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Skullgirls |OT| New age of Heroines
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DR2K
Banned
Like most fighting games where only less than 1 percent stick around after awhile.
The netcode is soo good. Skullgirls does rollback right out the box, whereas a game with millions of more dollars and manpower can't even get sound effects, much less a stable netcode working.
Oldschoolgamer
The physical form of blasphemy
Hitbox viewing sure as hell should be fundamental for a technical fighter. The tutorial obviously is needed just as much as a movelist, considering the amount of people that have been playing fighters, bitching about not being able to block a simple ass high/low mixup. Also those that have been playing these newer fighters haven't had to deal with realistic throw ranges unlike the ones found in UMVC3.
I don't understand how we're even back to the movelist thing. It's not there. Sucks. It's getting patched in for free, alongside of any other fixes for stuff that they find.
Edit: It's not perfect. The game has some issues. Lack of lobbies is one of them.
I don't understand how we're even back to the movelist thing. It's not there. Sucks. It's getting patched in for free, alongside of any other fixes for stuff that they find.
Edit: It's not perfect. The game has some issues. Lack of lobbies is one of them.
Raging Spaniard
If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
Just because something is a priority doesnt mean its going to make it in. The way I see it, youre lucky you got as much as you did.
Im not aware of the specifics, but the features you want would take weeks to implement properly, while the hitbox took 1 day. Sometimes a simple and taken for granted feature isn't as simple. You would rather have lobbies than story mode, sure, but to set up a good lobby system is expensive and takes other kinds of talent. The people working on story mode probably don't overlap with the network engineer much.
They teach people how to play the genre better than any other game has, Id say thats more attention to fundamentals than any other company.
Honestly, I am a bit baffled by the reactions here.
I can easily draw paralells to what happened in Sine Mora.
There, I bitched about something (to myself) - the cave section being "too hard" -, but the NEXT DAY, I immediately did it. Really, without delay (hah, see what I did there?).
And a WEEK went by. A whole friggin weak. Every single playthrough, I went through there without hitting the walls. I go to the uber-hardcore-omg-shmup forum, and bam: some hardcore dudes STILL complain about cave sections. Really? Mmkay?
Skullgirls. Lack of movelist? Yeah, bummer. Last day, I had to constantly switch between tabs, etc. Today? I know everything of Parasoul. Every move. Of course I do. Who does not know the full movelist of a char (sans Dante UMVC3) after a few hours of play or at worst ONE sleep over it?
And here we are, some people still cant get over it. By the time it takes to write a post, one can learn a character's movelist. Literally. And there are 8 characters.
So yes, it is a bummer - at first. But by today? Seeing hitboxes is a long-term feature. Having movelists is for day one. Yeah, it sucks for day one. But we are at day2 already. It is past us.
I can easily draw paralells to what happened in Sine Mora.
There, I bitched about something (to myself) - the cave section being "too hard" -, but the NEXT DAY, I immediately did it. Really, without delay (hah, see what I did there?).
And a WEEK went by. A whole friggin weak. Every single playthrough, I went through there without hitting the walls. I go to the uber-hardcore-omg-shmup forum, and bam: some hardcore dudes STILL complain about cave sections. Really? Mmkay?
Skullgirls. Lack of movelist? Yeah, bummer. Last day, I had to constantly switch between tabs, etc. Today? I know everything of Parasoul. Every move. Of course I do. Who does not know the full movelist of a char (sans Dante UMVC3) after a few hours of play or at worst ONE sleep over it?
And here we are, some people still cant get over it. By the time it takes to write a post, one can learn a character's movelist. Literally. And there are 8 characters.
So yes, it is a bummer - at first. But by today? Seeing hitboxes is a long-term feature. Having movelists is for day one. Yeah, it sucks for day one. But we are at day2 already. It is past us.
An argument could be made here that, if it was a deadline-case of "we either keep the movelist or we keep the hitbox implementation", there's a sort-of of compromise that can be made by leaving the hitbox stuff in-game and releasing the movelist outside of the game. PDF docs of your characters move data sure isn't ideal (nor particularly professional
), but it's still a solution of sorts with a view to releasing as much as possible. Hitbox data in practice mode, interactive tutorials, etc -- these things *need* to be in-game.sixteen-bit
Member
The tutorial was not as good as VF4 Evo's.
Axis
Member
Why do you continue to use hitbox viewing as an example? Because it shouldn't be a priority? Because other games don't have it? It's an awesome feature that will help people understand the game/moves better...what the fuck?
BrLvgThrChmstry
Banned
Thanks, needed this. You are awesome.
Raging Spaniard
If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
I agree with this. I personally don't give a shit about it being ing ame ever. It's online, whoop de doo.
But online spectating and lobbies is a major selling point to me along with good net code. Don't have both? Don't want it. I have 2 friends I basically sell any game to that I'm interested in and they love fighters too. Not being able to play with them at once while we have a blast is just deal breaking, I'm sorry. On the other hand, none of us give 2 shits about a story mode for fighters. SFxT the only reason I've done it was for titles, and I skipped over all cut scenes, because it was a shitty story mode, so fuck it.
Idk how good the story is for SkullGirls, but I don't care that much either. I enjoyed BB's and MK's story, but if they told me that I can pick their solid story modes or spectating/lobbies, I know which one I'll pick to keep me interested in the game for hundreds of hours.
That said, it's a shame. Good luck to the team to possibly put it in soon.
Yes, Yes, and not really as much as, you know, telling them what the moves ARE rather than the guess and check of the days of yore. Extraneous.
It doesn't matter to you, it matters to casuals. It matters a LOT. Hitbox viewing? They don't give a shit, they're not in that deep.
Also, it matters to people who like using lots of characters and to have that as an absolutely invaluable reference left out is very much controversial and worth being riled up over.
Raging Spaniard
If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
Why cant they?
I'm curious, what about the tutorial is so great? It didn't teach anything that an average FG player wouldn't know iirc.I was going for 2D fighters, Evo didnt make me better at SF
Sorry I was projecting, but I never play fighting games with less than 2 other people. So, it's basically an all or nothing deal.
Axis
Member
It took me, literally, 2 minutes to figure out the moves for my characters...is it really that difficult to press buttons? And hitbox viewer is far more helpful for anyone thinking of playing the game in a serious way...
Casuals should determine what features are in-game, of course. They don't give a fuck about hitbox viewer, therefore no one should.
LeMaximilian
Alligator F*ck House
Schooling With Skullgirls (Tutorial Mode)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-j_TMWAE30
Just finished my first SG video going over tutorial mode with live commentary, comparing certain aspects to other fighters, stuff like that. Really liking the game, more online/story mode stuff to come.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-j_TMWAE30
Just finished my first SG video going over tutorial mode with live commentary, comparing certain aspects to other fighters, stuff like that. Really liking the game, more online/story mode stuff to come.
Master Milk
Member
I keep seeing this, but is this true? Have a bunch of "casuals" actually gotten up in arms about there not being a movelist in the game? Have a bunch of "casuals" that actually know about the game, and were interested in it, suddenly said no to it because of the lack of an in game movelist?
Controversial? A lack of an in game movelist is controversial? I can't shake my head slow enough at this.
I think you overestimate the average FG player.
crazygambit
Member
I hate random bitching about small stuff just as much as anyone, but the bolded really irks me as well. There's no luck in the equation here. If the small indy developer of a title in a niche genre that already has plenty of well established games with much bigger (and recognizable) rosters wants me to give their game a chance, they damn well better offer features that differentiate them from the competition.
Including an comprehensive tutorial is one of those features (and really is the only reason I'm considering buying this). So no, I'm not "lucky" for getting as much as I do, it's in fact the other way around. They'll be lucky if I choose to spend my money on their game over the hundreds of competitors out there. Also I'm sure they're very aware of that fact.
So if some of those potential customers are crying they won't buy the game until it has a movelist in game, if the number is big enough the developer sure as hell better listen. Which is exactly what they're doing, so I don't see any problem.
Personally I'm much more worried about the loading times reported and the memory issues the game seems to be having (disappearing sprites), which I'll assume they're also working on.
I will not take away from you the option to be riled up about something, do not get me wrong. But in the meantime, recognize please that what is "missing" is not a gameplay piece but a natural information that can be obtained by simply playing the game.
Axis
Member
Seriously, tho. There's 8 characters...I can understand, maybe, if we're talking about using the entire cast of umvc3 or SSF4:AE but it's 8 fucking characters!
Oldschoolgamer
The physical form of blasphemy
Why even bring up the casual card? Are we talking about the same players that try BlazBlue and Marvel and don't give a fuck about an option menu, cause they can mash special / simple all day and do cool shit?
Edit: Lack of a movelist is controversial? How did I survive the arcade era. Wow
Clearly it does, considering I saw some average fighters on stream and in forums, complaining because they couldn't pass the mixup section, or the throw tech section in a couple of tries... >.> It's more for trying to bring new people into the fold whom aren't the most savvy. Also helps break some bad habits. -_- Thank you option select fighter 4.
Edit: Lack of a movelist is controversial? How did I survive the arcade era. Wow
Clearly it does, considering I saw some average fighters on stream and in forums, complaining because they couldn't pass the mixup section, or the throw tech section in a couple of tries... >.> It's more for trying to bring new people into the fold whom aren't the most savvy. Also helps break some bad habits. -_- Thank you option select fighter 4.
I'm conflicted by this game- because I know I'll never be "good" at this the way I could be "good" at say, KOF, so that's a big demotivator to play. However, I can just tell this is a great game if I actually could play it the way it was intended, and I love the fanservice and art touches. I just can't do real combos- my execution is horrible in just about any fighter, but it really seems to hurt here more then any other game.
I wonder if it would be possible for me to like a fighting game casually? I don't regret buying, but I'd never see myself playing this game at a tourney.
I really wish Reverge would make a more footsie/poke oriented, less combo heavy game next time, but I can't see Mike Z ever doing that. Or even a non-fighter in the SG universe, I see this universe as having Guilty Gear-like potential.
I wonder if it would be possible for me to like a fighting game casually? I don't regret buying, but I'd never see myself playing this game at a tourney.
I really wish Reverge would make a more footsie/poke oriented, less combo heavy game next time, but I can't see Mike Z ever doing that. Or even a non-fighter in the SG universe, I see this universe as having Guilty Gear-like potential.
SolarPowered
Member
Does anyone know any good combos using launcher with Valentine? I can build a basic ground chain, but I have no clue to what to do besides going into her "major surgery" level 1 when my opponents get knocked into the air. It's not like Parasoul or Ms.Fortune who can knock an opponent into the ground from the air.
I'm trying Ms.Fortune right now and she is just amazing. She is so elastic and dynamic which is fantastic. The pressure with her head is really good. She feels weird, but her fighting style really appeals to me for some reason. I may drop Valentine for her if I can't get some good combos down soon. Oh God... I'm interested in a puppet character and a charge character. This is not good. Stop making me so interested in strange character archetypes or I'll never get good at this game, Reverge.
It'd be an understandable trade off if they had a gigantic fanbase ready to buy whatever software they put out there(ie: Capcom). They could just patch in story mode for a price later, but they don't have any security and it's Ahad's project too. Hell, a lot of the team were people who Ahad has known for a long time and they were probably looking forward to building Ahad's world just as much as they looked forward to cooperating with Mike on his fighting game vision.
Not really, it's inexcusable, even if being patched in later. Literally seems like the easiest possible thing to implement into the game.[/QUOTE]
The bar thing was something that Mike Z came up with as far as I remember. I don't know if move lists are something he could have done, but it might have taken him longer than it did which is why it was set for patches along with replays(something he really didn't want to cut). It's hard to believe, but this seems to be the case.
I've got complete trust in them as of right now though.
Don't think that SCV is fine just because the hardcore tourney scene is showing it on some tiny streams either. It is selling less and less with each entry. This is probably the last Soul Calibur game we will have in a loooong time.
I'm sure as hell going to continue harping on about the issue as someone who bought the game, but there is nothing more to be said or done until the second patch comes in(yeah, I don't expect spectator/lobbies until a second paid patch). It'd be nice if some people recognized that Reverge/Autumn have to pay a ridiculous amount after that first patch. It ain't easy having to satisfy the demands of their buying customers and the folks who haven't even bought the game when the costs for a patch may cost more than a college tuition for one of us.
It's awesome to see you here giving this game a try. I always enjoy your vids. You recent Chris one was ABSOLUTELY AMAZING. Will watch when I come back home.
I'm trying Ms.Fortune right now and she is just amazing. She is so elastic and dynamic which is fantastic. The pressure with her head is really good. She feels weird, but her fighting style really appeals to me for some reason. I may drop Valentine for her if I can't get some good combos down soon. Oh God... I'm interested in a puppet character and a charge character. This is not good. Stop making me so interested in strange character archetypes or I'll never get good at this game, Reverge.
I would have preferred lobbies/spectator mode/move lists too, but this game was also Ahad's vision as well. I think it'd be unfair if they only used his characters with no story or context as to what is going on. This is a fairly niche product and they had no assurance that it would sell enough copies even with the standard modes we've come to know in every fighter.
It'd be an understandable trade off if they had a gigantic fanbase ready to buy whatever software they put out there(ie: Capcom). They could just patch in story mode for a price later, but they don't have any security and it's Ahad's project too. Hell, a lot of the team were people who Ahad has known for a long time and they were probably looking forward to building Ahad's world just as much as they looked forward to cooperating with Mike on his fighting game vision.
I can see what you mean. It's nice that the online even works at all tbh. I can't wait for those patches though. The lack of Spectator and lobbies killed MvC3 for me. I don't expect that to happen with SG too soon, but it'd help if those two things got added sooner rather than later.
Yep, I can get the complaint...
Daisuke Ishiwatari and Mori(iirc) actually bought one of everything from Ahad/Mike last year at EVO. They were definitely in love with the designs, but they haven't had a chance to test the full game as far as I know. Ono may have more experience than them when it comes to that subject.
Yeah, it hurts the most when it comes to spectating stuff. A lot of the hardcore folks are picking it up and building some good BnBs/strategies. I want to copy that shit fast and in real time if possible. I guess I'll have to settle for youtube action until things are improved.
So... smaller dev team means effort should go into extraneous content like hitbox viewing instead of core fundamentals like a move set built in?
Not really, it's inexcusable, even if being patched in later. Literally seems like the easiest possible thing to implement into the game.[/QUOTE]
The bar thing was something that Mike Z came up with as far as I remember. I don't know if move lists are something he could have done, but it might have taken him longer than it did which is why it was set for patches along with replays(something he really didn't want to cut). It's hard to believe, but this seems to be the case.
Yeah, this pissed me off in MvC3. I'm just accepting it here since we are playing a product made by a significantly smaller team with less money. I'm kind of done with promises and words if spectator/lobbies don't make it into the game though. I'll play this for a while, but my trust in fighting game companies will be done. It'll be a big blow for me.
I've got complete trust in them as of right now though.
This kind of attitude is kinda messed up and it's gonna start looking immature and shortsighted to boot. This wasn't just Mike Z's game and there are lots of people who enjoy a good single player offering.
Don't think that SCV is fine just because the hardcore tourney scene is showing it on some tiny streams either. It is selling less and less with each entry. This is probably the last Soul Calibur game we will have in a loooong time.
Yeah, you should definitely give the tutorial a shot. The tech tutorial is particularly important since throws here are 3S throws. It's not like Mahvel where you can mash the shit out of a button to get out or like BlazBlue where you get different colored exclamation marks and a generous tech window. Throws in this game are hard to tech properly. I'll be going through that tutorial quite a few times.
I agree with you. Some people are really not taking a second to think it through here. The price is 1/4th that of a regular retail release. Something had to give after the all the time and money they invested in the game. Adding new features and modes brings in new glitches and possible breakdowns of the game that have to be tested and fixed. They just didn't have the luxury of a 100 man team or deep pockets to make it happen. They should keep their expectations in check while playing tons of friends if they have the game and they should take a chill pill with this crusade if they haven't bought it yet.
I'm sure as hell going to continue harping on about the issue as someone who bought the game, but there is nothing more to be said or done until the second patch comes in(yeah, I don't expect spectator/lobbies until a second paid patch). It'd be nice if some people recognized that Reverge/Autumn have to pay a ridiculous amount after that first patch. It ain't easy having to satisfy the demands of their buying customers and the folks who haven't even bought the game when the costs for a patch may cost more than a college tuition for one of us.
There is a time and place for learning. Maybe this is your chance to learn a fighter in a more comprehensive manner? I've played all types of fighters and I've even played some where I began and got wiped(think 40-0) only to improve immensely after a few weeks/months.
Anything is possible. I guess it depends on how much enjoyment you can get out of single player and the online multiplayer. This game is built for the long haul. DLC hooks are firmly planted in there and the roster is only going to become larger/more varied.
Mike has said that he is legitimately interested in making games from other genres iirc. I also see this game as far less combo oriented compared to BB or Mahvel. You only need good blocks and ten hit combos to kill severely injure your opponents after 3-4 hit confirms.
Neat
It's awesome to see you here giving this game a try. I always enjoy your vids. You recent Chris one was ABSOLUTELY AMAZING. Will watch when I come back home.
Hey, 360 users - can you try something for me?
If you're having load time problems, can you try clearing your cache and seeing if that helps?
Because artists can't program?
Everything you guys are complaining about is really more of an element of game production than design. With such a tiny team we don't have any flexibility on how artists, programmers and designers are allocated.
The hitbox viewer is in because it was done. That is a feature that MikeZ made for himself to help him make hitboxes and work on the game, and so it cost zero time and effort to include from that point on. Should he have... not included it for appearances' sake or something?
If you're having load time problems, can you try clearing your cache and seeing if that helps?
Settings > System > Storage > Hard Drive (Y) Device Options > Clear System Cache
Because artists can't program?
Everything you guys are complaining about is really more of an element of game production than design. With such a tiny team we don't have any flexibility on how artists, programmers and designers are allocated.
The hitbox viewer is in because it was done. That is a feature that MikeZ made for himself to help him make hitboxes and work on the game, and so it cost zero time and effort to include from that point on. Should he have... not included it for appearances' sake or something?
great vid so far max. definitely would love to see a lot of support from you even though there is more money in making capcom vids.
I've said this many times but I was really against not having the movelist, but if it came to the point where it has an impact on gameplay, then I'm fine having it external. Just have to spend more time with the game (which we all should be). At least we have it available as a PDF.
I think people should be looking at it this way. On a fundamental level, every fighter should have a Virtua Fighter 4 style tutorial, with a SG type training room, with all the features of recent fighting games. But even the big developers don't do it. I'm sure if SG was a full blown retail release with a larger budget, all the things we're starving could be met.
crazygambit
Member
Watching this I have to shake my head at not having a next lesson option. Every time you finish a lesson you have to back out into the lesson select screen (loading...) and then choose the next lesson (more loading...) every single time. I could see myself getting annoyed with that pretty quickly.
It's nice to offer the option to do the lessons in any order you want, but most people are gonna wanna do them in order anyway. If you can shave a few seconds of loading times that way, the option should be included.
This. Everything else can be worked around. (including lack of lobbies by calling your friends after a match to connect, lol)
But this is fucking inexcusable game breaking shit. Why am I punished by not being able see what my opponent is about to do when I knock out his first character? Different key animation frames have the same hit boxes, so seeing the animation is essential.
We need an assist me series... complete with cosplay actors that have the .... assets.
Can you try clearing your cache to see if it helps?
The game was built around expectations of data coming in at a certain rate, and for some reason the 360 isn't able to maintain that rate consistently. This didn't show up in our testing so it's something peculiar to home users' HDDs.
Raging Spaniard
If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
I dont mean to offend, but when you pay $15 for a game that has a s much as it has solely because the devs gave up a lot of their personal time in order to give it to you, I consider you lucky, yes.
Go ask Capcom what you can get for $15
Marie must be the laziest final boss I've ever seen. There's nothing to it you just have to pray you get in enough damage before you either get slowly chipped to death or something random happens like a skeleton pops up and knocks you back into one of the shadow uppercuts. This isn't even a "u mad" post, I've beat it multiple times but it's just stupid and lazy to have a boss like that.
I am having trouble beating her on insane with cerebella though, any tips?
I am having trouble beating her on insane with cerebella though, any tips?
Im on PS3. I know how to clear the cache on the 360 but have no idea how to, or if it's even possible on PS3. It' a slim with 500 gigs
DR2K
Banned
You could try redownloading the game. Flawless on my end.
EDIT: LOL game just froze my PS3 literally a minute after I type this.
sixteen-bit
Member
Wow, they proved you wrong.
Oh, huh - I've seen it happen rarely on PS3 during dev, but I don't think I've seen it on the retail release yet.
Does it really happen for you that often? It almost makes me wonder if your HDD is dying or something, because we've definitely had devkits with worn-out HDDs that had that problem show up more often.
Where on the totem pole is spectating and lobbies for you guys in terms of getting it added, or maybe even guess how long from now it might take?
SolarPowered
Member
Disappearing sprites? How does that happen? The most I've seen is the appearance of hit/hurtboxes for a second or two.
That was fixed yesterday. Things have been running fine on XBL since then.
It was true for a few hours on launch day. It's fixed now.
I'll try the system cache clear on 360 later. I only see the hitbox thing a lot when I knock another character in. It's usually pretty bad with Ms. Fortune and Painwheel specifically, I was trying to do it in Training a lot and never got it with Valentine or Cerebella.
Honestly, no idea. Whereas most companies have multiple network guys, we have one. He's a very sharp guy, but one man can only do so much.
It's definitely on the list, but probably would not be in the first patch, which would include move lists, etc.
Nope.
As the others said, it was down for a few hours yesterday - Konami didn't upload a file that's needed to validate the game online, and once it was uploaded everything's been good.
Just been thinking about something. Since MikeZ had to convince autumgames to patch in the movelist regardless of sales numbers does that mean if it doesnt hit the numbers they want we won't see any further patches or updates?
Correct me if I'm being ignorant but it's just something that passed my mind.
Correct me if I'm being ignorant but it's just something that passed my mind.
If it took him one full day to code the hitstun bar thing, then I understand why this game got so late: this shouldn't take more than 2 hours. ^^
But yeah, it's true saying that adding a move list is way more work than the hitstun bar thing, especially if it was to be added at the end of the development, where every resource was already allocated and the UI already done. Problem is, a feature like this should have been decided upon and implemented at the very beginning of the development. For me, this is just poor planning and a poor decision all in all; planning this thing ahead would have made it REALLY easy to implement, while now I can understand how problematic it can get.
This is what indie dev is all about though, sometimes people are too novice to anticipate things like this, and end up taking way more time than needed. This is also why a lot of indie games are delayed, or take forever to make.
I suppose what I want to say is congratulations to Reverge for releasing the game in the first place: this is not something everyone can make, and all in all this is the most important thing. You learn from your mistakes, and you can only improve on those mistakes if you release something and get enough money to continue working.
Next time they will probably think those things ahead.
Disclaimer: I've been coding games for the past ten years now, for a living. I know how it's done. And I know that you always need to take decisions, and cut things out: I know how hard it can be. I personally don't like Skullgirls, but I can commend the effort and feel all the love and work that went into making it. So, yeah, you can be proud of yourself, Ravi, you and all of the team; try and take the criticism for what it is -- a way to improve, and nothing more!
This is a terrible sarcastic retort. The game is stuck between this place of appeasing casuals and being "made for the hardcore." Story is important for casuals, so they double up on artists and whatnot. You simply sit on the other side of the fence, and see your priorities different. If they are trying to go for the casual appeal too, it's a no brainer to put a move set in there to appease that audience.
You play fighting games regularly, ofcourse you can try the same old inputs and get some moves out of it to make a mental move set. You, presumably, are not someone casual who has heard about this Skullgirls game that is so great for newcomers; yet lacks something that newcomers use as a go-to. They want to know how to do cool shit, or learn how to do cool shit. The tutorial mode aids, but is not a replacement for a move set in the game. A move set is something all players can refer to, hit boxes? Not so much.
It clearly is controversial if people are defending the exclusion to this degree.
Also, I showed a friend the game and told him about it. He likes fighting games a lot, but is not serious about them (mostly because of time restraints and whatnot), and is huge on Street Fighter and Tekken. After describing the game to him, he seemed interested, then I told him one thing that sucked is that it didn't have a move set built into the game and he was kinda disappointed. He's the kind of guy that buys the game guides to things he'd barely play too. Again, having that as a reference is invaluable I believe, especially so to the casual gamer.
I'm gonna ask two of my other friends what they think of the game too, but I haven't had time. If they like it and are willing to play it with me, I'll buy it. But having a move set helps a lot, and everyone I have introduced to fighting games this gen likes to press start and on top of looking at what the controls are, look for some sort of indicator or help for how to do cool shit. It's a go-to the same way it is in other genres when you wonder what the controls are rather than just shooting the shit. That is why I'm extrapolating these anecdotes into what I believe someone looks for when they want to engage themselves in a fighting game, and consider having a move set built in a necessity. Or if you prefer, a standard. Lobbies are pretty much an expected standard now too, but I don't really play online so it affects me less.
Its a likely possibility. We might get some fixes/balancing when Squiggly and Umbrella come out. I think everything after that would be based on sales