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Rumor: Wii 2 at E3; 6" Touch Controller [Up: Cafe Header On Nintendo Site, More]

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R

radioheadrule83

Banned
gofreak said:
You could ask why they got all the low level NGP details before other outlets.

But they did.

They clearly have friends in a dev house somewhere. Probably ubisoft or the like.

That doesn't mean these same friends are those sharing this info, or that it's correct, but they do have a record here.
Click to expand...

Sony != Nintendo... one is a notoriously leaky ship, the other isn't.

We knew about NGP / PSP2 before 3DS, and we knew that developers considered it a beast, we even got photos suggesting a rear touch panel. We had people here making fairly reasonable guesses at the specs of the thing... they did not score some sort of ultimate exclusive that automatically makes them an authority on this stuff. Ask yourself, how many non-French speaking people here had even heard of 01net before today...

Add to this the fact that 01net's story has far more detail than other outlets have been able to get -- the project name, the nature of the controller, the possible buttons, the approximate power... going with Power PC seems unlikely to me, it seems the kind of thing someone would assume from the rumours of it being Wii backwards compatible. A capacitative touch tablet with only single input control? What would be the point in that? A controller that you have to look at as much as your screen? It's like they've extrapolated the rumour about the controller having a touch screen into saying that they're going to actually release little handheld machines for controllers. Think about that in terms of cost. It would be prohibitively expensive surely. And what benefit is a front facing camera in a controller you hold in your lap? An outward facing camera to face the console / sensor bar I could maybe understand...

Café doesn't seem like a very Nintendo project name to me btw... Project Reality, Project Dolphin, Project Revoultion.... Project Café?

It just reads like nonsense. I bet any of you absolutely anything that their story is bollocks. They're just cashing in for hits on Wii 2 rumour day.
 
G

Graphics Horse

Member
frankie_baby said:
Does anyone else remember a fan made bullshit mock up of a new Nintendo handheld that floated around briefly a year or so ago it was Wii remote shaped the entire top was a screen and had a dpad and a couple of buttons sticking out of the screen?
Click to expand...

Yes, I liked that but I can't find it anywhere.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
Steve Youngblood said:
Well, there's tons of conflicting information, so obviously we can't really draw anything from it. It does, however, reinforce my belief that the "It will also do 1080p resolutions" is meaningless without context. I never understood why that was supposed to be a piece of juicy gossip. Of course it will be able to render 1080 P, but render what?
Click to expand...

The reason that's so frequently brought up as something notable is because no console has been able to even come close to hitting that mark yet. There are a very small portion of console games which are native 1080p, and some prominent ones which are sub-HD (and still running at lower frames on top of that).

Console games hitting a consistent 1080p (and in a magical world, 60 FPS) would be ideal for the next gen of systems, especially since it also means devs would begin to create more high-res textures and art assets, thus not shitting up PC ports quite as much. :>
 
M

mentalfloss

Banned
We'll see. For my part, if it can do 1080p with the same polygonal output of 360/PS3, then I will be happy.

It's better that they don't overdo it on the power, so that the price is still somewhat respectable. Online connectivity and the social paradigm of gaming is a much more important evolution for the industry than graphic fidelity or physics.

A.KU.MU said:
Wind Waker.
Click to expand...

I'll take the more diverse library, thanks.
 
D

Doodis

Member
radioheadrule83 said:
The 01.net story is 99% bullshit. Come on! Why would they be any more privvy to details such as the project name and the way the controller works than the likes of Game Informer, Edge and IGN? It reads like embellishments on today's earlier rumours.
Click to expand...
It makes more sense for the leak to come from a less-prominent source, actually. Even if Game Informer, Edge and IGN have info on the subject, they're likely under NDA. Plus, their livelihood depends on good relationships with publishers to get stories. They would be less likely to damage that relationship than a smaller outfit.
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
radioheadrule83 said:
Sony != Nintendo... one is a notoriously leaky ship, the other isn't.
Click to expand...

They didn't get their NGP info from Sony. They got it from a developer.

Developers know about Nintendo's next system.

radioheadrule83 said:
We knew about NGP / PSP2 before 3DS, and we knew that developers considered it a beast, we even got photos suggesting a rear touch panel. We had people here making fairly reasonable guesses at the specs of the thing... they did not score some sort of ultimate exclusive that automatically makes them an authority on this stuff.
Click to expand...

No one pinned down the CPU before them, no one came out and said 'it will be XYZ', we were still speculating on possible mini-Cells up to that point. And there were lots of other details. The nature of the touch panels (even down to the number of supported touch points and pressure sensitivity), the inclusion of GPS (non-obvious), the memory setup (VRAM was confirmed at GDC), the precise resolution of the screen etc, the exact sensor setup - even down to the 'SGX543MP4+' branding of the GPU, the '+' being a Sony specific addition that subsequently appeared in Sony's official spec. If they were guessing they went out on limbs that no one else did, and they got everything right.


radioheadrule83 said:
Ask yourself, how many non-French speaking people here had even heard of 01net before today...
Click to expand...

Everyone following NGP? There's a reason they stand out, because they did genuinely have a big coup there.

radioheadrule83 said:
Add to this the fact that 01net's story has far more detail than other outlets have been able to get -- the project name (café doesn't seem like a very Nintendo project name to me btw), the nature of the controller, the possible buttons, the approximate power... going with Power PC seems unlikely to me, it seems the kind of thing someone would assume from the rumours of it being Wii backwards compatible
Click to expand...

You can't on the one hand accuse them of coming up with by-the-numbers assumptions while pointing out how incredible other claims are...there's plenty of non-obvious stuff in there info. And again, yeah they have more detail...but they have had in the past.
 
R

Roi

Member
impact.jpg
 
N

[Nintex]

Member
Fafalada said:
What makes you think SM4.1 means "extra power", or high power at all?
There's a plethora of chipsets out there with 4.X featureset that are considerably lower power then even the PS3 GPU.
Click to expand...
That is true but why would Nintendo or better yet why would ATi/AMD develop/design a new chip using their R700 technology from 2007/2008 for use in 2011/2012. Unless the WiiHD has been gathering dust in the warehouses ever since Wii Music was released there's no reason for Nintendo to have designed a system using R700 tech. ATi/AMD would've no doubt advised them to go with R800 or perhaps R900 given the problems and delays they ran into with R700 tech. It's much more likely that Nintendo went with R800/R900 or AMD Fusion if only because all three would've end up cheaper.
 
F

FrankT

Member
With Blu Ray and being more powerful with what is out there I may actually be interested in this thing. 2012 could be a great year. Start of the new gen.
 
L

Luckyman

Banned
No way is Nintendo pushing for 1080p. It will output 1080p

For anyone doubting PowerPC what are you suggesting for Wii compatibility..
 
J

J-Rod

Member
I'm concerned about how much the controllers are going to cost. The money I've spent to get all the controllers I needed for wii/360/ps3, plus all the charging equipment, batteries, and such was quite an expense.
 
S

Steve Youngblood

Member
Zeliard said:
The reason that's so frequently brought up as something notable is because no console has been able to even come close to hitting that mark yet. There are a very small portion of console games which are native 1080p, and some prominent ones which are sub-HD (and still running at lower frames on top of that).
Click to expand...
Yes, I understand that. But what I'm getting at is that an out of context tweet from Jim Reilly saying "It will also do 1080p resolutions" isn't in and of itself even remotely informative. The existing HD consoles can do 1080p, despite the fact that it's rarely pulled off outside of stuff on par with Geometry Wars 2. If the comment was "every game will be rendered natively at 1080p" or something, then I'd be raising my eyebrow with interest. As it is, this comment felt to me like it might as well have been a reveal of "sources tell me that it will be capable of outputting to a televisions screen via HDMI."
 
W

wsippel

Banned
Jocchan said:
Being a big-name site doesn't mean a thing. You can still have very good sources. I honestly find their rumor unlikely at best, but they *could* still be correct.
Click to expand...
The only thing about the specs that French site states as a fact is the triple core PowerPC. Everything else is either estimated or admittedly unknown. Even if the system uses an old R700, pretty much any R700 blows Xenos (R500/ 600 hybrid) out of the water, so it would be almost certainly more than just slightly more powerful.

I also think it's possible that they heard "triple core PowerPC", remembered Xenon, and deducted that they have to be similar in performance. Which doesn't have to be the case, of course. Xenon uses obsolete first generation CELL PPEs. A triple core PowerPC A2 or a stripped down POWER7 would also be "similar to Xenon", but still completely different animals. Actually, if it really is a PowerPC, my money would be on an A2 based design clocked at ~2GHz.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
Steve Youngblood said:
Yes, I understand that. But what I'm getting at is that an out of context tweet from Jim Reilly saying "It will also do 1080p resolutions" isn't in and of itself even remotely informative. The existing HD consoles can do 1080p, despite the fact that it's rarely pulled off outside of stuff on par with Geometry Wars 2. If the comment was "every game will be rendered natively at 1080p" or something, then I'd be raising my eyebrow with interest. As it is, this comment felt to me like it might as well have been a reveal of "sources tell me that it will be capable of outputting to a televisions screen via HDMI."
Click to expand...

Very true. Remains to be seen. It may end up just wishful thinking.
 
T

thefro

Member
radioheadrule83 said:
Yeah, it evokes images of a controller the size of a Kindle. Somehow I doubt it.
Click to expand...

kindle.jpg


Yep, the kindle has a 6-inch screen... unless the screen is haptic and gives you feedback it can't replace buttons so you'd need to basically duct tape a classic controller on the bottom.
 
J

Jarmel

Banned
FlyingTeacup said:
... is my sarcasm detector broken? a controller that costs 250 a pop!
Click to expand...

Well the good news is that it's less likely to be swung around and go through that TV. I can assure you more people would be wearing those damn straps.
 
W

wrowa

Member
radioheadrule83 said:
Café doesn't seem like a very Nintendo project name to me btw... Project Reality, Project Dolphin, Project Revoultion.... Project Café?
Click to expand...
It also is French.

Yeah, I know, that isn't really a point. But it seems a bit fishy. Just like the rest of their story.
 
T

thehillissilent

Member
[Nintex] said:
That is true but why would Nintendo or better yet why would ATi/AMD develop/design a new chip using their R700 technology from 2007/2008 for use in 2011/2012. Unless the WiiHD has been gathering dust in the warehouses ever since Wii Music was released there's no reason for Nintendo to have designed a system using R700 tech. ATi/AMD would've no doubt advised them to go with R800 or perhaps R900 given the problems and delays they ran into with R700 tech. It's much more likely that Nintendo went with R800/R900 or AMD Fusion if only because all three would've end up cheaper.
Click to expand...
I would be pretty disapointed if Nintendo actually went with a R700 derivative and not a R800/R900 or Fusion. Xenos (360) was R600. It reminds me of them choosing a 2006 era PICA GPU for 3DS.
 
poppabk

poppabk

Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
What the hell happened? Yesterday there was some rumor that it existed, now we have estimated specs/power, a new controller. Have people been sitting on this info under coercion from nintendo, and the first leak opened the floodgates, or is there one leak heading to multiple outlets? I know the original article cited multiple sources.
 
N

[Nintex]

Member
Quadrangulum said:
I like the "big surprise they can't talk about just yet" part.
Click to expand...
Yeah that pretty much proofs that it's bullshit if Nintendo comes out and says it has a rocket attached that shoots your Xbox to Mars they can say: "See we told you there was more!"
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
poppabk said:
What the hell happened? Yesterday there was some rumor that it existed, now we have estimated specs/power, a new controller. Have people been sitting on this info under coercion from nintendo, and the first leak opened the floodgates, or is there one leak heading to multiple outlets? I know the original article cited multiple sources.
Click to expand...

The following combatant entered the ring:

NaviLink said:
Hey guys, I hope I can get your attention on this.

The french website 01.net has posted perhaps what is the most complete story so far on the successor of the Wii. Link to the story (in french).

They have a very reliable source that previously told them about the specs of the Sony NGP.
Here are the bullet points. Most of them have already been reported by other sites, but here goes :

  • the console is codenamed "Project Café"
  • will be introduced at E3 2011
  • architecture is very similar to the Xbox 360; the Café is a bit more powerful than the 360
  • porting current xbox 360 titles to the Café should be very easy
  • should be retro-compatible with GameCube and Wii games, and support all Wii peripherals
  • Specs : CPU is custom IBM PowerPC with three cores, GPU should be an ATI from the R700 family, with a shader unit at version 4.1. Ram should be at least 512 Mb.
  • the controller is a touch tablet, with moderate graphic output (appears to be sub-HD, so nothing comparable to an Ipad, for example.)
  • controller specs : 6-inch screen, single touch (so no multitouch, it seems), front camera, acts as a wii sensor bar, has a d-pad, two bumpers, two triggers, possibly more.
  • should be released in June of 2012 (for Japan ?), and holiday season (in the West ?)
  • there is another big surprise they can't talk about just yet

I can do a full translation if you guys want, tell me what you think.
Click to expand...
 
W

wsippel

Banned
thehillissilent said:
I would be pretty disapointed if Nintendo actually went with a R700 derivative and not a R800/R900 or Fusion. Xenos (360) was R600. It reminds me of them choosing a 2006 era PICA GPU for 3DS.
Click to expand...
Well, PICA200 was announced in 2006, five years ago. The SGX543MP4 the NGP uses was announced in 2007 if I remember correctly, four years ago. The NGP launches half a year to a year after the 3DS. Using "outdated" hardware isn't a Nintendo thing. ;)
 
F

Fafalada

Fafracer forever
[Nintex] said:
there's no reason for Nintendo to have designed a system using R700 tech.
Click to expand...
I think it's fundamentally irrelevant - consoles are built around a power/size envelope, and architectural changes of immediate DirectX successors aren't shifting any major balance there.
Of course, if this is positioned as Hardcore crowd pleaser then those DX checkboxes, no matter how meaningless they may be in the big picture, do have an impact with marketting the thing...
 
C

Cosmonaut X

Member
[Nintex] said:
Yeah that pretty much proofs that it's bullshit if Nintendo comes out and says it has a rocket attached that shoots your Xbox to Mars they can say: "See we told you there was more!"
Click to expand...

Oh, for fucks sake - what's the point of an NDA if you're just going to break it so casually, Nintex?
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
[Nintex] said:
Yeah that pretty much proofs that it's bullshit if Nintendo comes out and says it has a rocket attached that shoots your Xbox to Mars they can say: "See we told you there was more!"
Click to expand...

Hardly a get out of jail free card for 01.net. They offer plenty of specifics that would reveal the crapness of their info definitively, if it is wrong.

Don't get me wrong, I hardly KNOW 01.net is right here, but it's annoying to see people be revisionist about their history (wrt NGP for example).
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
Navilink said:
Hey guys, I hope I can get your attention on this.

The french website 01.net has posted perhaps what is the most complete story so far on the successor of the Wii. Link to the story (in french).

They have a very reliable source that previously told them about the specs of the Sony NGP.
Here are the bullet points. Most of them have already been reported by other sites, but here goes :
the console is codenamed "Project Café"
will be introduced at E3 2011
architecture is very similar to the Xbox 360; the Café is a bit more powerful than the 360
porting current xbox 360 titles to the Café should be very easy
should be retro-compatible with GameCube and Wii games, and support all Wii peripherals
Specs : CPU is custom IBM PowerPC with three cores, GPU should be an ATI from the R700 family, with a shader unit at version 4.1. Ram should be at least 512 Mb.
the controller is a touch tablet, with moderate graphic output (appears to be sub-HD, so nothing comparable to an Ipad, for example.)
controller specs : 6-inch screen, single touch (so no multitouch, it seems), front camera, acts as a wii sensor bar, has a d-pad, two bumpers, two triggers, possibly more.
should be released in June of 2012 (for Japan ?), and holiday season (in the West ?)
there is another big surprise they can't talk about just yet

I can do a full translation if you guys want, tell me what you think.
Click to expand...

sounds good. I like that it has the same architecture as 360 = easy PC ports.
 
K

KAL2006

Banned
If that french leak is right, I am disappointed, slightly more powerful than 360 is not enough, the 360 is 6 years old, it should be way more powerful than 360. It also seems like they are going to use a normal controller (with a screen on it) instead of a WiiMote, I find that strange, I liked that Wii differentiated itself from the other platforms by forcing the WiiMote as the default controller, now it's basically going to be another 360 with Nintendo games on it. However Nintendo will have success from this by getting superior multiplatform ports and real next gen versions of Mario, Metroid and etc. But the problem is when PS4 and 720 gets announced the Wii 2 would not be cutting edge anymore. As for the big surprise, I am guessing it's vitality sensor.

I think Microsoft are at the best position and may dominate next gen, they have the hardcore by their balls due to 360 gamers being ties to their live accounts with friends, acheivements and digital games. They can include an improved Kinect with their next console which comes with a HD camera and is more accurate. The next Microsoft console can differentiate themselves from Sony and Nintendo which will basically be the same as each other, while Microsoft continues to push Kinect for casuals (and make it better and more accurate), but at the same time cater to hardcore like they always do by making a powerful console.
 
R

RedSwirl

Junior Member
Question: will you re-buy all your N64 and SNES games on Wii2 Virtual Console for the chance to play them all in 1080p on your TV?
 
N

Nicktals

Banned
I haven't given it a ton of thought, but if there's a camera on the TV facing the room, and each controller has a camera, couldn't that lead to some incredibly cool multiplayer scenarios? If the picture of each controller camera is sent to the console (is this feasible?), then you have some really cool AR possibilities, and some very cool multiplayer possibilities too.

I'm not smart enough to see what all those possibilities are, but I know they exist!
 
N

[Nintex]

Member
Fafalada said:
I think it's fundamentally irrelevant - consoles are built around a power/size envelope, and architectural changes of immediate DirectX successors aren't shifting any major balance there.
Of course, if this is positioned as Hardcore crowd pleaser then those DX checkboxes, no matter how meaningless they may be in the big picture, do have an impact with marketting the thing...
Click to expand...
AMD/ATi delayed the Radeon 4XXX line by months if not a year because it was a load of shit. The Radeon 5XXX series was seen as a 'return to form' for ATi/AMD. I doubt they wanted to build yet another chip using R700 tech. Slamming a couple of Radeon 4000 cards in a devkit is an entire different story Rare build Perfect Dark Zero using Radeon X800's.


Cosmonaut X said:
Oh, for fucks sake - what's the point of an NDA if you're just going to break it so casually, Nintex?
Click to expand...
I could tell you guys that Rayman Origins is a Wii game, now that's breaking an NDA.
 
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