OLED_Gamer
Member
What does this mean for early adopters?
RX 7900XTX and 7900XT review thread
- Thread starter winjer
- Start date
What does this mean for early adopters?
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
A $1000 lemon
Broken silicon
I cannot even imagine the series of events that led to releasing a GPU with A0 silicon. It was apparently documented by amd employee in code that its broken. Did they make an A1..2..3 version but sent the A0 for fab by mistake? That.. that would look so bad on the team if true
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Haint
Member
Those benchmarks represent older games at Valve Index 100% render resolution (no super sampling), a now 3.5 year old HMD whose resolution was unexceptional when it first launched (1440x1600 + 40% distortion correction). A more modern headset, with more modern games, ideally being super sampled are definitely going to struggle to hit frame rate targets even with a 4090. There's no such thing as too much performance with VR, you'll always want more. Super sampling in VR is as significant as a whole new HMD.
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Kazekage1981
Member
Had it not been for these recently identified bugs and went through some sort of QA/testing and proper execution would it have been 10%-20% better than 4080 in rasterization?
//DEVIL//
Member
It already does for the most part have a 10% increase over 4080. however from some of the games benchmarked. a driver fix ( which AMD sucks at ) honestly can push the GPU to much higher levels. a look at COD MW2 and FH5 ( after you enable SAM), you are in the 4090 level here.
Now I am not expecting the card to reach 4090. but I believe with proper drivers if you have the power in you to wait, should be at least 20% more powerful than 4080 in resta
Hydroxy
Member
The only ass that is getting kicked is the consumers. Nvidia and AMD both laughing all the way to the bank.
supernova8
Banned
Lisa Su knows what's what (ie she's not just a corporate suit with zero engineering background). If they really did release A0 silicon then she, someone close to her level, or someone else high up in management must have known. I absolutely cannot see that happening by accident.
If it did happen by accident (doubtful) then I expect they will be announcing a recall very soon (and offering the choice of a refund or guaranteed replacements when the "real" ones are ready) and asking retailers to take off the shelves (physical or not) any units that haven't been sold yet.
It's a bad look and personally I would respect them more if (assuming it's a big mistake and not intentional to rush it out before Christmas) they just put their hands up and say "sorry guys we literally made the most textbook mistake and we're working around the clock to sort it out".
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Perhaps they released it to hit their investor targets. I can see them thinking that it is good enough to compete against the 4080 with a price cut, and they can release a "fixed" version as the 7950 XTX in 6 months.
hardware unboxed had rebar/sam enabled and they had fh5 in their tested games and they don't seem to have got this massive performance increase?
I Master l
Banned
Its honestly frustrating being an amd hopeful. They already had a rasterization advantage last gen and had a perfect chance to gain some ground after nvidias greedy practices and we end up with this underwhelming output...their flagship barely actually losing their rasterization advantage compared to last gen to select cases and being inferior to the last gen nvidia cards in RT, i mean its inferior to a 3090 sometimes.....even intel with their first effort produced a superior rt pipeline. People trying desperately to play the RT is not important narrative should just stop....people are not buying 1000$dollar graphics cards to play the latest game without the best visual fidelity...pc gamers buy the latest graphics cards to watch tech being pushed not to see a game being played at lower settings at 150fps.
To make matters worse they launched a bugged card losing out on power efficiency compared to rdna2 even though they pushed the efficiency and die size narrative during their presentation....at this point, we might as well pray for intel to get their asses in gear to push nvidia because amd is so far behind they aren't catching up its not even close.. I wonder how things would have turned out if amd never bought ati and its sole focus remained on gpu tech.
To make matters worse they launched a bugged card losing out on power efficiency compared to rdna2 even though they pushed the efficiency and die size narrative during their presentation....at this point, we might as well pray for intel to get their asses in gear to push nvidia because amd is so far behind they aren't catching up its not even close.. I wonder how things would have turned out if amd never bought ati and its sole focus remained on gpu tech.
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I Master l
Banned
All this drama over some developer comments in code barely anybody understands with zero fucking proof of AMD releasing A0 silicone, which I highly fucking doubt they did.
The internet these days… fucking hell
Just a bunch of Nvidia fans who bought the 4080/4090 and want to feel good about their
purchase by bashing AMD
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
They counter checked with GPU-Z and vbios readouts, not just the driver code.
GPU-Z reports board revision, vbios reports GPU revision. That doesn't mean 100% solved case, it's just a bunch of dudes searching with the little to no tools we have to see what's going on?
If you read the wall of this guy on twitter, his 5500XT beats the 7900XTX fur mark score hardware unboxed got. The hell? It's all over the place.
Whatever happened, 100% fixable via driver or workaround via drivers (typically penalty in performance compared to 100% functional hardware), it showcases that AMD is fumbling around. If they didn't know, it's not a good look. If they did know, it's not a good look.
By 1-2 weeks we should have a clearer image of what happened. Best hope is some silly driver mistake.
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GreatnessRD
Member
After the 7900 series review, I think a lot of people went 4080, to be honest. After you throw in the AIB's, you're right there at 4080 money anyway.You are assuming people bought 4080s?
Buggy Loop
Gold Member
What say yee now?
7900XT beating the 4090 by alot, because "its fucking maths" and has "chiplets".
Mate it looks like its a generation behind.
Yall drank the koolaid
1) TBP is 355W which is below what I said the minimum would be to match the 4090 which was 375W-400W if you actually read my post.
2) AMD fell short of their perf/w gains which compounds the above.
3) When the clocks and power are cranked to 3.2ghz and 450 or so watts it is actually pretty close to a 4090 in CP2077 (would love more tests to get a wider picture here)
It simply looks like the VF curve is not as good as AMD designed for which means less performance at a given wattage.
So yes, not as great as hoped due to AMD not hitting the perf/W target. The biggest issue I have is how misleading AMD were in the reveal presentation, they just flushed 5 years of trust building down the shitter.
EDIT. I also noticed you didn't quote my actual prediction of ~4090 @ 375W from further up the thread.
On top of that your RT prediction is hilarious.
RT on par with the 3080? It actually matches the 3090Ti on average.
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Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
The TUF has a TBP of 450W so thats not the issue.1) TBP is 355W which is below what I said the minimum would be to match the 4090 which was 375W-400W if you actually read my post.
2) AMD fell short of their perf/w gains which compounds the above.
3) When the clocks and power are cranked to 3.2ghz and 450 or so watts it is actually pretty close to a 4090 in CP2077 (would love more tests to get a wider picture here)
It simply looks like the VF curve is not as good as AMD designed for which means less performance at a given wattage.
So yes, not as great as hoped due to AMD not hitting the perf/W target. The biggest issue I have is how misleading AMD were in the reveal presentation, they just flushed 5 years of trust building down the shitter.
Pretty much every AIB 4090 hits 75fps in CP2077 at 4K.
With a simple overclock that would easily be 80fps.
So the 7900XTX with a very careful almost surgical overclock and undervolt gets to below a base 4090.
A 4090 simply going to its natural clock rate is still 10fps ahead.
So we are right back where we started?
Last gen they didnt make any high tier variants of AMD cards.
There was no SuprimX of the RX6000s only Gaming Trio and Gaming X Trio.
Come to think of it, i dont think there were even Ventus RX6000s
That might have been the first sign MSI isnt particularly interested in making AMD graphics cards.
This gen they havent even announced anything.
No leaks about RDNA3 have come from MSI.
Me thinks theyve just given up making AMD GPUs.
Irobot82
Member
That's a shame, 2 of my kids have 6600XT Gaming OC's and another has a 6650XT Gaming OC.
Razvedka
Banned
Which is crazy to me. I bought a 4090, thing is amazing. I still want AMD to kick in Nvidia's head.
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
The Gaming OC was made by Gigabyte not MSI.
The Gaming OC has already been announced.
Irobot82
Member
My bad, I'm tired. Mech 2X's.The Gaming OC was made by Gigabyte not MSI.
The Gaming OC has already been announced.
SportsFan581
Member
Hardly. In the US the price gap is even larger when you compare AIB to AIB cards:
GeForce RTX 4080 GPUs / Video Graphics Cards | Newegg.com
Shop GeForce RTX 4080 GPUs / Video Graphics Cards on Newegg.com. Watch for amazing deals and get great pricing.
Radeon RX 7900 XTX GPUs / Video Graphics Cards | Newegg.com
Shop Radeon RX 7900 XTX GPUs / Video Graphics Cards on Newegg.com. Watch for amazing deals and get great pricing.
SportsFan581
Member
I wouldn't let any nonsense about why this and why that alter your decision making. Judge the cards based on the performance data available, what you want to pay, and what you expect to get out of the product. Crazy rumors about the how and why don't matter much at the end of the day.
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Yeah I was surprised to see that most cards are pretty much at MSRP for AMD or at least were while they were available. Not sure why I am even looking seeing as I just bought a 6900xt, mainly just to feel good about the deal I got I guess.
//DEVIL//
Member
from the provided link, most AMD cards are reference cards from AIBs. those you will never see again. The same way you will never see a reference AIB card for Nvidia anymore. those just first run because they are required to have them.
Now all you will see is AIB-designed coolers and AIB prices. if you look at the list, it starts from 1100$ for the basic one. but it goes up to 1200$ and so.
again this is not something against AMD. as Nvidia ( from the link provided as well ) AIB listings are not referenced designs which is why they are expensive.
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adamosmaki
Member
A bit off topic but is it to much nowdays to want Nvidia/AMD to release a mid range GPU for 300-400 with a 40-50% performance increase over current mid range offerings which are disappointing considering they are barely faster than the rtx 2060s/rx 5600/5700 ?
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Sadly I think the answer is that those days are gone. Used to be that everyone was looking at mid range bang for your buck, but nowadays all anyone talks about is the top end cards and the prices you want to pay for a card are the 'you might as well pay the extra $x' price differences between already $1000+ cards.
1) The TUF does not have a TBP of 450W. The OC model at its stock performance config pulls around 400W.
2) FPS is always scene dependent. It will always vary review to review because different places use different scenes so saying the AIB 4090 does 75 and OCd does 80 is utterly meaningless unless you are pointing to another TPU review where we know the variables are all the same. You can't right now because he changed his rig between the 4090 AIB reviews and the XTX launch so you can't compare like for like.
3)The card was maxed out. Increase power limit, Up the clockspeed slider until you are power limited, drop the voltage, repeat until you lose stability. Pretty standard stuff. To call that an almost surgical overclock is just nonsense.
SportsFan581
Member
The PowerColor cards aren't priced bad (Hellbound $1k and Red Devil $1,100), those should continue to be produced as should the GIGABYTE Gaming at $1k. But, yeah the copycat reference cards will be dropped.
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
I think 300 dollars is now completely outta the question from Nvidia.
There is hope from AMD.
Its all but guaranteed from Intel.
The cuts Nvidia would be doing would actually make the 3060 look like good deals vs im guessing 4050/Ti.
If
The 4070Ti is 7-800 dollars
The 4070 5-600
The 4060 which will likely be a match for the 3070/Ti will probably end up costing exactly the same as a 3070/Ti today, the 3070/ti might even be the better bet value wise.
The 4050/Ti will be in the same spot you are disappointed in where it would barely be faster than an RTX 3060.
The real issue with the price hike that happened with GPUs, is that now older generation cards start looking better from a price/perf perspective and new cards look less enticing.
At the upper end people dont really care about that, they just want more.
In the mid/low range.....beating the 3060Ti/6700XT in terms of price/perf right now is gonna be a tall tall order from Nvidia and even AMD.
The replacement 4060Ti already looks like its gonna be a hard sell.
SportsFan581
Member
@
Black_Stride
yeah I saw that 4060ti leak/rumor. If true, it looks like a real disappointment waiting to happen on paper, we'll see how it performs.
The numbers leaking out about the mobile 4050 look even more disappointing, apparently doesn't even match the mobile 3060. Desktop 4050 might fall more in line with that bastardized 8GB 3060.
Black_Stride
yeah I saw that 4060ti leak/rumor. If true, it looks like a real disappointment waiting to happen on paper, we'll see how it performs.The numbers leaking out about the mobile 4050 look even more disappointing, apparently doesn't even match the mobile 3060. Desktop 4050 might fall more in line with that bastardized 8GB 3060.
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//DEVIL//
Member
did you see the hellhound unboxing? it looks cheaper and worse than the reference. even the fans look like 2$ fans you find on Alibaba and you would be like ouff that is ugly ( which probably its 1$ fan or so. because the rgb on those fans are like just 2 colors. a baby blue and purple. it doesnt even a basic rgb )
I have never seen such a cheap-looking modern video card like this. I wouldn't want to put it in my case. people will think it's a 7-year-old card.
Edit : duh, its Hellhound not hellbound. lol thanks
SportsFan581
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SportsFan581
Member
I'm not one of those users that gives a single shit about what a GPU looks like. I always gravitate to the more simplistic models anyway. Hellbound (or is it HellHound, I never remember) and the Gigabyte gaming look fine to me LOL. If I was getting one the research I'd be doing would be more about the temps and whether or not the memory chips are getting cooled properly and that kind of thing.
Many times the cheap fans function better as well, thanks to the thinner plastic (just don't let anything ping them when running, LOL).
I'd probably lean more towards the smaller Gigabyte gaming for a two 8-pin model so long as the cooling was "good enough".
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Orta
Banned
Cutting through
Yep. That $400 will go towards a juicer cpu to partner the card. No brainier really.
Yep. That $400 will go towards a juicer cpu to partner the card. No brainier really.
OLED_Gamer
Member
Anyone order from amd direct before? How long does it take to ship after an order is done?
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Yeah I wish I could find the asshole who came up with glass sides for PC cases and turned them into sculptures rather than functional black boxes.
SportsFan581
Member
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GreatnessRD
Member
Well, I'm only going off my Microcenter stock. Prior to the review of the 7900 series, they had a TON of stock of 4080s. Now they're down to two models with 5 and 1 in stock respectively when that wasn't the case a mere for days ago, haha.Hardly. In the US the price gap is even larger when you compare AIB to AIB cards:
GeForce RTX 4080 GPUs / Video Graphics Cards | Newegg.com
Shop GeForce RTX 4080 GPUs / Video Graphics Cards on Newegg.com. Watch for amazing deals and get great pricing.www.newegg.com
Radeon RX 7900 XTX GPUs / Video Graphics Cards | Newegg.com
Shop Radeon RX 7900 XTX GPUs / Video Graphics Cards on Newegg.com. Watch for amazing deals and get great pricing.
SportsFan581
Member
They had to eventually sell out of that launch shipment. 7900XTX seems to already be gone for the most part.
GymWolf
Member
I had to buy a new case and the model with a good offer had a glass panel, i already dread the room becoming a fucking carnival of rio with all those fucking leds on sight...
adamosmaki
Member
Man if those 4060ti rumors are true is gonna be DOA if AMD release something decent in the 400-500 range.I think 300 dollars is now completely outta the question from Nvidia.
There is hope from AMD.
Its all but guaranteed from Intel.
The cuts Nvidia would be doing would actually make the 3060 look like good deals vs im guessing 4050/Ti.
If
The 4070Ti is 7-800 dollars
The 4070 5-600
The 4060 which will likely be a match for the 3070/Ti will probably end up costing exactly the same as a 3070/Ti today, the 3070/ti might even be the better bet value wise.
The 4050/Ti will be in the same spot you are disappointed in where it would barely be faster than an RTX 3060.
The real issue with the price hike that happened with GPUs, is that now older generation cards start looking better from a price/perf perspective and new cards look less enticing.
At the upper end people dont really care about that, they just want more.
In the mid/low range.....beating the 3060Ti/6700XT in terms of price/perf right now is gonna be a tall tall order from Nvidia and even AMD.
The replacement 4060Ti already looks like its gonna be a hard sell.
A 128b bit bus and only 8gb is laughable for a card most likely to cost 600 .