The first one was almost an outlier. It was an event for Nintendo fans "omg Metroid is back in 3D". We've seen since that there was a general drop off between the one time consumer and the dedicated consumer. Granted, maybe the games could have been designed differently and garnished more excitement.
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RUMOR: NX more powerful than PS4, Splatoon/Mario Maker ports in development
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The first one was almost an outlier. It was an event for Nintendo fans "omg Metroid is back in 3D". We've seen since that there was a general drop off between the one time consumer and the dedicated consumer. Granted, maybe the games could have been designed differently and garnished more excitement.
Dark Cloud
Member
I don't want Dark Souls type of Metroid games. They should be exactly as they are, but they need to be marketed more and better. The Prime series should've sold way more.
Schnozberry
Member
There was a bit of series fatigue at that point as well. The Prime games were brilliant but a worn concept at that point. You touched on it as well, but there were more original concepts on other platforms targeting the same gamers.
Did I say anything about making Metroid like Dark Souls? No because that's fucking absurd, I said those are the gamers that they need to be advertising and marketing to.
It doesn't have to be deliberate bs to not be true or independent. Big red flag when someone sits there for 10 posts about how they are going to post some information and is getting verified and then...it's the same information as 5 days ago. Why all the drama? There's nothing specific or new. It's the same vague stuff. That's a red flag.
My take is this is not a new source of rumors. Also these latest rumors we've heard regarding ports and power are vague enough to mean anything. We still haven't heard any good dirt on the NX.
If a helper character like that is a basic part of the design, "getting lost" is not a thing that the developer will intend to happen to begin with.
The more you signpost players, the more linear the game is going to be at a basic level. No thanks.
Spieler Eins
Member
Nintendo is a platform holder, not a random 3rd party software provider. As a platform holder they need to keep all kinds of gamers and niches happy. 1-2 million people is big enough of a group to be important for a platform holder. In particular when it's core gamers, which are the foundation of every successful console - including the Wii in the beginning. Maybe as a 3rd party you can piss off most of your fanbases and do nothing but tired 2D platformers and minigames that ,,sell best". But not as a platform holder. Otherwise you'll end up with the WiiU. I.e. a terribly monotone library which was rightfully rejected by everyone on the market except the most hardcore of the core Nintendo enthusiasts. That's why Sony is smart banking on things like TLG and Bloodborne whenever the time is right, even though it's not gonna be a calladuty-level hit. On the other hand, shitting on fans of Metroid or other core series because ,,it only sold 1,5 mil" and not even providing proper equivalencies for them is dumb and shortsighted.
Dark Cloud
Member
Hmm. That's fine then.
Everything could have been more popular.
That's not necessarily true. The introduction of a babby mode allows for the base game to be that much more difficult.
edit: each game in the MP franchise has sold around the same or more than Demons Souls.
Well obviously gamers didn't find MP3 impressive enough to buy more than 1.8 million copies of it worldwide.
His opinion is that i can be that no zelda or mario come to nx... <-- which is the same kind of % that uncharted 4 will be released to NX... (yes i know it's Sony dev, i think i made my point).
If he didn't played uncharted, how do he even knows that it's worth to buy a ps4 for.
It all make no sense
Ok, thanks for applying. We'll get in touch with you, should we chose to make use of your services in the future.
Seriously though, if you want to develop for a Nintendo CoD crowd, start a new IP. But keep your mits off what makes Metroid Metroid. There's plenty of ways to make Metroid more enticing.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
It could all they have to do is AAA it up in terms of production, visuals. It doesnt have to appeal to the COD people its could be its own game/genre like it was before. If the game is good it wil gain its audience. It just cant look generic like the alien, doom, games or whatever. They can do it.
About the same number of gamers found Demons Souls impressive enough. Dark Souls 1 across 3 platforms sold less than MP1 on the gamecube.
lol
Basically ANYTHING has been rumored at this point. It being weaker, it being a WiiU+, it being more powerful, it having a new gamepad. You obviously don't know 10k or his posting habits and are badly placed to analyse the way he brought the info. I mean, it's not like he's been a member for years but has only recently started to crappost in Nintendo topics, unlike some others you may know.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
Literally tales from your ass.
Sorry. I would like to apologize on the behalf of Nintendo for the lack of a Metroid Prime game on the Wii U.
Imagine if the controller does have scrolling bumpers, and you use them to select different visors and beams.
It's very diffferent from the original MP; which is one of the best games ever AND one of the best at getting you drawn into the world through a traversal-based narrative and no dialogue.
LegendofLex
Member
Metroid on NES and Metroid Prime on GameCube (to a lesser extent, I'd say) were already basically Nintendo's Dark Souls equivalents: grittier games targeted at more skilled players.
LegendofLex
Member
I think it's more because that kind of game (Metroid, not Souls) isn't one that lets their development leads be auteurs, as Other M proved.
Real talk: without looking up the answer, how many people actually know offhand who the director of Metroid Prime actually was?
I don't think this is true.
I think the better argument is that attach rate is meaningless for the kind of comparison that's being made.
All it tells us is that more people bought Wii for reasons other than SMG than bought 3DS for reasons other than SM3DL.
In fact, given that the business objective and core design impetus of 3D Land was to broaden the appeal of 3D Mario, the fact that it really just sold as well as other 3D Mario games means it should have been seen as a failure.
edit: Oh wait you're saying something totally different.
Nintendo saying that 3D Mario doesn't sell as well as 2D Mario makes this entire line of argument meaningless. 2D Mario sold better against stronger competition (Sonic) than 3D Mario has ever had (Crash Bandicoot? lol). Galaxy in particular had basically no competition, unless you think that Spyro game that released in 2007 mattered.
IF something sells alot then they tend to find a new idea for it. They never run out of ideas for Pokemon.
If it doesn't sell then ...you either need a super new great idea or need 10 years to pass so its fresh again.
And you have to remember we're talking Nintendo. A million or 2 million seller isn't as impressive to Nintendo as it would be to some much smaller developer/publisher.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
It's also very arguable those games had less competition than SMG. You can't just use the raw sales to say "this game is better than this one, and resonates w/ consumers more" because that isn't the whole picture.
SMG released during a very different gaming landscape than either 3D Land or 3D World. So just using sales alone, I feel, isn't a good enough measure to say the market outright demands the more 2D-style Mario games over the 3D-style ones.
Spieler Eins
Member
When I was playing Bloodborne, the masterful Metroidvania-esque map exploration made me think about whether Nintendo would even still be able to produce something as masterfully crafted as BB/Souls nowadays. They've been crapping out 2D games, minigame collections and 3D titles with several cut corners forever now. I guess the closest game on WiiU feeling like a proper, modern 3D adventure for gaming enthusiasts was Bayonetta 2. And that wasn't a Nintendo game. fake edit: and maybe Xenoblade, which I didn't get after bad impressions.
But I mean, this idea that the series doesn't sell is pretty silly or at least it should be to Nintendo. No, it doesn't do Mario or Zelda series numbers but I mean the audience is different imo. I don't know if Sony looked at Demons Souls or Bloodbourne and went meh because it didn't roll Uncharted numbers. Something like 5-6 million units of 3 games in a niche series really isn't bad.
Curious as to whether or not you'd be calling the library "monotone" if it had even a single Metroid game.
Some people would definitely disagree with you there, lol.
LegendofLex
Member
Nintendo is a very brand-centric company.
Whether or not their brands are on a healthy trajectory is hugely important to the long-term health of the company.
It's not at all silly for Nintendo to focus on cultivating evergreen brands that don't add deadweight and risk to their portfolio.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
They launch with another NSMB some shit goin down, fuck that
Angry Chair
Member
Before 10K posted, he said it was nothing big. Everyone else blew it out of proportion. I don't know how getting information that backs up the same stuff we heard sends up red flags especially since we have no idea if 10K got the information from the same sources as others. It's okay to be cautious of positive news but you shouldn't be shitting all over 10K.
lol. The point was they keep releasing pokemon regardless. Not that its the bastion of awesome new ideas.
Graphics Horse
Member
I think Mario Maker can be their 2D mario series from now on, might as wll be.
Make a sequel where you can validate levels for multiplayer.
Not to get off topic (though that's the name of the game now!), but I really liked the first Metroid Prime. I think the UI elements were amazing, as was how much detail the worlds had. But, they should (funnily enough) take a cue from some of the Alien games and go for some quick thrills and bursts of enemy encounters, more than what they already did. Keep it real moody.
Oh, and with all the scanning. It's awesome to get the story revealed the way they did it, but the scanning got a bit out of hand. They should have Samus, say, enter a ship, get a dying computer with an unfinished message on it trying to get sent out, and then you're left to your devices to go around and figure it out, complete the level, find the weapon, etc.
They just need to tighten and somewhat modernize the style is all. Metroid Prime had so much going for it.
That said, seeing a new 2D Metroid would be great as well, but there's no reason why they couldn't have both.
Oh, and with all the scanning. It's awesome to get the story revealed the way they did it, but the scanning got a bit out of hand. They should have Samus, say, enter a ship, get a dying computer with an unfinished message on it trying to get sent out, and then you're left to your devices to go around and figure it out, complete the level, find the weapon, etc.
They just need to tighten and somewhat modernize the style is all. Metroid Prime had so much going for it.
That said, seeing a new 2D Metroid would be great as well, but there's no reason why they couldn't have both.
Yep it's right there in Websters....
"shitting all over" : verb
means someone not believing information posted on the internets that you happen to believe.
LegendofLex
Member
I agree, but that's more because NSMB is a bad long-term look for 2D Mario, the same way that Toon Link had no business being the course the Zelda series took for like 7 out of the last 10 brand-new Zelda games.
How much did they pay for Bayonetta 2, I wonder?
Wishmaster92
Member
Just announce a first person metroid game and I'm there day 1
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
Just to illustrate the lunacy of your argument, let's try a few supplements here:
"Face it. The Forza franchise just isn't that big. IT doesn't resonate with that many consumers."
"Face it. Soccer just isn't that big (in America). IT doesn't resonate with that many consumers, therefore it shouldn't exist."
The first one is literally your comment but supplements it w/ a franchise I'd say is comparable to Metroid in its genre. The latter is the fuller interpretation of your kind of comment. This should highlight how flawed your logic is.
Fact is, there are plenty of other reasons a franchise, product, anything can and should exist that goes well beyond merely sales. Let sales be the determining factor, and the markets will eventually become creatively flat (which in turn will influence market health and sales).
Metroid's justified its reason for existing outside of sales. Just like many other niche games from other companies (many of them being favorites of mine). Get that sales and marketing sharp-eyed angle outta here!
This is exactly what's hurting them with non-hardcore Nintendo fans, however. They don't do enough to appeal to people outside of their entrenched demographic, a demographic that seems to be getting smaller gen-over-gen.
Stuff like Miimoto, Bayonetta 2 etc. are good starts, but they need to be doing that more often. Metroid could be a great catalyst for this.
LegendofLex
Member
(I like all the Link styles. And Wind Waker was awesome.)
People keep doing this, as if it's somehow impossible to like something while simultaneously recognizing that it's doing more harm than good to Nintendo.
I mean, I like Wii U, too.
I want the next 2D Mario game to have a new art style and music. Otherwise it won't be well received.
I agree with the other poster that Nintendo could do well by just sticking with Mario Maker for a while.
It's your right to be skeptical. I'm glad you're skeptical. I said it was a rumor and nothing major. But the info you said was already known five days ago, those aren't my sources. When someone like IndieGamerChic posts the NX is more powerful than the PS4, that's one person. She wasn't one of my sources for that post. My info helped corroborate what she and others were saying so it adds some more validity to it.
And nobody was certain on the four Wii U Remasters. In fact, one of my sources admitted he had no idea about Nintendo's struggles porting Splatoon and Mario Maker over. But that's the kind of reaction you get when you use more than one source. That's why I said Splatoon and Mario Maker were 50/50 right now but smash and Zelda are confirmed. (Yes LegendOfLex, zelda is coming to NX).
The info was verified by two mods, I did my part. It's rumored information from sources that are in positions to know this info or know people who are in positions to know this info. I said it wasn't big information, the members of this forum hyped it up, not me. I set expectations low.
But I'm not here to gain fame, recognition, or your specific approval, or any approval (except from mods
). Take it or leave it. But don't call it bullshit. I didn't just take a Reddit post and claim it as my own info. I didn't browse 4chan and post some fan fiction or April fools shit."Face it. Demon Souls just isn't that big. IT doesn't resonate with that many consumers."
James Scott
Banned
Yeah, if they can't guarantee sales to 3rd parties, I think deals like this instead of having to pay for each exclusive could be one way to do it.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
Demons Souls is like the perfect example for anything lol.
? I literally just saw your comment and looked at your avatar and meant no context behind it.
If we want to discuss directions, though, does Zelda HAVE to change styles every game? Just because it happens/ed is reason enough? Mario doesn't really change all the time and that's OK?
Which is where them, ea, and plenty of other companies are missing solid opportunities. Then again none of them want to have good devs teams and use money wisely.
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