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[Lupin the Third]

Kindle is 6" right?

Someone take a photo holding their Kindle like a controller.

I'd be doing this right now if my wife would let me get one.

EDIT: It's a shame the cameras in the tips of the Wii Remotes were only infrared-compatible. I think it would have been cool to use it to take photos and stuff for gameplay ...and stuff.

 

[TheRagnCajun]

I think it will be 3D. Nintendo has been experimenting with 3D since the NES. They finally ship a home console w/ a screen. I don't see them not taking advantage of 3D.

What? That makes even less sense. The 3D effect will be too distracting. The players are supposed to be looking at their TV screen, not their controllers.

 

[brochiller]

Some predictions for future mocking.

Sensor Bar Rumour
------------------------
Rumour is that the controller IS the sensor bar.
This only makes sense if the controller can be put under the TV and acts as.. a Kinectesque camera. In Soviet Russia, camera senses you, etc.

01net confirmed that the sensor bar rumor was a mistranslation. Here's the google translation of what they said about it:

"Finally, several English-language media already announced that the lever on the console - one shelf - work the same way that the sensor bar for Wii (the "bar of reception" to put under the TV), as if the future slate of Nintendo allowed to aim at the screen (!). And this by quoting ... 01net. It is actually a mistranslation of a NeoGAF forum users. Our data refer only to the presence in the lever-shelf technology sensor bar (an infrared transmitter received by the CMOS sensor housed in the Wiimote, which allows the console to locate the player). Its stated purpose in the ecosystem yet wave of Coffee Project, however, remains to be determined. It can just as easily be used, for example, interact with 3DS. But here it is we who speculate."

http://www.01net.com/editorial/531680/project-cafe-ce-qui-reste-a-eclaircir-a-propos-de-la-wii-2/

Is there anybody here who knows French that can clear up what they're saying here?

 

[Starchasing]

Sensor Bar Rumour
------------------------
Rumour is that the controller IS the sensor bar.
This only makes sense if the controller can be put under the TV and acts as.. a Kinectesque camera. In Soviet Russia, camera senses you, etc.

I think how this rumour came to be.

The sensor bar is not really sensoring anything , its actually a emisor bar... its called the sensor for marketing reasons.

In wii the sensor is really inside the wiimote...

so someone said that the new controller has a sensor inside and some one asumed that it was the sensor bar

"Finally, several English-language media already announced that the lever on the console - one shelf - work the same way that the sensor bar for Wii (the "bar of reception" to put under the TV), as if the future slate of Nintendo allowed to aim at the screen (!). And this by quoting ... 01net. It is actually a mistranslation of a NeoGAF forum users. Our data refer only to the presence in the lever-shelf technology sensor bar (an infrared transmitter received by the CMOS sensor housed in the Wiimote, which allows the console to locate the player). Its stated purpose in the ecosystem yet wave of Coffee Project, however, remains to be determined. It can just as easily be used, for example, interact with 3DS. But here it is we who speculate."

i dont understand half of that!

 

[Joey Fox]

I'd be doing this right now if my wife would let me get one.

EDIT: It's a shame the cameras in the tips of the Wii Remotes were only infrared-compatible. I think it would have been cool to use it to take photos and stuff for gameplay ...and stuff.

Take control of your finances, the Kindle is cheap now.

 

[Pyrokai]

I'm so helplessly addicted to this thread. I keep coming back hoping for new rumors always to be disappointed

 

[BuggyDClown]

The wii remote is 6inches. Which is why my mockup made it a tiny bit bigger closer to 6.5 and made the screen the size of the current wiimote. 1.43x5.8

 

[Azure J]

I'm so helplessly addicted to this thread. I keep coming back hoping for new rumors always to be disappointed

This. Then again, as one of the regular members who posted in the 3DS threads when they were popping up all over the place, this is to be expected. :lol

 

[Krev]

I'm so helplessly addicted to this thread. I keep coming back hoping for new rumors always to be disappointed

Me too.
At least yesterday morning was exciting.

 

[Fourth Storm]

01net confirmed that the sensor bar rumor was a mistranslation. Here's the google translation of what they said about it:

"Finally, several English-language media already announced that the lever on the console - one shelf - work the same way that the sensor bar for Wii (the "bar of reception" to put under the TV), as if the future slate of Nintendo allowed to aim at the screen (!). And this by quoting ... 01net. It is actually a mistranslation of a NeoGAF forum users. Our data refer only to the presence in the lever-shelf technology sensor bar (an infrared transmitter received by the CMOS sensor housed in the Wiimote, which allows the console to locate the player). Its stated purpose in the ecosystem yet wave of Coffee Project, however, remains to be determined. It can just as easily be used, for example, interact with 3DS. But here it is we who speculate."

http://www.01net.com/editorial/531680/project-cafe-ce-qui-reste-a-eclaircir-a-propos-de-la-wii-2/

Is there anybody here who knows French that can clear up what they're saying here?

That it will work basically the same way as the Wii Remote (camera in controller and IR beams set near the tv)? And the 3DS has an IR transmitter, right? So presumably it would be able to sense that as well.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Do-able to an acceptable level to some people in ideal circumstances does not equal for everyone in the world and their dog when things like Wi-Fi interference and everything else exist. Nintendo like things to just work.

As soon as you scale and compress it, you introduce lag and cost to what is displaying it. If there are 4 people playing, to have any point you'd also have to be rendering 4 different screens before you even did this, for the 4 different views the players were getting. If they were all seeing the same picture, you might as well have them looking at the television. So all the power of your new HD console is being ruined by having to do 4 times the work of everyone else's. It makes no sense.

Wireless isn't perfect, and fluctuates in performance. If just one of these screens didn't get all it's massive amount of data correctly it would throw all the other ones out and you'd have to stop to resync. This is all getting in the way of the basic thing Nintendo are about, making good games and having them play well.

There's basically 101 reasons why this won't be happening, and to think of it as totally do-able is ignoring most of them.

Check the bold part. All controllers in consoles are wirlesss now and with the video transmitting there are no more interference issues than the ones you could get with the controllers.

You are taking the extreme route with your example and imaging the super worst case scenario. Of the multiple applications i proposed. One, was send the exact frames generated by the console to both screens. So you are taking the same data and just sending a downsampled version to the touch screen, so theres almost no performance overhead. So far i havent talk about generating multiple view points of the game.

The use of the case i described above (and thats just one use) is to allow direct input method for a relaxed game where the player can focus confortably in both screens. I.E.: A traditional adventure game, focus attention on touch screen press an object. Look at TV player character automatically walks to object and grabs it.

Again not saying Nintendo will do it, but im just looking for a less conventional aplication for a screen like the one the rumor suggested.

To sum up its like having your 100'' tv in the palm of your hand. Its a super direct control method.

 

[BuggyDClown]

That makes it sound like the tracking in sony move. Except in a much better way, instead of one move camera and a bunch of glowing orbs, why not have the sensor bar, and a light on it that the camera on the controller uses to track movement from the light.

Think like a backwards move.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

That makes it sound like the tracking in sony move. Except in a much better way, instead of one move camera and a bunch of glowing orbs, why not have the sensor bar, and a light on it that the camera on the controller uses to track movement from the light.

Think like a backwards move.

This is how the Wii pointer already works.

 

[EatChildren]

That makes it sound like the tracking in sony move. Except in a much better way, instead of one move camera and a bunch of glowing orbs, why not have the sensor bar, and a light on it that the camera on the controller uses to track movement from the light.

Think like a backwards move.

This is literally exactly how the Wii remote already works. The sensor bar emits infrared light that the cameras at the top of each Wii remote detect for pointer tracking.

edit: beaten

 

[Lupin the Third]

Take control of your finances, the Kindle is cheap now.

She's not really "stopping" me (I got me a 3DS, after all). But she makes a strong point that I don't really read all that much as it is and I probably wouldn't even use the thing a short while after I got it.

 

[Starchasing]

That makes it sound like the tracking in sony move. Except in a much better way, instead of one move camera and a bunch of glowing orbs, why not have the sensor bar, and a light on it that the camera on the controller uses to track movement from the light.

Think like a backwards move.

Thats how Wii works

 

[Dascu]

01net confirmed that the sensor bar rumor was a mistranslation. Here's the google translation of what they said about it:

"Finally, several English-language media already announced that the lever on the console - one shelf - work the same way that the sensor bar for Wii (the "bar of reception" to put under the TV), as if the future slate of Nintendo allowed to aim at the screen (!). And this by quoting ... 01net. It is actually a mistranslation of a NeoGAF forum users. Our data refer only to the presence in the lever-shelf technology sensor bar (an infrared transmitter received by the CMOS sensor housed in the Wiimote, which allows the console to locate the player). Its stated purpose in the ecosystem yet wave of Coffee Project, however, remains to be determined. It can just as easily be used, for example, interact with 3DS. But here it is we who speculate."

http://www.01net.com/editorial/531680/project-cafe-ce-qui-reste-a-eclaircir-a-propos-de-la-wii-2/

Is there anybody here who knows French that can clear up what they're saying here?

The article says that the new controller has tech inside similar to that of the sensor bar. Its use however is entirely unknown.

 

[From The Dust]

head tracking

 

[NewFresh]

The article says that the new controller has tech inside similar to that of the sensor bar. Its use however is entirely unknown.

Just like everything else about the console

 

[poppabk]

Anyone know how cheap you could make a 6" single touch tablet with enough power for basic browser functionality and not much more?
I see that you can get android based tablets for ~$60-$70 like this lovely apad http://www.ankaka.com/apad-android-tablet-pcmidwifi-7-tft-touch-screencamera_p46977.html

For just basic browser functionality and without mark-up you should be able to get down below $50. So maybe it could be a standalone tablet, and you could still buy extra controllers for $50-60.

 

[Saint Gregory]

This is literally exactly how the Wii remote already works. The sensor bar emits infrared light that the cameras at the top of each Wii remote detect for pointer tracking.

edit: beaten

The fact that all these years later people still don't realize this illustrates how elegant Nintendo's motion solution is compared to Sony's although Move is much better for motion overall.

I would imagine that it wouldn't take a lot of effort to bring the remote up to that Move level of precision as the necessary components should be much more affordable now than they were back when the Wii launched.

 

[Fourth Storm]

The article says that the new controller has tech inside similar to that of the sensor bar. Its use however is entirely unknown.

I'd dispute that interpretation. I believe it's saying that is basically the mistranslation. Rather, there will be a sensor bar (IR Transmitter) and the camera/sensor itself is what is housed in the controller. Exactly the same as Wii. They're not jumping to that conclusion, however, as a 3DS also can emit IR signals and could therefor be picked up by the sensor/camera in the controller.

 

[anonymousAversa]

one thing I don't see anyone talking about is the fact that the 6" touchscreen is reportedly NOT multitouch.

This has huge implications for the usefulness of that part of the console. If the screen is indeed resistive and not capacitive (like most good multitouch displays) then we're really looking more at an older touchscreen tech akin to the graphics being on par with xbox360.

With a multitouch display you'd be able to pinch to zoom in the browser, in games etc...

I reallly hope it's multitouch capacitive. Resistive non-multitouch would not be enjoyable.

 

[gofreak]

A part of me hopes that the bit about the 'sensor-bar-ish' components is a mix-up, or is a reference to some kind of 3D imaging sensor - for more advanced AR through the tablet. Like, a time-of-flight IR system such as in kinect, could be used to construct a 3D representation of what the tablet 'sees' for better, markerless AR.

It would be very interesting to see what that could do. Awareness of the surfaces in the line of sight of the tablet in three dimensions + good graphics + good physics + TV = great AR possibilities.

But a kinect-style system may be too expensive.

(The stereo-cam on 3DS could also offer some 3D geometry reconstruction possibilties, but the processing power in the home system would let them really capitalise on this stuff.)

 

[Plinko]

wait... was there any truth to those David Perry comments yesterday?

Seemed like pretty damn solid info from an insider, but it doesn't look like it was added to the first post.

Fake

All we know so far is "above the 360."

 

[DECK'ARD]

Check the bold part. All controllers in consoles are wirlesss now and with the video transmitting there are no more interference issues than the ones you could get with the controllers.

You are taking the extreme route with your example and imaging the super worst case scenario. Of the multiple applications i proposed. One, was send the exact frames generated by the console to both screens. So you are taking the same data and just sending a downsampled version to the touch screen, so theres almost no performance overhead. So far i havent talk about generating multiple view points of the game.

The use of the case i described above (and thats just one use) is to allow direct input method for a relaxed game where the player can focus confortably in both screens. I.E.: A traditional adventure game, focus attention on touch screen press an object. Look at TV player character automatically walks to object and grabs it.

Again not saying Nintendo will do it, but im just looking for a less conventional aplication for a screen like the one the rumor suggested.

I've explained in the best way I can why it will not happen for 101 reasons. You then repeat all the same things again, and why you want it, in a fantasy land where none of the downsides exist and everything works magically.

The data for wireless control is absolutely minuscule compared to the data for a realtime video feed. You will be murdering all available bandwidth and as such wireless performance which varies will be critical, and also far more susceptible to interference, errors and having to resend stuff. Due to the sheer volume of data involved. With realtime video for games which has to be interactive, this would be disastrous. Video also isn't downsampled, compressed and decompressed, magically without additional lag to what is already there by using wireless. You keep ignoring this, and the fact it would add to the costs of the devices on the receiving end even more.

If there isn't multiple view points for each device, then what on earth is the point in building your now very expensive controllers now around it? So you can look down, touch something and then look up to see it happen on the television screen? Just use the remote's pointer to do that with the television itself, that's what it was invented for. This line of thinking makes no sense at all.

For a personal screen to have any benefit to a player what it is displaying must be unique to that player, otherwise there is no point for it to be there at all.

Looking for less conventional applications is all well and good, but at least try to consider 1) if they are feasible and 2) if there is any actual point to it being done in the first place.

To sum up its like having your 100'' tv in the palm of your hand. Its a super direct control method.

No it's really nothing like that is it.

It's rendering your expensive 100" TV, and the lovely HD picture, pointless. Just so you can look down at a 6" screen and do something you can already do with the Wii's pointer.

You already have touch functionality with the Wii, just in a way which is adapted to the totally different experience console gaming is to handheld. And preserves what is good about enjoying games on a large screen.

 

[Fourth Storm]

A part of me hopes that the bit about the 'sensor-bar-ish' components is a mix-up, or is a reference to some kind of 3D imaging sensor - for more advanced AR through the tablet. Like, a time-of-flight IR system such as in kinect, could be used to construct a 3D representation of what the tablet 'sees' for better, markerless AR.

It would be very interesting to see what that could do. But may be too expensive.

(The stereo-cam on 3DS could also offer some 3D geometry reconstruction possibilties, but the processing power in the home system would let them really capitalise on this stuff.)

Considering Iwata was pitched the Kinect technology and passed on it, I doubt it. I'd like to see it happen as well though...

 

[From The Dust]

one thing I don't see anyone talking about is the fact that the 6" touchscreen is reportedly NOT multitouch.

This has huge implications for the usefulness of that part of the console. If the screen is indeed resistive and not capacitive (like most good multitouch displays) then we're really looking more at an older touchscreen tech akin to the graphics being on par with xbox360.

With a multitouch display you'd be able to pinch to zoom in the browser, in games etc...

I reallly hope it's multitouch capacitive. Resistive non-multitouch would not be enjoyable.

resistive screens are cheaper than capacitative screens I think. and there isn't much that a resistive screen can't do that a capacitative screen can. for the purposes of the device, a resistive screen would suit it just fine. multitouch however, I won't argue with

 

[Saint Gregory]

one thing I don't see anyone talking about is the fact that the 6" touchscreen is reportedly NOT multitouch.

This has huge implications for the usefulness of that part of the console. If the screen is indeed resistive and not capacitive (like most good multitouch displays) then we're really looking more at an older touchscreen tech akin to the graphics being on par with xbox360.

With a multitouch display you'd be able to pinch to zoom in the browser, in games etc...

I reallly hope it's multitouch capacitive. Resistive non-multitouch would not be enjoyable.

It depends on how Nintendo expects users to hold the controller. Unless it's expected that you'll have a free hand gestures won't make a lot of sense. Even with that the DS has never had multi-touch and it hasn't seemed to impact its gameplay options.

 

[BuggyDClown]

Thats how Wii works

Right, but instead of inferred I was talking about visible light.

 

[Vinci]

Considering Iwata was pitched the Kinect technology and passed on it, I doubt it. I'd like to see it happen as well though...

Well, he might not pass on its current level. He simply didn't like where it was before.

 

[anonymousAversa]

It depends on how Nintendo expects users to hold the controller. Unless it's expected that you'll have a free hand gestures won't make a lot of sense. Even with that the DS has never had multi-touch and it hasn't seemed to impact its gameplay options.

Sure, but correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not a DS owner) but doesn't the DS primarily use a stylus?

resistive screens are cheaper than capacitative screens I think. and there isn't much that a resistive screen can't do that a capacitative screen can. for the purposes of the device, a resistive screen would suit it just fine. multitouch however, I won't argue with

Resistive displays are slower and less accurate if i'm not mistaken.

All i'm saying, and I think it's obvious, is that a multitouch screen would be much better. Could the device still be enjoyable with a cheaper touch display? Sure

 

[gofreak]

Considering Iwata was pitched the Kinect technology and passed on it, I doubt it. I'd like to see it happen as well though...

For skeletal tracking of the player, motion control, I can understand that and understand why.

But for constructing a virtual model of a real environment, that kind of tech might be a lot more attractive to them. Same tech but different application really.

Still, it's probably still too expensive for inclusion per-controller...would be nice if it wasn't.

(Not to get hooked up on AR, but Nintendo seems to be into it lately, and in that kind of context it would be amazing for them to put a large screen on a controller without this kind of application in mind, even if among others at least)

 

[Fourth Storm]

For skeletal tracking of the player, motion control, I can understand that and understand why.

But for constructing a virtual model of a real environment, that kind of tech might be a lot more attractive to them. Same tech but different application really.

I hear yah. Guess we'll have to wait and see!

 

[NewFresh]

I would think that regarding the screen on the controller, what makes most sense is to have a small touch screen that would let you slide between some aplications or menu items. But I am still having a hard time with 6", people go get a ruler and see how huge that is.

 

[Starchasing]

one thing I don't see anyone talking about is the fact that the 6" touchscreen is reportedly NOT multitouch.

This has huge implications for the usefulness of that part of the console. If the screen is indeed resistive and not capacitive (like most good multitouch displays) then we're really looking more at an older touchscreen tech akin to the graphics being on par with xbox360.

With a multitouch display you'd be able to pinch to zoom in the browser, in games etc...

I reallly hope it's multitouch capacitive. Resistive non-multitouch would not be enjoyable.

Oh i forgot that... if its not multitouch there is no way its going to be 6 inches in diagonal

 

[anonymousAversa]

Oh i forgot that... if its not multitouch there is no way its going to be 6 inches in diagonal

Why not? I wouldn't be surprised if Ninty went with old tech on this one, although I'd like to see something newer.

 

[NewFresh]

Why not? I wouldn't be surprised if Ninty went with old tech on this one, although I'd like to see something newer.

Touch = Definitely
Multi-Touch = maybe

 

[Starchasing]

Why not? I wouldn't be surprised if Ninty went with old tech on this one, although I'd like to see something newer.

Because its a waste of space, and being so big people will allways try to use more than one finger

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

if there is a benifit, I'll use it. that's up to the developers though

As long as its not like Motion+ which gets ignored by most developers and only used in a few Nintendo titles.

That's just the curse of being an add-on they can't count on people having. Just ignoring it is a lot easier than letting go of the M+-lacking userbase, or trying to balance control schemes so M+ works but isn't necessary.

I'm pretty positive 10 and 13 sold a lot more than 8

Going by Wikipedia's sources for shipment numbers, VIII shipped 8.15 million, X 6.6 million, and XIII was at 5.5 million as of the middle of last year.

Well all I know is that both X and XIII sold enough to get a sequel so...

Well frig, in that case FF VIII is less successful than Dissidia.

 

[JohnB]

I'm thinking this whole "touch screen" rumour is really about how the 3DS/DSi will seamlessly link with the Wii+ and can be used as an additional controller for specific games. Nintendo have tried this approach before, after all.

I'm guessing some games will come with "enhanced content" for 3DS owners. Explains why they shipped the 3DS at an unusual time. Nintendo are probably going to release Wii+ (or whatever it's called) within the next 12 months.

How much would an upscaler cost to push out existing Wii games at 720p? Anyone know?

Ta!

 

[poppabk]

I'm thinking this whole "touch screen" rumour is really about how the 3DS/DSi will seamlessly link with the Wii+ and can be used as an additional controller for specific games. Nintendo have tried this approach before, after all.

I'm guessing some games will come with "enhanced content" for 3DS owners. Explains why they shipped the 3DS at an unusual time. Nintendo are probably going to release Wii+ (or whatever it's called) within the next 12 months.

How much would an upscaler cost to push out existing Wii games at 720p? Anyone know?

Ta!

With a decent quad core level cpu and an expert knowledge of their hardware, it is feasible that they could run them upscaled through emulation, in an advanced dolphin style emulator. The downside would be reduced compatibility for titles.

 

[Fantastical]

I'm thinking this whole "touch screen" rumour is really about how the 3DS/DSi will seamlessly link with the Wii+ and can be used as an additional controller for specific games. Nintendo have tried this approach before, after all.

I'm guessing some games will come with "enhanced content" for 3DS owners. Explains why they shipped the 3DS at an unusual time. Nintendo are probably going to release Wii+ (or whatever it's called) within the next 12 months.

How much would an upscaler cost to push out existing Wii games at 720p? Anyone know?

Ta!

Multiple sources have said the controller has a 6" screen. Either they are completely wrong or there is a screen on the controller. I don't think anyone is confusing the 3DS when they say something as specific as a "six inch screen".

EDIT: Oh, I think I may have misinterpreted what you were saying.

 

[From The Dust]

That's just the curse of being an add-on they can't count on people having. Just ignoring it is a lot easier than letting go of the M+-lacking userbase, or trying to balance control schemes so M+ works but isn't necessary.

except the touchscreen will be in the box from day one. unlike the M+ which was added too late in the Wii's life

 

[DECK'ARD]

I'm thinking this whole "touch screen" rumour is really about how the 3DS/DSi will seamlessly link with the Wii+ and can be used as an additional controller for specific games. Nintendo have tried this approach before, after all.

I'm guessing some games will come with "enhanced content" for 3DS owners. Explains why they shipped the 3DS at an unusual time. Nintendo are probably going to release Wii+ (or whatever it's called) within the next 12 months.

How much would an upscaler cost to push out existing Wii games at 720p? Anyone know?

Ta!

Yeah, that's far more likely. If you want the functionality of a handheld-like controller with your console, just wirelessly connect to a handheld. Ideally Nintendo would like you to own both after all.

And with Download Play the 3DS is ready to do things like Four Swords, Pac-Man Vs etc.

 

[Effect]

She's not really "stopping" me (I got me a 3DS, after all). But she makes a strong point that I don't really read all that much as it is and I probably wouldn't even use the thing a short while after I got it.

On the flip side you might actually start reading more if you get one. As a gamer your naturally into tech and holding a device like that might feel more natural. Thus make you more incline to use it just to interact with it more.

 

[Lupin the Third]

I don't get it. Did everyone forget the developer quote where Nintendo was "doing this one right" and that there "wasn't a gimmick"? What's with all the Kinect-camera-finger-tracking tech talk? You'd think this is an old "Revolution" speculation thread or something.

EDIT: Effect: Well, that's a coincidence! That's actually kinda what I was thinking, too. Maybe I'll snag one if it ever hits below $100. Or pick one up secondhand.

 

[From The Dust]

I don't get it. Did everyone forget the developer quote where Nintendo was "doing this one right" and that there "wasn't a gimmick"? What's with all the Kinect-camera-finger-tracking tech talk? You'd think this is an old "Revolution" speculation thread or something.

congradulations! you discovered the problems with these rumors!

 

[wsippel]

It seems there have been rumors in December 2009 that Nintendo's next generation system might be based on IBM's 476FP core. Judging by the little information we have regarding IBM's involvement, that would make some sense: it seems Nintendo contracted them between late 2009 and early 2010, and the 470 series was the most efficient core they had at the time.

The 476FP, presumably used in a 16 core configuration, is actually quite impressive. It's not exactly very fast, but incredibly efficient. It's a 32bit PowerPC core, out of order and highly modular, with a really short pipeline, supporting SIMD and DSP instructions. It draws about 2W while achieving around 4GFLOPS (double precision) at 2GHz - per core. It's currently IBM's latest and greatest, at least until the A2 ships.

 

[Fernando Rocker]

I think that the IR Port of the 3DS is going to be a very important part with this new console.