NX boxart leaked, new name confirmed. Nintendo Polystation is the future with over 1,000 games to play!!
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RUMOR: NX more powerful than PS4, Splatoon/Mario Maker ports in development
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NX boxart leaked, new name confirmed. Nintendo Polystation is the future with over 1,000 games to play!!
interesting. So why is the current conversation About the cartridge patent? Lolol
LegendofLex
Member
Unless that different format allows the addressable market for many (not all) games to be larger since it can include users on both the console and handheld.
Even bigger, but the cost of the actual card increases with storage size.
There a quite a few posts that explain why it wont nessecarily be more expensive.
Although Id love to see carts, I think theyd be a hard sell for Nintendo.
Dark Cloud
Member
Yeah, why is everybody talking about cartridges so much?
Over half the games I posted were well out of launch. On top of the fact I didn't even begin to scratch the surface of all the games they have released and left out several devs.
There was a cartridge patent?
Fury nano variation would line up with WSJ cutting edge chips rumor... hmm...
I hope 10k source is correct and we are looking at a modified fury nano on a 14nm process with some Polaris features, with 8gb of gddr5 instead of 4gb hbm.
And somehow AMD got BOM down to $100ish or less for Nintendo for gpu. Fury nano idle power consumption is extremely impressive at 10-12 watts. Downclock to keep gpu power draw at 100w max load. Downclocked FX 6300 for cpu for sub 50w power consumption on cpu side. 4gb of separate system ddr3 ram.
It should be possible to keep total power consumption under 150watts with some slight tweaking to basically off the shelf parts.
Downclocked FX 6300 would line up with LCGEEKs cpu specs?
Because it's more fun than speculating whether the GPU will be 2.5% slower or 7.5% faster than the PS4.
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
Nostalgic heartache combined with utter delusion.
DownGrader
Member
NX boxart leaked, new name confirmed. Nintendo Polystation is the future with over 1,000 games to play!!
Heck yes, Namco third-party support.
We got back on it when someone started talking about the lack of a disc drive again.
I would prefer if they used the extra space for a 2.5" HDD/SSD slot.
I've got a USB drive hooked up to my WiiU and it's held with elastic bands to the console, not very pretty but keeps things together. Would be nice if it's hidden on the NX.
Interfectum
Member
DS4 NX exclusive??
Yeah, and it's not because they have to use carts, Wich was the original point.
Cards to me are a great solution for retailers and just how game revenues are moved around and charged back.
I wonder if it fits that NFC patent.
Skittzo0413
Member
That may have been my fault-
We were doing the regular power speculation song and dance, and I was curious to see how much money can be saved on the console BOM by removing a disc drive and possibly removing/downsizing a hard drive, and speculating that if they go that route they can use those savings to cover the price of a relatively costly GPU.
I'm willing to believe that 10k's source isn't completely bullshitting, but that we don't have the full picture of what this "polaris/fiji" chip is or what it can handle. And I'm betting that Emily's tweet had more to do with dozens of pages in this thread assuming that 10k's source was explicitly saying "Polaris 14nm!!", so Emily wanted to clarify that a Polaris 14nm chip is unlikely.
If there is a relatively high end GPU in the console, then they can potentially keep the MSRP low by removing the disc drive/HDD, which is how we are where we are now!
Also I don't believe there is a cartridge patent, though feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
It's not feasible at all. It wouldn't be ROM anymore at that point, and it would force them to use a DRM of some sort. No used games. This part of the idea just isn't something that's likely to happen. I also mentioned the business strategy stuff, but it's obvious that this doesn't matter to anyone and you guys just want cartridges back. Meanwhile, I'm the only biased one here...
I believe this was one of the excuses for their memory cards, not their game cards. And testing proved Vita memory cards are slower than lower cost class 10 micro SD cards anyway.
Not quite, 3DS cards use sonething called Nbit XtraROM. 3DS game cards still include some EEPROM for saves though.
Presumably Vita uses the same thing but I've also heard it just uses EEPROM and patitions a set amount for on card saves.
Doesn't XB1 have mandatory installs for games? So you're basically running off the hard drive anyway? Yeah card would be faster than a normal HD, but HD is usually faster than disc, no?
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
Again he takes the fact of smaller logistics to cut cost into account.
At best his numbers are
So AT BEST your looking at $1.67 increase from $2.24 to $3.91.
That's not even counting the fact that he is going off of 3ds base numbers.
He's not even basing that # on higher capacity cards that would be needed. Plus they need to be faster since you'd be dealing with a fuck ton more data.
Skittzo0413
Member
Oh, well like I said I have no idea how feasible it was but I thought it was worth discussing. Cartridges as a whole though is not a crazy concept, and I'm very convinced that Nintendo at the very least discussed the potential of removing the disc drive in favor of a cartridge slot(s) when discussing the NX hardware.
The potential benefits are just too great to ignore- even if they don't end up going in that direction it's certainly worth considering. Also I don't think anyone has made a persuasive case of this being an explicitly bad business decision. So what if it costs about $2 per 64GB cart? N64 had $55 carts and STILL had WAY more third party games than Wii U. Nintendo can offer to reduce their royalties, or otherwise eat some of that cost, but I don't see how $2 is prohibitively expensive, even assuming if the cost is as high as $2.
This is very true!
It's a good point because this is all about cost. We're all speculating about cartridges vs. discs, and I'm all for cartridges, but it has to be compelling pricewise. That said, there are things Nintendo can do to "eat" the difference. They could charge publishers less money to allow these games on their system, for instance. With a range of cartridge costs based on game size, depending on the type of game, it could be cheaper for the game developer overall. (Costing them a little more for very large games...which, in most of those cases, developers WANT their game on as many devices as possible to make money from sheer volume of sales.) So, if Nintendo's fee is $10 to put a game on their system now, but they lower that for NX to $7, that'd help a great deal. Then, if a 8 GB cartridge costs only $1, but a 64 GB costs $2.50, the smaller cartridges could end up being a cost savings for game developers compared to discs (maybe even compared to publishing with Microsoft and Sony, thus incentivizing 3rd parties back to the system).
That said, I know nothing. For all I know publishers only really care about the publishing fees while Nintendo (or Sony/Microsoft) have to figure out all the manufacturing costs. But, regardless, there ARE other costs out there and potential ways of handling them to make cartridges attractive.
My only real concern is what to do about developers releasing incomplete games, or at least games requiring a huge patch from the get-go. The console could have a small flash hard drive to handle downloading and installing the patch into the cartridge...but, what if they are read-only? Making them read/write seems to be begging for piracy problems! Also, was the developer expecting to do a huge patch? If not, then a big uh-oh if they didn't have the game printed on a big enough cartridge in the first place. That's my only real problem, and it seems that there has to be some sort of hard drive around anyways to help out these problems.
(I really think cartridges would be great!)
Dark Cloud
Member
Nintendo is the type of company that would go back to cartridges. Come on this is Nintendo. They always do something different every gen and I love them for that. I hope they go to cartridges to be different and unique. There are lots of positives too from reading this latest discussion.
They could still do the haptic feedback, the AR, holograms. Who knows at this point.
They could still do the haptic feedback, the AR, holograms. Who knows at this point.
AFAIK the PS4 does too, I'm constant hitting storage walls.
Alebrije
Member
NX boxart leaked, new name confirmed. Nintendo Polystation is the future with over 1,000 games to play!!
At this point this seems more reliable
At this point this seems more reliable
The Nintater.
Proelite
Member
If Vegas had bets for NX TDP, I'll put my life savings on a console less than 100W TDP.
Let's say there is a $2.5 loss per game. At an average of 10 games sold per sold console. Nintendo could easily foot the bill if they wanted. They will save a lot by excluding the disc drive (cost) as well as repairs (for malfunctioning discdrives). They could also keep the console (thus the packaging for the console) smaller and again save on stocking and shipping there. Also the use of cards might eliminate the need for installs (as often with discs) and cut down on the internal storage too.
Skittzo0413
Member
I really doubt they would completely ditch a hard drive (or SSD), since that would make it impossible for Nintendo to do any OS updates. In my hypothetical scenario, I'm thinking they would cut out the disc drive and stay with a very small and cheap HDD, something around 64gb or 128gb max, maybe with some of that reserved for OS updates. At this point I'm willing to bet such small HDDs are pretty cheap to include.
Why do people like you speak in absolutes as if you are experts or can see the future lol?
It's funny and unfortunate at the same time.
Oh and confirmation bias.
10k says a source the power of NX is better than the PS4 and we got a select few thinking NX will be as strong as PS4K. Now Rogers comes along and says the specs are "good" and that is being taken a gospel as a bad thing by a few. Even going as far to say below XB1.
At this point this seems more reliable
You cannot change the goodness of the potato, for it represents perseverence.
The main point that I'm trying to get across is that it's still going to need an HDD. The ~$3 additional cost (after factoring in making it re-writable and the higher capacities) is a difficult problem to explain, so I gave up on that one. Basically, it could cost them billions over the next few years if the console and handheld are both successful. Business don't just consider unit costs. The way around this is with a heavy digital push, which requires an HDD, which kills the "no moving parts" argument and reduces he potential savings on the hardware.
I see no reason not to beat PS4, unless Nintendo is going for that lpddr ram that goes in 6 GB increments and chooses 6 over 12. That'd be the only way to go underspecced on RAM. For CPU/GPU, if they go with x86 as the rumors seem to be leaning, it would be hard for them to get something weaker in 2016, unless they just ordered the same chip as PS4 or X1.
I still say this thing NEEDS a second screen. How would you port Splatoon 1 otherwise? Especially having cross-compatible play on a level playing field (unless you just make people use the Gamepad, separately bought, but that will cut your audience drastically and defeat the purpose). Otherwise the gamepad users would be at an advantage if they tried to soft-emulate the touchscreen for superjumping by having the users scroll through a list of allies, the spawn point, or beacons.
And a Mario Maker port would go right out the window.
I still say this thing NEEDS a second screen. How would you port Splatoon 1 otherwise? Especially having cross-compatible play on a level playing field (unless you just make people use the Gamepad, separately bought, but that will cut your audience drastically and defeat the purpose). Otherwise the gamepad users would be at an advantage if they tried to soft-emulate the touchscreen for superjumping by having the users scroll through a list of allies, the spawn point, or beacons.
And a Mario Maker port would go right out the window.
SSD and Flash memory options do exist. As well as what the wiiU and Xbox One currently do allowing external drives (my personal favorite solution)
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Why in the world would they do that? That doesn't make any sense.
Why would they say anything at all regarding rumors on neogaf? It doesn't make any sense anyone at Nintendo told Emily anything...
What happened?
Of course, but they're too expensive to make sense for such a strategy right now. Maybe in a $400 SKU with a 500GB SSD vs a basic model for $300, but would something like that actually happen?
lmao
Just speculating re Emily's comments saying 10ks sources are wrong about gimmick and power level.
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
Because it's common sense. You only think it's confirmation bias because it's something you don't want to hear. And 'people like me' are perfectly qualified to talk about trends in the industry.
Please tell me, in what world, when Nintendo's relevancy in the home console space is the worst it's ever been, does it make sense for them to release a console at a premium price? It's not as if they've just come off the back of a killer generation like Sony had with the PS2.
Herb Alpert
Banned
Skittzo0413
Member
Again I certainly understand the need for a HDD or at least SSD or flash, specifically because the NX OS would need space for inevitable updates. Also third parties love their day 1 patches and DLC, so yeah, of course you'd need at least a small amount of space. I'm mainly saying that by removing the optical drive and keeping the storage low (like, less than 500gb or 1tb) they can save money on the BOM that can be used on a beefier GPU, or that can be used to just make the console MSRP cheaper.
No moving parts is nice, I built my laptop for just that, but that's not exactly what I'm arguing here.
Fair enough.
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