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Rumor claims RDNA2 build for Microsoft
- Thread starter darkinstinct
- Start date
- Rumor Clickbait Cringe
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splattered
Member
Hmmm maybe ps5 has software RT "accelerated" by their super fast SSD technology haha
Metroiddarks
Member
It is a nonsense is in the same level of stupidity when they say RNDA was only for Playstation. All this are just fanboys of each company believing its favorite company is invincible.
Panaphonics
Banned
Why didn’t he say then it’s based on and nextgen architecture or it’s based on RDNA (2.0)?
maybe it’s not based on that but on a custom Sony own implementation?
ZywyPL
Banned
Apparently not xD
replicant-
Member
Could it be possible for Sony to have an off-chip solution to RT?
I've been wondering how they will approach RT. MS luckily enough has DX RT which is their baby and being used on PC.
I've been wondering how they will approach RT. MS luckily enough has DX RT which is their baby and being used on PC.
RT must use shader pipeline. There's no way to color pixels otherwise. I don't think it can go off chip.
If we look at the NV solution it has only two hw components AFAIK: ray intersection ffp and ray coherency optimizer. All other parts of the pipeline are in pure software.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
Well if RDNA2 is heavily tied to DXR it may mean AMD are designing there RT hardware which is tailor made for DXR at a hardware level will give them an advantage against RTX. SONY would not need these hardware DXR implementations because Sony don't use DXR.
D
Deleted member 775630
Unconfirmed Member
Could be the case, but I can't imagine that AMD would go for that. I would imagine that they are very open when it comes to their GPU and don't necessarily tie everything in to DirectX. We'll know tomorrow.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
I think it's more likely they have it on die, e.g they will have a customized. RDNA1 clusters, 2 zen2 clusters and some RT hardware
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Shader based raytracing acceleration is not software raytracing. Software raytracing would happen on the CPU.
replicant-
Member
Thanks. With their own propriety API?
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
They have to. Right now the only raytracing API is DirectX Raytracing. It's just now ported to Vulkan by the Khronos Group and Microsoft.
llien
Banned
A kind reminder:
www.forbes.com
Sources: AMD Created Navi For Sony's PlayStation 5, Vega Suffered
Sources reveal not only that the PS5 uses Navi graphics, but nearly 2/3 of AMD's engineering resources were devoted to the task.
www.forbes.com
Pallas
Member
A kind reminder:
Sources: AMD Created Navi For Sony's PlayStation 5, Vega Suffered
Sources reveal not only that the PS5 uses Navi graphics, but nearly 2/3 of AMD's engineering resources were devoted to the task.
Wasn’t that back then when certain Gaf posters were claiming or speculating that Navi was also exclusive to Sony’s next gen console?
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Yeah, but now that RDNA2 exists it looks like they don't want it anymore.
llien
Banned
When I think about it, imagine you are AMD.
Two arch-rivals approach you to develop for them, what will you do?
Probably have two completely disconnected teams working on respective 'semi-customs'.
Now, what kind of questions are NOT OK to ask?
"Hey AMD, what semi custom are you doing for my competitor" I guess.
But, what kind of questions are OK to ask?
"Hey AMD, what kind of new Tech is on the horizon for us to use in upcoming consoles?"
AMD's R&D annual budget is $1.2-1.6 billion. I think it's too expensive for Sony or Microsoft to afford having entire architecture exclusively to themselves. I don't recall where I read it, but the budgets the two had were said to be about 200-300 million for "semi custom" efforts (including process node bumps).
So, major architectural development will be shared by both, separate semi-custom teams could do relatively minor (compared to full blown new arch) customization (e.g. two mem buses for PS4, "onion" and "garlic" vs that strange memory config Microsoft used).
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Who knows, if you use the resulting chips in enough devices it might be feasible. But you made a point, it's expensive. So if Sony decided in 2017 to launch in 2019, there would have been only one technology available, RDNA1. So they would've spent 200 million on that. And the resulting Ariel APU reflects that, it's RDNA1 (Navi10). Would at the point where they decided to go for 2020 instead they have spent another 200 million for another architecture? That's a lot of wasted money. I think they just continued with what they had and upped the clock speeds to get the most out of it.
nikolino840
Member
But Sony don't have the PC market with API or games
Amd Is behind schedule with raytracing against Nvidia that already use dxr for raytracing
For now we don't know if it's only for Xbox and PC so we see in a couple of months
llien
Banned
I think you are misreading it.
After decades of research, NV thought it was a good time to try it.
Microsoft supported it by giving a blessing to actual DirectX API.
If AMD has learned anything about DXR prior to that announcement, it would more likely be a friendly leak,than some sort of agreed schedule to do RT (where did you even get this idea?)
demigod
Member
Man, what is this crap as usual from darkinstinct?
AMD Has Its Own Ray-Tracing Technology
AMD announced widened support for Radeon Rays, its GPU accelerated ray-tracing developer software.
Pallas
Member
I get that but a while back the popular theory was that Navi would be exclusive to the PS5, it was pushed pretty hard by certain posters. This kind of reminds me of that, I hope both consoles are as beefy as they can be within affordable expectations.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
This is kinda my thinking as well. Oberon's gotten plenty of steppings since the first one, it's possible they could have added in more RDNA2 features with other versions of the steppings, probably even stuff like more CU units (E0 doesn't actually mention the CU count).
However usually with iteration of chips that different, they get full revisions, not steppings. But I do think PS5 will have at least some RDNA2 features built into it. The question would be how many; if their chip is smaller than XSX's and the features are hardware-dependent you can't fit the same amount on a smaller chip.
So I can see a situation where PS5 has less RDNA2 features via hardware than XSX but maybe it's possible to simulate some of the others through software solutions with as low a penalty hit as possible on cycle timings and resources. I'm just guessing here however. If the whole thing about Navi being made for PS5 is true (keep in mind at that time Navi was used interchangeably with RDNA1), then it's maybe possible this thing with RDNA2 and MS is also true, but I personally don't think either is true honestly.
Oh well, we'll find out tomorrow what's really what (and hopefully some other info to boot).
Tripolygon
Banned
You have no idea what you are talking about. Vulkan Ray Tracing was worked on by Nvidia, AMD and Intel with Nvidia contributing more than the others. Microsoft had nothing to do with it. Plus its been available to developers since 2018 same year as Turing was released.
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darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
llien
Banned
There is no Vulkan RT, there is NVs proprietary extension on Vulkan. (VK_NV_)
Tripolygon
Banned
Ok? They used Microsoft's open-source DXC compiler via SpirV to translate HLSL to Vulkan. Microsoft did not work on it. It was entirely done by Nvidia with contributions to the extension from Intel and AMD.
Tripolygon
Banned
Should be pretty obvious that's what i was talking about since i emphasized Nvidia and Turing architecture in my reply.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
They will likely use an updated version of the PS4 API.
llien
Banned
It's pretty obvious you either don't understand the difference between NV's proprietary extensions and "Vulkan RT" or are trying to mislead people.
DXR is an actual vendor neutral standard for RT-ing.
There is no analogy on Vulkan.
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
It was just confirmed in the AMD meeting, RDNA2 raytracing was co-engineered with Microsoft.
ethomaz
Banned
Fake rumor.
AMD confirmed that Microsoft DXR 1.1 API (the new version of the API) was co-developed by them.
RDNA 2 is developed by AMD only.
They confirmed RDNA 2 is 7nm (not 7nm+) and power the two next-gen consoles (PS5 and Xbox One Series X).
AMD confirmed that Microsoft DXR 1.1 API (the new version of the API) was co-developed by them.
RDNA 2 is developed by AMD only.
They confirmed RDNA 2 is 7nm (not 7nm+) and power the two next-gen consoles (PS5 and Xbox One Series X).
Nope.
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it_wasn't_me
Banned
Hello. I'm Mark Cerny. PS5 has his own API, so, we developed our own RT solution for PS5. Who gives a shit about MS.
01011001
Banned
well to be fair, co-developing the API will most likely have indirectly influenced RDNA2's development.
if you work together closely on the software side that can also mean results of that work can change how the hardware is designed.
but it's not like even if it was fully co-developed with MS that it would be unavailable to Sony, it's not like Microsoft can't use Bluray just because Sony co-developed it.
Agnostic2020
Member
Just stop making a fool out of yourself. They were talking about the api software lol.
ethomaz
Banned
All DirectX are co-developed by vender hardware.
DXR 1.0 co-developed by nVidia to support RTX.
DRX 1.1 co-developed by AMD to support RDNA 2.
I thought you know that at least.
You can't make an API without the vendor hardware help.
Let's think a bit about... do you believe PS5's API is being co-developed with AMD?
BTW Sony won't use DXR.
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01011001
Banned
you don't know how close they worked together on this.
just saying that it could have influenced RDNA2.
which in the end is not really affecting anything but I'm just saying it could have
remember how developers influenced how the PS4/One and the Switch were designed in their final form... with some pushing for more ram etc.
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Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
RDNA2 was developed by AMD and Microsoft. Hmm. Didnt know that. There may be some weight behind this story. Watching the AMD conference now.
ethomaz
Banned
You did not know because it was not lol
He is trying to fool you.
DXR 1.1 API was co-developed by AMD and Microsofy.
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Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
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ethomaz
Banned
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Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
I just saw it. I understand it now. Again, not too much of a techie. Still learning. I know this tho; 12tf > 9tf.
ethomaz
Banned
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
"So wether it's PC or mobile or one of these consoles - 2020 is going to be exciting". LOL.
Tripolygon
Banned
DXR is a vendor neutral API from Microsoft. Vulkan does not have a standard yet but it is being worked on. In the mean time IMG Tech has their extension for RT on Vulkan and Nvidia released their extension which was contributed to by both Intel and AMD, they are all trying to create a standard Vulkan RT solution that is cross Vendor. Read the freaking Vulkan 1.1.133 specifications.
Let Nvidia developer tell you himself how they are trying to bring RT to Vulkan in a cross vendor way.
I don't try to mislead people, only to inform and call out BS.
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Vroadstar
Member
Poor darkinstinct, it's ok, the battle is lost but the war is not yet over, take the L as there is still the TF war to move on to.
alabtrosMyster
Member
Because there are direct x drivers for some hardware feature doesn't mean it has no use for equivalent functions on other APIs. MS pulled the same disingenuous strategy when they alluded that only the xbox one could use mega textures because DX 12 + esram.
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