly awful, the super Legolas stunts and then it culminated in the ghost thing. The only reason it's not remembered as awfully as The Battle of Five armies is that we get character moments that actually do pay proper homage to the books (or even the original scenes that - somehow isn't Jackson flipping off the script in literal scenes and manages to work well in context).
But well - ROP combat shown so far is skirmishes of 20 people on each side, they don't have any actual battles, so it's hard to compare. Although we do get super-elf stuff so Jackson cemented that well and good into zeitgeist.
It's not wild when you consider they made Isildur an adult around 2-3 thousand years before he was supposed to be born.
Taken at face value - the show has enough time-dilation that by the time the Battle of Last Alliance happens - Aragorn should be at least a teenager already (And Bilbo would be getting the visit from Gandalf about a year later).
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Trelane
Member
You know, most of the controversy could have been avoided had they just made their own story with their own characters and left the established characters and lore alone. I mean, they're going to make up their own stories anyways, and that would give them so much more creative freedom to do whatever they wanted. I mean, they're going to do whatever they want anyways, but it would be nice if they didn't defecate all over someone else's hard work to do it.
Trouble is you can't market original characters like you can the ones everyone knows from LOTR.
That's why we get cheap shots like Handsome Sauron, Joan of Galadriel and Sexy Shelob.
And yes I fully believe these are now officially part of the same canon universe - and we WILL get to see that triangle.
Patrick... JD - I'm only watching your abomination of a show to see this happen live-action on screen - so you BETTER not let me down.
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Unknown Soldier
Member
The nonexistent "modern audience" keeps not showing up huh'The Lord Of The Rings: The Rings Of Power' Season 2 Premiere Viewership Reportedly Suffers Nearly 50% Decline From Season 1
The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power Season 2 premiere reportedly suffered a nearly 50% decline in viewership compared to its Season 1 premiere.
I wonder if it's because the "modern audience" actually doesn't exist?
ThatStupidLion
Member
Turned off s2e1 halfwayish thru.
Started to second screen and then just decided itd be better to go to sleep than faux listen to this crud
Started to second screen and then just decided itd be better to go to sleep than faux listen to this crud
thegame983
Member
Here's a bold idea.
Don't make any more LOTR stuff. You don't have the talent you fucking hacks.
Don't make any more LOTR stuff. You don't have the talent you fucking hacks.
There are DOZENS of fairly well known and respected fantasy IPs they could have used, and the ENTIRE thing, several seasons of show included, wouldn't have cost just what the RIGHTS to the appendices cost Amazon.
Oberstein
Member
Ep.4 Goodness...
"Get me Sauron's manager!!!"
Well, this episode isn't great at all. There are a few interesting elements in the batch, but overall almost everything is filler. The Rhûn arc is really bad, especially by adding Harfoots and other cousin that are irrelevant in this great story of Sauron which is the intended main plot. We don't need
The Filler (Estrid, the Harfoots, etc.) is a constant departure from interesting storylines. Even the appearance of
can't hide the factual errors of Tolkien's lore. I've tried to defend the show so far, but this episode doesn't help. I still love the aesthetics, but they need to fire the writers and dialogue artists. It's just not possible anymore.
Too many storylines, too many underdeveloped characters, irritating fan service and elves that don't look like elves. AND it pains me to say it, especially after seeing Ben Daniels' very good performance as Cirdan. Here, the elves look like human clods with pointy ears. Is this their elite elf?!
I'm going to wait for the climax, which will be episode 6
, but my interest has already faded.
They almost managed to make a Karen Ent.
Well, this episode isn't great at all. There are a few interesting elements in the batch, but overall almost everything is filler. The Rhûn arc is really bad, especially by adding Harfoots and other cousin that are irrelevant in this great story of Sauron which is the intended main plot. We don't need
the origin of the Shire in this season.
The Filler (Estrid, the Harfoots, etc.) is a constant departure from interesting storylines. Even the appearance of
Tom Bombadil
Too many storylines, too many underdeveloped characters, irritating fan service and elves that don't look like elves. AND it pains me to say it, especially after seeing Ben Daniels' very good performance as Cirdan. Here, the elves look like human clods with pointy ears. Is this their elite elf?!
I'm going to wait for the climax, which will be episode 6
with the attack on Eregion
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Ammogeddon
Member
But you can guarantee the blue hair brigade and media would be up in arms if it was cancelled. I’m sure they’d put a petition together.
Toytown Assassin
Member
This episode is insultingly bad and deeply retarded.
ZehDon
Member
Worth remembering how they got to this point. Season 1 was literally the most expensive show ever made, based off of one of the greatest artistic works in human history, so it pulled in a lot of people. Less than a third bothered to finish it. However, Season 2 was into production before Season 1 had finished airing, so this is basically Season 1 Part 2. They never had a chance to course correct.
Seeing as the show is being slammed from basically everyone, and the viewers just aren't bothering, end of Season viewership numbers are going to be abysmal. Given the money Amazon is burning, we're going to see some major departures before Season 3. The actors will be locked in with iron clad contracts given the commitment Amazon had to make to get the rights, so I doubt they'll be running away. But the show runners, writers, and creatives? And the show's budget? I'd expect a bloodbath before Season 3 gets underway. You don't burn billions of dollars of Bezos' money, embarrass him personally, and walk away.
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Toytown Assassin
Member
They said something along the lines that it made sense to them that the world they are making should reflect the modern world. So that's what you get no matter how retarded it is. Everywhere is like a multicultural city. They could've easily had diverse casting by making the halfoots brown skinned and the stoors and other desert people black but no fuck logic everywhere has to be multicultural.
The only way that even starts to make any kind of sense over any sort of time period is if all of these people are so racist that there is never any interracial relationships as they all hate each other so much. I somehow doubt that is the message they are going for though.
All of that is the least of the show's problems though.
Kacho
Gold Member
Even if they hypothetically fixed all of the show’s issues people aren’t coming back. You get one chance to capture an audience and when you miss there’s really no way to undo that. Rings of Power is tainted beyond repair.