But that kind of delusional "uncertainty" exists for everything. The "uncertainty" regarding the existence of evolution can lead some people to question almost everything about biology. Is it worth anyone's time considering this or what those kinds of people have to say or how they justify it? Absolutely not. Irrational hatred and ignorance will find a way.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Shaun King responds to race questioning
- Thread starter birthday-suit
- Start date
- Status
But that kind of delusional "uncertainty" exists for everything. The "uncertainty" regarding the existence of evolution can lead some people to question almost everything about biology. Is it worth anyone's time considering this or what those kinds of people have to say or how they justify it? Absolutely not. Irrational hatred and ignorance will find a way.
In terms of housing sure. But plenty of people of difference races interact with each other and gasp develop friendships. Pay attention the next time you are on the train or walking down the street. You'll see many interracial couples as well. This is very much my reality and plenty of other peoples.
That's not even a remotely good analogy. Do you not acknowledge that race is subjective?
what the fuck are you even talking about anymore
Chie Satonaka
Member
New York is enlightened because they do the same things people do all over the fucking country.
Jawbreaker
Member
Racism is alive and well in NYC, it just tends to get a pass because it's a multicultural, liberal mecca, and racism is always ascribed to the Southern/red states.
Thelonelykoopa
Member
Of course not everybody racist and interracial couples are becoming more accepted but it's not like racism isn't still a very large problem in American today and to many people race identification is still very much a black and white situations even if its very much a grey area.
smokeandmirrors
Banned
jesus. conservatives can be some vile vindictive people.
bobbychalkers
Member
You missed my point, #381504 looks like this
My paternal DNA will most likely point to England but the overwhelming majority of my ancestry is of West African origin. I'd be lying to myself and others if I told people I was full blooded English. Wouldn't be quick claim my great-great-great-great grandfather anyways since he thought it was cool to own people.
As for your second statement, blackness isn't limited to darker shades. That "socially constructed nonsense" is very real and carried many implications. For example your seemingly post-racial New York City that you keep referencing to. These cops clearly recognize that he is of a mixed ancestry but it doesn't matter to them. He is still the "other" (a fucking mutt using their words). Using your logic he could have personally identified as any of the components that make up his ancestry but the story will still end up with him on the ground with a cop threatening to break his arm for having the audacity to walk around Harlem while looking even a little bit black.
Race being subjective has absolutely no bearing on what I'm saying. He claims he has always been treated as being black, and this claim is verifiable. We can find out for sure if it's true or not. Upon being given this verification, those who find room in the "uncertainty" to still suspect he is a liar are not worth giving any consideration.
In terms of housing and our school system which is the most segregated school system in the country. People of different races mingling together does not at all make this place a post-racial utopia, not when such realities exists.
In New York people some people are denied housing based on race just like in other parts of the country. However some people self-segregate. For example i've never had any desire to live in a predominately white neighborhood. However a former roommate and I was going to sign lease in Park Slope but we declines because we wanted to live in a predominately black neighborhood. Now despite our choice in housing and despite choices of housing for many people, we actively choose and are comfortable with having friends of difference racial backgrounds and seek out activity with people of difference races and date people of different races.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
That response was the best way he could have possibly handled this. I understand not just wanting to throw your family history out there, but it's way better than keeping silent. I had no idea what the truth really was, I didn't know him from Adam before yesterday, but now I couldn't feel more in that guy's corner.
People should read every damn word of that.
People should read every damn word of that.
Now. Which boroughs and neighborhoods do you actively avoid on a daily basis in this reality of yours?
I appreciate your attempt armchair psychology, but you don't know shit about me or what I "depend on" to uplift me. If you're implying racial inequality, police brutality, discrimination and other shit people of color deal with is a media-created narrative, then I'd love to find your version of America I can live in. Bottom line is that the shit is really hitting the fan thru the use of technology and camera phones, and the smell is billowing out in a nauseating fashion.
I never stated that it is a post-racial utopia. Could it be that in some cases it is better than some other places in America in some regards? Furthermore, can you really be surprised that white people who traditionally have the means to send their kids to better schools would opt to not send their kids to schools that are failing? NYC public schools are a mess.
One girl was able to pass her class and graduate despite not even attending one of her classes at all.
http://nypost.com/2015/08/02/students-stunning-plea-why-did-nyc-let-me-graduate-high-school/
Please keep in mind there are schools that are fighting to stay diverse. See below.
http://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/20141210/park-slope/how-park-slope-school-is-fighting-stay-diverse
It is possible that racism exist and that there are significant amounts of people who are not racist, actively fight racism and pursue relationships with people of different backgrounds because they honestly don't give a shit about the persons race.
We both know his claims are true. What you haven't said though is how his treatment at the hands of others translates to definite proof of whether he's black or not. It's not hard to see how his response could be treated as a non answer.
He has a mixed race father and was brought up being identified and identifying as black. There is literally nothing left to consider because nothing else matters.
If you feel otherwise, then what boroughs and neighborhoods do you actively avoid? Where I go, I see plenty of people of different backgrounds. Maybe you go to segregated boroughs and neighborhoods or self-segregate but I most certainly don't.
Thelonelykoopa
Member
now I know know your dislusional
Well that's all you needed to say. You can't speak for anything outside of a strictly metropolitan or gentrified view with boundaries like those.
Did you just call this shitty conspiracy theory a non-story and then link to another shitty conspiracy theory?
Clearly you didn't pay attention to the and portion of the sentence. A society can have racist and non-racist co-exist. It is not a one or the other situation.
Chie Satonaka
Member
Yes, that just happened, with "proof" from the same people who attacked him on this issue as well.
I speak based on my experience as do others. Personally I find it bizarre that someone would find it shocking or unbelievable that in NYC, one of the most diverse cities in the world that you would find people of different backgrounds intermingling.
I think you would have to make a concerted effort to not interact with people of a different background.
What are you talking about? What is your point right now? You tried to position NYC as racially progressive compared to the rest of the country and people in this thread are reminding you of the very real problems the city has with race on institutional levels. Your retort to that was "well people of different races intermingle" which doesn't amount to shit if the black guy goes back to crime stricken Brownsville and the white guy gets to lay his head down gentrified ass Bushwick after they are done "intermingling".
Thelonelykoopa
Member
yes but a society with racist means their is by default racism and what I quoted was you literally questing the existence of racism.
Nothing else matters according to who though? You? Surely you see how this kind of thinking has no true answer. King was forced into a position where he had to give an answer that would satisfy as many people as possible, but whether those standards for blackness are something we should continue backing are another matter entirely imo.
Edit: typos. On my phone atm
As I said, anyone not satisfied by his claim of "blackness" is irrational and not worth considering. These kinds of delusions will always exist and the existence of those with such an ailment says little of value of the subject about which they are delusional.
That's not what I or anyone else has said. Not even close. Your little utopian view doesn't even apply to a measurable majority of NYC let alone the state of NY, and you can't even see how narrow it is. Exactly how many blocks does Metropolitan NYC encompass these days?
And when you say things like this, you demonstrate that you have no experience and are just wasting everyone's time.
Are you fucking following what is being posted? Damn! Despite the fact that institutional racism exist not everyone is a fucking racist and makes concerted efforts to fight racism and promote diversity. This whoa as me only seeing one side of things in every aspect of shit is getting old.
But what you haven't done is explain why those people are irrational or what a rational line of thinking about the subject would be.
Clearly the same number of blocks in the little narrow world you live in where everyone is racist and completely self-segregates.
I was not questioning racism. I was saying that it is possible for racism to exist and not have everyone be fucking racist and in fact have people fucking fighting racism. It isn't a one or nothing situation.
No one made the argument that there aren't non-racists people and people who are actively anti-racists in NYC. You made that rather useless point when people told you that NYC isn't the racially progressive city you think it is.
Thelonelykoopa
Member
nobody is claiming everybody is racist and we are improving on race situation but lets be honest we are just now arriving at the point where people are getting comfortable talking about these issues . I hope for a day where a biracial person can choose which race or both he can be apart of and have the majority of people accept it but for many we are just not there yet.
Yes I have. It's rational to conclude that a person conceived by a mixed race father, who is identified by those in his community, family, school, church and seemingly all social groups as black and who self identifies as black is black.
You're running out of fuel. That doesn't even align with my personal narrative, nor anything that I've said.
There's always that one.
Gotdatmoney
Member
What are you talking about? Have you ever been to low income housing areas in major cities? The bulk of those residents are minorities. You can live in a major city and see and talk to other races in a regular day and still live in completely different realities in with completely different socioeconomic perspectives. You honestly seem to be implying that there is no race issue and that shit is laughable given all the events of the past year or so.
Wait what the fuck? When did anyone ever imply that everyone was a racist? And lol at black people holding on to an identity from 400 years ago. That is literally the funniest shit I have ever read.
Those are three separate variables. Are you saying he had to meet all three to earn your approval?
But dat intermingling
Hmm... The simple fact that people are screaming about the gentrification of the outer boroughs. I would say much of NYC.
I've lived in NYC all my life (Brooklyn to be exact). I've been through all of it and have a very firm grasp of it. Many of my friends are of other backgrounds. Family members are in interracial marriages and relationships. Could it be that my experiences are simply different than yours? Could it be that other life experiences can co-exist? /sarcas
I would say all three being true means someone is black, and that is the case we're discussing here.
I have never said that nor implied that. You seem to think that this is the only reality of minorities in NYC. It is not!
In the below neighborhood blacks had a higher income than whites!
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/01/nyregion/01census.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
It's like you want to stay on the whoa as me train. Yes racism exist. Yes there are shit ton of issues but not every one in this country has the exact same problems or have the exact same experiences in life. Your life experience in not the only one. When you fucking learn to accept that then this conversation can end.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
Didn't really matter to me if he was black or white, or mixed, etc. He's trying to promote a better life for a disenfranchised group of people and that's all that matters. He isn't going all black face like the lady from the NAACP.
So you you completely ignore that you are half white? I know mixed kids grow up having an identity crisis and have a hard time learning where they fit in in the world, but it just seems like a disregard of your being.
So you you completely ignore that you are half white? I know mixed kids grow up having an identity crisis and have a hard time learning where they fit in in the world, but it just seems like a disregard of your being.
I had the same experience. I lived in Brooklyn growing up and I still do to this day. I had friends of many different backgrounds, I have siblings who are the products of interracial relationships who also speak two languages. Our experiences aren't that different the only difference here is I'm not dumb deaf and blind to the realities facing the that you're propping up as this utopia when in reality it's anything but. Stop with the delusions.
Yeah. It seems really sad. My niece and nephew are half black and half white but my sister has really instilled in them that they are both and to never deny, degrade or value one more than the other no matter what anyone else tells them.
I never claimed it was a utopia. You have chosen to view my words in that way because that is the narrow view you hold where everything and everyone is racist. Whoa as me. Continue on the self pity train.
One can acknowledge that they're half white, but be socially aware enough to know that they'll always be regarded as "other" among white people. Not the case with black people.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
This is the only part that kind of had me do a double take
Maybe not all families talk about this stuff (though from personal experience I don't know how you'd avoid this but maybe that's because I went to school with a lot of people of various colors, including mixed) but to say it's part of white privilege is weird.
It's also a contradiction because the basis of the one drop rule is racist, which would mean it had to be (during slavery, post civil war, civil rights era) and still is in places a thing white racists adhere to.
Maybe not all families talk about this stuff (though from personal experience I don't know how you'd avoid this but maybe that's because I went to school with a lot of people of various colors, including mixed) but to say it's part of white privilege is weird.
It's also a contradiction because the basis of the one drop rule is racist, which would mean it had to be (during slavery, post civil war, civil rights era) and still is in places a thing white racists adhere to.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked